247 has a link showing all the Michigan 5 stars
Man, a few things I find interesting:
1. We haven't had a ton since they became a thing
2. We haven't had much luck with the one's we've had
3. How many players on the 97 team would have been considered 5 star?
February 1st, 2018 at 8:17 AM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 8:09 AM ^
Shameless self-plug, I guess, but I have a page that lists every player Michigan has recruited since 2002 and where they were ranked in their class.
The highest ranked player Michigan has grabbed is Rashan Gary at #1, and the lowest is Quintin Patilla, who was a 0-star recruit in 2006.
February 1st, 2018 at 8:21 AM ^
Is this based on the 247 composite, or another ranking metric?
edit: Stupid question, the answer is on your site, Thanks!!!!
February 1st, 2018 at 9:25 AM ^
One of the basic tenants of this site has been to thoroughly debunk the notion that "stars don't matter." It has been done thoroughly and repeatedly on MGoBlog and elsewhere. Not only is it not an accurate opinion, it definitely isn't an original one.
For those who care about things like data, statistics and, I dunno, PROOF, it's pretty clear that, in the aggregate, recruit rankings are often an excellent indicator of future performance. Team's that stock up on highly rated recruits invariable do better than teams that don't.
For those into anecdotal evidence, yes, we can all point to the five star bust and the two star all-pro and say "see, stars don't matter."
At the 10,000 foot view, the recruiting services are definitely providing worthwhile information. On the individual player level, you can point to any number of players that they didn't evaluate quite accurately.
Hence, as a prospect, I take my ranking with a grain of salt. However, as an individual interested in guaging the trajectory of any given program, these rankings are a significant indicator.
We've had this conversation 1000 times.
February 1st, 2018 at 10:42 AM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 11:47 AM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 9:46 AM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 10:31 AM ^
I heard that also. He hasn't mentioned Patterson since his father said he was down to 2 schools, and Michigan isn't one of them. I guess that's paywalled info.
February 1st, 2018 at 10:35 AM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 11:25 AM ^
Sam hates to be called wrong. I would never call these guys wroong, but he has said on more than a few occassions that it was a ND, Michigan battle, and for Michigan to be eliminated doesn't look good. So it's better to just avoid the issue all together.
February 1st, 2018 at 11:39 AM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 9:44 AM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 10:08 AM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 11:32 AM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 12:38 PM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 10:09 AM ^
"Stars Don't Matter" - fans of schools who have crappy recruiting classes
"Depth Class" - Michigan made up term to describe said crappy recruiting class
February 1st, 2018 at 10:32 AM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 11:22 AM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 1:06 PM ^
Fact: Michigan is struggling to hold onto its only top 100 recruit for 2018
Fact: Ohio St. has already signed 12 such players and may add 1 more
February 1st, 2018 at 10:27 AM ^
By my count we basically hit on 11.5/16 Five Stars becoming very good college players. That's not bad, especially considering a few of the kids removed themselves from the equation with poor choices. There's some inference on DPJ and Aubrey Solomon, but both played like Five State Freshmen. They both look to be on track to manifest their recruiting ranking.
Hits: Rashan Gary, Jabrill Peppers, Ryan Mallett (0.5 - became a very good player, just at another school), Lamarr Woodley, Prescott Burgess, Chad Henne, Brandon Graham, DPJ, Ernest Shazor, Aubrey Solomon, Marlin Jackson, Gabe Watson
Misses: Kelly Baraka, Kevin Grady, Derrick Green, Marques Slocum
If 75% of the Five Stars you take end being, at a minimum, All-Conference type players and having some type of NFL career, have you really had bad luck? Especially when 2(?) of the misses weren't necessarily a bad evaluation or bad coaching job, but the kid more or less removing himself from the equation? Seems to me that Michigan has done just fine with Five Star recruits.
February 1st, 2018 at 10:42 AM ^
Jury is still out on Donovan and Aubrey. They were freshmen last season. Don't get me wrong, as they have much upside and I believe they will be good, but I don't think we can say they are hits just yet.
February 1st, 2018 at 10:47 AM ^
Yeah, I said there's still some projection, but based on their freshman years you'd say they're hits, just for the purpose of this exercise. They both played like 5 star freshmen. They're also both good people. If DPJ or Aubrey suddenly gets into drugs or decides to rob someone then this could change, but all the data we have suggests "hits".
February 1st, 2018 at 10:55 AM ^
OK but I think most would agree that starting as a true freshman (especially at positions in which it's more difficult to start early such at DT and WR) is a very good sign putting them on the verge of being hits (and certainly on that path). Most would agree that it's a much better than 50/50 shot at this point. I think that was the point.
February 1st, 2018 at 11:04 AM ^
It was the point. At this point, gun to your head, you would say both are hits.
February 1st, 2018 at 10:39 AM ^
Amazing we have had so few in total while other teams sometimes get four or five five-star players in ONE CLASS.
February 1st, 2018 at 11:54 AM ^
I take issue with your #2 point. I see 10 out of that group of 15 that either panned out very well or are still in progress.
Three of the five misses were running backs. Take that for what it's worth.
February 1st, 2018 at 12:29 PM ^
My stars.....
Obviously there are 5* with natural ability that is superior to others.
