Lions Lose in Dallas on Botched Call
Putting up a new thread and sharing the base information because a previous thread needed to be taken down.
Last night the NFL franchise with twice as many flagrantly controversial calls against them as the rest of the league combined picked up another that profoundly changes the Playoff picture.
Long versions of the events are available all over the internet. The short version is the Lions went for two after closing to within 1 point with a 2-minute drill touchdown and appeared to complete the conversion on a lob to LT Taylor Decker, who had reported as eligible. Unfortunately for the Lions the ref thought a different lineman had reported as eligible, gave the defense the wrong number. As of last night the referee in question was still falsely claiming the wrong lineman had reported. Due to the mix-up the officials flagged Detroit for an illegal formation and illegal touching.
Official sticking to his story, but there’s no way in hell Goff grabbed Taylor Decker by the arm, directed him to report, Decker went to official, official looked at him, and the Lions threw to Decker…but Decker didn’t report. It’s illogical. What’s logical is a ref being wrong. pic.twitter.com/VGP7cPoRH8
— Charles Robinson (@CharlesRobinson) December 31, 2023
Video evidence shows the Lions handled it correctly:
ESPN just showed another angle. Jared Goff literally sends Taylor Decker and tells him to report as eligible. I mean…. Wow. https://t.co/5rJoI0AcJT pic.twitter.com/vuyQCmnJkY
— Ari Meirov (@MySportsUpdate) December 31, 2023
Decker went up to the referee and reported himself an eligible receiver on the play. Dan Campbell claims he discussed the play with the officials before the game, and the other lineman says he never reported. Had the correct lineman been reported as eligible on the play the Lions were in a legal formation and the play would have counted.
Also every ref in the league has a history of questionable calls so it's not particularly relevant that this one does. Also also the Lions tried twice more for the conversion (the first after taking the penalty drew an offsides) and failed, and many more events in this game, including the Cowboys losing a fumble out of the endzone and Jourdan Lewis being absolutely boss, and a 92-yard touchdown that could have been a safety greatly influenced the outcome.
December 31st, 2023 at 11:20 AM ^
In the intellectualized world of the internet, you are correct, they should have kicked the XP and taken their chances with OT. Coach Campbell was not in that world. He was in a world of (justified) blind rage and his call for the second 2-pt conversion was driven by that. I love what Dan has done with changing the culture and having seen the boobery we've passed off as coaching for the last 60 years (apologies to Joe Schmidt, he doesn't deserve to be tarred by the same brush as Harry Gilmer, et. al.), I'll take Dan Campbell and his quirks ALL DAY LONG!!!
December 31st, 2023 at 2:12 PM ^
The “intellectualized world” is represented by ESPN’s analytics thing they showed in the corner of the screen. In every case, I think it agreed with Campbell’s aggressive approach. The issue boils down to, do you think you have a >50% chance of getting 2, 7, or 4 yards. Goff is a 67.7% passer this season. Run routes into the end zone and let him win it for you. That’s what he’s paid for. The problem was they ran a 2 yard route from the 4 and Goff slightly under threw the ball.
It was the right decision to go for 2. It was also the right decision (except in hindsight, but that’s just lazy analysis) to go for the TD early in the game. From the 4, if you are in that situation twice and kick 2 field goals, you get 6 points. If you go for it both times and score once, you have 7 points and have pinned Dallas at the 4. I think a 67% passer should be at least 50% from the 4 when the field is compressed.
December 31st, 2023 at 1:00 PM ^
One thing to consider about kicking the XP after the penalty. The kick would have been a 47 yard attempt (the ball gets marked off from the 30)....
That MAY have factored into the decision (me personally, I would have kicked the XP as well after the penalty)
December 31st, 2023 at 11:19 AM ^
The try from the 7 was the only thing questionable, but we got bailed out. Conversion rate from 3.5 is comparable enough to OT that makes it worth avoiding the injury risk to your starters of playing potentially another quarter. If they were trying to get into the playoffs, that'd be a different story, but having clinched and only playing for (a chance at) a better seed, I'm fine with the call.
December 31st, 2023 at 11:39 AM ^
The repercussions of the decision to go for it are yet to work out. This sets the Lions up for success in the playoffs and is a statement about what the team and coaches are about. This isn't soccer.
