OT: Mahomes vs Montana
As this is a Michigan board we all are aware that Brady is the Unstoppable Super Bowl Throw God
But who inhabits second place? To me it comes down to Mahomes or Montana. The comparison:
Montana in four Super Bowls:
83-122, 1142, 11 TDs, 0 INTs, 127.8
Mahomes in four Super Bowls:
107-164, 1071, 7 TDs, 5 INTs, 85.2
I was a bit taken aback when I initially compared the numbers. Montana threw for more yards on 42 less attempts in an age where DBs were permitted to be far more physical than they are now.
Got to be honest, part of me(🤌🏻)still believes Joe Cool is the GOAT because of how dominant he was in the Super Bowl. He was sooo good while outperforming some all time greats on the other sideline.(Marino, Elway)
Mahomes is already an all time great who is must watch TV. But man, hard to go against Montana if you need to win a big game.
February 12th, 2024 at 10:08 PM ^
is there a third choice? mr ed?
February 12th, 2024 at 10:11 PM ^
Jim Kelly
*kicks rock
...
*kicks three more
February 13th, 2024 at 12:43 AM ^
*kicks rock
Found Scott Norwood's account. 😕
Man I loved those Bills.
February 13th, 2024 at 8:54 AM ^
Were the rocks wide right?
February 12th, 2024 at 10:11 PM ^
Sure.
February 12th, 2024 at 10:35 PM ^
I mean - look at those stats! Did he even mention 4-0?
Why TF would you even look for a 3rd option? It's pretty clear Mahomes is the distant 3rd already! Unless you wanted to compare 4-0 Bradshaw to Mahomes?
February 13th, 2024 at 2:52 AM ^
I would place Bradshaw ahead of Mahomes and behind Montana. Bradshaw was 4-0 in the Super Bowl and had a better passer rating and more TDs on roughly half the attempts than Mahomes. His YPA were fantastic at over 11 YPA in 4 Super Bowls, but the 4 INTs keeps Joe Cool in #2.
Montana in four Super Bowls:
83-122, 1142, (9.4 YPA), 11 TDs, 0 INTs, 127.8
Bradshaw in four Super Bowls:
49-84, 932, (11.1 YPA), 9 TDs, 4 INTs, 112.8
Mahomes in four Super Bowls:
107-164, 1071, (6.5YPA), 7 TDs, 5 INTs, 85.2
February 13th, 2024 at 10:44 AM ^
Keep in mind that was a much more run-oriented era, too. Harris, Campbell, Csonka, Payton, Dorsett, etc. The Montana years ushered in the West Coast offense and then Jerry MF Rice.
I think Montana and Bradshaw are a bit of a push for #2, but given Mahomes age and the Chiefs in general, I like his chances to move above them.
February 13th, 2024 at 2:25 AM ^
Hannah Montana.
February 13th, 2024 at 10:35 AM ^
Roseanne Roseannadanna
February 12th, 2024 at 10:14 PM ^
If you just go in Super Bowls..if you factor in Montana's performances in the playoffs of the years he missed the playoffs..2 games without a TD and multiple INTs...For me, Mahomes these last 2 years without a strong receiving core becomes #3 because Peyton is still my #2.
February 12th, 2024 at 10:19 PM ^
That’s fair. It really depends what statistic you want.
Montana played vs Gibbs Skins, Parcell’s Giants, and the ‘85 Bears. There aren’t teams in the AFC today comparable in quality to any of these teams. Montana played some absolutely filthy defenses.
Outside of the Ravens who in the AFC can be said to have an elite defense?
February 12th, 2024 at 10:28 PM ^
Absolutely great defenses..if you have that line, Jerry Rice, Roger Craig..you still can't get shutout in the playoffs...different eras so it's hard to compare..Mahomes back to back with 7th rd Pacheco and a washed up JuJu as his best WR in the 2 SBs is too impressive for me..Kelce is great..Mahomes in the 3 spot, final answer
February 12th, 2024 at 10:33 PM ^
Mahomes only scored 9 pts vs Tampa Bay. He has an 7:5 TD to INT ratio. That’s pretty mediocre.
Manning wasn’t good in the playoffs generally speaking. If you want elite QB play in the playoffs you will need to look elsewhere.
February 13th, 2024 at 10:42 AM ^
Let's be clear - Mahomes scored 0 points against TB. KC had 3 field goals.
