Your Thoughts On Players Opting Out Now vs. Earlier
Just saw that Aidan O'Connell and "Chuck Sizzle" have both opted out of their bowl game vs. LSU.
Now this question is not aimed at them, because they were playing for a B1G Championship.
But for those who weren't playing for a conference championship, CFP, or bowl game they felt like they'd want to play in...why opt out now? Why not opt out as soon as your team was eliminated from all postseason options that you feel are worth playing in?
Corum got hurt in the last two games. I can't imagine you're more likely to get hurt in a bowl than you would be as a 6-4 team playing in the final games of the season.
Any thoughts on this? Maybe it's the proximity to the NFL Draft? Or related to the holidays? Genuinely curious.
(No, this isn't a rant on opting out in general, it's a question about the timing of opting out)
December 15th, 2022 at 12:27 PM ^
Out of curiosity, what are the projections for O'Connell and "Chuck Sizzle" in the draft?
December 15th, 2022 at 12:31 PM ^
I was thinking the EXACT same question.
And I won't lie...I was thinking, "wait they aren't NFL locks, why wouldn't you use the platform in a big bowl game for the NFL?"
...again, nothing to do with the OP question. But that was also my thought, I looked it up and I can't find anything because they're all so first 3 rounds heavy.
December 15th, 2022 at 1:11 PM ^
Chuck Sizzle might be thinking he needs to have a great combine to bump his draft stock, and that spending the next month on training for that is better than running plays to prep for a bowl game.
December 15th, 2022 at 1:46 PM ^
O'Connell is probably opting out because he so old and needs this time to rest.
/s kinda
December 15th, 2022 at 2:33 PM ^
Both are going to be walk-ons in the NFL. Just you watch, they'll end up playing on the same team. And then Hollywood will make a movie about these 8U baseball teammates ending up in the NFL.
December 15th, 2022 at 3:18 PM ^
They were teammates growing up in Illinois? I had no idea...
December 15th, 2022 at 4:47 PM ^
Did you know Tom Zbikowski from Notre Dame was a boxer?!
December 15th, 2022 at 3:16 PM ^
I saw where O'Connell was the #15 QB according to ESPN. All of the guys that are opting out are third round projections or worse. This would've been a great chance to impress the scouts in front of an SEC defense. Maybe they would've played if Brohm stayed.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:28 PM ^
You need to at least give the NFL a sample size to evaluate you. But once you're done with the regular season, might as well just focus on resting up for combines and pro days.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:30 PM ^
It is a good question. I don't think it will be too long before players are opting out of The Playoff. The usual retort is "well they are playing for a National Championship." But if the reason to opt-out is because of some chance of injury or occurrence that would damage their professional prospects, really who cares? Any college championship is essentially "mythical," not really tangible. If Purdue had beaten Michigan, after the confetti and holding up the trophy football.... really, so what? Would they have then opted out of the Rose Bowl?
I don't get it. Competitors compete. Now with NIL in the mix, transfer opportunities, and so forth, the playing field has been leveled a little bit. I am getting to the point where I think football scholarship agreements should require bowl game participation absent injury or extenuating circumstance. AOC (not that AOC) has an extenuating circumstance with the death or his brother but honestly Charlie Jones should be playing in that game and I am starting to judge players who don't.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:39 PM ^
I'm with you.
Although I'm starting to look at non-CFP bowl games as a preview into the next season.
It's still a reward for seniors (who want it) and it would be scholarships/available players nightmare...but I almost wish anyone graduating or going pro was ineligible and we could really make it about next year.
Again, that could (and should) never happen, but regardless, I have started to look at bowls as a preview, if you're not in the CFP. It allows me to get past judging anyone for making the best decision for himself.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:45 PM ^
There is just no end point to the logic. We are going to have an expanded playoff, and half the teams will have players sitting out because they don't have a "realistic chance" to win the playoff.
