[Marc-Gregor Campredon]

George Jewett Would Be Proud That This Post Has Graphs Comment Count

Brian October 25th, 2021 at 2:00 PM

10/25/2021 – Michigan 33, Northwestern 7 – 7-0, 4-0 Big Ten

Michigan is 7-0 and has just dispatched an inferior opponent in almost exactly the manner expected to pregame. The Vegas spread was 23.5. The actual spread was 26. Michigan outgained Northwestern two-to-one even if they gave up a 75-yard touchdown. So naturally the Michigan internet is on fire in more or less the same way they would be if the team was hewing close to preseason expectations. (IE: they were butt.)

This is because of a quarterback controversy that currently exists only in the minds of fans. I could explain it but we're Michigan people so someone's already made graphs.

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Cade McNamara is the game manager with limited upside and limited downside who will not lose a game to Northwestern or defanged Penn State or Indiana; JJ McCarthy could be anything and therefore gives you a better shot of cashing this season in at the end of it. The diagram further asserts that McNamara's overall level of play is a titch better than McCarthy's but that doesn't matter for the relevant question.

Because we are Michigan fans the diagrams top out at a 10% chance of beating OSU, and therein lies the mania. For most other programs, this level of performance would be cause for celebration. The quarterback hiccups would be small blemishes on an otherwise impeccable resume, because the last game of the season would not be a gallows. (Or, in Auburn's case, the last game of the season is a gallows that they will escape due to a brief, inexplicable failure of quantum mechanics.)

For Michigan in this moment, every missed deep shot immediately induces not only frustration in the immediate circumstance but reinforces the dread certainty that this guy ain't beating OSU. This would matter less if the team was butt and nobody was beating OSU—although in that circumstance they'd still be calling for the five-star freshman since nobody is beating OSU. You can't win when you're in front of the guy with the woo woo on his 24/7 profile.

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this is Cornelius Johnson, not RJ Moten [Bryan Fuller]

I can see both sides of the QB debate. On the one hand I'm pretty negative about McNamara's performances to date, though not as negative as PFF:

McNamara earned a 57.8 passing grade and led the Wolverines to negative expected points added (EPA) per pass play. The Wolverines signal-caller earned a 37.9 passing grade on passes thrown 10-plus yards downfield, as he completed just 1-of-6 pass attempts for 12 yards. At this point, it is painfully obvious that McNamara will not be able to carry Michigan to victory when they need to win through the air. …

McCarthy did miss a couple of throws, but he has already shown his upside in the vertical passing game — he has thrown fewer than 25 passes this year but already has multiple big-time throws. Overall, McCarthy has earned a 90.5 PFF grade in his limited snaps this season.

On the other, "did miss a couple of throws" seems to undersell McCarthy's wobbliness so far. He hasn't felt more accurate overall than McNamara; he just uncorks an eyepopping throw here and there that obscures the other stuff. Also this felt like a reason he's on the bench:

While cool in the moment—before it got called back for a blindside block—that is bonafide High School Crappe that will get you wrecked if you do it too much. There were a couple games early in the Devin Gardner era with similar escapes, and we were very hyped about them. Then Gardner turned in one of the worst plays in Michigan history* against Notre Dame. That's not going to fly. In a telling post-game moment, McNamara was asked about the above "wow" play and flatly said it was dangerous. This is accurate and not fun at all.

Back to the first hand: the picture that above was McNamara throwing an open post way long when his receiver had inside position and the safety had sucked up on a dig. McNamara threw into double coverage to Sainristil when his other option on a two-man-route was open. He put a throw to an open Schoonmaker down the slot in the wrong spot, etc. Thus the PFF grade. Meanwhile McCarthy appears to bring better-than-functional ability as a runner. The thought of combining the extant ground game with a mobile quarterback is really appealing.

I understand that this switch isn't happening until circumstances are dire, and that there are likely good reasons that it hasn't happened already. I also understand people who want to damn the torpedoes and see what Michigan's got. Likely this is moot. All of this is entering Approaching The Lucy Football territory, which is inadvisable since OSU has the top offense in the country by 4.5 points per game according to SP+.

