MGoPodcast 13.6: The Solution to College Crappe
1 hour and 32 minutes
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1. Offense vs Nebraska
starts at 1:00
Better in numbers than it felt. Sort of a Washington game but with dinky doo passing. The TE leak stuff was something they saw on film and kept working. McCarthy’s arc read worked when they thought it was Cade, but they need a pop pass or something off of it because it’s too obvious late. Had to use multiple guards—Stueber wrecked. Appreciation for the running backs—greatest hurdle of all time? McNamara deep accuracy, where’d you go?
[The rest of the writeup and the player after THE JUMP]
2. Defense vs Nebraska
starts at 23:45
Nebraska is very good at college crappe, not very good at fundamental football. DTs have a very good day again, impressive that Mazi Smith could keep going after the opening screen. Jenkins had the 3rd down stuff. Hinton was great. They’re not pass rushers however, which is still a step-up problem. Michigan had crappe as well, especially when Morris and Hawkins played that 4th and 2.
3. Hot Takes, Special Teams, and Game Theory
starts at 47:15
Not a lot of weird decisions—both teams punted on 4th and 1 in their own territory. Special teams battle wasn’t as big as we expected because of Michigan’s punt returns: one flub, one ran backwards, one let bounce and lucky it went in the endzone. The rest was great: Robbins added distance to his Boom. MAAR blood in Moody.
4. Around the Big Ten, wsg Jamie Mac
starts at 1:14:03
Iowa-Penn State changed when PSU didn’t have a backup quarterback, which is very hard to do in 2021 when your Will Levis can just go start at Kentucky. PSU’s defense is legit: Luketa is doing the Micah Parsons stuff, and their secondary is filled with stars. MSU-Rutgers you can watch the highlights because that’s all there was. Wisconsin’s best RB was booted from the program. Ohio State is shoveling coal again.
MUSIC:
- “You and Me ”—Penny and the Quarters
- “Maria También”—Khruangbin
- “On the News”—Your Old Droog
- “Across 110th Street”
THE USUAL LINKS:
I’m just thinking of Joe Tiller now, where he’d have 15 guys in the huddle and run four of them off.
October 10th, 2021 at 5:50 PM ^
Totally disagree with much of the criticism of Cade, especially concerning the deep ball. "100% of overthrown balls are incomplete." I think Cade is throwing jump balls, throwing balls that can (should) be contested by the WRs. We see this sort of thing all the time. The problem is, right now none of the WRs contest the pass: they don't "high-point it" or "make a play on the ball" the way Braylon Edwards, and Junior Hemingway, and Nico Collins used to.
And still too many drops.
October 10th, 2021 at 5:52 PM ^
Bro this got posted 14 minutes ago. How you already listen and argue thst quick?
October 11th, 2021 at 9:06 AM ^
I think folks that have auto downloads get it way before it's posted.
October 10th, 2021 at 6:34 PM ^
How are you arguing "jump balls" on routes where the M receivers had the defenders beat by a step (Johnson), or more (Baldwin)? Why would you put your receiver in a position to make a contested catch when they have their defender beat?
October 10th, 2021 at 6:43 PM ^
I kind of agree with both of you. Mostly you, because obviously the intention of throwing deep passes is not to make them jump balls. But I do agree with the original guy that there are some definite issues with the receivers, most noticeably Baldwin, in actually making 50/50 balls be 50/50. The first deep Cade underthrow where Baldwin was 100% complacent to let the ball drop to him while the corner swats it harmlessly away was not great on either end. Lots to improve in the bye week, I have faith that this stuff will get addressed in some way.
October 11th, 2021 at 5:53 PM ^
Much of the time the throw needs to be made well before the defender is clearly beaten, and so it is made with a degree of confidence/faith that the receiver will break open or make a play. It may just be a matter of the QB seeing the back of the defender’s helmet and that there’s no coverage over the top before he "let's it rip." At that point it’s one to two seconds before the ball arrives, and in that timeframe, anything can happen.
