If Michigan refuses to adapt to the current NIL landscape, Warde Manuel needs to be fired.
The whole "Michigan will not become a transactional experience" is so ridiculous.
People can hand wave the concerns we have about recruiting all we want, but Michigan cannot sustain success by getting classes ranked 30-40, and relying on development.
I guess that means he’s really not a part of our family.
Also, he’s divorced so he’s really not even a part of his family.
When the donor money and broadcast/ performance $ starts to dry up... then change will come. If the regents and president really wanna turn the athletic. Dept into a second tier program they're gonna get second tier financing too.
Yep, and until then...
That donor and broadcast money isn't drying up ....... likely ever. Really?
Michigan athletics is going to be completely fine. I really don't get folks consternation with things - they will still be a top-tier football & basketball program. Same as it has been.
Check the revenue from football/basketball tickets during the last year of Hoke, the early days of Beilein, or when Amaker was the coach.
I'd rather our fine university not engage in a free-for-all, pay for play, highest bidder free agency for recruits. If that means we become a "2nd tier program", then so be it. However, that won't be the case. I've postulated before that NIL will have a short shelf life. With the kid getting $8m at Tennessee, the entire '22 TAM class, this rumored Nike deal for Moore, OSU stating a $15m/yr need, this Wild West atmosphere will only be tolerated for another class or two. Michigan is playing the long game, here. It's the smart move. When NIL implodes, Michigan will have much less collateral damage to clean up.
Not so sure about that. You can't sit around and wait assuming things will become more reasonable and regulated--who knows when that will happen? It may change and M may be better positioned administratively if NIL becomes less Wild West but the recruits will remember M's last 3-5 years as a second-tier program depending on how long this goes on before an "anticipated" change happens--and that inertia is a problem in recruiting.
Actually, you can sit around and wait. It's sort of what Michigan is doing with its laissez-faire approach to NIL. The binary choice is to engage in free agency or not. Michigan is choosing not to. If the landscape for NIL never changes, then Michigan has still made its choice - no to free agency. They, seemingly, have decided that they don't want to engage in free agency however long NIL exists. They still have a program, but it will NOT be pay to attend. Further, recruits won't remember anything. Hoke and Harbaugh recruited well after the most feeble decade of Michigan football in half of a century.
The NCAA can regulate it! Just as they determine the rules and bylaws for admission into their association, they can dictate the terms of NIL for members.
The hesitancy was probably in seeing how NIL would take shape. Now that it's apparent how chaotic and corrupt it will be, countermeasures can be prepared. The NCAA will attempt to craft something that is advantageous for them in a potential lawsuit.
But, if you think 100+ schools are going to sit quietly by and not demand that their governing body rein in a wild west free agency that benefits 10 schools, but damages the entire lot, then you're fooling yourself.
2 of the most prominent CFB Head Coaches have already expressed displeasure with NIL (Saban, Harbaugh).
Well, that is exactly the AD thinks. But it is completely wrong. NCAA has no power to fix this. And it also lacks the will. Congress is not going to grant an anti-trust exemption. But maybe the folks in the AD that are collecting big pay checks, but are too naive to figure this out, will figure in out in a few years after the program is totally cratered. Or not. They have been stuck in a 1997 mentality since...1997. Can't really see it changing.
This is an interesting take.
It sounds like what Oregon is doing breaks NCAA rules. The NCAA has shown time and time again that they don’t have the stomach or ability to enforce rules. Will they try to reign it in or will it become literally anything goes?
Harbaugh was so cutting edge within the rules when he 1st arrived. It’s hard to watch knowing what could be.
I think what he was alluding to is NIL money coming back down to a mean... right now it's in a hyper-inflationary stage where boosters and businesses are throwing stupid amounts of cash at unproven kids because its new and they can. One would think once they see how little return on investment they're getting after a few years that the amount of money thrown around will start to recede, I hope. Whether UM is playing the long game or not, this is the current CFB landscape, so we can debate ad nauseam about potential ramifications for "sitting out". As an OSU fan, UM's approach is interesting to say the least.