It's possible that "could beat Ohio State" isn't actually the best metric to go on since approximately zero plus 50 percent is still approximately zero. People have differing risk tolerances. Football coaches do not, and that's another way things are moot. It'll be McNamara until it can't be McNamara anymore.

*[Standalone category. IE: how bad was this play in a vacuum, without game context.]

 

AWARDS

Known Friends and Trusted Agents Of The Week

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[Fuller]

-2535ac8789d1b499[1]you're the man now, dog

#1(t) Hassan Haskins and Blake Corum. This was not planned but seven games into the season these guys are tied in the points standings here. Each turned in spectacular plays in their milieu: Haskins stayed upright in a rugby scrum that turned a four yard run into a 19 yard one while Corum repeatedly WOOPed guys in the hole and then WOOPed the safety coming down trying to put the fire out. Five points each, they're made up and don't matter.

#2 Aidan Hutchinson. This section threatens to become fairly boring. It's going to be one or two running backs and Hutchinson in some order, with game heroes sprinkled in. But, I mean… what can you do? Hutchinson sent the right tackle out of the game with a broken soul. He also got half a sack, further proving that numbers cannot encompass his play.

#3 DJ Turner. Hey, here's someone new. Turner got a thumping TFL early, made a spectacular interception late, and in-between was the target of the worst penalty call in a Michigan-Northwestern game since Karan Higdon got called for holding.

Honorable mention: Erick All was a reliable underneath option and erased some dudes on the edge. The OL kept the QBs clean with one notable exception and consistently delivered guys downfield, except when NW overplayed and it still didn't matter. Josh Ross delivered a number of sticks to NW RBs, nearly had an INT, and could have had a sack but for some holding.

KFaTAotW Standings.

(points: #1: 8, #2: 5, #3: 3, HMs one each. Ties result in somewhat arbitrary assignments.)

28: Aidan Hutchinson (HM WMU, #2 Wash, #1 Rutgers, #1 Wisc, HM Neb, #2 NW)
18: The OL (#1 Wash, #1 NIU, HM Neb, HM NW)
17: Hassan Haskins (HM WMU, T3 Wash, T2 NIU, #2 Neb, T1 NW), Blake Corum (#2 WMU, T3 Wash, T2 NIU, HM Neb, T1 NW)
8: Ronnie Bell (#1 WMU), Brad Hawkins (#1 Neb)
7: Dax Hill (#3 WMU, HM NIU, HM Rutgers, HM Wisc, HM Neb)
6: Nikhai Hill-Green(HM NIU, #2 Rutgers)
5: David Ojabo (#2 Wisc), Brad Robbins (HM Wash, #3 Rutgers, HM Wisc), Jake Moody (HM Wash, HM Wisc, #3 Neb), Josh Ross (HM Wash, HM NIU, HM Rutgers, HM Neb, HM NW)
4: AJ Henning (HM WMU, #3 NIU)
3: Donovan Edwards(T2 NIU), Roman Wilson (#3 Wisc), DJ Turner (#3 NW)
2: Cornelius Johnson(HM NIU, HM Wisc),
1: Andrew Vastardis (HM WMU),Mike Sainristil (HM WMU),  Mazi Smith (HM Wash), Gemon Green(HM NIU), Chris Hinton (HM Rutgers), Erick All (HM NW)

Who's Got It Better Than Us(?) Of The Week

Difficult selection since Michigan didn't have a scrimmage play longer than 24 yards, but for my money it's the Corum third down run right before Michigan broke up M00N 2, because just look at this:

That turned a dicey redzone proposition into a touchdown, as Michigan just went hurry-up and dove in with Corum right after the above.

 

Honorable mention: Rugby scrum run, Hutchinson dump truck sack, the other Corum run where he WOOPed two guys, James Ross breaking up a third consecutive third down screen.

image​MARCUS HALL EPIC DOUBLE BIRD OF THE WEEK.

Northwestern gets a 75-yard touchdown that sets Twitter on fire for halftime.