October 10th, 2021 at 7:01 PM ^
I mean we can debate about certain things about Cade's performance last night but he was objectively not accurate on deep balls. The one deep ball completion took a great diving catch by the WR. Like some of you people need to stop being so defensive about Cade. Now he had been very accurate before yesterday on deep balls so maybe it is was just an aberration in his defense. I mean there was one throw Baldwin could have fought for it better but Cade also threw inside toward the db.
To Cade's credit the biggest thing he showed yesterday was guts and moxie to overcome the adversity, but let's not pretend the game he played was to the level where there was nothing to say he could have done better.
October 10th, 2021 at 7:34 PM ^
Like some of you people need to stop being so defensive about Cade.
Defensiveness generally doesn't just appear out of thin air. People are over-defensive about him because a significant portion of the fan base is over-critical of him. For example, literally one comment below you have to make your big retort about Cade when someone simply says "Cade is fine." Nothing more than that, you even agree to a point (I think), but for some reason this isn't enough and you then have to point out every single flaw or how it won't be good enough in the future as if this is new information or you people didn't come into the season predicting 4-8. Those who are fine with Cade know he's not perfect. Stop with this straw man. We just accept that he has his flaws and can still rationally look at the fact that he's done a hell of a job leading this team to 6-0 regardless and the coaches might know a thing or two more than us regarding who to play in the future.
October 10th, 2021 at 7:47 PM ^
Nothing you said changes the fact that he was not accurate on deep balls last night. That is literally what the original poster was trying to dispute. And speak for yourself I absolutely did not think this team would be bad this year, last year was an aberration to me so I expecteokd this team to worst case be more a typical 9-3 type Harbaugh team. You do realize when Cade watches the film he is going to be saying the exact things as far as critiquing himself to try and get better right? Newflash, Cade is a division one athlete, people on a blog saying he was not accurate on deep balls in a game and needs to be better in future games on that front is not going to hurt his feelings.
Critiquing Cade also does not equate to anybody saying JJ should start either. The reason people are getting so defensive is because they are putting words in people's mouth and think any critique made is saying that. It's not.
October 10th, 2021 at 8:06 PM ^
You people truly just do not stop. No off button. Incredible. Like I said, literally one comment below. The guy said "Cade is fine" and you couldn't help yourself from giving your "Well, aCtUaLly" take after. It doesn't matter that the dude above is a bit too optimistic. Even if he wasn't, it's been shown that it doesn't matter.
I won't be checking back here. If you feel the need to get some snarky last word in, go ahead. I choose to enjoy my Saturdays regardless of who they trot out at QB rather than be perpetually miserable about my 6-0 football team. Have fun with that.
October 11th, 2021 at 7:57 AM ^
"You people truly just do not stop."
Says the guy who won't stop... And who is this "you people" you keep saying? I mean, you're both saying the exact same thing! Look, you're both pretty, so just stop the bickering and go elsewhere...
October 11th, 2021 at 7:32 AM ^
He was not very accurate before this game. He was just accurate enough. The point is McCarthy throws deep balls objectively better.
October 11th, 2021 at 11:07 AM ^
Cade didn’t play well and left points on the board. I’m sure he would admit it.
But he did play well enough to win in a very hostile environment against a solid defense. Nebraska held MSU to Zero 1st downs in East Lansing.
This was a good win. Cade needs to be better.
October 11th, 2021 at 12:45 PM ^
I don't think Sainristil's catch was actually a catch. Ball was dislodged by the ground when he landed. Glad it wasn't reviewed likely because there were a ton of other reviews around that play.
October 11th, 2021 at 1:20 PM ^
The ball...never touched the ground though...
October 11th, 2021 at 1:24 PM ^
I wasn't sure either until I saw this angle. Clearly on the ground
October 10th, 2021 at 8:57 PM ^
I'm fascinated by this one, because in just under 13 years of visits to this site, I have never--until the last few weeks--been bothered by negativity about the team or pessimistic takes on its prospects from mgoblog writers.
So what's changed? It all seems to have concentrated around Cade McNamara, and a critique that seems like hair-splitting--a little bit willful in character--of his performance.
All against a backdrop of totally unexpected SUCCESS.
What was neat about this site, for a very long time, was the fact that its authors were avowed amateurs bringing really, really great writerly skill and intelligence to a view not just of Michigan's football teams, their play and games, but to the culture surrounding the sport. . . and the school itself.
