?Vaccine or Negative Test Required to Attend UM Games Starting 1/1/22

Submitted by Kilgore Trout on December 29th, 2021 at 12:34 PM

Looks like you will be required to prove vaccination or a negative test within 72 hours to attend games starting next week. Not much in the way of details on how it is going to be enforced. I don't think I really have an opinion on this one way or the other, but god speed to the ushers and ticket takers who will be tasked with verifying this for 12k people on 1/8 for the MSU game. 

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Jack Hammer

December 29th, 2021 at 1:28 PM ^

It is good.  As an example of how it should work, at Kraken games this season a mandatory proof of vaccination is required through the Clear app for entry.  Takes 10 seconds.  Very easy, very simple.  

Joined: 11/25/2014

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wardcrazy01894

December 29th, 2021 at 1:52 PM ^

Reasonable minds can very much disagree on if this makes any safety difference or not. Plenty of people can cite NYC's nation leading spikes as evidence it doesn't. 

I'd encourage people not to share their personal opinions (read carefully, I didn't share mine even though you might think I did). Informative post on rule changes is helpful, whether you agree with them or not. Before this thread inevitably gets locked.

Joined: 09/25/2014

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blue in dc

December 29th, 2021 at 2:10 PM ^

Some might argue that plenty of people who cite NYC’s spike do not understand the distinction between cases and strain on the medical system.    Cases when everyone is vaccinated and chance of hospitalization are much lower are not a significant societal risk.    A rise in cases amongst unvaccinated who are significantly more likely to tax the health system does cause societal risk

I believe this is consistent with what you have defined as the appropriate way to “not share your personal opinion”.

Joined: 01/22/2011

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wardcrazy01894

December 29th, 2021 at 2:36 PM ^

I'd emphasize that for everything you and I believe there is a valid rebuttal to it. Thus proving reasonable minds differ. I might completely agree with you btw, but devils advocate would rebut it as such:

If the argument is to stop spread, case rate is the only metric that matters. If the point of a passport is to stop spread, a metric identifying spread is all that should matter. The only metric that tracks spread is case rate, not hospitalizations or deaths or anything else relating to the effectiveness of vaccines in lessening symptoms.

They might even continue to say hospitalization and death rates are obviously very important, but then when you look at Florida having the lowest death rate in the country (cite: WaPo below) and (loudly) no mandates on anything it gets confusing. 

Point trying to be: love ya, reasonable (very educated) minds can differ. Just assume that for everything you and I and everyone below this says there is a valid rebuttal and it'll save mods a lot of time as they try to keep it a sports blog. 

EDIT: Citation added for the angry bird below who couldn't find it. https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/national/coronavirus-us-cases-deaths/

Joined: 09/25/2014

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blue in dc

December 29th, 2021 at 3:05 PM ^

That is just silly.   I believe that if you jump in front of a speeding train you are likely to die.   What is the valid rebuttal?  

How is that different from, all else held equal, if you get the covid vaccine you are less likely to need to be hospitalized?   There is clearly a rebuttal, plenty of people on this blog would and have made one.    Does that somehow make it a valid rebuttal?  If people’s arguments are premised on falsehoods, their arguments are neither reasonable nor educated.   I personally would not consider that a valid rebuttal.

 

Joined: 01/22/2011

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blueheron

December 29th, 2021 at 5:40 PM ^

"... but then when you look at Florida having the lowest death rate in the country (cite: WaPo) ..."

I missed the citation in our post. I went a-searching like this:

https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=%22washington+post%22+%22death+rate%22+florida

Guess what was at the top? A WaPo link:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/09/05/florida-coronavirus-delta-surge/

Within:

"Florida’s per capita covid death rate since the pandemic started ranks 18th among states, according to Washington Post tracking."

This site isn't frequented by idiots. You're going to need to work a little harder if you're going to lie.

Joined: 03/26/2009

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4godkingandwol…

December 29th, 2021 at 2:12 PM ^

Reasonable people can disagree, but they wouldn’t be following a conclusion that is supported by the breath of data. Vaccines help reduce spread and help reduce the severity of symptoms for breakthrough cases. This is irrefutable. Therefore, Making sure everybody in a packed place is vaccinated will result in fewer cases and fewer deaths. There is no debating the efficacy of this. You can debate whether these rules are fair or “worth it” based on how you value lives. That’s a fair and difficult question to answer. But the science is conclusive here. Cherry picking data from  one densely populated city that is a tourist and international hub is not reasonable. 