Honorable mention: Michigan's drive after the 75-yard TD ends in a fumble on some cute perimeter stuff. McNamara misses various deep shots. Egregious PI call on Turner is egregious.

[After THE JUMP: 1 and 3]

OFFENSE

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[Fuller]

In which radically positive podcast takes are not radically positive enough. I thought Blake Corum was PFF's top-ranked running back and that Hassan Haskins was around 15th. This was actually underselling it:

Corum and fellow backfield partner Hassan Haskins tore up the Northwestern defense Saturday and find themselves first and third, respectively, in the overall running back rankings with TexasBijan Robinson sandwiched between them. Against the Wildcats, the duo produced a 0.58 missed tackle rate and gained a first down or touchdown rushing on 43% of their carries while averaging 5.5 yards per carry and four yards after contact per rush.

This provides a valuable sanity check for Seth's numbers, which are way out of line with historic running back UFR +/-. That does not appear to be an artifact of grading differences between us. They're just real good.

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[Fuller]

Outside bottled up largely. Michigan could not be accused of mindlessly bashing it up the middle in this game. A number of end-arounds got decent to good yardage and if anything Michigan's redzone playcalling could be accused of being too cute on the edge. The above from Henning was productive but required him to zip through a couple tackles, and on other attempts Northwestern successfully bent the ballcarrier away from the LOS.

Two backup guards. Northwestern is a very bad run defense, granted. Still worth mentioning that Michigan did their clobbering without either of their starting guards and the dropoff didn't seem that big. There was the one missed blitz pickup when Northwestern successfully disguised that a safety was coming, and I'm sure there were some run game hiccups. I'll take that performance from backups.

FWIW, this play was discussed in some depth on the podcast. Seth noted that the line call probably did not account for the safety, and I asserted that while that is likely true there are situations where the line call needs to be overridden by your OL spidey sense. When Filiaga checks right here and then left and the guy on the left runs that far away from him this needs to spur some Admiral Akbar in your head:

It's a trap.

Anthony over Baldwin. Andrel Anthony was much more prominent in the second half of this game than he had been all year. One dollar says this is directly traceable to the end of the first half, when Baldwin was tasked with a crack block on a safety that he completely whiffed, leading to the Sainristil fumble.

Anthony didn't do a ton but did get an end-around that he was forced to bend way back to avoid a DL who was way upfield. Making five yards out of what looked like a big loss was impressive. If that's truly indicative of his size/speed combo he's got a bright future.

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[Campredon]

All gets involved. I was watching Erick All in pregame warmups and he's a guy who just jumps out as a different dude, even in drills. Michigan's failure to translate that to production has been frustrating, although All has had a part in that with some quasi-drops. Here he was a reliable underneath target to move the chains and Michigan's leading receiver. Hopefully Michigan can get additional production out of him.

Rugby. This is up there with Mike Hart's eight yard run against PSU in the category of "shortest run everyone was super hype about":

I don't know how much to credit that to Haskins since at some point he's just passenger on the beeftrain, but to be able to come out of that with any balance whatsoever and then rip off another chunk is impressive.

Looks like split but it's going off the front. It's always hard to tell what's baked in to a gameplan that uses a lot of zone and what's improvised; here it felt like Michigan made a concerted effort to show split zone and their insert isos off of it and then just run to the frontside of the play once the linebackers had reacted to the split flow. Michigan got multiple touchdowns as a frontside double blasted back the NU DT and then there was no one scraping over the top of that until it was too late. Those were walk-in TDs for Haskins and Corum.

DEFENSE

Touchdown first take. Here it is:

IMO: Michigan is dropping Ross out to defend RPOs and inserting Hawkins in to the box to make up the numbers. Colson, a true freshman, should funnel to help, which is usually Ross but not on this play. So that cuts Hawkins out, Ross understandably can't recover in time, and then RJ Moten inexplicably seeks out contact with a blocker instead of running after the ballcarrier.

Also, yes, the line got creased but that's a reason Northwestern might get a 10 yard run, not a 75-yard one.