December 31st, 2023 at 2:30 PM ^
Campbell had just watched the refs ignore Decker reporting as eligible to help the Cowboys out. He also saw the blatant PI of St. Brown go uncalled a minute before. He knew he had a better shot at winning on one play than overcoming Dallas' officials in the OT period.
December 31st, 2023 at 9:08 AM ^
One other takeaway for me, however, is that the Lions appear more playoff ready than I thought they would be before the game.
Despite the way they lost, they did something that no other teams were able to do vs the Cowboys at home this year.
I'm excited for their run when the playoffs start.
December 31st, 2023 at 9:14 AM ^
That sounds to me like a "moral victory."
December 31st, 2023 at 9:34 AM ^
Possibly. But the worst they can do is third seed, maybe second if they get some help. They played well. I'm not ok with the result of the game but it didn't end their season.
December 31st, 2023 at 9:50 AM ^
With the win, the Lions would have moved ahead of Philly in common games 4-1 to 4-2. Now they're 3-2 and have a head-to-head loss with Dallas. If SanFran & Phiily win today against tomato cans, i think Detroit will be locked into the 3rd seed. (SanFran has the nfc record tiebreaker over Detroit at 9-1 vs 7-4)
December 31st, 2023 at 1:54 PM ^
Their defense despite Lamb was really good and surprising. The offense was dispiriting especially the OL
December 31st, 2023 at 9:12 AM ^
Hutchinson had three sacks last night including one ending Dallas’ last drive. Hutch has five career sacks vs Dallas.
His attitude was great.”Fuck it, I’d rather beat them in the playoffs”.
Ben Johnson and Jared again had subpar games. Lions can’t give Goff a huge deal based on what we have seen from him this season. Solid is not worth $40 million plus annually.
Re-sign St. Brown, Iffy, and Sewell. Develop Hooker and maybe draft a guy if the right one falls to you.
December 31st, 2023 at 10:07 AM ^
Completely agree on Goff. He's good, but if he's going to be a statue throwing darts in the pocket, he's gotta be better than that. The modern game requires at least a semi-mobile QB. If he can't be that guy, he's gotta be 10 steps ahead mentally and super accurate with his throws a la Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees etc.
December 31st, 2023 at 10:45 AM ^
Are you guys nuts? Goff is the QB that won the division the first time in 30 years, and now you wanna cast him off.aybe it's this mentality that is part of problem. Careful what you wish for.
December 31st, 2023 at 11:06 AM ^
Agreed, maybe it is a result of the OC’s awesome play calling but I really like what I see from Goff. People fail to realize that there aren’t even 32 humans on the planet that can play QB in the NFL above an average level. It’s that difficult of a position to play, and Goff has got us to this point. Who else we gonna get to replace him?
December 31st, 2023 at 11:34 AM ^
No biscuit if no risk it.
Goff is average. You need more than average to win Super Bowls. Super Bowl championships are the objective. You aren’t getting there with Goff.
The QB class over the next two drafts are strong. Lions also have Hooker who they see as a first round talent.
December 31st, 2023 at 4:45 PM ^
I wouldn't say Goff is average. I think that's an exaggeration. He's definitely above average. Hell, probably a top 10 QB in the league right now, maybe top 6 on his best day. But that's on his best day. He missed a bunch of throws in this game and when you're the kind of QB who can't make things happen with your legs, you can't be missing that many throws. It makes everyone else on the team have to play better to cover his weaknesses.
December 31st, 2023 at 1:50 PM ^
Agreed. People want a mobile QB who is elite with the arm too. There are 4 of these on the planet. Let me know how to get one. Oh we have it in Hooker who 31 teams let fall to the 3rd round due to injury even though he is up there with Mahomes just you wait and see! No great franchise who wins almost every year (Pittsburgh, Green Bay) thought to take a generational QB who will be top 6 in the league and stash him since he is way better than Goff.
You can win with Goff. The OL did him NO favors last night - he was under duress a lot. The QB2 is always the most popular player on the team when you don't have Mahomes or Brady.
Goff is lower end of top 10 in the Cousins territory. There are 20 guys starting worse than him. There are 9-10 better. So now Hooker is going to be top 6 in the entire NFL apparently based on these comments - sure.
December 31st, 2023 at 2:40 PM ^
Goff is not a top 10 NFL QB. He is league average being propped up by really good units across the rest of the offense & the offensive staff. He is also not the Detroit Lions biggest problem. However if you give him a 40+ million per year contract he just might be. If you can get him to stick around for a small raise on top of his current 27m per year than I think that is worth it. But when you give star money to an average QB the rest of your roster suffers in turn and it almost always bites franchises in the ass eventually.
