This Week's Obsession: Signing Day Roundtable Comment Count

Ace

[ED (Seth): This was published early yesterday afternoon, and then the site had to be reset, so we're republishing now.]

We almost needed an "other than Solomon" caveat. [Tony Morano/247]

SIGNING DAY ROUNDTABLE 2017

Brian: uh... so do we have an "other than Gary?" caveat this year?

Ace: I don’t think so. multiple ridiculous croots.

BiSB: Agreed

Brian: All right then

BEST RECRUIT

Ace: I’m as high on Donovan Peoples-Jones as anyone after following him at Cass Tech for years. That said, Aubrey Solomon’s highlight tape is on another level. He’s going to be a monster.

David: DPJ. Highest ranked.  Fills a massive need.  And from a local pipeline.

BiSB: Recency bias, but did you see the things Aubrey Solomon did to those poor damn high schoolers? Such a quick first step, and he arrives with a level of violence we probably shouldn't condone as a society. He's also a big symbolic get, being a 5-star from Georgia with offers from every SEC school. Satellite camps FTW.

Brian: While Solomon and Peoples-Jones are both correct answers, I think Cesar Ruiz is also correct. I can't remember the last time a center recruit ended up so high in the rankings; multiple services raved about him at both the Opening and the Army game, where he took on and defeated the best the country has to offer. At least two of them said he was the best center prospect in a decade. He might be a sure thing in a spot where not even Patrick Kugler is a sure thing.

David: I refused to watch the Solomon tape, as I heeded the Harris warning.  But...now I can!

Seth: I haven't watched the Solomon tape yet because I already watched the Harris tape this year and my therapist says not to put myself at risk...dammit David.

Brian: The Solomon tape is ridiculous. I was trying to add some variety to the answers but it's Solomon. He is Malik McDowell after the Wizard of Oz gives him a heart.

Ace: And we should note that DPJ is ridiculous, too. Solomon is just on a different level of ridiculous.

[Hit THE JUMP for Most Important, NOTY, Sleepers, and much more.]

MOST IMPORTANT

Brian: Let's just get this out of the way: other than Aubrey Solomon.

Seth: I don't know if [whichever offensive lineman starts] is an answer but at least one and up to three of them could.

Ace: Michigan is in desperate need of tackles, so I’d say either Chuck Filiaga or Andrew Stueber. Filiaga has the recruiting accolades but may need some time to put it together. Stueber is going to surprise people.

David: I guess this is where I say Cesar Ruiz.  M will definitely need a OL starter from this class next year and Ruiz has as good a shot as any.  Brian mentioned his almost unprecedented ranking for a center.  Possibly a 4 year starter.  Getting Ruiz was as 'whew'-inducing as anyone, I think.

Brian: Ambry Thomas wins for me because he brings two things to the table. One: he's an outstanding prospect in a secondary that loses its top five players. Two: he was widely reputed a Michigan State lean early, attended State-favoring King, and Michigan brought him in anyway. That's their biggest theft from State since Lamarr Woodley and set the tone for an unprecedented in-state blowout.

BiSB: You can make a case for Luiji Vilain as well. Michigan needed a pure edge rusher, especially if Josh Uche is going to be a linebacker permanently.

Seth: There's something to be said for Jaylen Kelly-Powell here. Michigan effectively has three safety positions they want to put on the field at any moment and right now the field is "thank God for Tyree Kinnel," "glad that 3-star from Devin Bush's school looked good," and "yay Glasgows!"

Ace: JKP could play that VIPER spot. He’s a good choice.

BEST GIFT TO UNWRAP IN THREE YEARS

BiSB: Dylan McCaffrey. NEXT

Ace: He’s got a lot ahead of him on the running back depth chart, but O’Maury Samuels is an absurd athlete. He’ll be a home-run threat every time he touches the ball. He could take some time to acclimate to the level of competition. Once he does, watch out.

Brian: Benjamin St Juste. St Juste has been playing against guys wielding hockey sticks for the duration of his career and will take significant time to adjust to college. Once he does you're talking about a 6'3" guy who has a Jourdan Lewis-caliber shuttle. He's got insane upside.

Ace: Man, I would’ve said St-Juste, but I think he sees the field sooner than that.

