Hoops Snowflakes thread

I had no confidence that Michigan was going to win this game because this team just doesn't know how to execute down the stretch to close games out. But when you have a chance to win with 8.9 seconds left and you rush a 3-point shot instead of driving for the game winner, well, that's not bad coaching, it's just dumb basketball. Juwan doesn't coach that.  

Michigan failed all night grabbing loose balls and repeatedly letting Florida get second and third shots when they had no serious outside game and could only score going to the basket. The way the game was called with every breath of contact called lent itself to yet another failed finish. 

Michigan has lost most of its games this season not because of lack of effort, but poor execution and failure to value the ball. Blaming a coach just back from surgery for a loss in double OT and calling for his ouster is just ridiculous. 

Holy cow this team is frustrating to watch. Anyone better than Florida and we’d have lost by 20 in regulation. 

Juwan Howard’s first four plus seasons: 

19-12(10-10

23-5(14-3)

19-15(11-9)

18-16(11-9)

6-6(0-1)

One Big Ten championship, an Elite Eight and Sweet Sixteen appearance, and four winning seasons. Is that a fireable resume? I don’t think so and I think Warde/Ono believe the same. Howard will return in ‘24 if he wants.

On the plus side because I just want to be positive: Dug is the kinda guy who could win NPOY as a senior. That award nowadays goes to a senior or upperclassman who is just a college dawg and not really a projected NBA star. 

Love his grit, he still needs to tone it down at times but man he’s a dude.

My only snowflake is that at least the top 6/7 of this team is actually pretty good. Like Olivier, Burnett, Dug, and Reed are good players. Like, this is a better starting roster that can play cohesively than last two years. We just can’t get out of our own damn way.

What a roller coaster ride the Howard era has been. I've given him a massive benefit of the doubt, I believe the 2021 team was the best in program history. They have a real shot at a national title if Livers doesn't get hurt. That team was the most organized team I've ever seen, and their chemistry was amazing. While it had a lot of Beilein pieces (Livers, Brooks, Davis, Wagner-ish), Juwan filled in the holes of that team masterfully with transfers (Smith/Chaundee) and recruiting (Dickinson).

My rope's run out after the last two years. Honestly, my initial reaction to the Wisconsin incident was that he should be fired as I saw it as a Knight anomaly (a problem that doesn't seem to have improved all that much). Now, for basketball reasons as well, I think he should be left go.

Loved the idea of a Fab 5 member being the figurehead of the program, and I'll always appreciate his commitment to the school and his past contributions (as well as the good-looking class he has coming in), but the time has come IMO.

This just need to just part ways on Good terms. Would hate to see his fab 5 legacy end on a bad note. He’s just not the guy. He’s not a good coach. 

What tells me more than just poor fundamentals, poor defense, poor decision making, poor execution, and poor coaching, that our Michigan basketball program is descending into oblivion, is that Brain and Seth hardly ever comment or react to it. Only Michigan football exists here. And who among us can blame them. This has become a poor product. You can tell it pains the two of them. I would submit however, that now more than ever, a critical and honest discussion about this program is needed. Just my two cents. 

we basically fell apart after the refs stopped the game for almost 10 !!! minutes to look at a possible goaltending

I am not happy with where the program is at but I don’t ever think the answer is fire your coach unless the coach has had every opportunity to succeed and yet he still fails. Juwan has taken his team to a final 4 and I believe 3 sweet 16s. He has recruited relatively well. I would begin to implement with Juwan what they did with Harbaugh and reduce his salary but put incentives in for specific achievements. I think fan bases are always so quick to fire coaches and the next coach ends up being no better. Juwan Howard has always been praised as an up and comer coach and I don’t think that has just gone away. Force him to replace some of his coaching staff and see if things change. 

I feel for Juwann because it seems the administration has done him no favors - You throw Caleb love Terrance Shannon and maybe even Hunter Dickinson on this team and you’re talking about a final four. But, they’re not here and you have to judge the product for what it is. 
 

The trend is bad, and it’s getting worse. There’s no reinforcements coming, or young guys that we can truly be excited about. And to be honest, someone like dug has a better chance at transferring than he does at sticking around a .500 program. 
I don’t know if the admin will do it - but unless the ship turns around, it’s time let juwann go at the end of the year 

This is the most frustrated I have been with the program since the final two years of Amaker. It just feels like we are running in place. I know that there is solid talent on this current roster, and that there is talent coming in next year. But can we honestly say that we have confidence they will be coached correctly and put in a position to succeed if the AD decides to run it back again next year? The 2021 team had 3 McDonald's AAs and only managed an 11 seed (the S16 run was fun, but that season was not). We had two lottery picks and the most coveted transfer in the history of the transfer portal era on our team last year and got blown out by a bad Rutgers team in the first round of the BTT to miss the tourney. This team has multiple pros on it and our defense has dropped 70 spots per Kenpom and it looks like our W/L record may be worse than last year or the year before it! 

