Toasted Yosties

March 9th, 2021 at 6:09 PM ^

Putting my Michigan fandom aside, I think they have a case. I don’t like the idea of not rescheduling missed games working to our advantage. I’d be making the same argument if I was in their position.

Gentleman Squirrels

March 9th, 2021 at 6:15 PM ^

And they would be fighting the same argument if the roles were reversed. It’s retrospective bullshit (admittedly well written and polite). He realized a few weeks ago that Illinois would lose the championship because they stumbled early and tried to see if they could get a share because of a technicality. At the end of the day, he agreed to the win percentage months ago and he and the rest of the big ten need to stick to that.

Also, you don’t know how Michigan would have played if they played a full schedule with appropriate breaks. Hell they could have even beaten Illinois. Hindsight is 20-20 and changing the rules after the die has been cast is moronic.

Toasted Yosties

March 9th, 2021 at 6:55 PM ^

The B1G has changed its rules to correct a bad rule that impacted a championship  just in the last three months, so that doesn’t hold any water.

 

“Also, you don’t know how Michigan would have played if they played a full schedule with appropriate breaks. Hell they could have even beaten Illinois.”

We could also speculate that it would have worn them out, which is why there is no point in speculating. Either way, that’s not Illinois’ fault. I’d tolerate it more if Michigan got a covid protocol in the last few weeks, when they wouldn’t have had time to reschedule as tough as it would have been, but they didn’t. It doesn’t sit right with me that those three games would determine it one way or another. Still happy we are hanging a banner regardless.

jdraman

March 9th, 2021 at 7:17 PM ^

I’m curious, did OSU have a worse winning percentage than Indiana? Because, winning percentage was the agreed upon rule being used to determine B1G division champs in football. So if OSU did in fact have a lower winning percentage than Indiana, well then Indiana actually had the B1G East division title stolen from them. 
Of course, the fact of the matter is that OSU did have a better winning percentage than Indiana and was the legitimate B1G East division champ; this is exactly the same for Michigan basketball. Better winning percentage = Champion. 

jdraman

March 9th, 2021 at 7:58 PM ^

No I know, I was being facetious. OSU would have won the East division with their 5-0 record regardless. No, they didn't qualify with the 6 game minimum, but 2 of their 3 cancelled games were due to other program's Covid pauses. The 6 game minimum was a silly rule to begin with. Winning percentage was set as the standard for winning the division before the season. OSU fulfilled that standard and won the East division. End of story. 

jdraman

March 9th, 2021 at 6:28 PM ^

This argument should have happened BEFORE the season. The ADs and Presidents agreed on winning percentage as the methodology for determining the B1G champion prior to the season. If anyone was worried about this happening, they should have agreed on a contingency about one team with highest winning percentage sharing the title with the team with the most wins. Writing this letter now is just retrospective sour grapes. 
Had every team agreed, before the season, that there could be a shared title between the team with highest winning percentage and the team with the most wins, then I think everyone would be completely fine with that. The problem is, these complaints only came up once Michigan was mathematically confirmed as the B1G champions. 

lhglrkwg

March 9th, 2021 at 6:14 PM ^

A key part of their argument is the loss to MSU. A game after we already clinched the title. You cannot just treat that like any other Big Ten game and Illinois’ entire complaint hinges on that

We’re the undisputed Big Ten champs. Crying doesn't change that

Solecismic

March 9th, 2021 at 6:15 PM ^

I'm in agreement. Embarrassing for Illinois. If you change the rules, then Michigan doesn't celebrate the championship after last week's victory, then it's a different game on Sunday.

It's a little like a football team claiming a bad call in a loss should be reviewed, then the result of the game changed to a tie.

This letter won't change anything, but if it does, I want Michigan declared Big Ten football co-champions of 2016 (written tongue in cheek, if it isn't obvious).

Grampy

March 9th, 2021 at 7:36 PM ^

This is also an embarrassment for the B1G front office, just as Nebraska going off on football policy last fall was.  Warren needs to tell the Illini to STFU and be gracious in what is a clearly defined, objectively measured DE-the fucking-FEAT.

Solecismic

March 9th, 2021 at 6:33 PM ^

I hope we wouldn't be complaining. The case depends on changing the agreement made based on the understanding that COVID-19 positive tests would cancel games.