February 13th, 2024 at 8:26 AM ^
Montana's first Super Bowl season was before Roger Craig. Their leading rusher that season, all time great Rickey Patton (/s) gained 543 yards rushing at a whopping 3.6 yards per carry. That was also before Jerry Rice.
February 13th, 2024 at 10:24 AM ^
In the Super Bowl, hard to argue against Joe's numbers, but he did get benched in a playoff game in 87 vs. the Vikings, a game that Anthony Carter took over. Right now I'd put Mahomes with Aikman, who also had great numbers in the super bowl, behind Montana and Brady.
February 12th, 2024 at 10:37 PM ^
1-1 Peyton?
Over Joe?
Laughing emoji.com
Eyerolling emoji.com
February 13th, 2024 at 7:07 AM ^
Peyton Manning the greatest quarterback in the history of regular season NFL.
February 13th, 2024 at 9:22 AM ^
Don’t forget about Aaron Rodgers.
February 13th, 2024 at 7:01 PM ^
I’ve been trying to forget about Aaron Rodgers.
February 13th, 2024 at 11:38 AM ^
I agree, it's no comparison, but Manning did go to 4 Super Bowls and won 2. And since it is very difficult to get to a Super Bowl, I will posit that 2-2 is a much better record than 2-0.
But these stats don't compare with Mahomes or Bradshaw. I'd put him in a tier below with Elway, and maybe lump in Aikman.
- Peyton Manning: 4 Games (2-2), 103-155, 1001 yards, 3TD, 5 INT
- John Elway: 5 Games (2-3) 76-152, 1128 yards, 3TD, 8 INT
- Troy Aikman: 3 Games (3-0) 56-80, 689 yards, 5TD, 1 INT
February 12th, 2024 at 10:57 PM ^
Dude, either you're a child or you picked the wrong damned board to be talking up Peyton Manning on. I'm half-inclined to think you wandered over from Rocky Top Talk and invented that screen name. :)
February 12th, 2024 at 11:04 PM ^
Elway was better than manning by a mile!
February 12th, 2024 at 11:54 PM ^
Plus he put more mustard on his throws.
As did some other NFL quarterback.
February 12th, 2024 at 11:51 PM ^
Sorry bro but you must never have watched Montana. He was almost perfect in SBs, nothing like how Mahomes struggled the first half yesterday. That never happened, not even close.
February 12th, 2024 at 11:58 PM ^
When Montana was in his prime it wasn't close.
February 12th, 2024 at 10:20 PM ^
Mahomes has won what, 3 of the past 4 ? And this last one was masterful with a 7th round RB, a rookie wr, though Pacheco took it to us when on Rutgers. This is a discussion for after his career is over, and it won't be close.
February 12th, 2024 at 10:25 PM ^
We don’t know how the rest of his career will go. How will Mahomes fair once Reid and Kelce retire? We saw Montana and Brady win titles without Walsh and Belichick. Will Mahomes be able to do that?
History says….maybe. But it should be noted that Montana and Brady were able only to win one more after their time with their respective legendary coaches was done.
February 12th, 2024 at 11:30 PM ^
Brady did it over 40 so that counts double.
February 12th, 2024 at 11:43 PM ^
Yeah, but that shouldn't apply to Brady. He was 40 and his coach didn't win shot after Tom left.
February 12th, 2024 at 11:53 PM ^
But Brady was over 40. So the argument is mute.
February 12th, 2024 at 11:37 PM ^
You might be right when all is done.
February 13th, 2024 at 1:14 AM ^
"Masterful"?!
He was great in the clutch last night, as he often is
But for much of the game he was ordinary. Overmatched even.
Not "masterful"...
February 13th, 2024 at 8:10 AM ^
Yeah, that’s a bad descriptor, for sure. What’s the adjective for “thrives on chaos not preparation”? Dischordful? We’ll see if he can keep the plates spinning.
February 13th, 2024 at 11:43 AM ^
I'll bet anyone a dollar that by the time his career is done, Pat Mahomes will have the record for most Super Bowl interceptions in a career (Current leader, John Elway with 8, Mahomes has 5). And he won't come close to TB's 21 TDs (Mahomes has 7).
February 13th, 2024 at 7:07 AM ^
For now, the numbers don't lie (Montana, easy), but Mahomes is currently younger than Montana was for three of those SF wins. He could still improve with age and narrow the gap.