Two other things that happened. Other successful Northwestern plays came in two varieties: overloading zones with flood stuff and picking the open guy on the sideline, which happened about three times, and that drive where Northwestern ran screens on every third down. Michigan finally adapted on number three and Josh Ross dropped off to knock the pass away. Screens have been productive for the opposition this year even though Michigan's got a little fortunate with deflections. Something to work on.

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[Campredon]

Welcome to the show, DJ Turner. Turner supplanted Gemon Green in the starting line up and was up to the task. The juggling interception above is one thing but he was there to PBU on a quick hitch, which is probably more important in the long term than his ability to bat the ball to himself several times and then bring it in.

Northwestern isn't the sternest test for a new CB, especially after Stephon Robinson went out. Encouraging nonetheless.

Uh… that's it? Everything else went basically as expected and there is not a whole lot else of note when Hilinksi's opportunities to hit guys downfield are spurned.

SPECIAL TEAMS

A blocked punt. Cornelius Johnson picked up Michigan's first blocked punt of the year on a free run from the edge. Special teams has been so good that it's been easy to forget that Michigan used to block punts all the time; nice to be reminded that doesn't have to be past tense. The way they did it was fairly typical: send three guys at the shield and then run a dude around them. Michigan has to set that up so that they can get a free run—nobody touched Johnson on the play—and that requires a series of feints and misdirection about who's actually coming, but the regularity with which they get through remains impressive.

Clockwork. Robbins punts: 48 yards, 47 yards, 47 yards. Unfortunate not to have one slightly shorter, as the coverage team couldn't handle a ball that landed at the ~2.

MISCELLANEOUS

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[Campredon]

Cumong man. The guys above are probably reacting to the PI on Turner but it's possible they were looking at various things that were done to Aidan Hutchinson that are not in fact legal. OL are not allowed to convert themselves into backpacks. This is not a viable method of dealing with Aidan Hutchinson, except it kind of is. Josh Ross was also the subject of a pretty obvious yank-back just before he was going to get to Hilinksi on a third down.

There's a lot of complaining about holding that is not valid but the Hutchinson ones in particular are baffling to me. If you're all the way around a guy and suddenly it looks like you're on a treadmill you have been held.

So hockey started and did not stop over and over again. Just for comparisons sake, there are 20 halftime minutes in football and 24 intermission minutes in hockey. There are six minutes of commercial breaks in the rest of a hockey game. Football eats up that ten minutes of Stuff Isn't Happening in the first half of the first quarter. After not having gone to Yost for a season, the first time sitting down and watching a hockey game that was over in two hours and change was shocking. These sports nominally have the same amount of time on the clock.

HERE

Best and Worst:

And while NW’s offense is exactly as bad as you expected coming in, the Wildcat defense is pretty good (though below their usually hyper-gritty selves).  They came into the game 31st per SP+, putting them around Nebraska (29th), Arizona St. (30th) and Kentucky (37th) in that metric, and yet Michigan seemed largely unfazed after the first possession or two.  UM moved the ball mostly at will, with drives often stalling because of bad execution or bad luck and less because NW was truly limiting what UM wanted to do.  And that continues a pretty consistent trend for UM against P5 teams this year – they’ve faced the #48 (Washington), #29 (Rutgers), #25 (NW), #24 (Nebraska), and 1st (Wisconsin) defenses per SP+ and have averaged a healthy 5.3 ypp in those games.  And defensively they’ve risen to #8 in the country largely on the strength of giving up few big plays; the 75-yard run by Hull was the first (and only) play this year over 50 yards.  And perhaps just as impressively, they’ve only given up 68 plays of over 10 yards a game this year, which given the fact they’re breaking in a new DC (and a new scheme) is one of the more pleasant surprises of the season.

State of Our Open Threads:

Indeed, after the 299 fucks given during the Nebraska thread, we only gave 96 fucks yesterday, which is our second lowest total this year (our lowest if you want to just not count the meager 18 given for the Northern Illinois game). It is certainly the lowest among the four conference games we have played so far, so if nothing else, yesterday was a brief respite for us.

