Stanford, Cal and SMU to the ACC
Here we go. I could see the 3 that voted no leaving soon.
September 1st, 2023 at 1:23 PM ^
I heard Oregon State, Washington State, Dwight, and Jim formed an alliance.
September 1st, 2023 at 8:49 AM ^
I agree it does not seem like they would have the power to do something like block a big brand like FSU, although, how big of a brand is that? Top 20 I suppose. I could see Georgia or Alabama vetoing someone.
September 1st, 2023 at 10:32 AM ^
I’m not sure I understand why Florida would be so angry about FSU coming in?
Do they not want to share revenue with them?
They already play every year so it isn’t like they care about adding another tough game to the schedule. I’m assuming saying “we’re in the SEC” is a better recruiting pitch?
September 1st, 2023 at 2:10 PM ^
They'd rather see FSU wither and die on the vine in the ACC than throw them a lifeline into the SEC.
September 1st, 2023 at 5:48 PM ^
Probably for similar reasons as to why Michigan didn't want MSU in the Big Ten.
September 2nd, 2023 at 11:32 AM ^
1957(?) and 2023 are radically different times for college football, so I’m not sure if this relates that much
September 1st, 2023 at 8:47 AM ^
this is like the B10 adding Rutgers. All three schools are "meh" in terms of revenue driving athletics. This is the ACC being reactionary and taking the leftovers.
September 1st, 2023 at 8:50 AM ^
B12 took leftovers, ACC is in desperation mode taking the scraps left in the dog bowl. The ONLY reasons these schools were accepted is b/c they got such a huge discount. SMU is coming in allegedly for FREE and Calford are likely getting $15-20M/yr, less than half a full share.
This is getting an ipad for $250, but its a refurb.
September 1st, 2023 at 9:00 AM ^
They mention this is the tweet (and I've seen it elsewhere) but the ACC adding these teams is for survival, as UNC, FSU, and Clemson (and possibly other teams) are looking to leave the league and if that happens ESPN can renegotiate their media deal, which my guess will go about the way the Pac-12's went. So this is a way to stave off losing a ton of money in the future and at least getting some good schools overall in the process. If I'm the ACC I'd rather pick up Cal and Stanford now versus scrambling in 3 years and taking on, I don't know, App St. and Memphis because they're available. Cal, Stanford, and SMU at least have the ability to keep the lights on.
September 1st, 2023 at 10:13 AM ^
Plus they 3 schools who have agreed to be subservient to majority of ACC schools. Next time there is some sort of vote it'll be easier for them to push things through with 15/18 member votes vs the 12/15 they barely got with a NC State flip.
September 1st, 2023 at 5:12 PM ^
At this point I think we can stop calling it the ACC and just call it ND’s bitch. They have nothing without ND if FSU and Clemson leave.
September 1st, 2023 at 10:04 AM ^
The Big Ten chose to take Rutgers. They weren't the leftovers of anything. They were the 'squint hard and they're New York's team' addition. But that's the thing with squinting, sometimes you spot the dime, other times you think a police horse is Jerry's cousin.
September 1st, 2023 at 11:16 AM ^
Adding Rutgers got BTN onto Cable Boy's subscription.
September 1st, 2023 at 11:07 AM ^
The addition of Rutgers successfully brought BTN to New York and the rest of the northeast, solidifying the Big Ten's position as the richest conference. Their addition also killed the possibility of Penn State bolting for the ACC, ensuring stability for the coming decade. See the Pac-12, Big 12, and ACC for what happens when you lack stability.
Yeah, they're an athletics doormat, but there's a lot of revisionist history about adding them. It was a smart move.
September 1st, 2023 at 11:13 AM ^
Rutgers and Maryland are also very valuable assts to the Academic Consortium and bring about BIG $ in research and clout in congress for research revenues.
September 1st, 2023 at 8:47 AM ^
SMU basically subsidizing Cal and Stanford is hilarious. SMU has money but those schools have some of the largest endowments in the world and absolutely don't need to be supported.
Sounds like Clemson, UNC, and FSU are on the way out so I guess this keeps parity but what a stupid league the ACC is going to look like in a couple of years. And I say that as someone who roots for a team that includes teams in Seattle, LA, and Piscataway.
September 1st, 2023 at 9:05 AM ^
SMU is expected to come in for nine years with no broadcast media revenue, sources told ESPN, and both Cal and Stanford were expected to receive 30% shares of ACC payouts. That money being withheld is expected to create an annual pot of revenue between $50 million and $60 million. Some of the revenue will be divided proportionally among the 14 full-time members and Notre Dame, while another portion will be put in a pool designated for success initiatives that rewards programs that win.