David: Maybe Kwity Paye.  Don Brown recruit with a lower profile.  Plenty of buzz around him being undervalued.  Probably not a guy that contributes too much too early, but has more potential as his career unfolds.

Seth: He may see the field way sooner but James Hudson sounds vastly underrated at "top 250 DT" and the same could be said for Donovan Jeter. Give them two years under the cruel tutelage of Mattison and I think we'll be relatively comfortable with Gary heading to the NFL.

BEST NAME (NATIONALLY)

Brian: Other than KOBE BUFFALOMEAT

Ace: KOBE BUFFALOMEAT DIBS oh goddammit

Brian: I think it's still KOBE BUFFALOMEAT even with the disclaimer that it can't be him.

David: Obviously.

BiSB: A late entry from Wrangler Haresnape

(Bonus points for the stache)

Brian: Good lord.

Ace: It’s not quite on the level of the above, but Octavius Pringle is pretty great.

Brian: I enjoyed Brelin Faison-Walden because nobody in the history of college football has ever sounded more like a viscount.

David: Obligatory Major Tennison reference.

Seth: When Michigan starts looking at guys I put them in my spreadsheet, so every update I do a search for Chaz Ah You and get upset all over again they I won't get to yell "AH YOOOOOOU!" after a bone-jarring hit.

Brian: As far as Michigan's class goes it's Luiji Vilain by a mile. I look forward to repeatedly posting Luigi mean mugs.

Ace: It’s definitely Vilain, though I think our long-time familiarity with him has made us underappreciate the greatness of the name Donovan Peoples-Jones.

BiSB: Obviously Michigan's strongest class of hyphens in years. Maybe ever.

David: The double plural is fantastic.

GUY WHO GOT AWAY WHO WILL HAUNT YOU FOREVER

Ace: You already know.

Seth: Gyah.

Ace: Don’t watch the tape.

David: Next. 

Ace: Though, actually, for the purposes of team need, it’s Isaiah Wilson.

Brian: I thought you might be referring to Isaiah Wilson and the hello post that now lives in the sad unpublished hello post graveyard.

Ace: Ugh. I was referring to Najee Harris but that may tip the scales.

Brian: Wilson was brutal especially because we knew behind the scenes that he had been a silent forever.

Ace: Also: he’s a very mobile house.

Brian: Also I put him in 27 Tickets. I have to stop doing that.

Ace: SERIOUSLY.

David: Watching Alex Leatherwood block for "The Tape" will not be fun, either.

Adam: Just sat down in Crisler. Really glad this is the question I jump in on.

Ace: grandpa simpson dot gif

Seth: Somehow I was prepared for both of those more than I pretend to be. I knew the moment Harbaugh decided to break the Mason-DIxon rule that we'd lose out on some guys who were in.

BiSB: The number of offensive linemen Michigan missed on will be a sore spot, with Wilson, Leatherwood, and Tedarrell Slaton leading the list.

Seth: Slaton I never got into.

Ace: Red flags popped up for him early.

Brian: The absence of a plug-and-play five-star or near five-star OT recruit is pretty much the only problem with the class so Wilson, Leatherwood, and Jedrick Wills are all candidates.

Wilson hurts the most because he was the closest to being in the class.

David: I think Willie Gay would have been nice just to break the 49 state limit.

Brian: Yeah, also I could get behind Peppers 2.0.

Ace: Yeah, he would’ve been the ideal VIPER, and one that could’ve potentially started right away.

Brian: Somehow losing him to Mississippi State is less painful than LSU.

Ace: Yes, black hole mitigates the disappointment.

David: I would have put him for "Most Important"

Brian: For crystal ball purposes this is every potential fifth DB we sort of tried to flip and then backed off of.

Seth: In non-ESS EEE SEE battles, I see the sites dropped AJ Dillon since he flipped to BC, but anyone who looked closely at him saw the kind of talent that, well, you don't want to see wasting away at Boston College.

GUY YOU'RE MOST IRRATIONALLY ENTHUSED ABOUT

Seth: ST JUSTE ST JUSTE ST JUSTE

Brian: can i say 2018 Aussie man-mountain Daniel Faalele

Seth: Wait he even has a hyphen. ST-JUSTE.

