The Athletic- NCAA only got this last Tuesday
Pretty amazing stuff, this outside law firm presented this to the NCAA and the next day they tell the Big Ten
No more information who is paying this law firm
The timing also seems to confirm the leaks initially were from the Big Ten not the NCAA, the leaks today do seem to be from the NCAA IMO
“The firm presented its information to the NCAA last Tuesday, according to the newspaper, and the NCAA informed both the Big Ten and Michigan that it had opened an investigation into the matter Wednesday. The investigation became public knowledge Thursday.”
https://theathletic.com/4999767/2023/10/25/michigan-sign-stealing-inves…
October 25th, 2023 at 8:55 PM ^
Franklin can't even get a 4th and 1 playcall off without having to waste a timeout just to decide to punt inside opponent territory. I doubt he's smart enough to mastermind this plot to uncover our super secret operation.
October 25th, 2023 at 8:59 PM ^
If this really did come from a rival school who hired a private firm to hack Michigan computers and give the data to the NCAA, that is insanely stupid considering everyone, including the NCAA, will wonder how the firm got their hands on confidential UM data. So maybe it is him after all
October 25th, 2023 at 9:01 PM ^
NCAA will not care.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:14 PM ^
True but UM can sue. Then it becomes a court case with subpoena power..
October 25th, 2023 at 10:20 PM ^
Which is why the odds the data was obtained illegally is basically nil. This isn’t WWII.
October 25th, 2023 at 10:25 PM ^
It’s 100%. An authorized accessor does not have the right to disseminate propriety information without consent of the organization. Something definitely illegal happened.
October 25th, 2023 at 11:42 PM ^
Here is where if we had an AD worth a damn, we’d fight back, hire a PI to expose pay for play. Wouldn’t be that hard. Warde is having such a larger negative impact than anyone would have thought. Warde will lay down to this.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:03 PM ^
Thread got nuked. Nobody hacked a Michigan computer in this case. The notion is silly.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:13 PM ^
They may have. At the very least they leaked proprietary information which is illegal.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:30 PM ^
That's a dumbass suggestion that someone would hack Michigan football's computers -taking all that risk - and decided the best thing to do with the data was to give to journalists.
Hackers would only target such computers for football subterfuge - and would thus be motivated to use all information hacked to their own benefit without M knowing they have been compromised - and possibly plant a permanent bug allowing them continued access to as much information as possible.
Think Ultra. You don't leak that shit to journalists so they can write "hey we have a cable from the Nazis saying they have been planning another operation."
You keep your own secret and keep reading their shit and try not to let them know what you know.
This is not brain science.
You don't risk your professional life and or personal freedom to hack a computer in the UofM football department to share stupid ass info with journalists.
Somebody inside M who has access was really bothered by what was going on - frankly they were not wrong - and then chose to secretly provide that information to investigators and media.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:53 PM ^
Instead of going to Compliance? Who's job it is?
October 25th, 2023 at 11:03 PM ^
Did you not notice that compliance was apparently NON-EXISTENT!?!?!?!
If that shit was going on in the department and it was not one rogue idiot but had the tacit support of powerful staff then clearly "Compliance" was only lip service and not an actual option.
The culture clearly lacked "compliance."
October 25th, 2023 at 10:03 PM ^
They should have gone to the compliance and they will be protected. It is that simple. We don't know what happened..
October 25th, 2023 at 10:29 PM ^
This is a dumbass take. Having access doesn’t grant you the right to disseminate information. That is illegal.
Furthermore, this controversy really isn’t that significant. All teams steal signals. The matter here is the manner. If this person really had an issue with this and cared for Michigan they would have taken it to Manual or Ono and not a third party.
Using World War Two as an analogy is fucking dumb and incorrect that I won’t other to address how wrong you are.
October 25th, 2023 at 11:06 PM ^
Yes, yes, moron.
Everybody steals and murders people arguments abound.
Good Lord. Is Terelle Pryor really every other poster?
Oh, and I apologize for using a World War Two analogy. I'm sure you're easily confused..
October 26th, 2023 at 12:12 AM ^
Good Lord, aren’t you a sanctimonious blowhard.
Theft of signals is legal. A certain method used to steal said methods is not. Ergo the NCAA is okay with theft so long as it is done in an approved method.
That isn’t ethical whatsoever.
October 26th, 2023 at 6:25 AM ^
Somebody inside M who has access was really bothered by what was going on - frankly they were not wrong - and then chose to secretly provide that information to investigators and media.
You don't even know how to interpret the rule. You should quit while you're behind.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:16 PM ^
There are two ways. Either it is hacked or it was given by an insider. So you can't be sure it wasn't hacked.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:45 PM ^
No, nobody is going to risk a criminal situation by illegally hacking somebody's computers.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:59 PM ^
You’re assuming the person would know that what they’re doing constitutes hacking.
Accessing an unprotected shared file, something that can be done effortlessly by an internal or external user, can still be hacking in a legal sense if the person wasn’t authorized by the data custodian or institution responsible for the data.
That said, a malicious insider seems the more likely explanation. But given how easy it would be for someone to unknowingly commit a crime like that, given the sad state of opsec in this operation I’m sure there were plenty of such data sources to trip over, it’s not out of the realm of possibility.
