Oh, I agree with you. I think they will be very good. But, what else is new? They have been very good for like 20 years.
I never underestimate them; that has made The Game super fun over the last three years. They will be very difficult to beat, as always, this year. Our odds seem lower this year, with all the change to defeat them. But then, it could happen!
Winning the NC really took a lot of that stress feeling away from me...
As a lifelong Lions fan, and general consumer of way too much football news, this is almost comical to me. Every year in the NFL, there is a ton of noise about who 'won' the offseason. Generally, it's whoever drafted the next 'hot thing' at QB, and/or whoever got the most high-priced free agents. It's very predictable.
Every year, we rank recruiting classes for college football. Who had he #1 class? Who had the #10? Yadda, yadda, yadda.
It's all just noise. Spending money and grabbing 'stars' does not equate to championships. It just doesn't. It shows that you are trying, perhaps, but there is very little correlation to these 'big' offseasons and then immediate championships within 2-3 years. The Jaguars in the NFL like two years ago. Texas A&M. Many, many others. It just doesn't work well.
I suppose Alabama over the years could be considered an outlier, since they consistently had top-5 classes, and then consistently won championships for a stretch of time. However, that felt more like a machine/system, rather than trying to use fundraising to go 'all-in' for stars in a given year.
Sheesh. What are those donors going to do if they lose to UM again? Give even MORE than ten times last year's haul?
This board can be ridiculous sometimes. We just hired an NFL DC, who helped invent the system that we have run with great success over the past three years. And yet, many seem unhappy.
This is, of course, less than a month after we won the National Championship.
So many people seem to have their gears permanently set to 'mad' or 'unhappy.' Why don't we at least wait until we play a PRACTICE to get upset about a hire with a great resume?
Be mad if you want, I guess. This seems like a great start for Moore for outside hires in my book!
Braylonfest in 2004 against MSU had some epic crowd energy. From the very low lows in the 4th quarter (down 17) to the resounding build to the finish... it was visceral in the stadium. It's hard to say the team was 'willed' to victory, but it felt like a building avalanche. Once we tied the game up, it felt like there was no way in the world we would lose. Pretty magical.
I mean, "brutally slow" is a relative term. We won the National Championship 22 days ago. Harbaugh was still our head coach SEVEN days ago. We have had our new head coach, Moore, for FOUR DAYS.
These are multi-year, multi-million dollar contracts that are being written for very busy people, many of whom have current jobs. Coach Moore has about 4,567 things to do every day.
I mean, I would love to have immediate answers to every question as well. But I think we can relax on the timeline. I think the University has moved fairly quickly to get a new head coach, and are actively locking down existing coaches, pursuing new ones, keeping the recruiting class together, etc.
I think the internet age has warped our sense of time. I also kind of want everything right now, and for it all to be great and perfect. But that is not realistic. I would MUCH rather take a bit of time and get the right candidate, than be stuck with the wrong one for 1-3 football seasons.
I think we would be foolish to not split Edwards out wide more than the last two years. Him with Morris, Morgan, and Loveland as receivers? That would feel great as the top 4 in targets!
This certainly helped us this year. I think you can (fairly) legitmately say we had a 2-3 game 'season' by this metric (PSU, Maryland, OSU, and I think Maryland is debatable). Maryland was made much harder by its position in the schedule (one week after a top ten matchup with PSU, week before The Game).
We were effectively able to 'tune up' for a couple of months before we faced truly difficult challenges. It worked for us... it may be helpful for them as well.
I mean, I hope not. Hopefully they are gashed by the run and ineffective on offense... one can dream!
I know we are all on Cloud 9, and soaking in our great moment. I am loving it.
However, I think anyone who thought OSU was 'buried' should re-adjust expectations. We have had a great three year run. But each time, we took down TOP level teams. They were all very, very good - we were just better. I think the idea that someway, somehow, OSU will 'crumble' is not accurate. They will continue to be very good. Honestly, how could they not be with their recruiting classes? Each of the last three games were close at some point. Even this year, they had the ball with a chance at the very end of the game.