ACC shopping at Dollar Tree:
https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/38304694/sources-acc-votes-invite-stanford-cal-smu
I'm not sure $60M/14 = $4.3M, probably no more than $3M if they divert some of that to a performance pool of $$$. It's pennies relative to the $10-40M/yr the ACC schools will be short of the B10/SEC b/t now and 2030
September 1st, 2023 at 10:16 AM ^
Yeah the ACC trying to stave off extinction, but in order to do that they need to make ND a full time, permanant member. But why would ND want to be if Clemson and FSU are about to leave. And for the teams you suggested above which make sense, are Memphis and App St going to do anything other than add teams for the sake of keeping the ESPN deal alive till 2036.
It is going to be a very weird conference.
September 1st, 2023 at 10:21 AM ^
Yeah, I've gotten tired of people treating ND's decision to not join the conference for football as some principled stand for tradition because it's just nakedly a cash grab by a school that wants to have its cake and eat it to. They basically get to have whatever schedule they want, with a dedicated network, and equal say in who gets into the playoff as every other conference (seriously, their AD has a spot on the CFP committee along with the heads of every other league, which is bananas since they're one school and the Big 10 is going be 18 teams). Of course they're not going to join a league; they've got everything they want and get flowers for doing so.
September 1st, 2023 at 11:15 AM ^
NBC is a dedicated as they are incompetent. Watching football on NBC is ND's punishment for being independent.
September 1st, 2023 at 10:33 AM ^
It may be a weird conference, but it won't last for long. Injecting a few neutrons into the nucleus will result in fission. The only question is the half-life of this unstable substance.
September 1st, 2023 at 1:41 PM ^
Stanford has money to burn, but not Cal. Cal among the most debt-ridden and financially dysfunctional athletic departments in the Power 5.
September 1st, 2023 at 8:48 AM ^
College athletics is no longer about the student athletes, it's all about the tv deals and how much the conferences and universities make off of it. NIL is great, but the NCAA should stop pushing the narrative that collegiate sports are all about the student athletes. For me it is becoming harder and harder to be maintain my interest in college sports because of this.
September 1st, 2023 at 10:17 AM ^
If the atheletes got revenue sharing from the TV deals would that bring you back in?
September 1st, 2023 at 11:18 AM ^
Dad I am shocked you post on MGoBlog using your flip phone.
As long as Michigan is a have no matter the "state" of college football the stadium will remain full and we will pay our $ to stream when that day comes in full.
September 1st, 2023 at 2:44 PM ^
The athletes have it better than ever before. NIL and transfer portal gives them immense power.
But the next step is to untangle the business that is CFB and CBB from the rest of the sports because those worlds are so far apart at this point it's not doing anyone a favor to keep them together.
September 1st, 2023 at 8:56 AM ^
It’s ok. At some point soon schools will have to start revenue sharing with players, which is going to remake the conference landscape all over again as schools in these superconferences won’t all be able to hang. This report showed most schools aren’t turning a profit right now.
But that still doesn't mean all these institutions are making money from athletics. According to the NCAA, among the 65 autonomy schools in Division I, only 25 recorded a positive net generated revenue in 2019.
If you aren’t one of the top athletic departments in the country, paying players the same kind of share as others in your conference may become untenable, leading to further realignment. We will see but we had 10 years from seeing the final version of all this sort itself out.
September 1st, 2023 at 9:05 AM ^
The over/under on # of years until we have a College Football Premier League just dropped from 10 years to 8 years.
September 1st, 2023 at 9:16 AM ^
I'm always a bit dubious of the stats claiming these athletic departments aren't net positive of revenue. The most up-to-date data I've seen (that article references 2019 numbers, which were negatively impacted by COVID shutdown) paints basically an even picture, with total revenue equalling total expenses. And total expenses oftentimes are due to either long-term infrastructure investments that were, at least in part, taken up in order to not show an excess revenue. Basically, schools are inclined to use up as much budget as they have and so that's why you see these projects where locker rooms are remodeled every couple of years, practice facilities keep getting upgrades, a bunch of ticket bros with MBAs get paid $400k/yr to make people believe that putting a Kraft noodle in a parking lot will draw fans to games, etc.
Look no further than what's happening at WVU, where former OSU head Gordon Gee massively overspent despite ample evidence the school wasn't likely to experience the growth he thought and is now cutting programs despite, for example, spending over $800M on campus-wide expansions and "improvements" they definitely didn't need.
“I love seeing cranes sprout up on our campus like spring daffodils, heralding rebirth and renewal,” Gee said in 2014. “Because a university that is not renewing itself is a university that is wilting and withering.”
The school added about 900 beds on its Morgantown campus since 2012. A report issued by the school shows no dormitories or apartments were at full occupancy last year, and one has been taken entirely offline.
Gee's idiociy isn't directly related to sports but considering Neal Brown (football) and Bob Huggins (basketball) are/were some of the highest-paid people at the school and both should have been fired years earlier for incompetence but had such massive contracts/buyouts the school was afraid to pull the trigger.