More on the QB controversy-type substance:

I get it; JJ McCarthy is Dyno-mite:

And when he's out there, there's always a chance for something electric to happen, he's got IT and I won't argue that, But the TEAM(3x) is riding an undefeated season, based a lot on the unity in the locker room, why would a fan want to risk upsetting that? And saying that, I hope the staff is preparing JJ to be ready to start every game and I hope he sees plenty of snaps at meaningful times to get him ready. I'll be so stoked when it's his time. But to think his time is NOW, is pure lunacy.

I get it, he's a 5* legit! but which one of those stars means he's ready to win rivalry road games in his first couple starts? Which one means he won't thrown an interception in his first 150 passes? Is he ready for a "whiteout"?

This is pure Hubris.

Comments

umich1

October 26th, 2021 at 7:33 AM ^

As the guy who built that graph, I don’t think it would be as compelling today.  One of the axes of that graph was the sack rate from Football Outsiders.com; implying the expected correlation that defenses that live in the offensive backfield should draw more holding calls.

2018 and prior Michigan was top 10 in that stat.

Today we are truly average (50s).

 

 

Bohannon

October 25th, 2021 at 2:27 PM ^

Small feelingsball note: 

I loved hearing the stadium crowd noise escalate as the pile drove forward and Haskins eventually emerged. 

Go effing Blue. 

Thanks for the write-up, Brian. 

njvictor

October 25th, 2021 at 2:33 PM ^

I appreciate the first part of this write up because I hope it shuts up some of the McCarthy truthers. For every "wow" play from McCarthy, you're gonna get him missing 2-3 routine throws. Is his ceiling higher? Sure, but putting in McCarthy is going to result in a more volatile offense with more big plays, but also more 3 and outs and turnovers

GRWolverine1223

October 25th, 2021 at 3:47 PM ^

I like the perspective njvictor but a key question I have is if we line up Cade against OSU/Bama/Georgia, and those teams stack the box against our run and dare a downfield throw, can Cade honestly deliver? Can he make the pull read and run the ball? Can he escape pressure, buy time and punish the back end? I honestly don't think so... So then are we just deferring the inevitable truth for some sense of false accomplishment?

I'd also argue that with our solid defense to bail us out it might have been worth having a volatile offense through these first 7 games against crummy teams and develop JJ into a quarterback that can beat those top 5 teams. 

UMinSF

October 25th, 2021 at 9:18 PM ^

Thank you GR for making your point about OSU/Bama/Georgia specifically.

It drives me crazy when people talk about how "we can't beat good teams" or "we can't beat top 10 teams" with our current offense. The fact is, we can. 

Michigan can beat top 10 MSU with Cade. We could beat ND, or Cincinnati, or Oklahoma (please note, I'm saying we COULD, not that we WOULD - hell, that's why games are played). Our team, as currently constructed, pretty clearly seems capable of beating almost anyone.

There are 3 teams this year that are simply a cut above everyone else. Honestly, the debate about Cade and JJ is pretty much about whether it's possible to beat those 3 teams with a game manager like Cade, or whether we should roll the dice and hope for greatness - and risk disaster - with JJ.

OSU/Bama/Georgia. That's what this is about. And of course, that really means OSU.

I don't know the answer. I'm just glad to see you have properly framed the debate. Well done!

JFW

October 26th, 2021 at 8:13 AM ^

That's a great point. This team, and this offense, can beat most teams in college football. 

But OSU/Bama/Georgia are at different levels this year (and OSU/Bama are most years). Could we beat them? Maybe. That's why games are played. 

But there isn't some secret sauce to scheme or starting players on our team that can have us walk into a game with those three with a consistent expectation of victory. 

SAM love SWORD

October 25th, 2021 at 2:36 PM ^

After rolling with the "higher upside" guy the last three years in Milton and Patterson, I'm not surprised the coaches are content with moderate consistency. I know comparing JJ to those guys isn't apples to apples, but as I fan I can't say I mind the steady hand at the helm.