These things often come down to a few key plays, and even to luck. It is truly a game of inches. I predict The Game will continue to be very hard, and OSU continues to have an excellent chance to win it. I would not be surprised if they are favored in 2024, or 2025, or any other year.
We just need to keep working and grinding with our excellent team, culture, and coaches. Anything less will lead to a slide. Because you know the whole country is gunning for us now!
Oh, and of course Go Blue. The victors valiant, leaders and best!
This is kind of a meta response. I was interested to read more on the OP's thought, and there have been plenty of threads about MSU and recruiting in here before. I understand that others don't care about this topic.
But why do so many posters have to be so negative to each other in here? To me, it is my least favorite part about this great site/board. And it's not just this post, it happens regularly here.
Why do people feel the need to attack a post they find 'unworthy?' Why do we need a dozen posts (or more) which essentially say 'who cares?' Why should people continue to make responses, in essence, to make the OP feel bad for trying to contribute?
This board is 98% Michigan fans, yet some insist on attacking their own. It makes this place less enjoyable.
There are already moderators on here. If you don't like a post, just ignore it and it will fall off the top couple of pages quickly. Can we attempt to be slightly nicer?
Yep... Drumline member from the mid-2000s here. My memories are tinged a bit from good times with good people. But the concrete "field" and parking lot we practiced on was nothing special from a logistics/practice perspective. I would have rather had the new turf field that was put in after my time, and I'm sure the proposed field will be even better. I do hope that the new practice area is outdoors.
Elbel field was great! We used to have a band-wide flag football league that got really rough. Each section had their own team with a full playoff, etc. Super fun, and they probably discontinued it to prevent injuries and people murdering each other. Not to mention the fun times hanging out there with volleyball, ultimate frisbee, laying out in the sun when it was like 60 degrees out, etcetera. I even played kickball and had picnics with my now wife there...
I feel like I'm generally in line with most folks on here. I will have my 'old guy' memories of my time there, but a lot has already changed. Honestly, my old high school was knocked over, my elementary school no longer exists, etc. I'm sure the new dorm will be nice, and the new field will be excellent. It is the people and experiences that make it special. I'm sure there will be great people and wonderful experiences in the new sites as well!
Honestly, in terms of the distance, it will just provide a few more cadence reps for the drumline on the way to the practice field from Revelli... (:
6'5", 205 pounds, and track speed, but 'narrow build'? I mean, if I'm going prototype, that's a stud WR right there. Assuming he can run routes and catch? I mean, even if he cant, bomb it to the moon and have the guy come down with it...
Nope... He is totally right, and Ohio doesn't need to change a thing!
OSU, you have great coaches, great players, a great scheme, and great toughness! Michigan was just lucky again! So don't worry about it, it will all work itself out next year.
...
(shh... don't tell them. It will make it less fun next year.)
The Buckeyes under Ryan Day are good, occasionally very good, but the reason why The Game means so much (aside from the latent hatred that gives our lives meaning) is that Michigan is the gatekeeper to the postseason.
For their sakes, I hope this is hyperbole, or an overblown reaction after a tough loss. If latent hatred gives your life meaning, you have a lot more problems than a football game. Like, if you are in that spot, get some help... Just a terrible and toxic way to live.
"Coach has said he just wants players who love football and want to get better at it. That is the correct attitude. My father used to say that those that have to fight to get to the top of the mountain stay there longer. It's the work that goes into that process that makes champions"
Great point. I have been around a lot of people who have gotten to very high levels of success in their field. That fight to get to the top of the mountain is enormously important to long term success.
For our guys, it makes me happy. Because I believe that fight translates well beyond the football field. Eventually, all of these players will be done with football, and we want them to have great lives. That internal fire will really help them no matter what they pursue.
I personally love that it appears we have gotten in their heads. To the point, where they question everything. That is an insane amount of D-Line studs. Yet, they are not good enough per fans (based on the original post). So do you change D-line coaches? Change scouts/evaluators of recruits? Change the defensive coordinator or scheme to enhance their skills/talents? Everything is on the table.
And that is an exhausting/difficult place to be. Especially when you are an insanely good program outside of this game (like OSU is from a bird's eye perspective).