For me, an 84 grad, it has been the closest thing to a strong connection that I retain with my beloved school.
Without the founders having realized it (maybe), they have lost that sense of mission, of (sometimes) shambolic artistry and JOUISSANCE--to use a big word--of freaking PLAY, and playfullness. And now, instead of just being able to revel in these games, now that--FINALLY--good times have, if tentatively, rolled around again. . . they're here sucking lemons and offering learned commentary like school marms about this throw and that.
All of us, from the most knowledgeable to the least, could see that a number of the long throws didn't connect last night.
It doesn't feel generous. A whole lot of us, clearly, see it as off base.
It was, in a word, dumb to leave that cyan on Cade, and dumber not to back off just a little in the postgame. You're missing the forest for the trees; the mission has changed without ever really being acknowledged.
Obviously, I should admit, I'm talking about a matter of degrees, not absolutes. But it's like the goal at this stage is to be football technocrats. . . of which there are already enough. Personally, I miss the sense of play. The reminders that these are 18-22 year olds playing their guts out, to be celebrated.
October 10th, 2021 at 11:51 PM ^
The front page posts by the writers are great, and as far as I’m concerned have maintained their quality for the years that i have been reading. The comments OTOH, especially on football columns, are a cesspool, and have been for a long time. *not all comments/commenters. Its why UM Hoops is such a great resource for basketball - great posts, and higher quality comments.
Anyway, Brian - we love you! Stay healthy and keep up the great work.
October 11th, 2021 at 12:01 AM ^
Brian has been weirdly salty about Cade ever since he took the job from Milton. As if Milton not working out was some personal defeat for him, after the promising start in the Minnesota game last year. He similarly made Shea out to be some kind of Michigan Football supervillain.
It's fair to call out Cade's limitations. They've been called out here plenty. Noted. But the relentless negativity about a kid who is 6-0 -- winning games that the authors of this site assumed we would almost certainly lose -- is pretty grating. It's not his fault that the coaches think he gives us the best chance to win. And just so happens that's all he's done this year...win.
October 11th, 2021 at 12:27 AM ^
I don’t think it’s a Milton thing, if anything, it’s a general issue of roster management, as the Dylan McCaffrey situation did stick in Brian’s craw before last season, in part because Milton was such a high variance player.
October 11th, 2021 at 1:38 AM ^
I can't believe you chose, of all days, Scott Frost Day to accuse us of a lack of jouissance. Amateurs we are, and biased we'll ever be (I've got a Haskins jersey hanging behind me for petessakes), but that doesn't mean we should stop being honest about what the charting says because it's not homer enough.
Nuance has always been the thing here. I think the howling over Cade's cyan is based more on visceral reactions (YOU SAID MY 6-0 QUARTERBACK SUCKS DIE MF)---I mean, how many people mad about this even mention split zones? Has one? Their #1 favorite offensive play is getting eaten alive because McNamara doesn't have either the skills or the green light (or both) to run the counters. What do you want me to do, lie about it? I'm infusing all the love I can into it while still pointing out the lack of a QB run game when our base play is the counter to a QB run game is hurting the offense.
You're still trying to block a slanting inside shade with Hayes...but I'm smiling and we're going to work on that for next time.
And I keep repeating the guy has one interception and one sack in six games and said he should still start. I'm a (bad) quarter done with the Nebraska offense UFR and am getting frustrated because I am getting feedback from the readers that they don't want to hear about anything negative I'm seeing, and I feel like people are going to jump down my throat for every IN or missed read I chart.
The truthfulness, the process, and the nuance are what gravitated me to Brian's site in the first place. And some of the goofiness, but the goofy-ass HOT TAKES segment with the Sklars seems to be the part of the podcast people are most upset about.
October 11th, 2021 at 3:49 AM ^
Come on Seth. No one here want to bury their heads in the sand re: what Cade can and cannot do. We want to hear that and that’s why we come here.
but when the guy had an bit of an off day, and they only give up one sack, one pic and 58% completions, on the road, drive to comeback down (twice was it!?!) that’s not a cyan dude. Bc had he hit 3-5 more passes and/or avoided the pick we’d be talking about a 68% completion guy with 59-100 more yards or 6 games in and ZERO TOs. He’d be a danger man. And if not what would he need to do to get dangerman status? 89% comp and negative 4 TOs per game?