October 25th, 2023 at 8:55 PM ^
I just have a hard time imagining anyone else as motivated and willing to spend the money on this as 3rd Base Day and his ilk
October 25th, 2023 at 8:56 PM ^
Add urban to your list. That dip wad is as butthurt as anyone that his replacement is embarrassing urban by not winning every year
October 25th, 2023 at 8:59 PM ^
I don't think we have all the facts because none of it makes sense...do any of them have legal rights to access UM computers? Maybe Stapleton would be the only one with the authority
October 25th, 2023 at 9:17 PM ^
How, he's not employed by Michigan. The nameless firm provided the information to the NCAA.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:00 PM ^
Frames, come on. No. He’d go after OSU if he would even bother with this.
Tuck, lol no.
Gattis might hate Harbaugh but I doubt it’s that bad. He wouldn’t get Maryland to help him with this.
I guess I don’t really know what happened with Weiss. Maybe he’s mad at us?
October 25th, 2023 at 9:20 PM ^
How does any coach get the university president and board to spend millions on a scavenger hunt. Those 3rd parties don't work for free.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:31 PM ^
Wouldn't put anything past OSU.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:05 PM ^
Tuck, nah. He doesn't use his phone to call law firms.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:26 PM ^
Dudek?? When was he fired?
October 25th, 2023 at 9:49 PM ^
What is the old adage? Follow the money, right? Your answer is likely down that path.
October 26th, 2023 at 2:55 AM ^
Don't forget Dudek.
October 25th, 2023 at 8:53 PM ^
The firm: Meyer-Dantonio-Tressel and Third Base associates.
October 25th, 2023 at 8:53 PM ^
If the NCAA leaked that they have stolen information that is even dumber than what Stallions did.
October 25th, 2023 at 8:59 PM ^
Why do you keep thinking they got this stuff illegally?? There is zero reasoning behind that.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:03 PM ^
What makes more sense ?
October 25th, 2023 at 9:06 PM ^
Somebody (internally) ratted us out.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:15 PM ^
That’s still illegal. They can’t share proprietary information without authorization from Michigan.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:51 PM ^
There are two different things.
It's illegal to use a password someone who is not the owner/admin gives you. A 3rd party firm couldn't do this. It would be a crime under the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act.
A 3rd party could click a link to access some open website or shared drive that was provided by someone. In that case, the person providing the link may be legally culpable, but not the 3rd party.
Also, a person could make copies or share documents to a 3rd party. That person may commit a crime by doing so, but the 3rd party is highly unlikely to commit a crime by viewing them. This happens all the time and is sometimes known as giving sunlight to an issue.
October 25th, 2023 at 10:16 PM ^
Your second point is incorrect. There are numerous examples otherwise, here’s one.
If what you’re saying were true, penetration testing contracts would be a lot simpler.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:20 PM ^
Whether it's Stapleton or someone else, not condoning it, but they best be careful of someone that has a different kind of manifesto.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:20 PM ^
Even if they did, would they not be shown the door like Weiss who signed onto someone else’s account? It’s still illegally obtained. Or was that what Weiss was illegally obtaining?
October 25th, 2023 at 9:16 PM ^
It's only 2 things for me.
1. Somebody tipped off the NCAA, B10 (likely someone at some point inside the program) and the NCAA authorized a 3rd party access to investigate.
2. This is branched from a federal investigation involving someone with access to those computers and the FBI tipped off the NCAA...it happened in the Tressel case so yes, the FBI has notified the NCAA of things while investigating something else.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:24 PM ^
According to Sports Illustrated today, Deputy of UM Police said it has nothing to do with Weiss investigation.
And former offensive coordinator Matt Weiss was suspended and then dismissed last winter amid a University of Michigan Police Department investigation into a “computer access crime” inside the football facility. Melissa Overton, deputy chief of UMPD, told SI’s Pat Forde that the Weiss case is “still under investigation” but “not at all associated” with Stalions’s situation.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:42 PM ^
Devil's advocate here. How likely is the average FBI computer forensic analyst to see photos and videos on a drive, and recognize evidence of a sign stealing scheme? Additionally, how likely is an average FBI computer forensic analyst to know that it is against NCAA rules to scout a team in such a way? That's why I was suspecting as soon as the WaPo article was released that whoever was the firm examining those computers was looking explicitly for something of the type. I just think the average analyst used to looking for either criminal evidence, or network intrusion evidence or the likes, is unlikely to be versed in NCAA bylaws. It would take an analyst some specific knowledge IMO to connect the dots from a bunch of pictures and videos of sidelines to a scouting and sign stealing scheme and know to report it to the NCAA.
October 25th, 2023 at 10:28 PM ^
Re your first point - a third party still can’t just hack into your computer (legally). If you believe the Sam Webb reports, M was just as blindsided by this as you or I. No way they allow someone access to computers and then are surprised if this comes out.
2) FBI isn’t investigating sign stealing. This is “illegal” as an NCAA matter, but it’s not criminal. Why the fuck would the FBI be involved in any of this?
October 25th, 2023 at 9:14 PM ^
Oof. The person with authorized access isn’t authorized to disseminate information. Two different potential crimes here.
October 26th, 2023 at 6:00 AM ^
Possibly.
Or Stalions put all his stuff, that he created,on a non-university drive that was shared intentionally with the person who leaked.
October 25th, 2023 at 8:54 PM ^
Very interested to hear who is bankrolling this and how they got access to any Michigan networks. Everyones to busy fantasizing about Michigan penalties to stop and ask “….so whered you get this information again?”
October 25th, 2023 at 9:14 PM ^
Right. Who and why seem to be more important than the information itself. Is there precedent for this among other schools? Has any school ever hired an outside firm to investigate another school? Something doesn't smell right. At. All.
October 25th, 2023 at 9:18 PM ^
Yep. If you have a problem with a university hire a private firm. This is not a good model for NCAA.