Joined: 08/06/2008

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MGoStrength

December 29th, 2021 at 5:14 PM ^

Reasonable people can disagree

Unfortunately when it comes to this topic, the majority of the time they cannot.  

You can debate whether these rules are fair or “worth it” based on how you value lives.  That’s a fair and difficult question to answer.

Again, this topic has been and remains so divisive that reasonable discussions rarely happen, particularly on social media.  If you hold an opinion that differs from the powers that be, good luck.  There are lots of debatable things regarding this topic which are a complex set of value judgements.  But, a few things are certain here.  One, the majority of MGBers are left of center.  Two, the majority of MGBers prefer everyone get vaccinated.  And three, the majority of MGBers aren't interested in dissenting opinions about it.  

Joined: 07/29/2010

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blue in dc

December 29th, 2021 at 6:15 PM ^

Personally I would prefer we have no covid discussion on this site at all.   If however people are going to argue against vaccines in the midst of a health crisis, I am likely to argue back.   If your argument is based on incorrect or distorted information, I will likely call you out on that (and if your argument is based largely on false information, I would not consider it to be a reasoned position).

That doesn’t mean I am against you having a differing opinion, it just means that absent providing some new info, or an argument that I had not considered, you are unlikely to change my mind.   If it is something I care alot about, I am likely to explain why I disagree.   Isn’t that why message boards have a reply feature?

 

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blue in dc

December 30th, 2021 at 2:12 PM ^

Straight from the CDC

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/safety/adverse-events.html

“CDC has also identified nine deaths that have been caused by or were directly attributed to TTS following J&J/Janssen COVID-19 vaccination. Women ages 30-49 years, especially, should be aware of the increased risk of this rare adverse event. There are other COVID-19 vaccine options available for which this risk has not been seen.”

Happy to hear how I have distorted the information or see any better numbers you’ve seen.

Note also that the comment about 9 deaths was in rebuttal to a comment that there have been thousands of deaths attributable to the vaccine.    While the number may be somewhat higher than 9, the link I provided is very consistent with the number being much closer to 9 then in the thousands.    

Joined: 01/22/2011

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Charlesdesmond

December 29th, 2021 at 7:10 PM ^

It's absolutely not irrefutable.  As many people are getting sick that have the shot as those who don't.  It's all a joke. They are wrong so then they just make up another lie. A vaccine would not allow a person to get the virus.it is not a vaccine at all. Yes, I got the shots back when I thought they worked. It's been one big lie from both sides.

Joined: 12/02/2016

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BoFan

December 29th, 2021 at 2:39 PM ^

Responding to your comment about reasonable minds:
 

There are facts and science that can be sound and generally accepted and there are false conclusions (regarding cause and effect) that can be made from bad or fuzzy data or from an incorrect application of logic or statistics. 
 

Reasonable minds can, and have been far too many times, be led down a path of false logic. 

And worse, but not the case here at all, the manipulation of a person’s subconscious fears can lead to what appears to be an unreasonable mind. 

Joined: 03/09/2012

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Harball sized HAIL

December 29th, 2021 at 2:28 PM ^

This should have been a requirement since September.  Nation wide. 

My friends brother just died of Covid Dec 23 (age 50).  He had one dose of J&J vax.  They were both at OSU game.  Pretty sure wasn't contracted there but at a X-mas party week later.  

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BKBlue94

December 29th, 2021 at 12:47 PM ^

Sounds like good policy to me. Don't want everyone getting sick around campus, and will feel better about going to games with this in place. 

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IndyBlue

December 29th, 2021 at 1:26 PM ^

I went to a concert about a month ago that required a vaccine card or proof of negative test.  It didn't appear to slow down the entry process, but it does require some extra workers.  There was one stop to show your card/test, another for metal detectors, and lastly someone to scan your ticket.  Granted that was for a 2,500 person venue.

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