Speight Returning?
Per Harbaugh:
"Got good news in recent cat scan. Doctors surprised he's so far along."
Wilton seems like a great candidate to grad transfer a la Shane Morris in the offseason, but I(much like many of you I'd presume) can't shake the feeling that Jim believes he gives us the best chance to win. If I was forced to bet on this, I'd say Wilton is starting against ND on September 1st rather than for Central/someone similar.
November 6th, 2017 at 5:03 PM ^
Why play the guy that does not take care of the ball(Speight) if the running game will carry the guy that does(Peters)?
November 6th, 2017 at 6:21 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 5:47 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 1:36 PM ^
Not sure about Tim, but for me? It would take Peters demonstrating that he can run more than a half-dozen pass plays.
He made no glaring mistakes on Saturday because he wasn't asked to do anything. The passes he is throwing are the most basic concepts available. He goes to the line, knows who he is going to throw to, and throws it to him, often well. But in metaphorical terms he's a kid using a floatie in the shallow end of the pool right now, and as a consequence the offense really has no plan B available if he is in the game. And we're going to need a plan B against Wisconsin and OSU.
November 6th, 2017 at 2:25 PM ^
Speight gives us the entire playbook. I don't think we'll need it against Maryland (or Wisconsin for that matter), but we're sure as hell going to need it against OSU.
If Speight is healthy and ready, I want him under center.
November 6th, 2017 at 2:43 PM ^
he does throw a prettier pick 6 than Okorn does.
November 6th, 2017 at 2:48 PM ^
He had some yips early this year, but I blame the OL for a lot of that. He didn't get much time at all in the pocket. Now that we at least have a run game I think he'd look a lot better.
I just don't know about Peters. There's a reason he was #3.
November 6th, 2017 at 4:05 PM ^
that 100% of Speights 2017 problems were due to an awful O-line and mostly freshman recievers. It's just that the end of 2016 wasn't that great for him either.
Was it all about his injury at Iowa?
He dug himself into & out of quite a few holes.
Maybe Michigan gameplans differently with him under center and it's not always as effective as it should be on paper. . .
I'm sure he knows the playbook better, and thats huge, but I'd hate to see any possible Peters momentum crushed prematurely.
I'd like to see this Peters learning curve for at least another game, It's prettyy obvious that this team has rallied around him, and I don't think he's #3 anymore.
Whatever Coach decides when the time comes is fine.
November 6th, 2017 at 5:37 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 4:11 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 1:12 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 10:08 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 1:12 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 1:13 PM ^
Lame.
November 6th, 2017 at 1:15 PM ^
Pretty sure there was some national news about him continuing to play through a concussion a few years back....
Besides, I'm not hating on Wilton at all. I just get the feeling that he will be starting next year.
November 6th, 2017 at 2:40 PM ^
you even suggesting he'd leave. That's absurd. As others have mentioned, he is clearly the best QB on the roster right now. It isn't even close. Your OP reads like a weird backhanded compliment: "I get the sense that JH thinks he gives us the best chance to win"...uh, no kidding. Anyone with eyes and rudimentary knowlegde of football can see that he gives us the best chance to win.
Unless he's physically unable to play or Peters makes massive strides in the offseason, Wilton Speight will be ahead of him on the depth chart.
November 6th, 2017 at 2:59 PM ^
Your thoughts are spot on if Speight held the promise that someone like Rudock did(meaning he showed consistent growth at Michigan-There's no arguing that Wilton regressed). Peters has a very small sample size, too small to say he is the perfect answer(19/28 184 yards, 2 tds 0 INTs). However, if Peters does progress and takes care of the ball, I don't think he requires massive strides to be named our starter at all.
I don't necessarily think Jim is against playing young guys-He went hard after Josh Rosen when he first came to town; would have to imagine he wouldn't have him ride the pine. I just think he likes Wilton's leadership so much that my gut tells me he would want to work with that over Peters should he have mild success in our next four games.