Interestingly, if you make the wrong changes, you could very well make things WORSE rather than better. Yikes. Not that I'm sad about it...
I'd argue it was something that most of us did NOT see.
It's whatever changed Harbaugh between 2020 and 2021. Do you remember how he just seemed to hyper focus somewhere between those two seasons? He lost a bunch of belly weight, and just changed his demeanor. He spoke differently, moved differently, etc. I think it was whatever motivated THAT change. And I have no idea what it was.
The only thing I disagreed with was a specific section about Harbaugh. Pate implied that Jim confidently 'stuck to his guns' with an older school run offense. However, us psychos in here know that he had been constantly tweaking things, often to counter losses to Ohio.
Bringing in Gattis, with his 'speed in space' mantra. Getting away from a true fullback (raise a glass to Bench Mason and the Hammering Panda). Hiring Don Brown. Firing Don Brown. Installing a pro/Ravens-style defense. Etcetera.
Sure, he stuck to a strong and varied run game. But it took a TON of adjustments in coaches and philosophy to get where we are now. And I think Jim deserves a lot of credit for that.
Honestly, I don't even criticize Pate too much for not knowing that. If he is a national guy, there is no way he can get that far in the weeds with each team. But I thought I'd offer some constructive criticism. (:
As a former drumline member, I'm very happy to hear you are OK!
When you were elevated from MMB work to full stadium work, it felt like the most obvious and correct choice possible. Thank you for all of your great work, and get well soon!
When I rewatched the game from last year, OSU seemed insanely nonchalant for the first 2.5-3 quarters. Like, they didn't seem upset when they missed a pass, or had to punt, or even when we scored. They EXPECTED to win, even when individual drives were not going particularly well. Because since 2004, they had only lost one game (and it was a weird year with an interim HC). So, there was no urgency or fire.
I think they will have a lot more urgency and fire, and their fanbase will be incredibly riled up. Our team better be willing to box, because I am pretty confident OSU will be.
Alumni here. My two cents, which are probably worth less than that:
He should be fired.
He is in one of the two most visible roles for the University (football and men’s basketball head coaches). He is supposed to lead young men, is insanely well paid, and should be held to a higher (not lower) standard than others.
He should be fired.
It’s like Bobby Knight or Woody Hayes. Not acceptable.
I believe it is possible. I thought something similar as soon as Urban left. It is very difficult to match the success of a top-5 all time winning coach, no matter who you are.
Yes, the cupboard is stocked, and their recruiting is excellent. However, I believe there will be SOME regression. The latest 1st round QB just got cut two years into his contract (Haskins). they haven't had sustained success developing QBs into NFL players in a long time. They just got walloped on national TV. So, there are some chinks in the armor.
Please don't misconstrue this... they are beastly. However, based on statistics and history, the odds of finding back-to-back coaches with Urban levels of success is not very high.
So, will they continue to be excellent? Yep. Will the next 10 years be as good as their previous 10? I doubt it.
We must have been in at almost the same time... Drumline 04-08 here. Thanks for bringing up those good/awful memories! That Northwestern game in the 3-9 rich rod year was horrendous...
The couple of bowl trips before that were awesome though!
This is one of the groups that popped into my head when I read the title as well. I think if they up their stage presence, they are a stadium tourer in the future.
Sitting with the rest of the drumline on the sidelines, about 10 feet from the field. The first ten minutes of that game were glorious, and then it just kept rolling. The Led Zeppelin show at halftime. Dominance to close them out. An amazing day!
Just a mild correction... 'Let's Go Blue' in pregame has been played since at least 2004, when I started with the band. I believe it predates that. Some earlier bando can probably clarify...
Those early morning band practices on game days were pretty magical. Thanks for the nostalgia!
I am a Michigan alum who decided to stay in state.
For me, I felt that the best overall economic opportunities were in entrepreneurship (in the long run). I knew many similarly minded folks in school, and your daughters may be of a similar type.
I am now in my early 30s, and can say this was an EXCELLENT decision for me. I have started 3 companies (some more successful than others), and had a wide variety of 'other' jobs in various industries. If you are ready to work, and have the advantage of a UM education, you can thrive in a variety of fields and industries within Michigan. No doubt.