December 31st, 2023 at 11:32 AM ^
The point is to win Super Bowls.
Erik Kramer won a division with the Lions. Didn’t win anything else.
It’s this settling mentality that is part of the problem. Lions need more from the position.
December 31st, 2023 at 11:46 AM ^
No rookie quarterback has ever started a Super Bowl in NFL history. What are we playing for here? This team is ready now.
December 31st, 2023 at 1:52 PM ^
Hooker >>> Kramer
You've nailed it.
December 31st, 2023 at 1:57 PM ^
JJ as an understudy!!?!!
December 31st, 2023 at 1:48 PM ^
Hilarious that Iffy went from a nobody 3 weeks ago to one of the most important players in Lions history. Love the recency bias. (he has played amazing for the past few weeks)
They need to move on from Jonah Jackson - it's a position easily drafted in the 3rd round to find a nice player. He is going to want big money and is not a big money player. Go get ZZ in the 2nd - massive upgrade.
They need a CB1 - unfortunately their pick is in Atlanta doing little (Okudah) and pencil ear ran off the other guy who has been great in Philly - they need another end to complement Hutch. I'd honestly go the Rams route and give up draft picks to get Crosby who is only 26 and plays like he is on crack. You get half a decade from a crazy man who plays possessed. Can't imagine him and Hutch on the same line.
Cornerback issues can be solved by pressure. Goff is fine behind a good OL. Hooker has done exactly nothing in his career - laughable to replace a top 10 QB (like 9-10 in the league) with someone who has done nothing with a playoff ready roster.
AG gets so much hate but the talent on the defense is mediocre - Iffy a guy who was a nobody is like the 4th best player now on defense. They were missing Alim who had a great year. All these ends on opposite side of Hutch do nothing. Anzalone was hated by the fanbase a year ago and Holmes was called an idiot for resigning him - but he is like the 3rd best defensive player they have. Cam is a CB2 not CB1 - a good player but not someone you put on Lamb Jefferson Chase et al. Branch is coming on, I like that kid.
Defense played outstanding last night and if Barnes could tackle they had a shutout in the first half and win the game. Yet guys called for AGs head after that play.
Things change fast in the NFL - you have to take your windows of opportunity. Decker is aging and Frank is amazing but playing 80% most weeks. They have to replenish the offensive line NOW so guys are ready to step in in 2 years, and find a fix for the guards. Glasgow is service level. Keep feeding DL and OL. This is their window next 2-3 years. A lot can change quickly.
December 31st, 2023 at 2:05 PM ^
Anzalone has been great this year. We need Jack Campbell to make a big leap next year. He has shown promise and growing pains.
I have seen Chop Robinson mocked to Detroit at the end of the 1st and the thought of him and Hutch working together is pretty exciting.
I was really unhappy spending an early pick on Gibbs and was way wrong on that. He is dynamic. The Lions, Holmes and staff, deserve credit for high achievement in the draft.
This is a young team. And they have great OL play which is where you start.
December 31st, 2023 at 9:12 AM ^
You gotta just take the PAT after the call though.
December 31st, 2023 at 9:14 AM ^
Agree but a good throw from Goff gives them the conversion again.
December 31st, 2023 at 9:24 AM ^
This is such a bot take.
If the officials aren't going to let the Lions win in regulation, why would they in OT?
December 31st, 2023 at 9:29 AM ^
If the officials aren’t going to let them score on the first try, why would they on the second? Holding can be called every play. Logic isn’t your thing.
December 31st, 2023 at 10:05 AM ^
The Lions are guaranteed 3rd seed at worst. If they win, they have a chance at the 1-seed.
I would go for 2 pts in regulation too.
They may not have had any chance in OT.
December 31st, 2023 at 4:48 PM ^
If the Cowboys score a TD in OT the game ends. No chance for the Lions to respond. I'd rather have the game in my hands at the end of regulation than hope I get a coin toss to land my way.
December 31st, 2023 at 9:13 AM ^
They had to win one for the ring of honor - refs were going to make sure it happens.
December 31st, 2023 at 9:35 AM ^
Refs should probably be in the ring of loudmouth honor after their steady contributions to Cowboy success.