I would also be interested to know what the break-even point is in Wilton's mind should Peters play very well to wrap up the season. There would be a lot of teams that would want Wilton for sure, and he wouldn't have to sit out a year like Will Grier did.
November 6th, 2017 at 4:30 PM ^
struggling for 3.5 games this year behind an atrocious offensive line that couldn't pass protect or run block, and throwing to very young, ineffective receivers indicated that he regressed, we can just agree to disagree.
He didn't get worse, the pieces around him did.
I'll grant you that if Peters actually does something against Wisconsin and/or OSU, he might not be as bad as it takes to be sitting behind John O'Korn. But all evidence points to that being the case right now. He certainly does have the talent to take a big leap between now and next year.
November 6th, 2017 at 4:58 PM ^
Have our surrounding 10 on offense gotten better since Wilton got hurt? In some ways yes(run blocking is better, pass protection is stagnant). In some ways no(Tarik Black getting hurt has made things more difficult).
I just don't ascribe to the thinking that Wilton had all of these obstacles against him, and Peters does not have those obstacles.
Wilton's pick sixes killed us in Columbus(I was there to see that firsthand), he had even less time against Florida State(was also at this game, don't blame him for that one) and his start against Florida was brutal as well.
Short story is that I don't see a reason to stick my neck out for Speight like he is anything more than what he's shown. Same rule applies to Peters. Just hope we get consistent QB play soon either way!
November 7th, 2017 at 1:31 AM ^
He does. And that's part of the reason why he threw for a paltry 56 yards on 13 attempts (4.3 YPA!!) against Minnesota and has fewer than 200 yards at just 6.6 YPA despite playing nearly two games at home against bad teams.
Speight wasn't good with this offense, but Peters looks far more limited right now. Which means he has a long way to go.
I guess I'm giving Speight the benefit of the doubt against OSU and FSU because he was hurt and under constant duress. But he was very good for the first 9 games. Check all the stats Brian cites on Recap. That's what he was doing when healthy with some pass catching weapons as a third year player. I would expect he could do even better as a fifth year player, and Peters has a lot of improvement to beat that out.
November 7th, 2017 at 8:47 AM ^
To Wilton?
Wilton has not been good, he has been serviceable at best. He was fantastic at home last year, and brutal on the road(11/26 for 103 yards with 0 tds and 1 int in the season ruining Iowa game). His pick six in Columbus killed us, especially since our defense held them to 81 yards in the first half!! This year, he was 44/81(54% completion with 3 tds and 2 ints) before getting hurt.
I cheer for every Michigan player and appreciate their efforts, but I'm not going to absolve Wilton of how poorly he has played. If he comes back and plays well, I will be elated for him, I just don't think he has those abilities. Take off the Speight glasses and be objective!
November 6th, 2017 at 1:15 PM ^
My tin foil hat fits just fine, thank you.
November 6th, 2017 at 1:14 PM ^
Speculation on next year seems waaaaaaaay premature, especially if people think grad transfer is a thing. Other than some uncorroborated rumors regarding Speight's status affecting Brandon Peters, I expect Speight to be healthy in the offseason competing for the starting job. He has experience and full knowledge of the offense, something nobody else that will be eligible next fall has yet demonstrated.
However, if Peters and/or McCaffrey can master the offense in the intravening time and show more consistency with their passing, Speight could find himself as a backup.
But there's a long way to go before any of this happens. The more pertinent question is one of this season--if Speight is cleared to play before OSU, he is almost certain to start. And, Speight haters notwithstanding, that would give us the best chance to win.
November 6th, 2017 at 1:19 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 1:23 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 1:26 PM ^
I really think he was Gardnered. The poor pass blocking really hurt his decision making.
November 6th, 2017 at 1:37 PM ^
I don't see that. I see an offensive line that could not protect him at all early on, and freshmen receivers that haven't tightened up their route running, or their ability to read a zone defense. His accuracy did seem to be off, for whatever reason, fwiw.