One of the best parts for me is work/life balance and flexibility. I could have gone the law school route, and gotten in with a large firm. This would have allowed me to make a ton of money, and work 70+ hour weeks for a decade until I made partner (and then worked more). Or, I could have searched out a high-paying job in a more well-known metro area. I would have made more money off that bat. However, I am now quite comfortable, set my own schedule, and live close to family, friends, and places I know well. The grounds are fruitful here, in my opinion.
If your goal is to simply have the highest possible salary, right after school, then you may need to move (depending on your career path). There is no denying that other areas may offer higher starting salaries. But looking at your LIFE as a whole, they may wind up happy that they stayed in state.
For instance, we just had our third child. We are close to family, who can watch our kids or recommend a day care. Our kids will know their cousins, aunts, uncles, and grandparents. We know three good mechanics, and how to grab the best local camping spots.
If you pick up and move to a new area, these things just aren't feasible. You move by yourself (or maybe with one other person), and then try to figure EVERYTHING out. If kids enter the equation, things get much harder without support. They might not care about that at 22, but it may be worth mentioning.
A big part of the reason why I enjoy life to the extent I do is our location. Michigan is home, I have a lot of family here, and work has been challenging (in a good way), and has allowed us to better our financial situation each year. You don't need to move to DC/Austin/California to find that, and doing so may actually hurt your chances of a truly flourishing and happy life.
MANY studies have shown how important relationships are to happiness, as well as experiences. It is easier to craft both great relationships and great experiences (which usually center around people) when you have stronger roots.
Of course, you can find happiness, good work, and a good life anywhere. A lot of that is based on personal decisions (and some luck as well). So if you love the idea of LA, NY, or Nashville, go for it. But the idea that most people NEED to move out of state due to lack of opportunity/inability to maximize their life here is hogwash in my opinion.
It's important to live intentionally, and really choose what they value. For some, family is what matters most. For others, it's all about their career. I find both to be important and valuable, and have struck a good balance in Michigan. I firmly believe others can too.
Great words of advice here. I'm in real estate, and have a couple of others.
1. People lie. I am generally a trusting person, but people will hide things, mislead you, and generally work in their own best interest instead of yours. YOU must be your own best advocate, on everything.
2. Get recommendations and check references when hiring any professional (realtor, inspector, etc). There are some great ones and terrible ones in every field. Make sure you take the time to get the great ones. It is well worth the effort.
3. DO NOT overbuy. Look at what you think you could 'comfortably' afford within your current budget, and then aim for considerably lower than that (with your mortgage). I know people often use the 'buy the most house you can afford,' but this is terrible advice. Crap happens in life, and if you are scraping by and meeting your expenses every month without any reserves or excess income, you will get walloped at some point.
4. School districts are super important, and are crucial to your value.
5. Get a house with 'good bones.' A lot of newer houses are built with really crappy construction, and will be in bad shape in 10-15 years. You can't see it when the houses are new, but they fall apart fast. It's better to get a smaller, more solidly built house to save you headaches later.
I could go on with this for a long time. There's already enough advice here to make your head spin, so I'll leave it there. Good luck!
This is a little odd given the setting, but is there a way I could send you a message Hoek? My brother-in-law is looking at trade work in West Michigan, and we were even looking at jobs tonight. If not, no biggie, but I thought it might be worth it to take a shot in the dark...
One of these days, the NCAA will stop being a pretender and actually punish rulebreakers. In the meantime, it will take the best of you to remain patient.
Recent Comments
Oh, I agree with you. I think they will be very good. But, what else is new? They have been very good for like 20 years.
I never underestimate them; that has made The Game super fun over the last three years. They will be very difficult to beat, as always, this year. Our odds seem lower this year, with all the change to defeat them. But then, it could happen!
Winning the NC really took a lot of that stress feeling away from me...
Oh my goodness...
As a lifelong Lions fan, and general consumer of way too much football news, this is almost comical to me. Every year in the NFL, there is a ton of noise about who 'won' the offseason. Generally, it's whoever drafted the next 'hot thing' at QB, and/or whoever got the most high-priced free agents. It's very predictable.