I thought the team fought hard and once a game goes to double OT it’s a coin flip. I am very interested to see what this team can do in conference. I don't agree with those calling for Juwan to be fired. I think he loves Michigan and just like Harbaugh he will get it figured out. My personal opinion (that doesn’t mean anything) is to wait and see how this season plays out. 

It’s his first loss of the season. 

Now I remember why I avoid snowflake threads. I understand the frustration, really, I do. However, some of you remind me of a typical Chicago Bears radio post-game caller-a classic miserable Monday morning quarterback. I think I read a similar thread…what was it, two days ago? Maybe it’s time to get a new hobby. 

I know—I shouldn’t click on it if I don’t like it. I’ll try to remember next time. Sorry for interrupting—back to our regularly scheduled programming.

A couple things to go over. Does the team get better if Howard isn’t coaching them right now? I don’t know really know that answer. I think Phil is a better coach but the team wasn’t exactly playing great with him as the head coach. Second if Howard is fired who does Michigan hire? If I were the AD I’d make a strong move at Dutcher. Would he take the job? Just some thoughts. 

I love Juwan, always will, but it does feel like the program needs a fresh start.

Is it weird that I think if his sons had played better, we wouldn't be at this juncture?

This was a post on the Facebook fan page "Maize and Blue Sports Fans", which I think is the best Michigan fan group.  This is a very fair post.

"Long post warning:

I am not the person who calls for a coaching change, but Howard is not producing. Reminds me of the Brian Ellerbe reign. Nice guy, but not getting it done.

For those people who go, "Everyone wanted Harbaugh gone, too". I LITERALLY created this page, because I thought that was nonsense. I (and a couple of others) was doing nothing but defending Harbaugh and was getting called "homer", because I predicted a one loss season in 2021 (yes, I have receipts. Lol).

The thing is.....it's an apples and tomatoes comparison. Harbaugh took over a program that was in shambles since the end of the Carr era. They were literally 5-7 before he took over. Harbaugh IMMEDIATELY turned around the program, and dumb people decided to move the goal post.....as if OSU hadn't built a two decade head start on roster development.

They focused on the half Covid season as "proof", but blatantly ignored the facts of that "season", because it went against their narrative. Michigan was literally the 2nd most inexperienced team - IN THE NATION- that season. Their best players literally opted out right before the season started. Covid protocols prevented proper (normal) practices, so they couldn't adequately "coach up" the inexperience. Teams with a lot of experience had an advantage (see Indiana, Northwestern, Iowa, Iowa State, etc....). On top of that.....several players went through the game weeks without practicing, because of Covid protocols. Michigan also had a Covid outbreak.

It was just bad all around, and not a fair measuring stick. When I pointed all that out.....I was said to be "giving excuses".

Well....I was right.

Now.....on the flip side.

Juwan Howard took over a team that was in the middle of it's most successful era since the Fab 5. LITERALLY played in TWO national championship games in the previous 6 seasons, before Howard took over. They won 30 games the year before Howard took over, which was the year after they won 33 games and played in the national championship game.....with SEVERAL players who were on the team when Howard took over.

Howard jumped in with an experienced team, and took advantage of the Covid season.....similar to the football season for Indiana.

He also had the NUMBER ONE recruiting class.

All seemed to be coming up roses.

The only problem was that success was reliant on the health of Isaiah Livers. With Livers.....they were fantastic. Without Livers.....not so much.

Since that season......Michigan has done nothing but regress back to pre Beilein levels.

Howard's best season was the Covid season.....which was 23 wins. His other seasons? 19 wins, 19 wins, 18 wins (last year), and they are 5-5 right now. The last time Michigan basketball had back to back sub 20 win seasons? In the 2002-2003 season, when Tommy Amaker was head coach.

Howard is literally working on 4 out of 5 seasons below 20 wins. 🤷‍♂️

I can't see any justified reason to keep him as head coach.....other than "nostalgia" from him being a beloved alum and Fab 5 member.

Watching this team the last few years has been hard to watch. That's 100% on coaching.

It just might be time to make a change.....and that's not some "knee jerk" reaction. This has been a several season evaluation."

How many points did Michigan score in the last 5 minutes of the game??? 
 

seems to be a trend 

They are poorly coached. The roster makeup has not been good. The defense is laughable. The offense is nonsensical in high-leverage possessions. The culture is non-existent. All of this points directly to the HC. It’s time.