Other than those, a 4* with great attitiude and work eithic will out perform most 5* divas 9x out of 10.
I think.
February 1st, 2018 at 12:57 PM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 1:32 PM ^
February 2nd, 2018 at 6:19 AM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 2:45 PM ^
It depends on when you are calling the recruit a 5*. The guys that end up that way are either:
1) Amazing athletes (Julio Jones, Jabrill...)
2) Continue to go to camps and all-star games
These kids end up as 5*s when the rankings are "finalized" (which is in the Spring) and the kids are different than those tagged as 5* the year before.
Also, a 4* kid, who gets offers from all of the big boys will end up as a 5* compared to the 5* kid that gets offers from 1-2 big boys and a bunch of MAC teams.
February 1st, 2018 at 1:02 PM ^
Believe it or not, some continue to work hard after they're in college, but they're stuck with the stars they were given before they enrolled.
Crazy system, but that's how it is.
February 1st, 2018 at 2:32 PM ^
IMO, college football recruiting is following the path of basketball - there are a few programs that are willing to do anything to land superstars and provide a short-term path to the NFL.
Bama and OSU are essentially the Kentucky basketball of football (two/three and done vs. one and done). They bring in a galaxy of stars, promise early playing time and an NFL career very quickly. I wouldn't be surprised if other incentives are promised as well.
Michigan is simply not that kind of place. It makes no sense to lament our lack of 5 stars relative to Bama and OSU - we don't play by the same rules.
They have guys who couldn't hack it here academically, who have no desire to "play school", and who are attracted to the idea of teaming up with all their superstar buddies.
That doesn't mean we can't win and win big. It also doesn't mean we can't get our share of 5 stars. Great coaching, recruiting and development of quality kids can do great things.
I'd say the closest analogy to Michigan football is....Michigan basketball, with a higher ceiling.
While football certainly has more traditional success and notoriety, both hoops and football recently went through a rough period, and finally hired a great coach to right the ship.
Both teams produce a lot of professional-caliber talent, both recruit a combination of high and upper-mid level guys, with a few sleepers mixed in. Both miss more than hit when going after top guys. Both are great at player development, and finding superb role players.
Michigan football is bigger than Michigan basketball, so ultimately the football team should be able to recruit at a higher level and contend for championships more frequently than hoops - but it will be done using a formula much closer to Michigan hoops than Kentucky hoops or Bama/OSU football.
February 1st, 2018 at 5:45 PM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 9:11 PM ^
How can someone that's been a member of this site since 2009 continue to repeat the myth that it's somehow appreciably harder to get into Michigan as a football player than it is to get into any other school, such as MSU or OSU or PSU or Alabama? It's been repeatedly debunked by people who, like, actually work in the admissions department.
It's harder to get into UM as an every day student than it is to get into OSU-- a *lot* harder. But if you are a worthy of a football scholarship, there is no evidence to suggest that won't get into UM if you got into OSU, and over a decade's worth of multiple threads and articles detailing why the idea is nonsense.
I mean, the current head football coach of Michigan once publicly complained that he wasn't able to get marginal students into Stanford the way he would have been able to if he had been at Michigan...
February 1st, 2018 at 11:08 PM ^
couldn't hack it here academically
have no desire to "play school"
That's what I wrote. I said nothing about entrance requirements.
Meeting entrance requirements does not equal potential success at Michigan.
I feel pretty certain there are guys who played at Bama and OSU (among other schools) who weren't pursued by Michigan because it's likely they would not be successful. Michigan is certainly more restrictive when it comes to Juco transfers. I also think there are players who don't want the challenge of succeeding at Michigan and choose an easier academic path.
Of course there are great students who play at both Bama and OSU, but if you think the academic emphasis and challenge at those places and Michigan are the same, I disagree.
Finally, IIRC, you got Harbaugh's comments wrong. I believe he was not complaining about Stanford's admissions standards or academic rigor; rather, he was touting them, and expressed disappointment that Michigan did not match Stanford's high standards (stating he was discouraged from majoring in history, for example). If anything, Harbaugh's presence at Michigan is further evidence that academics matter, because by his own words it's keenly important to him.
You're right, I never worked in the admissions office, but I know people who did. I'm just a guy who grew up in A2, went to UM and have closely followed UM sports for decades.
February 2nd, 2018 at 12:27 AM ^
FWIW, the guy that didn't "come here to play school" had above a 3.0 GPA when he tweeted that, and was by all accounts an above average student. He also graduated on time.
But if it makes you feel better to believe that football players take academics more seriously at UM than they do elsewhere, that's fine.
February 1st, 2018 at 3:28 PM ^
Hah, it looks like they've got Brandon Graham's 9th grade year listed as his class, 2002. He wouldn't arrive at Michigan for another 4 years.
February 1st, 2018 at 5:05 PM ^
February 1st, 2018 at 8:41 PM ^
Consensus is that more stars are better the fewer stars.
I suspect I don't know half as much about running backs as some on this thread but I will always be amazed that La'veon was a 2 star. The first time I watched Bell was when he was a freshman at MSU and I thought, "Wow, I do believe this guy will be playing in the NFL." I believe he had three carries but his vision seemed spot on.
February 2nd, 2018 at 8:50 AM ^
with as many 5 stars as possible. I like the odds.