February 13th, 2024 at 10:53 AM ^
And this last one was masterful
Whoa now, "masterful" is a stretch. He made plays when he needed to and had a decent second half and great OT, but his first half was pretty rough. He had 52 of his 123 passing yards on one play. He was inefficient otherwise.
They had one TD drive in regulation, and that went for 16 yards after the 49ers muffed a punt (off the blocker's foot) and KC recovered. Reality is that he had an uneven performance and Butker bailed them out bigtime.
February 13th, 2024 at 12:46 PM ^
Their defense won that game
February 12th, 2024 at 10:28 PM ^
Throw out the stats and I'll take Tarkenton because I'm an ex-vvikings fan.
February 13th, 2024 at 12:11 AM ^
I became a Vikings fan the year they knocked off the niners, 86 or 87. Wade Wilson was the QB, AC was the #1 WR, and they were barely in as the wild card. My first real heartbreak as a fan when they lost in the NFC title game.
February 13th, 2024 at 2:30 AM ^
My first heartbreak as a fan was when they lost their first Super Bowl. Welcome to the heartbreak club.
As I have said on here before, thank god for the Bills.
February 13th, 2024 at 5:40 AM ^
Vikings - 2nd best helmet in the NFL
February 12th, 2024 at 10:28 PM ^
Rex Grossman and Trent Dilfer are the 2 and 3 best super bowel QBs
February 12th, 2024 at 10:51 PM ^
Montana 🎶 Yippy-Ty-O-Ty-Ay 🎶
February 13th, 2024 at 12:07 AM ^
I became a Chiefs fan after Joe Cool was traded back in 93. Always wanted to cheer for him, but couldn't stand the niners. So having Mahomes right now is probably what the niners felt back in the 80s. And he's amazing, and if the 3 starting OT weren't injured against the Bucs, that game wouldve been competitive & his numbers would've looked much better.
That said, Joe Cool has the best numbers of the 3 SB goats, but he's still #2 to Tommy. The future is uncertain for Mahomes, when Coach Reid eventually retires especially. The AFC has premier QB's (Lamar, Allen, Burrow) with a bunch of potentially premier QB's in the next tier (Herbert, Tua, Stroud, Lawrence). Just winning the Lamar Hunt Trophy is a murderers row. Just blessed to be a fan this year of the Chiefs & Wolverines!
February 13th, 2024 at 1:30 AM ^
SQ? Yep, Montana to Rice. That zero picks number is incredible.
February 13th, 2024 at 2:24 AM ^
Got to be honest, part of me(🤌🏻)still believes Joe Cool is the GOAT because of how dominant he was in the Super Bowl. He was sooo good while outperforming some all time greats on the other sideline.(Marino, Elway)
I always hated these types of arguments (e.g. "Montana was 4-0 in the Super Bowl") back when Brady was, say, 4-2, as if that somehow made Montana a better QB. While it's nice to perform well in the Super Bowl, every Super Bowl Brady lost is a Super Bowl Montana didn't even make. I.e. every Super Bowl loss for Brady was a conference championship, divisional or wildcard loss for Montana (or worse, a year Montana didn't even make the playoffs). I truly feel like there were plenty of people out there that felt like it was better to lose before the Super Bowl than in the Super Bowl itself. And that's ridiculous.
February 13th, 2024 at 6:25 AM ^
Elway lost (and by a lot) in his first 3 SBs. And yes, clouded the thoughts on him for a time. Fortunately he got 2 wins and went out on a high note or he would have been on the M&M commercial with Marino SB Sunday.
We are but simple humans.
And yes, go Brady. Logical reasoning and I agree.
February 13th, 2024 at 8:42 AM ^
Montana was amazing. He was definitely the GOAT before Tom Brady. Brady passed him and then lapped him with 10 Superbowls (7-3). Brady holds all of the single season and career QB records other than running ones. (wikipedia)
People are hot on Mahomes because he is young and theoretically could challenge some of Brady's records if he plays long enough. He's 28 and 3-1 in Superbowls. He'd need to go 4-2 in six more Superbowls to equal Brady. It is fun to think about, but highly unlikely. KC had a phenomenal post-season this year, but squeaked by the Bills and Baltimore and were outplayed by SF for most of the Superbowl. They were a team of destiny, but they weren't dominant. Does Mahomes take a pay cut next year to help restock the Chiefs like Brady did with the Pats? Does he start sleeping in a hyperbaric chamber or Bacta tank like Brady did? Fun to think about, but I don't think Brady fans have much to worry about in the near term.