December 15th, 2022 at 1:33 PM ^
We don't know that yet. If you make the playoff, that's a big deal. That's what you shoot for all year. I don't think it will be common to opt out of it, outside of cases where a guy is not healthy and doesn't want to gut it out.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:40 PM ^
If a player quits before the end of the season, I suppose a college could take away a scholarship before then end of a semester.
But between the bad PR optics and the whiff of forced labor, I don't see schools doing that.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:55 PM ^
People keep saying that players will start opting out of playoff games. Other than the unique situations, like JSN who is opting out for a good reason (coming off a serious injury and pretty much hasn't played all year), I completely disagree. Opting out of a meaningless bowl game to get ready for the draft is one thing... but opting out of a PLAYOFF game and abondoning your teammates when they need you the most is a very selfish thing to do and also shows a lack of competitive drive. If I was an NFL GM, I wouldn't want a player like that on my team. I would be thinking to myself "OK, so you had a chance to win a national championship and become a legend at your school, and you chose to opt out instead? Sounds like you don't have a strong will to win. We want winners on our team, not selfish players."
December 15th, 2022 at 1:27 PM ^
The difference between the Playoff and a Citrus Bowl win is completely subjective though. Maybe there are seniors on the team who really want to go out with a win. Aren’t you quitting on them? Why would that be looked upon any differently?
And I guess the players don’t look at college football the same way that I do if a win over freaking LSU on News Years Day is not important. Frankly I don’t see why that game would not be the highlight of the year. Puzzling to me.
December 15th, 2022 at 1:36 PM ^
The difference between the Playoff and a Citrus Bowl win is completely subjective though
Huh? There is absolutely an objective difference. One is for a national title, the ultimate goal of any college football team. The other is effectively an exhibition game. It's akin to the difference between the NCAA tournament in basketball and the NIT.
December 15th, 2022 at 3:20 PM ^
I just don’t think your thinking it through. Bowl games don’t matter is a slippery slope to The Playoff doesn’t matter. 20 years ago bowl games were a big deal. They meant something and players strived to be in them and win them. There isn’t anything intrinsically special about winning The Playoff. It frankly is as arbitrary as playing a bowl game. What makes it special is the importance the players assign to it. Right now it is relatively novel, but it will become old-hat just like the bowl games have.
Players opting out is bad for college football and my personal opinion is that it is going to get worse and potentially ruin the sport as long as people hand-waive it away.
December 15th, 2022 at 4:36 PM ^
Uhhh, there sure as hell is something intrinsically special about winning a national championship! That's the ultimate goal in college football... to claim that you were the best team for that year. Teams that win NC's become legendary immediately. That will never NOT be special. That's why you play!
December 15th, 2022 at 5:29 PM ^
Winning a national championship is most certainly not important when weighed against blowing your shot at being successful professionally career, though, right? Isn’t that the logic for opting out?
Why is going to Florida and playing a really good team from a competing conference with your team you have been battling with all year “not important?” What makes it not important?
These players are quitting on their team. They don’t get participation medals for finishing the regular season. It’s a bad look and sets a poor example.
December 15th, 2022 at 1:41 PM ^
here's the thing: you're not an NFL GM.
December 16th, 2022 at 11:55 AM ^
What if it is the NFL GM’s telling the agents to tell their clients to opt out?
If I were an NFL GM and I had seen enough to have a top list of who I would draft, I wouldn’t want to see my potential future draft pick taking a chance to get injured in college.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:57 PM ^
I am getting to the point where I think football scholarship agreements should require bowl game participation absent injury or extenuating circumstance.
Not sure how you force someone to participate. If player doesn't want to be there, it will show up in effort.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:57 PM ^
Considering the Purdue coaching staff changes, I think both do.
December 15th, 2022 at 1:14 PM ^
I think accepting a football scholarship carries with it the obligation to play football, which means suiting up for every game, health permitting. Beyond that, I think a player also has an obligation to their teammates. The arguments of those who support players opting out all involve money and the only obligation they see a player having is to do what’s best for themselves. If money is the only thing that matters, then why not opt out of the CFP, or even some or all of the regular season? I bet we see it someday. Then I think of guys like Karan Higdon, who chose not to play in the bowl game but then never played in the NFL. I wonder if he regrets his decision.