Ace: We need to set a standard here because everyone in this class is good.

Seth: That is rational enthusiasm.

Brian: Gentleman you think will exceed his composite ranking.

Ace: Andrew Stueber, easily. He’s impressively polished for a high school tackle. If he played in a football-centric state he’s a no-doubt four-star.

BiSB: Still Khaleke Hudson. But if we're sticking with this class, Joel Honigford.

David:

Brian: Stueber is a guy who ESPN had fresh eyes on when he committed and he's a solid four star to them already. Scout too.

Ace: We said composite!

Brian: I'm not disagreeing. I'm just saying that a couple of the sites that paid attention at the right time are optimistic and the others not so much.

Seth: I'm at 1 minute in the Aubrey Solomon tape now and since ESPN forgot to update their rankings there's some room between where he's at and the top shelf to explore.

Ace: Also James Hudson is a four-star but he’s Willie Henry with a year head-start on technique progression.

Brian: I still think it's James Hudson even after 24/7 shot him to the fringe of the top 100. That tape isn't Solomon's but it's not that far off. Dude is huge and explosive. Boy how much would we have hated shipping him to MSU at this juncture.

David: Aren't they full?

Brian: Not only would he be their top croot he'd be replacing some guy ranked in the 2500s.

Ace: His junior- to senior-year progression is reminiscent of Taco Charlton.

Adam: Jaylen Kelly-Powell may be a composite four-star, but I think he's far better than the 266th best player in the country. His versatility is impressive. He held his own when matched up against Ambry Thomas, which is worth noting considering the buzz around Thomas as a two-way guy.

Brian: That's interesting because you saw Cass in person a couple times and various folks are down on JKP. One of them is Comparoni so lol, but also Rivals in general.

Ace: Which, also, lol. They’ve had some bad misses in the region of late.

Seth: I've got two cheats on this one. Brad Hawkins was dropped to #420 because he went to prep, but his prep film is noticeably better than his high school film--I think he's at least in range of the other 4-star receivers Michigan got this year (I kept him at last year's ratings in my spreadsheet).

The other cheat is Kurt Taylor, who willed his way onto the Michigan football team despite a national ranking that's only marginally better than the last five Michigan State commits.

Brian: Hawkins is a good one.

FAVORITE THING ABOUT THE  CLASS

Adam: Aubrey Solomon

BiSB: 

Brian: The New New Jersey, Michigan

Ace: The wide receiver haul. DPJ is ridiculous, Black is a big-time possession receiver, Martin can’t be covered and catches everything, Hawkins is slept on, and Collins—if he drops—is a classic red zone threat. Collins is probably the one I’m least excited about and in most years he’d be the headliner.

Brian: It is without question the best WR haul in program history. The only comparable class is the Terrell/Walker class, which had #1 and #2 but nobody else.

David: There are many great individual choices, but I really love that Michigan cleaned up in-state in one of the better years in Michigan High School Football.  AND the overall quality depth of the class.  There are very good players at multiple positions that are not the best player Michigan got in that particular spot.

Seth: The thing about this class is the guys Michigan got early, with only a few exceptions, kept going up. The only significant drop since last summer is Dylan McCaffrey, and like, okay he's still a McCaffrey. Almost every complaint from the three-star mafia this year was nullified because the guy either drifted away (Lasater) or leaped up the rankings (St-Juste, Steuber, Vilain, Martin, Jeter...)

And I mean camp leaps, not "Michigan is interested we'd better upgrade him."

Brian: This is a minor point but I do love grabbing the top recruit from seven different states and/or Canadas.

Ace: And, rather incredibly, Solomon isn’t among that number. The state of Georgia had a stupid good crop this year.

BiSB: A lot of that is Don Brown's pull in the Northeast, which is nice to have.

Seth: Taking the most Big Ten West receiver ever out of Iowa is some small recompense for making me stand in the cold and eat a loss among a swarm of people I couldn't hate.

Brian: I could actually do with another Don Brown dude or two in the class. Like, I heard about Melifonwu and I was like "yes please." But that's more in the next category.