Every year, we rank recruiting classes for college football. Who had he #1 class? Who had the #10? Yadda, yadda, yadda.
It's all just noise. Spending money and grabbing 'stars' does not equate to championships. It just doesn't. It shows that you are trying, perhaps, but there is very little correlation to these 'big' offseasons and then immediate championships within 2-3 years. The Jaguars in the NFL like two years ago. Texas A&M. Many, many others. It just doesn't work well.
I suppose Alabama over the years could be considered an outlier, since they consistently had top-5 classes, and then consistently won championships for a stretch of time. However, that felt more like a machine/system, rather than trying to use fundraising to go 'all-in' for stars in a given year.
Sheesh. What are those donors going to do if they lose to UM again? Give even MORE than ten times last year's haul?
I'll take winning the ACTUAL season, thanks.
I agree, but camera angles are funny things. It's possible the image is somewhat misleading, just based on lighting/angle etc.
This board can be ridiculous sometimes. We just hired an NFL DC, who helped invent the system that we have run with great success over the past three years. And yet, many seem unhappy.
This is, of course, less than a month after we won the National Championship.
So many people seem to have their gears permanently set to 'mad' or 'unhappy.' Why don't we at least wait until we play a PRACTICE to get upset about a hire with a great resume?
Be mad if you want, I guess. This seems like a great start for Moore for outside hires in my book!
Braylonfest in 2004 against MSU had some epic crowd energy. From the very low lows in the 4th quarter (down 17) to the resounding build to the finish... it was visceral in the stadium. It's hard to say the team was 'willed' to victory, but it felt like a building avalanche. Once we tied the game up, it felt like there was no way in the world we would lose. Pretty magical.
I mean, "brutally slow" is a relative term. We won the National Championship 22 days ago. Harbaugh was still our head coach SEVEN days ago. We have had our new head coach, Moore, for FOUR DAYS.
These are multi-year, multi-million dollar contracts that are being written for very busy people, many of whom have current jobs. Coach Moore has about 4,567 things to do every day.
I mean, I would love to have immediate answers to every question as well. But I think we can relax on the timeline. I think the University has moved fairly quickly to get a new head coach, and are actively locking down existing coaches, pursuing new ones, keeping the recruiting class together, etc.
I think the internet age has warped our sense of time. I also kind of want everything right now, and for it all to be great and perfect. But that is not realistic. I would MUCH rather take a bit of time and get the right candidate, than be stuck with the wrong one for 1-3 football seasons.
This was my first thought as well! If he doesn't appropriately recover that fumble, game over dude. Season over dude. No national championship!
Great posts in this thread... it's crazy how things come down to a razor's edge...
I think we would be foolish to not split Edwards out wide more than the last two years. Him with Morris, Morgan, and Loveland as receivers? That would feel great as the top 4 in targets!
Mostly a Lurker, occasional poster...
On field? Interception against OSU to seal the game.
Anger? Watching Zinter get hurt... ):
Surprise? The 'no-star' defense reaching historically awesome levels!
Favorite feature? Other than everything? Neck sharpies are amazing!
Thank you to this wonderful site!!
I certainly remember! Thank you for your fine work on the site for many years!!
Hey, it worked for us - if I were other teams, I would be copying it as well!
This certainly helped us this year. I think you can (fairly) legitmately say we had a 2-3 game 'season' by this metric (PSU, Maryland, OSU, and I think Maryland is debatable). Maryland was made much harder by its position in the schedule (one week after a top ten matchup with PSU, week before The Game).
We were effectively able to 'tune up' for a couple of months before we faced truly difficult challenges. It worked for us... it may be helpful for them as well.
I mean, I hope not. Hopefully they are gashed by the run and ineffective on offense... one can dream!
I know we are all on Cloud 9, and soaking in our great moment. I am loving it.
However, I think anyone who thought OSU was 'buried' should re-adjust expectations. We have had a great three year run. But each time, we took down TOP level teams. They were all very, very good - we were just better. I think the idea that someway, somehow, OSU will 'crumble' is not accurate. They will continue to be very good. Honestly, how could they not be with their recruiting classes? Each of the last three games were close at some point. Even this year, they had the ball with a chance at the very end of the game.