December 15th, 2022 at 2:05 PM ^
The championship is no longer mythical. That's why we have playoffs.
And it's a legacy for players that may never make an impact in the NFL. It is and will always be a big deal.
December 15th, 2022 at 3:23 PM ^
So why should any players keep playing after they cannot win it?
December 15th, 2022 at 9:14 PM ^
I was responding specifically to the comment that championships are mythical (they aren't) and players would sit out rather than play to win it (they won't). Not commenting on players that cannot win it.
December 15th, 2022 at 4:08 PM ^
I hate seeing players opt out. Finish what you started. Your team has another game and it’s a big game for the program. A bowl win looks great for the program and can help with recruiting.
I also wonder when players will start opting out even earlier in the season when their team is eliminated from bowls or CFP. Tie their scholarships and NIL money to finishing the season. You opt out of games you no longer have a scholarship or receive NIL money. This is becoming NFL light so make it a contract
December 15th, 2022 at 12:30 PM ^
There are some things that I don’t think about. This is one of them.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:32 PM ^
It doesn't bother me as much as it seems to bother others. Bowl games by definition are meaningless exhibitions. The only real point to them is building momentum towards the next season -- you get in extra practices, and another game of reps. No one cares if Purdue beats LSU or vice versa.
But if you're not planning on being on the team next season and have aspirations of going pro, what's the point?
December 15th, 2022 at 12:35 PM ^
The problem with this train of thought is that, essentially, all college games are mere exhibitions. Take a team that was out of the Big Ten conference race early but has still qualified for a bowl game. What is the difference between a November game against Maryland and the bowl game? Why should they play the game against Maryland?
December 15th, 2022 at 12:42 PM ^
This is what I'm asking.
Maryland, or...MSU (err, wait, nevermind).
Why did you play in games #11 and #12, but game #13 is all of a sudden an issue?
Just curious.
December 15th, 2022 at 1:13 PM ^
Game 13 comes after a month long layoff and is only 2 months before the Combine.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:46 PM ^
It's a win-win situation for the players and the team. Those who stay will get a chance to play/show what they can do and the coaches can evaluate the players who stay in a game situation.
December 15th, 2022 at 1:08 PM ^
Burgers - hmmm... "no one cares if Purdue beats LSU or vice-versa."
This might be a tangential point - but, here it goes.
If Purdue wins - then, LSU wasn't interested in the game, player opt outs, etc. It was an exhibition.
If LSU wins - then the SEC proves it's a stronger and deeper conference than the B1G. Why - because it just means more.
December 15th, 2022 at 1:20 PM ^
By that reasoning, every game a team like Rutgers plays is meaningless. If you’re an NFL prospect at a school with no post season hopes and a player owes no obligation to his school or teammates (as you seem to believe), why not opt out of some (or all) of the regular season?
December 15th, 2022 at 4:01 PM ^
That's not my definition (meaningless exhibition). Michigan hasn't the most stellar bowl record and as the last game of the season that's the last memory fans have of the team for 8 months. I sort of got the argument when players weren't paid (other than a scholarship worth 6 figures and many other benefits), but now they ARE being paid.
December 15th, 2022 at 4:13 PM ^
I’m think Purdue and LSU players, fans, students all care. So do some fans of both conferences. The conferences also care about the money and the game counts on their permanent records I think it’s ridiculous for people to say no one cares.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:36 PM ^
A lot depends on the relative health of a player. Let's say they've been playing all year with a nagging injury (like Smith-Njigba for example) I think skipping a meaningless game is 100% the right decision. The NFL seemingly puts more stock in your combine numbers than they do your actual game tape so getting ready for that event is WAY more important to their future than winning some random bowl game.
If they're 100% healthy then I think it's a coin-flip based on if you want more game tape or potentially better combine numbers. BTW players opting out used to piss me off but two words changed all that for me.