LEAST FAVORITE THING ABOUT THE CLASS

Ace: We’ve mostly covered this, but it’s the lack of a truly elite, ready-to-play offensive tackle.

Brian: Yep.

David: I really would have liked a SLAM DUNK TACKLE.

BiSB: Uh huh.

Seth: Like, is a 17-year-old, ready-to-order All Big Ten left tackle that too much to ask?

Brian: I'm gonna bold it too. Y U NO SHAQUILLE O'NEAL EXCEPT FOOTBALL? [Ed-Ace: Brian initially spelled it "O'Neill"]

BiSB: Technically Shaq was a rappist as well, so Brian is not allowed to spell his name correctly.

Brian: Very, very technically. Also, I didn't like losing AJ Dillon to BC.

Ace: Shaq was certified platinum! This is very on-topic.

BiSB: And relevant, given that the typo was fixed.

Seth: I guess if we can live one year with Mason Cole we could get Aussie Shaq Except Football next year.

Brian: That guy had a monster SPARQ score at 230 pounds and could easily have become the kind of YAC monster a fully functional Harbaugh offense thrives on.

Ace: If RB didn’t work out, he could’ve been a nice linebacker, too.

Brian: For that guy to sign up for death by TFL is sad.

Ace: Yeah, voluntarily signing up to play on BC’s offense is puzzling.

Brian: "I'm just gonna get up a nice head of steam here.... aaaaaaand it's gone."

BiSB: Dudes gettin' tackled right away by dudes.

Seth: At least they'll have to do a 30 for 30 when he goes 30 for 30.

Brian: Also in minor disappointments, no tight end is very un-dude.

BiSB: Did you see Aubrey Solomon blocking as a tight end? It could happen.

Brian: You just want to bring him up again.

BiSB: Well... yeah.

Ace: He pancaked a guy and then gave him a stern talking-to. The ref was too afraid to throw a flag. It's worth discussing.

David: AND he was still able to get free up the seam!

RANDOM THING YOU HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO BRING UP YET

Seth: I just finished the Aubrey Solomon video. Can we get this guy?

Ace: We haven’t mentioned the linebackers at all and we should mention the linebackers.

BiSB: Was just typing that.

Brian: Yeah, got some of those.

Ace: Drew Singleton had a chance to be a five-star before the ACL. He’s going to be a great ILB.

Seth: And you'd think signing the best player out of New Jersey would be a big deal.

David: It's really not getting old at all.

Ace: Jordan Anthony is right there, too. Plus they got a bigger version of James Ross in Josh Ross.

Brian: My thing is so you're a recruiting site. And you're looking at Dylan McCaffrey and maybe he's a little skinny and maybe he's not quite as impressive as some of the other guys right now. But his last name is McCaffrey, and he's going to be coached by Jim Harbaugh. Am I betting against that guy? I am not.

Being just outside the top 100 in the composite isn't a huge slight, I know. But I'm just sayin'.

Seth: That's basically where Gardner wound up. And Morris.

David: Also, I got stuck in a Homecoming parade route driving way out to see Phil Paea.  So, if he turns out to be pretty good, that would be nice.

Ace: I’ll mention that I’m not super-enthused about Paea as a DT prospect but I think he could be a really good OG.

BiSB: But what about when Harbaugh leaves to coach the Browns or something

Seth: We're so excited about the WRs and got so worried about nose until Solomon came back around that we left out that they loaded up everywhere on the DL. If you wanted to find something similar between all of the serious title contenders this year they all had ridiculous DLs. We already brought up the 5-star nose, the Willie Henry except more ready, and the guy who reminds us of Taco. There's way more where that came from. Jeter, Irving-Bey and Malone-Hatcher alone would be a good DL haul.

Ace: Love the versatility of that group, too. Vilain should be an excellent WDE, Solomon a great nose, and everyone else can play at least two spots. CMH could be a WDE or SDE and the rest are SDE/3-tech types.

I should clarify that Solomon is a multi-spot guy, too. And Hudson is strong enough to play nose.

Seth: And rounded out by Kwity Paye, who could be a WDE or a Crable-like SAM.

BiSB: Any chance Don Brown can find some interesting ways to use those guys and Rashan Gary?

Ace:

BiSB: Aubrey Solomon.