These things often come down to a few key plays, and even to luck. It is truly a game of inches. I predict The Game will continue to be very hard, and OSU continues to have an excellent chance to win it. I would not be surprised if they are favored in 2024, or 2025, or any other year.
We just need to keep working and grinding with our excellent team, culture, and coaches. Anything less will lead to a slide. Because you know the whole country is gunning for us now!
Oh, and of course Go Blue. The victors valiant, leaders and best!
Wonderful idea! Will buy!!
Also in West Michigan... I work in real estate over here...
I think people still like Rihanna? ~$1.4B according to Forbes?
Also, I think some people are REALLY into Warren Buffett. Other people seem to worship Musk. It has to be like a TRENDY billionaire though...
This is kind of a meta response. I was interested to read more on the OP's thought, and there have been plenty of threads about MSU and recruiting in here before. I understand that others don't care about this topic.
But why do so many posters have to be so negative to each other in here? To me, it is my least favorite part about this great site/board. And it's not just this post, it happens regularly here.
Why do people feel the need to attack a post they find 'unworthy?' Why do we need a dozen posts (or more) which essentially say 'who cares?' Why should people continue to make responses, in essence, to make the OP feel bad for trying to contribute?
This board is 98% Michigan fans, yet some insist on attacking their own. It makes this place less enjoyable.
There are already moderators on here. If you don't like a post, just ignore it and it will fall off the top couple of pages quickly. Can we attempt to be slightly nicer?
Yep... Drumline member from the mid-2000s here. My memories are tinged a bit from good times with good people. But the concrete "field" and parking lot we practiced on was nothing special from a logistics/practice perspective. I would have rather had the new turf field that was put in after my time, and I'm sure the proposed field will be even better. I do hope that the new practice area is outdoors.
Elbel field was great! We used to have a band-wide flag football league that got really rough. Each section had their own team with a full playoff, etc. Super fun, and they probably discontinued it to prevent injuries and people murdering each other. Not to mention the fun times hanging out there with volleyball, ultimate frisbee, laying out in the sun when it was like 60 degrees out, etcetera. I even played kickball and had picnics with my now wife there...
I feel like I'm generally in line with most folks on here. I will have my 'old guy' memories of my time there, but a lot has already changed. Honestly, my old high school was knocked over, my elementary school no longer exists, etc. I'm sure the new dorm will be nice, and the new field will be excellent. It is the people and experiences that make it special. I'm sure there will be great people and wonderful experiences in the new sites as well!
Honestly, in terms of the distance, it will just provide a few more cadence reps for the drumline on the way to the practice field from Revelli... (:
6'5", 205 pounds, and track speed, but 'narrow build'? I mean, if I'm going prototype, that's a stud WR right there. Assuming he can run routes and catch? I mean, even if he cant, bomb it to the moon and have the guy come down with it...
Yep. Very fair breakdown, well analyzed. Kind of like a quicker Neck Sharpies in video format (although lacking equivalent detail). I enjoyed it!
Nope... He is totally right, and Ohio doesn't need to change a thing!
OSU, you have great coaches, great players, a great scheme, and great toughness! Michigan was just lucky again! So don't worry about it, it will all work itself out next year.
...
(shh... don't tell them. It will make it less fun next year.)
For their sakes, I hope this is hyperbole, or an overblown reaction after a tough loss. If latent hatred gives your life meaning, you have a lot more problems than a football game. Like, if you are in that spot, get some help... Just a terrible and toxic way to live.
Great point. I have been around a lot of people who have gotten to very high levels of success in their field. That fight to get to the top of the mountain is enormously important to long term success.
For our guys, it makes me happy. Because I believe that fight translates well beyond the football field. Eventually, all of these players will be done with football, and we want them to have great lives. That internal fire will really help them no matter what they pursue.
Great points, thank you for the researched take!