So yeah, if these athletic departments are losing money that's not great, but I'd rather they lose money because they're giving more to the athletes than bad coaches and "enhancements" that I'm sure are mostly cosmetic ways to zero out your budget every year.
September 1st, 2023 at 10:55 AM ^
What's happening at WVU is serious. Departments like math and foreign languages are being slashed and students and professors are scrambling for landing spots because their majors and classes are are being cut.
Satellite campuses and peripheral institutions that WVU used to support are also being affected, impacting normal people who were employed indirectly by WVU.
September 1st, 2023 at 12:05 PM ^
Oh absolutely. It's atrocious that the flagship state school has to cut the Ph.D. program in mathematics and whole departments, and as you noted lots of people are being hurt in a state that doesn't have a ton of growth and economic potential either.
September 1st, 2023 at 9:05 AM ^
I have to question how this helps the ACC long term. I bet UNC, FSU and Clemson are even more pissed than they were before at this point. This is just going to makes things more interesting going forward.
September 1st, 2023 at 9:07 AM ^
More money More money More moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore moneyMore money
September 1st, 2023 at 9:11 AM ^
And all that’s left are Cougars and Beavers.
September 1st, 2023 at 11:19 AM ^
If all that is left is a Cougars Beaver I am down with it.
September 1st, 2023 at 12:12 PM ^
I didn't want to like this, but I did anyway.
September 1st, 2023 at 9:15 AM ^
This is getting absurd from a travel standpoint, especially for non revenue sports that play multiple games a week.
September 1st, 2023 at 9:16 AM ^
I'm happy Stanford and Cal found a home. I'm annoyed they're doing this the Friday before our first football Saturday. I'm sure this makes sense, but it doesn't to me. But none of this has since we started going to 14 team leagues.
I believe Seth's take - the current state of these conferences will not survive long. The 9 big ten schools stuck together during the depression and WW2. This 18 team behemoth is built on money. If it's only money holding you together, it won't last to the first sign of trouble. In the 2030s something more sustainable will replace the power 4/super 2 dynamic. No idea what it will be. I'll be watching, God willing.
September 1st, 2023 at 9:22 AM ^
A&P CC
September 1st, 2023 at 9:38 AM ^
Well done.
September 1st, 2023 at 9:28 AM ^
Other than Stanford and Cal-Berkeley currently being less than desirable in football and men’s basketball, despite their excelling in overall athletics and academic performance, what’s the reason why the Big Ten didn’t want to add them to create a 20-team conference with East and West divisions of 10 teams each or four divisions with five teams each?
TV revenue being spread thinner? Iowa, Minnesota, Nebraska and Wisconsin objecting to being in the West division with six west coast schools? Hoping to get to 20 with UNC and Clemson instead?
September 1st, 2023 at 10:43 AM ^
the ACC TV deal has a pro rata clause. The new B1G deal does not, so the B1G would have to cut the pie with 2 extra slices. Oregon and Washington did not get a full share, but Fox did pony up an additional 30m (+/-) for those two schools. IF Fox didn't do that, I doubt that Oregon/Washington would have been added; more travel + less TV money = no deal.
Fox wasn't going to kick in more money for Stanford and Cal, so it would have been up to the schools to make them whole.
September 1st, 2023 at 9:36 AM ^
ACC = A Costal Conference?
September 1st, 2023 at 9:43 AM ^
New trophy game? Duke vs. SMU for the Methodist Cup...
September 1st, 2023 at 9:43 AM ^
If I was Stanford, I would go independent for a while. See if you can make a deal with Apple or Youtube. The whole conference seems to be thrown together with fear and haste.
September 1st, 2023 at 9:53 AM ^
USC, UCLA, Washington and Oregon looks great on paper! The ACC counters with Cal, Stanford and SMU!!! Lol
This looks like me trying to box Mike Tyson in his prime!
Big Ten added for substance, the ACC added for desperation.
September 1st, 2023 at 10:07 AM ^
What SMU is doing is actually the most college football thing ever. It's amazingly on brand for a school that committed violations so habitually and egregiously that it got the 'death penalty' and is now forever associated with 'pay for play' schemes in college football.
Rich Texas guys willing to eat millions of dollars in losses for years and years, just so their alma mater has a relevant football team and they can clap back when their A&M and UT buddies talk smack on the golf course.
September 1st, 2023 at 10:12 AM ^
Wish we could just fast forward all of this to like 10 years from now when the players are being paid and the realignment finds stability with schools fitting into 2 camps: teams who can and want to pay players and those who can't and/or won't. The conferences that are established under that system, I suspect, will be stable for some time and all this absurd realignment stuff will go away (not forever, I'm sure but for a good while).
September 1st, 2023 at 10:14 AM ^
I'd be mad too, if i had to travel so far to beat up on cupcakes. ACC used to just drive down the road to the nearest mid major.
September 1st, 2023 at 10:28 AM ^
SMU electing to be the unpaid intern of the ACC, “just to get the experience”