November 6th, 2017 at 1:47 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 1:59 PM ^
He was definitely below 2016 Speight. Which does suggest that improvement is available.
It is a pity we never got to see what a bye would do for him. My recollection suggests that he improved markedly over the bye week last season, so it's reasonable to expect a similar result this year, and instead he was recuperating from a broken spine.
My theory is that he got burned by the fallout from the Florida game. He threw two really bad passes in that game--the second pick-six and the overthrown wheel route to Crawford (the other pick-six was Crawford's fault and that responsibility has become pretty clear in the weeks since). He was quite good in the rest of the game, with several huge DO passes and full command of the rest of the offense as they scythed through Florida.
But after the game the obvious conclusion was that Michigan's defense was unbelievable and the only thing that kept Florida in the game was Speight's mistakes. So the focus, whether from him personally or from coaches, was not on executing plays so much as not blowing it. So he was throwing fades out the back of the endzone instead of trying to make passes over the middle, because those fades couldn't be intercepted. And he was missing open receivers because he was worried about guys he couldn't see stepping in front of passes and taking the ball the other way. And these bad-case scenarios he was trying to avoid were the only things that stood between Michigan and a win, because our defense was so good and we have a good FG kicker.
And so he was playing scared. Thing is, he wasn't wrong--Michigan didn't lose any games that he started--but he lost his composure trying to compensate. Again, this is my theory.
But I think he's still the guy who best knows and operates the offense, and perhaps some time away will help solve the yips he suffered from. And Speight gives us our best chance against OSU, if he's healthy.
November 6th, 2017 at 2:01 PM ^
I continue to believe that if he had the receiving core from last year, and had Ulizio not been in at RT that he would have looked much closer to his mid/late 2016 form. I think the happy feet were purely due to the fact that he knew the OL couldn't protect him. But that's just my "arm-chair" analysis.
November 6th, 2017 at 3:16 PM ^
he was worse because he had no time, few guys open and a scuffling run game. Does anyone really think he just mysteriously became a worse football player? Highly doubtful.
The run game is already making huge strides, the WRs, eh, not so much, but my guess is that if Speight is healthy, he'd be better than he was earlier in the season just beacuse of the existing run threat that should take some pressure off him.
November 6th, 2017 at 10:11 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 1:15 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 1:27 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 1:16 PM ^
November 6th, 2017 at 1:17 PM ^
and throw an OT touchdown pass to Gentry or McKeon to win the game or something crazy like that?
Brace yourselves. Reality is often stranger than fiction.
November 6th, 2017 at 1:18 PM ^
Let's wait until we see Peters against Wisconsin before we decide we don't need speight next year....
10/14 for 124 against Rutgers and 8/13 for 56 yards against Minnesota is hardly enough data to send Speight packing.
November 6th, 2017 at 2:19 PM ^
And I'm not advocating for Peters as much as I am just making an observation that I get the feeling Speight will be under center against ND next year.
November 7th, 2017 at 4:29 AM ^
but Peters started converting 3rd downs v Rutgers.
I don't think anyone knew we were going to blow up Minn the way we did on the ground. I certainly didn't expect that.
Towit: it would be a fools errand to start throwing a slippery ball on a wet misty night when we're breaking off 60 yard runs over and over and over and over.
Osu won a NC with CarStale Jones a 3rd stringer iirc. Peters accuracy is superior, I can see that from way out here in the cornfields. Whether the OL can hold up against better competition *will* be seen.
Tl:dr...the passing game (especially TE passing v LBs) works well when the D has to respect the run. When the run game is carrying the team there is no need to pass.
November 7th, 2017 at 9:10 AM ^
Peters has thrown 27 passes in the last two weeks while we've rushed the ball 84 times.
You'll have to forgive me for not anticipating that a more than 2:1 rush to pass ratio is going to be possible against Wisconsin and OSU.