I personally love that it appears we have gotten in their heads. To the point, where they question everything. That is an insane amount of D-Line studs. Yet, they are not good enough per fans (based on the original post). So do you change D-line coaches? Change scouts/evaluators of recruits? Change the defensive coordinator or scheme to enhance their skills/talents? Everything is on the table.
And that is an exhausting/difficult place to be. Especially when you are an insanely good program outside of this game (like OSU is from a bird's eye perspective).
Interestingly, if you make the wrong changes, you could very well make things WORSE rather than better. Yikes. Not that I'm sad about it...
I'd argue it was something that most of us did NOT see.
It's whatever changed Harbaugh between 2020 and 2021. Do you remember how he just seemed to hyper focus somewhere between those two seasons? He lost a bunch of belly weight, and just changed his demeanor. He spoke differently, moved differently, etc. I think it was whatever motivated THAT change. And I have no idea what it was.
I really enjoyed that as well, thanks!
The only thing I disagreed with was a specific section about Harbaugh. Pate implied that Jim confidently 'stuck to his guns' with an older school run offense. However, us psychos in here know that he had been constantly tweaking things, often to counter losses to Ohio.
Bringing in Gattis, with his 'speed in space' mantra. Getting away from a true fullback (raise a glass to Bench Mason and the Hammering Panda). Hiring Don Brown. Firing Don Brown. Installing a pro/Ravens-style defense. Etcetera.
Sure, he stuck to a strong and varied run game. But it took a TON of adjustments in coaches and philosophy to get where we are now. And I think Jim deserves a lot of credit for that.
Honestly, I don't even criticize Pate too much for not knowing that. If he is a national guy, there is no way he can get that far in the weeds with each team. But I thought I'd offer some constructive criticism. (:
As a former drumline member, I'm very happy to hear you are OK!
When you were elevated from MMB work to full stadium work, it felt like the most obvious and correct choice possible. Thank you for all of your great work, and get well soon!
Excellent stuff. That would work for me!
My nervousness comes from a different place.
When I rewatched the game from last year, OSU seemed insanely nonchalant for the first 2.5-3 quarters. Like, they didn't seem upset when they missed a pass, or had to punt, or even when we scored. They EXPECTED to win, even when individual drives were not going particularly well. Because since 2004, they had only lost one game (and it was a weird year with an interim HC). So, there was no urgency or fire.
I think they will have a lot more urgency and fire, and their fanbase will be incredibly riled up. Our team better be willing to box, because I am pretty confident OSU will be.
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Alumni here. My two cents, which are probably worth less than that:
He should be fired.
He is in one of the two most visible roles for the University (football and men’s basketball head coaches). He is supposed to lead young men, is insanely well paid, and should be held to a higher (not lower) standard than others.
He should be fired.
It’s like Bobby Knight or Woody Hayes. Not acceptable.
I believe it is possible. I thought something similar as soon as Urban left. It is very difficult to match the success of a top-5 all time winning coach, no matter who you are.
Yes, the cupboard is stocked, and their recruiting is excellent. However, I believe there will be SOME regression. The latest 1st round QB just got cut two years into his contract (Haskins). they haven't had sustained success developing QBs into NFL players in a long time. They just got walloped on national TV. So, there are some chinks in the armor.
Please don't misconstrue this... they are beastly. However, based on statistics and history, the odds of finding back-to-back coaches with Urban levels of success is not very high.
So, will they continue to be excellent? Yep. Will the next 10 years be as good as their previous 10? I doubt it.
We must have been in at almost the same time... Drumline 04-08 here. Thanks for bringing up those good/awful memories! That Northwestern game in the 3-9 rich rod year was horrendous...
The couple of bowl trips before that were awesome though!
This is one of the groups that popped into my head when I read the title as well. I think if they up their stage presence, they are a stadium tourer in the future.
And Jack Stratton from Vulfpeck is a U of M guy (and an awesome dude).
Sitting with the rest of the drumline on the sidelines, about 10 feet from the field. The first ten minutes of that game were glorious, and then it just kept rolling. The Led Zeppelin show at halftime. Dominance to close them out. An amazing day!
Just a mild correction... 'Let's Go Blue' in pregame has been played since at least 2004, when I started with the band. I believe it predates that. Some earlier bando can probably clarify...