He can have limitations in this offense and make mistakes on reads and still be just a circle dude. but if the offense is centered around Cade being the man in the run game then who’s fault is that? Cade’s or the coaches’? When Denard was under center when Borges was around who was getting the cyan treatment? Borges or Denard? If the DL sets up inside Steuber and the DL slants inside and Steuber is always asked to block that dude anyway is Steuber deserving a cyan?
this criticism you’re getting is NOT based on the INs you’re counting for the Hennechart or the analysis of what the offense’s structure is based around. It’s based on one little decision about a cyan border in the graphics. Well maybe two re: G Mertz but you copped to that.
October 11th, 2021 at 7:48 AM ^
Yeah, that is basically it for me. Cade isn't a dual threat guy that the offense has tried to make that a thing I don't really fault him for. I'm not pretending that Cade is some how a Heisman contender or even a top 3 QB in the Conference. But he's also not Mertz or Penix. He's a B- QB, which yeah, isn't lighting anyone on fire, but its also not burning down the offense either.
He misses some ball and probably misses some reads, but he also makes some tough throws and plays an impressively clean game. The Cyan thing just seems way too harsh. Would love to see some side-by-side comparison of stats between him and other Cyan QBs though. Maybe I'm just way off base.
October 11th, 2021 at 8:16 AM ^
NC, you've captured my feelings and what I've said in a few of these discussions both here on MGoBlog and in discussions with friends.
Cade is, indeed, a "B" quarterback. He does miss reads...he does miss some open receivers...and he is athletically limited. But he has led us to a 6-0 record and makes minimal crucial mistakes.
But, this discussion has become like a political discussion...with everyone talking past each other and failng to demonstrate any nuanced thinking, understanding, or debate.
To point out Cade's shortcomings doesn't mean that we are somehow clamoring for JJ to be made the starter. And to defend him based on our 6-0 record and his solid play doesn't mean anyone is claiming he is a Heisman candidate.
He's not an awful quarterback. He's not a great quarterback. He is a solid, above-average quarterback who makes very few mistakes and very few spectacular plays. Will that be good enough this year to beat OSU or get us in the playoffs? Probably not, but everyone can agree that the team has thus far exceeded expectations...and Cade's play is a big part of that.
The nature of discourse on this blog - and in our country - is so frustrating and disheartening.
October 11th, 2021 at 11:29 AM ^
Cade is an A- QB throwing to a group of C+ WRs. There’s only so much he can do.
October 11th, 2021 at 8:13 AM ^
So, FWIW, I don't think Cade should have a cyan circle. But I do think it's entirely fair to fault him for not being able to fully implement the run game. We can also rightly (and mostly) blame the coaches for that - if Cade just can't do it (physically or mentally), and JJ isn't ready to do it (for whatever reason), then the run game has to be adjusted to something Cade can fully implement. Unfortunately, that looks like it'd be a huge deal...
Letting Cade actually keep on some downs might not gain a lot of yards, but it would keep defenses more honest. So why isn't this happening?
As for JJ being the starter? I don't see it... Cade has a couple of years in the system and experience reading defenses - and he's getting better at it each game. McCarthy just doesn't have that head start and is (most likely) still learning how to read a defense. I'm willing to also say that he's still relying on some HS instincts when plays break down or the look is different than expected. He had good coaching at IMG, but it was still high school stuff.
October 11th, 2021 at 12:25 PM ^
I agree that it would probably be a big deal to rewrite a RPO playbook to something else, but at the same time we haven't had a QB capable of RPO since Denard (maybe first year Shea). Why is the offense so committed to this offense if it can't get guys on the field (either through recruiting or coaching) who can run it? It's not like Milton was blowing teams up with his reads last year.
To be clear, I like our coaches (generally), and I think this offense is doing good things, but if the issue here is "does Cade deserve the Cyan circle" and the primary reason he getting it is because he is basically not the right fit for the offense we are running/wanting to run then absent seeing what he is taught in practice, I don't see how we can say the problem is him.