Sigh. How many times are we going to beat this dead horse?
The beatings will continue until morale improves?
Until a 5 star QB commits and then will start back up as soon as we finish second for another 5 star player.
Michigan cannot sustain success by getting classes ranked 30-40, and relying on development
I can guarantee you this class will not be ranked 30-40. We will likely end up in the top 15 as usual.
I am not quite as confident as you that we will end up in the top 15, but I think that is more likely than 30 to 40.
We are currently ranked 41 with a average of 88.59. 24 of the schools ranked above us have an average ranking of less than 88 (e.g. they are ranked above us solely because they have more recruits). There are only 9 schools below us with an average of more than 88. If we assume that we end up at around a similar composite average that means that we likely pass most/all of the schools ahead of us with an average below 88 and only some of the schools below us pass us. Four of the schools above 88 are below 88.5. assuming schools stay at similar averages, we end up in the low 20s. Based on average recruit last year an 88.5 would likely have put us in similar territory.
A little improvement in our average puts us squarely in the mid teens
I agree that we probably won’t crack the top 15. After winning the conference and making the playoff this would be pretty disappointing.
The Harbaugh-Vikings thing and the lack of NIL are both probably hurting us right now. Hard to say how much is contributed to each of those issues.
How are you not murdered every hour?
Hahahahahahaha
Day drinking on a Sunday afternoon?
If not, this is even more embarrassing.
Someone is on your lawn.
I do not believe this is a WM issue, I think this is a University of Michigan issue. If the University will not dive head-first into the NIL pool and swim with the rest of them, then we will look at a program that will fall flat very soon.
I may be mistaken here, but the football program and basketball program bring in the most money of any department at the University, yet the University is not doing all it can to help the student athletes rake some of that money in.
You are absolutely mistaken. Athletics is a drop in the bucket. It is a marketing project for the University.
Look at housing, the hospitals, research. These all dwarf athletics.
Just because the part of the university that you interact with is the athletic department does not mean that it is the most significant.
The hospital has a billion dollar budget.
Lol, yes, you are mistaken. Badly mistaken.
Athletics is a public relations tool for the university. That’s it. The university isn’t going to do anything that hurts it’s image as an academics/research first university. It doesn’t want to be seen as a football factory.
OSU and Bama don’t care if they are.
Realistically aren't those football factory programs in the same boat now than they were pre-NIL? They all competed for the same recruits using similar tactics, they'll still compete for the same recruits but just with on-the-table NIL money now. So pre-NIL it was who has the hottest coeds and loosest boosters willing to buy cars and dole out cash under the table. Now, it's who has the best NIL deals. We'll still be us and occasionally lose a few recruits to one of those schools.
Or we can’t beat MSU in recruiting will be the new thing.
Did it hurt Michigan's image when they swam with the big fish from 1970 to 2005? I fail to see how imploding our athletic programs is going to help the university.
U-M will never have a university president who says "I'm hoping the coach doesn't dismiss me."
You are mistaken. While athletics bring in revenue (budgeted at 165 Million in 21-22), Michigan Medicine brings in a ton more auxiliary revenue. General fund revenue (which is mostly Student Tuition and Fees, grants and State support) was budgeted to bring in 2.4 Billion dollars--approximately 1.8B is student tuition and fees). (this was looking at projected budget).
All of these units spend most of the revenue they bring in on providing the services.
At Michigan, unlike many smaller Universities--especially Non P5 publics, auxiliary revenue sources (mostly) fully fund those parts of the university (i.e. Michigan Medicine revenue completely funds the medical school; athletics revenue completely funds athletics) so no general fund revenue is used to subsidize athletics.
It is hard to say what impact changing the things the OP whines about would have on the other sources of revenue (and a strong athletic program certainly helps recruit undergraduates), but the President and the Regents are managing an enterprise and a brand that is much bigger than athletics, I am sure they are wary of making changes that could damage the University's academic reputation.