Okay, now we can be done.

Brian: In conclusion, gentlemen, Harbaugh hates recruiting.

Comments

skegemogpoint

February 2nd, 2017 at 10:28 AM ^

There's so much to like in this class it's hard to single anyone out but I think O'Maury Samuels will prove to be a great player in 2018 and beyond.  He's tough between the tackles (like De'veon), picks his spots well in traffic and explosive in open field (like Evans).  

Sopwith

February 2nd, 2017 at 7:56 PM ^

Is so completely bonkers I am seriously wondering if the kid has ever been checked for an extremely rare mutation similar to people who have a disease called Emery-Dreifuss. People who have it (the anabolic pathway version) basically have no fat on their bodies, and as a result some look just like "comic book heroes" for their exagerrated musculature. There are major downsides as you'd expect, but not the sort you'd catch in routine physicals. People who actually have the muscular dystrophy variant (the catabolic pathway version) are just the opposite-- basically skeletal.

There is an amazing story about this on This American Life if anyone is interested, the podcast was called "Something Only I Can See" about a woman with a wasting disease who looked at an olympic athlete with that "comic book" appearance and amazingly saw what no world expert had figured out-- that they had a slightly different version of the same disease. Here's a pic of the athlete, a Canadian Olympic sprinter named Priscilla Lopes-Schliep, and no, she's not on PEDs (because of her appearance she was one of the most heavily tested athletes you'll ever find):

ProPublica originally reported the story (LINK) and if you don't listen to the podcast, seriously, read the story. It's unbelievable.

Everyone Murders

February 2nd, 2017 at 10:43 AM ^

No love for the punter?  I mean, I understand that we hope to only use him once or twice a season, but still.

Many things to be excited about in this class, but I love the DL recruits as a group maybe as much as the WR corps.  I would not mind "DL U" becoming a thing, if it hasn't already.

Lou MacAdoo

February 2nd, 2017 at 10:44 AM ^

This class is so loaded and well rounded. It's nice to see most of the recruits actually get a bump in the ratings instead of constantly dropping. Harbaugh!!! Also, those sattelite camps sure worked out wonderfully for us. I completely understand why the SEC had their panties in a bunch. Harbaugh is a legit threat to them keeping their jobs. Here's to Harbaugh stealing pipelines! Cheers

dragonchild

February 2nd, 2017 at 5:21 PM ^

As discussed rather extensively by MGoStaff, well-rounded, not so much.  It kind of walks the fine line between "best player available" and filling out depth.  I mean that in a good way, but I wouldn't say "well-rounded".

5 OL in a normal year is fine, but this isn't a normal year; our OT depth is super-thin so we ideally would've had 6-7 OL, with 3-4 of them being tackles.  It's not bad, just, "ideally".  Zero TEs; we're fine with TE depth for now, but for a HARBAUGH class that's a strange stat.  We pulled in a silly number of silly good WRs; that's a good thing, but clearly we got them because between WR and TE we went "star or bust" and wound up with a bunch of the former and none of the latter.

TrueBlue2003

February 3rd, 2017 at 11:42 PM ^

that we didn't take a TE but I'm glad we didn't because we already have too many. A year without is fine.

Btw, we did take 4 (!!!) OT's.  In fact, all of our OL not named Ruiz are tackles.  So were you hoping we'd have taken a couple guards?  If we did, what position group would have you have taken fewer of?

I would have gone with one fewer RB (Taylor?) and added a guard.  Also, 5 WRs in one class would seem excessive if they weren't all so good.  Not sure who I'd want to go without.  Still, I can't see how the targets get split up.  I have to think one or two will get redshirted.

DonAZ

February 2nd, 2017 at 10:47 AM ^

Every year there's some player I latch onto as the guy I'll keep an eye on.  Usually it's some under-the-radar guy ... typically a FB or a TE ... for example Sione Houma a few years back.

This year it's Oliver Martin.  There may be no greater satisfaction in the world that getting 1st down on a 3rd-and-15.  It crushes will of the opponent.  Which is good.

I love the squirrely posession receivers ... the guys that give up 50 pounds to some poor LB trying to cover said squirrel.  Squirrel for the win.

jabberwock

February 2nd, 2017 at 10:54 AM ^

almost seems like a transcript of your podcast however.