We spent a lot of time dumping on Don Brown because he didn't have the guys to run his system and more or less refused to change his system. Well this is kind of the same situation. If you don't have the QB to run your offense and you aren't/can't recruit a QB that can and you can't coach the ones you have to run it either then maybe the system/coaching is the issue. Cyan that instead of the player(s).
October 11th, 2021 at 2:05 PM ^
Reece Bobby is doing the FFFF charts now...
October 11th, 2021 at 8:31 AM ^
I wouldn't take it too personally, and generally I think everyone is ok with negative feedback on Cade as long as it is explained and put in context. IMO there is way too much "put in JJ" and Cade complaining on the boards in general, which has resulted in the forming of a Cade defense force, and front page articles are going to be the main battlegrounds of these clashing factions.
It's just standard fan(atic) behavior - my unscientific data says that the majority of the Cade haters (not putting you in that bucket for the record) are the 5-7 to 7-5'ers that are now moving the goalposts because they just HAVE to be right about something in their preseason prediction. The Cade defense force is ecstatic that we are 6-0 and just want to enjoy a win without the whiners bringing them down.
October 11th, 2021 at 11:48 AM ^
You mentioned how there is too much "put in JJ" on the boards, but I think for myself and others, there's this confusion about why the same sentiment seems to keep coming from the site writers, and idk, it feels like its coming from a strange place. There isnt a lot that has or hasnt happened that truthfully should make this the case.
Alex in the post game front page story- "There will be much debate in Michigan-land over this bye week about who should start at QB in the coming weeks." Cade certainly wasnt amazing on Saturday night, but he was solid and made plays while leading the team to a tough road win against a decent team. JJ has made some great throws...in garbage time. Empirically, there just isnt a lot of game evidence that JJ should be starting over Cade, and yet....in the celebratory post game story the writer felt like that was something that would and should be discussed.
It just seems so odd
October 11th, 2021 at 8:49 AM ^
I mean, I think Brian was right on the radio: everyone except you interprets Cyan Circle as “this guy sucks”. No matter how many times you say otherwise, even though it’s your chart, you’re yelling at a wall. And c’mon man, at least admit that it was a mistake not giving Mertz that mark if you’re going to give it to Cade. Everything you say about Cade and the Michigan run game applies twofold to Mertz and the Wisconsin pass game.
The actual detailed critiques of McNamara are fine and fair. But people are sick of the pining for the backup and the damn cyan circle makes it look like the official position of MGoBlog is on the JJ train.
October 11th, 2021 at 11:07 AM ^
And c’mon man, at least admit that it was a mistake not giving Mertz that mark if you’re going to give it to Cade.
Seth has already done this, and laid out where he went wrong in not giving Mertz a cyaning (basically he was afraid that TD pass over Dax was going to happen much of the day). Seth has been as open about this as a guy can be.
October 11th, 2021 at 9:09 AM ^
Thanks for replying, Seth. I admire your work, and tend to think it has helped mgoblog survive through some difficult times. Not an attack on you.
October 11th, 2021 at 9:54 AM ^
How about a half cyan circle to show that he is limiting the ground game by not making correct pull reads but is also playing solid, mostly mistake free football in the other facets of the game
October 11th, 2021 at 11:53 AM ^
Seth, I think many level-headed responses have explained their confusion with the Cyan thing and general Cade front-page discussion and are not just users saying they dont want to hear anything negative about Cade.
October 11th, 2021 at 11:37 AM ^
Amen, dude (or dudette)
October 11th, 2021 at 12:36 PM ^
Substitute 82 grad for 84 and i would have thought I wrote this post. You have expressed my thoughts perfectly, especially the comment about the cyan on Cade in one of my favorite pieces that is presented on the site.
I realize that money changes everything, and in these days of NIL and the portal college football is going to change, but we are still dealing with 18-22 year old young men, who are no where near finished growing up. Don't believe me, ask your local auto insurance agent. Let's keep things in perspective. To paraphrase the late John McKay from USC, gentlemen, win or lose, there are 1.4 billion people in China who are going to wake tomorrow and not care.