December 31st, 2023 at 9:13 AM ^
Also massive missed holding call on 92 yard TD
December 31st, 2023 at 9:18 AM ^
Missed holdings are whatever. Happens to everybody. Ref going on autopilot to take away a fat guy score is an Only the Lions event.
December 31st, 2023 at 10:11 AM ^
Yes, file this one under the "only call that ever happened in NFL history was against the Lions" file. This ref should be fined. He was told about the play before the game. The correct player reported and he STILL throws the flag. What should be talked about all day today is the Lions miraculous final drive, Gamblin' Dan Campbell, and a much deserved reward for a big man who has endured many losing seasons. Instead we get Jerry Jones celebrating in his box with all his asshole friends and everybody but Joe Buck knowing that this is the head ref leaning on the scale and making the story about the officials instead.
Fuck 'em. The Lions looked playoff ready, and I think having the bye can be a bad thing--you're usually playing a team that is on a roll in week 2.
December 31st, 2023 at 12:11 PM ^
You mean the play during which a wiffed tackle by Barnes essentially gave Dallas nine points, seven for the TD and two for the safety that wasn't?
December 31st, 2023 at 9:23 AM ^
This sort of stuff makes it more and more difficult to defend the "NFL isnt rigged" thing. Cuz it sure appears to be
December 31st, 2023 at 10:27 AM ^
If it was so rigged then why did the refs call offsides on the second attempt. Seems to me if they’re “rigging” the game they would’ve let that go. Maybe it’s just the refs are incompetent and bad at their jobs at times. But to say they’re rigging the game is just ridiculous.
December 31st, 2023 at 11:16 AM ^
Why did the officials call offsides? Because it was obvious. Did you watch the game and that play?
The officials have to call that - it was clear as day and quite obvious.
December 31st, 2023 at 11:30 AM ^
Rigged or incompetent refs. I’m torn.
December 31st, 2023 at 11:44 AM ^
Hmmm.. great question - and, it's a Catch-22.
Could the refs be incompetent and the call / game attempted to be predetermined? If so, the refs would need to know what they were doing.
I don't expect the NFL to comment any more on this - which is a travesty.
December 31st, 2023 at 1:25 PM ^
The circumstantial nature of last night is what gets me. We already know the NFL had a commercial before the season openly mocking that they write a script. Last night was the cowboys night for the ring of honor and such. While the Lions were driving in Dallas territory Aikman said "not to get ahead of ourselves but you know Campbell is going for 2 if they score" which is a huge red flag. Then they score in ultimate drama, go for 2 on a trick play which there is clear evidence that Decker checked in AND Campbell let them know earlier that they might run one of those. Only well after the play do we get a flag. The whole thing stinks to high hell to me
December 31st, 2023 at 9:23 AM ^
The official.is either
A: corrupt and doing what the NFL told him.
Or B: so incompetent at his job having been told the play before the game and then failing at a routine eligible/ineligible tag that he should be fired immediately.
If he is not fired, we know it's A.
December 31st, 2023 at 10:09 AM ^
My buddy is an official so he pays attention and follows the crews. He said Brad Allen’s crew is known to miss calls.
If you are Brad Allen you know a lineman reported and the alignment on the play was proper. Why inject yourself into the game at that point.
December 31st, 2023 at 12:20 PM ^
Because DUMBASS Allen told Dallas the wrong number. His statement is that he told Dallas it was #70... That is where the F-up is and Allen is now just trying to weasel around everything else.
He put himself and everyone, in a very bad spot. No one was going to be happy in the end. Obviously, Allen took to course to cover up his mistake and try to make it sound like the Lions screwed up.
Had he picked up the flag and corrected his own mistake, Dallas would have been all over him for reporting the wrong number. Notice in the play, #1 from Dallas basically ignores Decker. He could very reasonably state that had he known Decker was eligible he would not have let him go into the end zone.
Bottom line, DUMBASS Allen F'd up, I can deal with human mistake even though in this case it is an extreme DUMBASS. But to push the blame on other..."70 reported to me..." is a cowards way out...
December 31st, 2023 at 12:31 PM ^
Its basically B. Official screwed up and won't admit it.
If the NFL fired officials for horrible calls there would be no officials left so you dont get to just jump to A
December 31st, 2023 at 9:36 AM ^
It almost looked like the ref ran away saying lalallalalalallala I can’t hear you.
December 31st, 2023 at 9:28 AM ^
I've always thought anyone on the team should be allowed to catch the ball