MGoStrength

October 25th, 2021 at 2:37 PM ^

While cool in the moment—before it got called back for a blindside block—that is bonafide High School Crappe that will get you wrecked if you do it too much. 

I get that, and it's probably accurate 99% of the time.  But, at the same time you can find several great college QBs like Newton, V. Young, Manziel, Murray, Vick, Watson, etc. who did this sort of silly running around in circles because they are more athletic than everyone else until they found a lane or WR to throw.  This is essentially what makes the uber athletic mobile QB impossible to defend in college.

It's possible that "could beat Ohio State" isn't actually the best metric to go on since approximately zero plus 50 percent is still approximately zero. People have differing risk tolerances. Football coaches do not, and that's another way things are moot. It'll be McNamara until it can't be McNamara anymore.

Is there more to this "whatever it takes to potentially beat OSU" thing than just the QB.  This whole risk adverse system seems to be all over the offense.  This is essentially my problem with JH's offenses.  They are boring as hell to watch because he is so risk adverse.  They just don't attempt to make enough plays and are too predictable.  How often do we throw on 1st down?  How often does OSU throw on 1st down.  I'd bet UM is like 77% and OSU is like 35%.  And, where is the intermediate passing?  It's all dink & dunk or deep balls.  Again, very low risk.  This is great for beating inferior teams for a consistent 8-10 wins.  It will never ever be enough to keep with Ryan Day's offenses.

stephenrjking

October 25th, 2021 at 2:46 PM ^

Most of those guys really didn't scramble around in the backfield that much. Manziel did, but he was faster than JJ and made mistakes. Kyler Murray and Pat Mahomes do that sort of thing, but JJ is not Mahomes/Murray-level athletic. He didn't elude Northwestern's rather pitiful defense by that much, and the throw he wound up making was... meh. 

And he literally missed a guy wide open for the first down on that play before bugging out of the pocket. 

https://twitter.com/JDue51/status/1452270445907128323?s=20

Kyler Murray types don't grow on trees, which is why Murray won a Heisman and got drafted #1 overall. JJ won't win games by scrambling around all of the time; he'll win by standing in the pocket, making the right reads, and nailing passes to his receivers. And he may well do that in the coming years; he's not quite making those plays consistently yet, though. 

MGoStrength

October 25th, 2021 at 3:50 PM ^

JJ won't win games by scrambling around all of the time; he'll win by standing in the pocket, making the right reads, and nailing passes to his receivers.

To clarify I wasn't suggesting he was like those other guys, rather that they do exist and can do that effectively, even if in rare instances.  JJ probably is not in that group, but he does have plus athleticism for a QB and can extend plays that Cade would be forced to throw away or take a sack.  There are times a guy will do things you wouldn't normally recommend, but he makes it work.  I recall Mack Brown saying along those lines with Vince Young...that his performance really took off when they stopped trying to change him.  Again, I'm not saying that's JJ, but it is possible that some guys can simply do things unconventionally that others can't.

B-Nut-GoBlue

October 25th, 2021 at 10:46 PM ^

There are times a guy will do things you wouldn't normally recommend, but he makes it work. 

I'm pretty sure it's that exact sentence he typed.  Sometimes guys just have the ability to pull some shit that isn't otherwise taught to 95% of other players.  It excels them to a level above the rest and the team benefits.  Is that JJ?  Who the hell knows.  But that was his...point.

MGoStrength

October 26th, 2021 at 11:55 AM ^

so what is your point? 

That talented athletes exists that the normal rules don't apply to and we make an exception for them.  I'm not saying JJ is one of them, but we've heard JH reference this once already.  When JJ made that big throw across the field after a scramble and most coaches would have advised against it, but it worked for a big TD, JH's response was that he doesn't want to handcuff his playmaking too much.  So, sometimes the rules don't apply.  That's my point.

MGoStrength

October 26th, 2021 at 8:28 PM ^

It just comes off as you arguing both sides, to me anyway. 

It's not an argument, it's a discussion.  Isn't that you what you do on discussion boards? 