Jake. Butt.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:40 PM ^
Yeah, what happened to Jake Butt sucked. That was really unfortunate. But I get what I take issue with is the word "meaningless." Why is it meaningless? Isn't that entirely subjective? It just seems like it is only meaningless if they player decides it is.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:46 PM ^
Jake Butt doesn't apply to this conversation.
Michigan would've been in the CFP if they won game #12. That game had significance.
Opting out before the bowl would've made no sense in a B1G hunt + a chance to beat OSU.
Jake Butt would've been relevant in this conversation if Michigan was 5-5 after 10 games in 2016.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:54 PM ^
Opting out before the bowl would've made no sense in a B1G hunt + a chance to beat OSU
Do we do drug testing on this board? Jake Butt was injured in the Orange Bowl which is (checks notes) AFTER the BIG hunt and has nothing to do with beating OSU!
Thus, he is the POSTER BOY for the sit vs play crowd.
Maybe you thought he got hurt playing OSU?
December 15th, 2022 at 12:58 PM ^
What are you talking about? Jake Butt got hurt in the Orange Bowl playing against FSU, not against Ohio State. And that year we had already missed our chance to play in the final four (hence our appearance in the Orange Bowl).
Jake Butt is absolutely relevant to this conversation because he blew out his knew and basically ended his NFL career before it got started playing in what could be described as "a meaningless bowl game."
December 15th, 2022 at 1:17 PM ^
I get the Jake Butt reference, but he has stated that he has no regrets about playing in the bowl game and would make the same decision again even knowing how it played out.
I don't get why the guys from Purdue would sit out. They're building their resumes now for what kind of player a team is, potentially, drafting. Seems like they would have more to gain by demonstrating their love for the game than worrying about what might happen if they get hurt. But who knows, maybe they're uncomfortable with the coaching uncertainty and want to just move on to the next chapter of their lives.
Here's a link to the Butt article:
https://thespun.com/college-football/jake-butt-says-he-has-no-regrets-about-playing-in-bowl-game
December 15th, 2022 at 12:44 PM ^
It sucks for the quality of the bowls and it especially sucks for the rest of their classmates which are largely playing in their last competitive football game ever and it gets ruined a bit by the best players sitting out on both sides
From the perspective of the opt outters I certainly get it though. You’re trying to make a short career of it in the NFL while you can and an exhibition game often isnt worth the risk. Jake Butt was playing an actual great bowl game and it really derailed his pro career when he got injured so I do not fault anyone for sitting out the bowls though it sucks as a fan
December 15th, 2022 at 12:45 PM ^
Keep in mind as well that their coach just announced that he was leaving (can't recall if he's coaching in the bowl game). They may not feel like playing for an interim or a lame duck.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:48 PM ^
Can't imagine he does. Recruiting and the early signing period pretty much eliminates that option for most coaches. Unless you do the Scott Frost thing where you work for UCF during the day and Nebraska at night and you don't sleep for a month.
December 15th, 2022 at 12:48 PM ^
Well one obvious answer to your specific example can be found by asking another question
What really noteworthy event happened to Purdue Football after the Big 10 Championship game?
Lots of players might not feel very motivated after their coach moves on.
More broadly, players are focused on the season 100%. It's a grind. They probably are not giving it much thought during the season.
And big decisions don't get made instantly. Most of these players probably take a couple days to weeks to reflect on things after the regular season is done.
They probably want to get feedback on where they might go in the draft. Talk to coaches, family, people in their circles, reflect.
Finally, even if a player IS thinking about sitting out a bowl game, they're never going to announce that in-season for a variety of good reasons
December 15th, 2022 at 1:02 PM ^
Not digging into this beyond what OP has posted, but I wonder how much Brohm leaving and Purdue hiring a DC played into this decision.
Also, I dont follow draft stock closely but they both strike me as late round picks so perhaps their best chance at making the next level is being healthy.
I'm sure their agents are spinning this as they are focused on prep for the draft to any scout who would have an issue with it.