This is good information. Thanks for correcting me.
You are high.
There is a reason that UM is number 25 in the world rankings and osu is nowhere close and Alabama is nowhere to be seen.
I hate to be the one to inform you, but the University of Michigan is far bigger than athletics. The U will do nothing to ruin that reputation.
You are dead wrong. There is zero causal connection between Michigan's academic ranking and whether Michigan tries to play at the bog boy table in college football. Zero. Thay have nothing to do with one another.
Ok, what is the highest ranked "bag school" in the usnwr rankings? There's no osu or Alabama there son. No Georgia, Texas a and m.. where's auburn at? How have duke or kentucky basketball money helped? Kansas? Lol
Have their "increased applications" led to a higher ranking? Nope. Has crap athletics hurt Chicago? Nope!
You have crisler in the name. He came from Princeton. Used to be good at athletics. Now they're obsolete. Even hired the best track coach in the country, Keene Fitzpatrick from um.. did that help their rank in the 20s? did it hurt it in the 40s when we took crisler? Nope. Research money.. endowment.. big boy stuff..
You're a clown
Michigan spent $1.6 billion on research and development in 2018, ranking it 2nd in the nation. The amount of research dollars brought in from the federal government and other public and private entities dwarfs the athletic dept budget.
Is Toby Seth’s other account, or did Toby just listen to the WTKA Roundtable and get all riled up?
Yeah can the guy who's running one of the most succesful athletic programs in the country. Arguably top 2 or 3 all things considered. Dunno how many wrong moves he's made but can't be many.
Hey everybody! Let's unreasonably panic five months before signing day when the July visit/commitment cycle hasn't happened yet!!!!
Yes, it's concerning. But Michigan recruiting got tubed much more by Harbaugh deciding to blow up all the goodwill from last season by flirting with the NFL than by differences in dollars being thrown around. It sucks that recruiting doesn't match expectations from last season, it sucks that there's something in the water in the state of Michigan that seems to make it so recruitments that SEEM like slam-dunks are actually basically chasing after players who were never coming to Michigan no how no way. The only thing here that's Warde's fault was not clearing out Harbaugh's office while he was interviewing with the Vikings and bringing in a new coach.
For better or worse this is just what Michigan was always going to do with NIL. They'll figure it out, it will just take time to figure out how its done in a way that matches the way Michigan does stuff and it's going to be slow and it won't turn out the way people might prefer, but Michigan just won;t play fast and loose, so we as well just get used to it and hope this particular ship gets turned in the right direction soon.
I thought the commitment parade was June? Now it's July?
BTW: BBQ should be exciting. I am reading a lot of high recruits are attending.
Announcement dates in July for the players people think are going to commit is what I understand. Care about facts on the ground not responding to whatever narrative you think you’re responding to.
A strong, or even mediocre, NIL program would overcome any negativity from Harbaugh’s NFL flirtation. We have a weak NIL program.
Consider the Oregon’s staff is basically brand new, with a first time head coach.
If I considered that, I would be considering something that doesn’t really compare very well to Michigans situation.
New, unproven head coach is not the same as one who oozes instability because he tried to fuck off to the Vikings after his one successful season.
Yeah, Warde Manuel is probably much more the bystander in this particular area than anything else. The University Of Michigan has always been, as a rule, very deliberate about its brand and brand equity and I will agree that they are probably this way to their own detriment. That said, I don't see how firing Manuel for any perceived substandard response to NIL competition would improve the situation unless it came to pass that he was the roadblock in implementing a board-level decision, which I very much doubt is the case.
It seems this is a major issue that needs brought up by The Boosters, NIL Collective that has formed with the AD Warde Manual and Jim Harbaugh to the University President and Regents.
Yes the Athletic Department and Football are a drop in the bucket financially to the university. However the reaps massive benefits from athletics and from Football and that cannot be undersold!