I agree the rules usually apply.  I'm just highlighting that the normal rules don't always apply to special players.  You don't have a 5-star QB all the time.  There's a level of excitement just like with DPJ, Gary, Peppers, Dax, etc.  The chances your 5-star QB is one of those 1% that the normal rules don't apply to is higher. 

JFW

October 26th, 2021 at 8:42 AM ^

Ugh... with a good O line and a good running game I hope to very rarely ever see a scramble like that. That's a broken play, not a good one, and most times bad shit happens. 

To me if JJ was consistently more accurate with his throws and kept the ball on the read more often and made plays on a planned run option that is far more upside than running around risking a huge yardage loss or a fumble while he's trying to make something happen. 

AlbanyBlue

October 25th, 2021 at 2:38 PM ^

There are graphs. With smooth (-ish?) curves. The answer is simple.

1. Find the area under both curves.

2. Play the QB with the greater area.

3. Profit.

Who said you'd never use calculus? This can tell us how to get into the playoff!!

/s (if it's necessary.....it shouldn't be, but if it is.)

KC 97 03

October 25th, 2021 at 2:43 PM ^

Couple of things I noticed on the deep balls to Sainristil was that he would stop running and then jump.  It looked like if he kept running he makes the catch (or at least dropped in his bread basket).  That's what it looked like from the stadium anyway.

RJWolvie

October 25th, 2021 at 5:35 PM ^

On rewatch, looking closely (as camera angle allowed) at Cade’s decision making and throws: i saw one bona fide bad throw and lots of not so open to well covered receivers. Not to mention HOW MANY?!?! routes short of the sticks?! I think the receivers need share a lot more blame than they are for the inconsistency of passing game.*
*also: I am convinced Mich threw so much against a decent+ pass D even though terrible run D to get more prep in for game this weekend. 

East Quad

October 25th, 2021 at 2:44 PM ^

Cade McNamara is CYAN-O-MITE!

Support the consistent one until the job requirements change or the experience and judgment catch up!

GO CADE!!!

GO JJ!!!

GO BLUE!  BEAT STATE!

antonio_sass

October 25th, 2021 at 2:49 PM ^

Regardless of who the QB is, I think our receivers are kinda bad, and it doesn't get talked about much. 

I watched a lot of top 25 teams this weekend. WRs around the country regularly make better plays on imperfect throws.

stephenrjking

October 25th, 2021 at 2:55 PM ^

They're ok. Not great. Johnson can make plays at times, and it will be good to have Roman Wilson back.

But, yeah, losing Bell in the first game, and losing out on Xavier Worthy, were pretty big blows to a team that already struggles a bit with WR development. I'm not unhappy with our individual receivers, it's just that none of them are real WR1 types. It's a problem, but this year it is what it is. 

Ecky Pting

October 25th, 2021 at 2:52 PM ^

The Cade distribution as drawn exhibits negative skewness for no apparent reason other than to make the Chi-squared tests for the "loss vs. NU" and  "win vs. OSU" come out equal. If Cade's distribution is symmetrical (i.e. skewness=0), as JJ's apparently is judging from JJ's equal Chi-squared tests for two the cases above, the Chi-squared test result for a "win vs. OSU" would be much higher than 2% for Cade.

GoBlueMike21

October 25th, 2021 at 3:02 PM ^

I don't know...I have no fucking idea what is pass interference anymore.  Pisses me off too.  Like everyone else I don't know why we don't see a lot of holding calls on the opposition when it looks pretty obvious on tv.  Just frustrated with the garbage officiating week in and week out.  Other than that, can't wait for Saturday.  Go Blue!!!

AC1997

October 25th, 2021 at 3:05 PM ^

I will admit that I'm mostly a Cade guy and have defended him throughout the season.  My senior year was 1997 and I had similar frustrations with Brian Griese at times knowing there were better players waiting behind him.  

The piece of the puzzle that is not being addressed by enough fans, which TTB did a good job of this week, is our inability to get WR open downfield.  I'm sure part of that falls on Cade and I know that it is hard to know without the all-22 or what his instructions were for the play reads.  