My question is regarding Wilson.
There were rumors that the way his recruitment ended hinted at something nefarious that may come to light.  Any info?

Mr Miggle

February 2nd, 2017 at 11:18 AM ^

3 of the 4 sites have him as a 4 star. Rivals has him as the #74 OT and a lower 3 star, while he's #35 in the composite. That's higher than everyone but Scout has him. Somehow 24, 38, 41, and 74 come out to #35. A lot of what comes out of their formula is counter-intuitive. It's a nice little tool, but I feel a lot of us give it too much weight because of its convenience. I wonder what becomes of it when 247 takes over Scout?

Incidentally, he is easily our lowest OL recruit on ESPN. They really like Hall and Honigford compared to the other sites.

BursleysFinest

February 2nd, 2017 at 12:03 PM ^

I believe the composite averages out the ratings of all sites and then re-orders the prospects based on that average.... So a recruit whose ratings all fall into a reasonably tight range (say  24-71), might end up ranked ahead of recruits who 1 or 2 services loved and the others all hated (say in an extreme situation, 15th, 20th, 250th, and 233rd) 

Mr Miggle

February 2nd, 2017 at 12:33 PM ^

And there aren't enough extreme cases like that to explain Stueber's rank. I don't think it's possible to simply average out his ranks and reach that result. Maybe if the sites have discrepancies on whether they are ranking players as tackles or guards.

In any case, I take their composite rankings with a grain of salt. Looking up the component ratings is more work, but also more informative.

M-Dog

February 2nd, 2017 at 11:30 AM ^

the hello post that now lives in the sad unpublished hello post graveyard.

After we win the National Championship, please post these so that we can have a moment of cathartic liberation as we then let them go forever.

 

 

kehnonymous

February 2nd, 2017 at 11:49 AM ^

It's really hard not to be excited about this class.  

The best class I can remember in terms of top-to-bottom depth and four-year productivity over the last 8-9 seasons was Hoke's first full 2012 class that has 27 guys, and 16-17ish contributors amongst them.

I'm leaving out last year's also-stellar 2016 group since they've only been here a year but this class is even larger as the 2012 group, much higher rated and the gap in quality of coaching they're gonna get vs the previous regime's is, to put it mildly, cavernous.  When you consider that this class will be bookended by the excellent 2016 class and 2018/19 classes that will also be top 10ish... 

Hold on to your butts.

lhglrkwg

February 2nd, 2017 at 12:23 PM ^

I don't know if it's just because Anthony and Singleton were assumed to be in for so long, but it wasn't long ago that the linebacking corps seemed lost and confused for the better part of a decade before McCray & Gedeon kicked some tail last year. Michigan's always seemed to lack those elite, athletic linebackers. I think those two could be great for us

Clarence Boddicker

February 2nd, 2017 at 12:31 PM ^

Harbaugh closed so strong he should get a Cadillac from Mitch and Murray. To me, the only miss that should hurt is Wilson, but the class is like a big shot of endorphins. I just don't feel it. Especially since we recruited real upside guys on the ol, a sizable group too, and Frey is onboard to coach them up.

buddha

February 2nd, 2017 at 12:48 PM ^

I wouldn't trade or change any of the recruits we have for others. I think Harbaugh and Co. did a wonderful job piecing this class together, and I look forward to the classes to come.

Having said that, the two guys I will watch with genuine interest over the next 3-4 years to see how their respective careers progress are Wilson and Gay. They are truly amazing talents - talents at positions we need - and I think they will be special. It's unfortunate we did not land them, but - again - our class is stellar.

StephenRKass

February 2nd, 2017 at 6:06 PM ^

We all have our opinions and ways to rank players. However, Magnus of Touch-The-Banner gave Solomon a 94 and DPJ an 89. Of course, this is just Magnus, but that's a significant difference.

drben51

February 3rd, 2017 at 9:54 AM ^

Ambry Thomas, in my opinion how this young man was not a five star is beyond me, equally remarkable no one is even talking about him here at mgoblog? This young man may look like a sweet young man but he, as they say plays with some "DOG".