The best argument is OSU football playing in the conference championship game despite not meeting the minimum six conference games. Under the letter of the rules written for last season, they were not eligible and Indiana should have played. But OSU beat Indiana and had a better winning percentage. So they changed the rules when the Michigan/OSU game was canceled.

To meet that standard, you'd have to consider the "championship banner" to be as important or close to as important as participation in the conference championship game. Since Illinois is playing in the conference tournament with a 2-seed, it's not even remotely similar in importance.

So I'm not sympathetic. The league could have stepped in last week and made a statement. They didn't, and when Michigan beat MSU last week, that was that. They celebrated.

S.G. Rice

March 9th, 2021 at 6:18 PM ^

That guy should contact Butch Jones and see if he trademarked the whole Champions of Life thing, because the Illini could definitely declare themselves that.

RobM_24

March 9th, 2021 at 6:19 PM ^

Daaaang we stole that Championship, suckers. What a great, coordinated plan by the athletic department, the University, and the State of Michigan -- to steal this Championship from the basketball powerhouse that is Illinois University. Unfortunately, next year we'll return to normal and Illinois will continue their tradition of racking up banners year after year, and we'll return to the B1G bottom dwellers that we've been since Coach Beilein arrived. What a heist, to finally get us some hardware. 

mi93

March 9th, 2021 at 6:34 PM ^

Maybe the "best team in the conference" shouldn't have taken nights off at home against o$u and Maryland and at Rutgers.

stephenrjking

March 9th, 2021 at 6:48 PM ^

You guys who wonder why Warde doesn't make public pronouncements about whatever complaint we may have, this is a good reason why: Do so and you might wind up being a whiny crybaby that is an embarrassment to the conference. 

stephenrjking

March 9th, 2021 at 10:24 PM ^

We have the trophy, that we've earned. Illinois is complaining about it. His complaints are sour grapes, and frankly don't make a hill of beans of difference. The only thing his whining does is make some Illinois people feel a bit better, I suppose. 

But I'd rather have a banner than a letter from the AD written to sooth my hurt feelings.

Warde Manuel griping in public would not have changed the result of the OSU game. It wouldn't have had any practical affect on officiating; any productive change happens behind closed doors, and we have no information about what words were or were not exchanged with people that mattered. And it wouldn't in any way make me feel better about losing to OSU. It's just bellyaching for the benefit of people who don't actually matter. 

I can't tell you how much I don't care about any OSU fan agreeing with the whining Illinois AD because I lack the advanced mathematical education necessary to describe numbers that small. 

DGM06

March 9th, 2021 at 6:51 PM ^

Michigan clinched the title with a game left, rendering the last game completely irrelevant to this argument. Could you imagine how much shit Michigan would take if the situation were reversed and Warde tried to pull this nonsense? 
Everyone hates Michigan, Exhibit 10 million something. 

mGrowOld

March 9th, 2021 at 6:52 PM ^

Two observations:

1: He's completely full of shit.  The methodology of determining the B1G champion was decided before the season began exactly BECAUSE something like this was bound to happen.  Sorry about your luck.

2: I respect the hell out him having the stones to stand and fight publicly for his school.  Unlike other ADs we know who choose to remain silent when their school is hosed (hi 2016 OSU game officials, did you guys complete your Buckeye autograph set yet?) He's not worried about making waves.  And he doesn't care if the B1G commissioner likes it or not.

bronxblue

March 9th, 2021 at 8:19 PM ^

I know you just dislike Warde for a variety of reasons, but getting mad at him for not whining about officiating publicly while commending this AD for, again, whining publicly seems like more of a personal preference than some indictment of a person's character.

Illinois (and all the schools) knew in November that a pandemic was ongoing and that teams may miss games.  As a result, they changed how the regular season title would be decided.  It's cold, hard math that says UM has a higher winning percentage than Illinois.  This isn't a subjective call about ball placement on a field based on forward momentum of a player.  

ak47

March 9th, 2021 at 8:31 PM ^

It’s funny you are getting downvoted on this because of how much everyone on this blog bitched about him not throwing a tantrum like a toddler. I mean the il ad looks stupid and warde would have to, it’s just funny how much standards change on this blog when it’s good or bad for Michigan