November 6th, 2017 at 1:22 PM ^
Re: Speight healing well, that's terrific news. I'd love to see him back in action sooner than later. (That's no slight against Peters or O'Korn - I trust that Harbaugh will manage the position well regardless of fan pressure to play Player X or Player Y.)
The rest of the speculation regarding (e.g.,) Central? That seems unproductive and unnecessary.
November 6th, 2017 at 1:29 PM ^
I'm going to say this. For Wilton's sake, I hope his injury is 100% healed if he plays at the tail end of this season or even next season. But for Michigan's sake, I honestly can't say with 100% certainty that Peters is the best chance we have against Wisconsin and Ohio St. if Speight is ready to go. I like that he hasn't made big mistakes, but he hasn't been tested that much either. The one positive spin of not really needing Peters very much, however, is the element of surprise against Wisconsin or OSU. I don't think Peters will need to throw the ball 30 times against Wisconsin to beat them, but I do believe he will against Ohio St. At least I won't be angry if Harbaugh gives Speight another chance here (with hopefully a short leash).
As far as next season goes, Harbaugh has said flat out that Peters' main weakness is his control of the offense - He needs to be more of a vocal leader out there and take better command. That being said, I do not see Peters getting beaten out by Speight next season as I expect that maturity to really take place. If Peters is beaten out, I would almost expect that to be by McCaffrey not Speight (which I don't believe either will happen).
However, I really hope, especially with how this season has gone, that Speight comes back for Michigan next season regardless of whether or not he starts. After all, he had some very promising moments pre-injury and even post-injury last season (despite what many Michigan fans claim). We can still win with Speight at QB next season, especially with the improvements I would expect our defense to make with 1 year of added experience. No matter what, I don't see the QB position to be a weakness after this season going forward.
November 6th, 2017 at 1:48 PM ^
would make for a coaching nightmare. I don't care who is the head coach, that would put the staff in an incredibly difficult situation.
November 6th, 2017 at 2:13 PM ^
Only if, by some miracle, Michigan is able to beat Wisconsin easily using largely the same playbook they used against Minnesota.
If Michigan can run for 300 yards and pass for 50-100 (with no glaring mistakes) and win easily, then questions about Peters remain unanswered. The coaches have to consider maintaining the same ultra-conservative philosophy that has worked for what would have been four consecutive weeks.
But that's unlikely. It is more likely that one of the following happens:
1. Michigan loses to Wisconsin, Peters is overwhelmed/unable to sustain a reasonable passing offense.
2. Michigan beats Wisconsin (or loses in a close game but scores 20+), Peters throws for 200, makes only a mistake or two, and makes some impressive throws in an efficient performance.
In scenario one, nobody has any qualms about putting Speight back in. In scenario two, it's pretty clear that Peters is growing and deserves an opportunity to start against OSU.
November 6th, 2017 at 3:20 PM ^
much more about Peters against Wisconsin, if not Maryland. It would take a lot, I think, for him to start over Speight against OSU if Speight is healthy.
November 6th, 2017 at 6:07 PM ^
I just don't see any scenario where Peters can show enough to displace a healthy Speight this year. Next year, that's an open question.
November 6th, 2017 at 2:31 PM ^
Iowa just put up a season high 250 yards on 6.5 ypc against OSU. They were averaging 3 yards a carry for the first eight games against pitiful competition. The blueprint is there to run on the Buckeyes.
November 6th, 2017 at 6:19 PM ^
Iowa also passed for 5 TDs, 0 INTs, and had an equal number of passing yards. (They were also creative in play-calling, went for jugular, etc.) A Minnesota-type game where we have 50 yards of passing is unlikely to work against OSU's defense. A plus-4 turnover margin, which Iowa had, also would be helpful.
November 7th, 2017 at 1:38 AM ^
I'll take winning by four fewer TDs than that, so maybe let's just get 3 passing TDs and a plus 2 TO margin....is that too much to ask? Ok, the passing TDs are too much to ask of this offense. Maybe just 2 passing and 2 running with a couple FGs.