Those early morning band practices on game days were pretty magical. Thanks for the nostalgia!
I am a Michigan alum who decided to stay in state.
For me, I felt that the best overall economic opportunities were in entrepreneurship (in the long run). I knew many similarly minded folks in school, and your daughters may be of a similar type.
I am now in my early 30s, and can say this was an EXCELLENT decision for me. I have started 3 companies (some more successful than others), and had a wide variety of 'other' jobs in various industries. If you are ready to work, and have the advantage of a UM education, you can thrive in a variety of fields and industries within Michigan. No doubt.
One of the best parts for me is work/life balance and flexibility. I could have gone the law school route, and gotten in with a large firm. This would have allowed me to make a ton of money, and work 70+ hour weeks for a decade until I made partner (and then worked more). Or, I could have searched out a high-paying job in a more well-known metro area. I would have made more money off that bat. However, I am now quite comfortable, set my own schedule, and live close to family, friends, and places I know well. The grounds are fruitful here, in my opinion.
If your goal is to simply have the highest possible salary, right after school, then you may need to move (depending on your career path). There is no denying that other areas may offer higher starting salaries. But looking at your LIFE as a whole, they may wind up happy that they stayed in state.
For instance, we just had our third child. We are close to family, who can watch our kids or recommend a day care. Our kids will know their cousins, aunts, uncles, and grandparents. We know three good mechanics, and how to grab the best local camping spots.
If you pick up and move to a new area, these things just aren't feasible. You move by yourself (or maybe with one other person), and then try to figure EVERYTHING out. If kids enter the equation, things get much harder without support. They might not care about that at 22, but it may be worth mentioning.
A big part of the reason why I enjoy life to the extent I do is our location. Michigan is home, I have a lot of family here, and work has been challenging (in a good way), and has allowed us to better our financial situation each year. You don't need to move to DC/Austin/California to find that, and doing so may actually hurt your chances of a truly flourishing and happy life.
MANY studies have shown how important relationships are to happiness, as well as experiences. It is easier to craft both great relationships and great experiences (which usually center around people) when you have stronger roots.
Of course, you can find happiness, good work, and a good life anywhere. A lot of that is based on personal decisions (and some luck as well). So if you love the idea of LA, NY, or Nashville, go for it. But the idea that most people NEED to move out of state due to lack of opportunity/inability to maximize their life here is hogwash in my opinion.
It's important to live intentionally, and really choose what they value. For some, family is what matters most. For others, it's all about their career. I find both to be important and valuable, and have struck a good balance in Michigan. I firmly believe others can too.
Great words of advice here. I'm in real estate, and have a couple of others.
1. People lie. I am generally a trusting person, but people will hide things, mislead you, and generally work in their own best interest instead of yours. YOU must be your own best advocate, on everything.
2. Get recommendations and check references when hiring any professional (realtor, inspector, etc). There are some great ones and terrible ones in every field. Make sure you take the time to get the great ones. It is well worth the effort.
3. DO NOT overbuy. Look at what you think you could 'comfortably' afford within your current budget, and then aim for considerably lower than that (with your mortgage). I know people often use the 'buy the most house you can afford,' but this is terrible advice. Crap happens in life, and if you are scraping by and meeting your expenses every month without any reserves or excess income, you will get walloped at some point.
4. School districts are super important, and are crucial to your value.
5. Get a house with 'good bones.' A lot of newer houses are built with really crappy construction, and will be in bad shape in 10-15 years. You can't see it when the houses are new, but they fall apart fast. It's better to get a smaller, more solidly built house to save you headaches later.
I could go on with this for a long time. There's already enough advice here to make your head spin, so I'll leave it there. Good luck!
This is a little odd given the setting, but is there a way I could send you a message Hoek? My brother-in-law is looking at trade work in West Michigan, and we were even looking at jobs tonight. If not, no biggie, but I thought it might be worth it to take a shot in the dark...
One of these days, the NCAA will stop being a pretender and actually punish rulebreakers. In the meantime, it will take the best of you to remain patient.
I'll see myself out...