October 11th, 2021 at 11:18 PM ^
Tom Brady was a victim of Sunday morning QB's.Enuff said.
October 10th, 2021 at 9:08 PM ^
There were multiple over thrown balls, he still can’t handle a zone read, and his lack of arm strength means the flats stuff gets closed on without the receivers being given a chance to make a move. Cade is absolutely the definition of game manager and his limitations severely restrict the ceiling of the offense
October 10th, 2021 at 10:38 PM ^
Cade hit 58 percent of his passes Saturday night. One minute you say he lacks arm strength, the next you say he's overthrowing his long passes (no, he wasn't).
A week ago, writers here were acknowledging that Cade had sufficient arm strength, and he was making lots of downfield plays. Saturday, he was off--and yes, most of the failed throws were on him--but by yards and inches. He wasn't throwing garbage.
After Wisconsin, Harbaugh said, "Our playbook has every play known to man." I assume that, while being hyperbole, Harbaugh meant that Michigan can show other teams a good many looks.
For a month, the whiners here complained that Michigan did nothing but run the ball. On Saturday, passes outnumbered run plays. Notice how silent everyone is about that?
I think it's safe to assume that, even if JJ is God, he doesn't know the playbook like Cade does. (No one seems interested in the near-disaster that his last entrance almost created.)
On Saturday, Cade settled into the game, and by the end was obviously RELISHING his task. Win or lose, that was a kid in command of his nerves, and not making mistakes.
Feel free to make yourself miserable; that's often a choice. Cade is likely to be the starting QB next year, too.
October 11th, 2021 at 12:32 AM ^
People want JJ to be Trevor Lawrence, and that makes Cade Kelly Bryant. What that leaves out is the Clemson went 12-1 in the regular season the year before Lawrence took over, and that loss came in a game Bryant was hurt.
we need to get to a base level of competence before we go making those types of ceiling unlocking changes. Cade is still a floor raiser, one that the team probably needs.
October 11th, 2021 at 8:21 AM ^
This is spot on. I'll add that Clemson is basically running a college "we have better athletes than you do" offense that relies on having stars in each position (look at it now when they don't). So it was easier for Trevor Lawrence to transition into that scheme. If JJ is far along with the playbook, we would be seeing more than read-options and one-read deep balls. My guess is that he's not even close with the complex playbook and will need at least an offseason to learn it and execute it with game speed. Right now, he's a change up like Peppers but with the ability to hit a one-read deep ball.
There aren't better options than Cade right now so instead of criticizing let's hope he uses the bye to improve his consistency.
October 10th, 2021 at 10:40 PM ^
If by “drops “ you mean failure to make circus catches on bad throws, maybe I would agree.
October 11th, 2021 at 10:31 AM ^
Well Mikey Sainrstil sure went and got that jump ball.
That however was more Desmond style than Braylon style
October 10th, 2021 at 5:57 PM ^
Cade is doing fine. People seem to forget the shit shows that we have the last …. years. He is probably the 3-4th best QB in the BIG in creating wins — makes almost no mistakes that cost the team and makes plays to win.
October 10th, 2021 at 7:10 PM ^
And that is fine and its not like Cade hasn't made important plays the last couple of weeks because he has, but people shouldn't get so defensive when someone says something that is objectively true like he was not accurate on deep balls last night. And you are right fine is a step up from the stuff we have seen at times in the past and it has been good enough to get this team to 6-0, but Cade is probably going to need to be better than fine to potentially navigate the rest of the schedule. However like I said I do think he can be better cause he was accurate on deep balls before last night.
October 10th, 2021 at 6:31 PM ^
Love the pic
October 10th, 2021 at 7:23 PM ^
it's uh....
something
October 10th, 2021 at 7:22 PM ^
That stick by Green on third down cannot be understated on that last possession.
October 10th, 2021 at 7:33 PM ^
Don't think it was mentioned how utterly disrespectful Ferentz was at the end of that game. Basically kneeled on a 3rd and 3 with 3 minutes left, and then actually kneeled starting on 2nd down with 2 minutes left. Because he was that confident PSU couldn't score if he punted it back to them.
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