Semi OT: [title edited] AN ohio state community college fires Hoops Coach Chris Holtmann
Interesting contrast between our program and the folks at the Central Ohio Sports Hedge Fund.
https://www.cleveland.com/osu/2024/02/chris-holtmann-fired-as-ohio-states-basketball-coach.html
[title edited for clarity per discussion with the OP---rob f]
February 14th, 2024 at 12:24 PM ^
Your title leaves something to be desired however if we must suck then better that they suck with us.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:29 PM ^
Is it because I no longer consider the Ohio State athletics program to be affiliated with the University? They're a business not a family, remember?
February 14th, 2024 at 12:34 PM ^
I mean, I would have gone with Buckeye Capital Investment Partners, Ltd.....but the point stands, I would think.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:37 PM ^
Thanks, OP, for the explanation and link, but I still believe the thread title to be too confusing to stand as is.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:42 PM ^
Fair enough, I make a semi-coherent version of the same joke in the body of the post anyway. Sorry for confusion. Change it as you see fit!
February 14th, 2024 at 5:44 PM ^
I was expecting this to be about a tiny Ohio college nobody cares about firing their coach who is coincidentally named Chris holtman
February 14th, 2024 at 12:55 PM ^
I’m just jealous of them. They are doing all that they can do within the rules to win / get better. What other area of life / business would you hate that? I respect it and only wish our AD would see college athletics for what they are today.
It’s never going to be like it was 5 years ago and prior. Those that don’t get with the times will be left behind. Michigan is not going to become less academically prestigious because they pay NIL like the SEC does or OSU.
February 14th, 2024 at 1:11 PM ^
I agree that the landscape has changed and we are playing a different game now. But I think that masquerading playing the same game as (almost) everyone else for two decades while running a professional program is embarrassing, shameful, and very childish. They rigged the game and pretended to be better. Like Kramer dominating children in Karate class.
February 14th, 2024 at 1:36 PM ^
Are you implying the Buckeyes are playing by the rules? Certainly - no instance of "coaching during a dead period" a few years ago - OR - tampering with prospects prior to their entry into the portal.
Are they being aggressive? Yes. Have they broken rules? I think so.
"Michigan is not going to become less academically prestigious because they pay NIL like the SEC does or OSU. " An interesting point - and, I'm not implying this would - or wouldn't - impact Michigan's academic reputation - since a student athlete must still obtain Admissions approval. However, this might have an impact on the locker room and culture - not NIL, per se - but, how individuals may elect to use their NIL.
Anyone has the right to do as they wish - and spend money like they want. My preference would be - no exotic cars in Michigan's parking lot. My advice for student athletes - plan for your future - drive a car that fits your needs to day - "blue collar" - like the team's culture. Hard working, etc. Save for tomorrow and prepare for a 40 year plan. And - when you sign your second NFL contract - and / or - are "set" financially - get the wheels you've always dreamed of, or wanted.
February 14th, 2024 at 1:44 PM ^
So OSU “cheats” and that somehow nullifies their strategy around NIL? I guess it’s better to be Michigan and “cheat” and not have any real significant strategy around NIL!?
February 14th, 2024 at 3:52 PM ^
It’s only cheating if you get caught. What does that say about us that Ohio State whistles down the path on a bright sunny day while we get shit about cheeseburgers and some wingnut recording signals on a shaky iPhone?
February 14th, 2024 at 1:43 PM ^
"Within the rules" may be generous... and making it a paid profession *does* change the nature of the sport, regardless of whether people feel that is a good or bad development.
February 14th, 2024 at 9:48 PM ^
Careful, that charge could be levied at all Power 5 schools now, including Michigan. With the influx of money, non-stop coaching departures, transfers, and lack of alignment in emphasis placed on the other elements of the college experience it’s really difficult to assess any athletic department as being anything more than professional sports franchises and sometime marketing agency for the schools. We should all get off our high horse even if the cooler poopers in Columbus have somehow found a way to sink even lower into the depths of hypocrisy.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:25 PM ^
There goes our shot at Dusty May
February 14th, 2024 at 12:30 PM ^
The timing does suggests a desire to be out ahead of others... .
February 14th, 2024 at 12:48 PM ^
Maybe so but there's also Darian DeVries, who I had never heard of until he was suggested by another poster several months ago. Looks to me from a distance like a legit up and coming young star in the coaching profession.