But with a running game as good as ours, why aren't we getting guys open deep?  Why aren't we testing that in more ways?  The picture clipped in this post does illustrate that the throw wasn't good, but it also illustrates that the DB is all over Johnson and he's not really "open" - putting the pressure on Cade to make a very good throw.  On the other throw, it was double coverage.  I know that Bell is out and Wilson has been hurt....but it feels like something that falls on Gattis as much as anyone else.  I would also speculate that even a "good" QB only completes 40% of those long throws so when you only get 2-3 per game the difference between good and bad is hard to tell. 

MGoBlue96

October 25th, 2021 at 3:53 PM ^

Well I would argue do we really have the whole picture? I honestly think Cade has issues going through progressions if his first read isn't there so can we 100% assume receivers may not be creating some seperation on routes not thrown too including some deep ones? I mean it's just the reality as a tv viewer that we can't see all the routes and if there was someone creating seperation on a given play who just happened to not get the ball. Note that is a possible defense of the receivers not a call for JJ since we can assume a freshman is not going to be great on read progression himself.

AC1997

October 25th, 2021 at 4:23 PM ^

Exactly.  The one clear frustration I have with Cade is the lack of keeping on a read....like....EVER.  I still can't say 100% that's on him or the coaches, but just do it 2-3 times per game so that it actually makes those plays relevant.  PLEASE.  

For JJ, my preference would be to get him in the game with a little more diversity to his playcalls and maybe slightly more often.  I thought he should have been in on Cade's last drive since the game was over at that point.  I didn't mind that they brought him in for one play to handoff to Henning because that broke a tendency.  Now give him an RPO or just a drop back pass or two.  I'm sure they're saving some of that for the big games (which is fine) but give him more reps when the game allows.  

Despite that, I'm still a Cade guy partially because of our success on the field and his contributions and partially because I've been a fan for the last ten years and have seen the following QBs who are almost all worse than Cade:

  • Denard with messed up elbow
  • Devin with broken ribs & confidence while playing in a non-sensical system
  • Rudock who was bad for 4 games, mediocre for 4 games, and good for 4 games
  • Speight who was okay and then physically broken
  • O'Korn who was....well....O'Korn
  • Peters who still seems shell-shocked when you watch him play
  • Shea of the alternating promise, frustration, and self-inflicted sack 
  • Milton and his erratic cannon
  • McCaffrey who never got much of a chance but is the king of low YPA

When faced with that list, I'll be content with competence until JJ is ready to be more than that.  I don't think we've hit that point yet and if we win this week I'm not sure we will this year.

BlueKoj

October 25th, 2021 at 4:48 PM ^

Put broken Denard on this team and the rushing game cannot be stopped (it'd be glorious). Put broken Devin on this team and this team is better. I'll take Rudock's 2nd half of the season on this team and a shot at the B1G. I'd ride 2016 Speight with this team too even with the shoulder. We likely lose to OSU regardless, but that's it.

MH20

October 26th, 2021 at 12:11 PM ^

Denard couldn't pass the football the latter half of 2012. Putting him at QB would just result in teams loading the box with 8-9 guys every play.

All glory to Devin for going through what he did in his time at Michigan, but in his "broken" state he made absolutely awful decisions with the football. IMO, there's no way if you ported his 2014 version onto this team that they become better. Do you not recall the soul-crushing interceptions he used to throw?

I agree 100% on Rudock; he was masterful down the stretch in 2015. Him hitting those intermediate-to-deep passes gave Michigan a pretty elite offense.

Speight had pretty good numbers but I also think that was a product of the overall team (and having much better pass-catchers). Starting with that Iowa game, he was okay-to-downright-bad. I don't think the version of him with a bad shoulder is any better than Cade.

MGoBlue96

October 25th, 2021 at 5:25 PM ^

You misunderstood, I wasn't talking about that type of read, I am saying his ability to go through his reads on WR's routes is not great. Ability to get to his non first option on a passing play. As a fan all we see is if the guy he threw to created seperation and is open, we can't see if someone running another route was open and QB never got to him on looking through the routes available.