February 14th, 2024 at 3:57 PM ^
Interesting tidbit. Darian is the older brother of Jared DeVries, who played eleven years for the Detroit Lions.
February 14th, 2024 at 1:26 PM ^
They're going to bring in a bigger name--one likely with baggage--think Oats or Miller.
February 14th, 2024 at 5:45 PM ^
The guy from Houston?
February 14th, 2024 at 11:04 PM ^
Kelvin Sampson is 68 years old. In the last 4 NCAA tourneys Houston has 4 sweet 16 appearances, 2 elite eights and a Final Four. They just joined the Big 12 so they're no longer in a mid major conference, and they're in first place in the Big 12. Why would he leave that for OSU?
February 14th, 2024 at 12:27 PM ^
At first I thought you were referring to one of those weird-ass named AAU basketball teams. Haven’t heard of the moniker of Central Ohio Business Boys in case you were wondering if that was catching on…
In related news, I wonder if the Southeast Michigan Corporate Crew will let go of Howard any time soon.
February 14th, 2024 at 2:09 PM ^
TURDS is my favorite name for them.
That University Right Down South
February 14th, 2024 at 12:30 PM ^
Good for them. They ran Thad Matta out of town after two "off-seasons" despite his getting to the Finals once, F4 another time, and three other S16s.
Holt has never made it out of the 1st weekend.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:31 PM ^
Yeah, I assume Howard will also be gone but OSU was somehow significantly worse than UM last year and are basically on par with them this year (OSU has more wins because they played a much easier OOC schedule). This has felt inevitable for a while.
But yeah, not a surprise.
February 14th, 2024 at 1:14 PM ^
OSU has more wins because they played a much easier OOC schedule
You mean they didn't have to play Long Beach State or McNeese?
By the way, I just looked, they beat WVU, UCLA, and Alabama. I know UCLA and WVU aren't vintage necessarily but still. Alabama is, of course, ranked. Their one non-con loss was to Texas A&M.
February 14th, 2024 at 1:19 PM ^
LBSU is the second-worse team UM has played per KenPom at 162, and McNeese is 22-3 and ranked 67th (basically Iowa). Michigan played 4 teams ranked outside the top 100 in the OOC, and one outside the top 200 (EMU). OSU played 8 outside the top 100 and 5 outside the top 200. So yeah, the difference between 8 and 14 wins is basically OSU's much easier OOC slate.
February 14th, 2024 at 2:07 PM ^
Since you edited your response I'll update mine as well.
Yes they played WVU, UCLA, and Alabama but WVU is, per KenPom, significantly worse than UM both offensively (62nd to 190th) and nearly as bad defensively (181st to 126th). They'd be the worst team in the Big 10 by a healthy margin and OSU barely beat them. UCLA is, again per KenPom, 92nd (for comparison UM is 103rd). Yes Alabama's ranked but that's basically it for their OOC schedule. By comparison UM beat the #41 team (SJU) and played #22 TTU, #29 Florida, #60 Oregon, #78 Memphis, and #85 Stanford. OSU's OOC schedule is losing to Texas A&M (#42) and beating #6 Alabama and #92 UCLA.
Again, I don't think rankings mean everything but this place needs to accept that UM has played one of the toughest schedules in the country and while that doesn't excuse their performance it absolutely has played a role in how bad they've looked at times and their overall record. I still think Howard gets fired but switch our Oregon, Florida, and Memphis with schools like Merrimack, CMU, and Miami (OH) and their overall record would look a bit better even if the same underlying team was there.
February 14th, 2024 at 2:22 PM ^
Did I update my post? If I did, it was immediately.
Anyway, I appreciate the deep dive into the non-conference schedule of these two decidedly terrible teams. Michigan actually beat OSU, too. It doesn't really matter.
February 14th, 2024 at 2:48 PM ^
I'm not saying this as a homer, but Joe Dumars State is good enough to take a game or two in March. I assumed that would be an L based on our allergic reaction to defense.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:33 PM ^
OP-your title?
How about giving me a better title and I'll edit it in. This one makes little or no sense. I'll give you a half hour unless I see you respond sooner.
If you don't offer a better title, then I'll edit in a title of my own choosing or the best one that someone else offers.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:38 PM ^
Mine was deleted because I was a second or two behind this one, but my title was much better.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:39 PM ^
I didn't see your thread, apparently LSA deleted it fairly quickly.
What was it titled?
February 14th, 2024 at 12:39 PM ^
Sorry, we can just change my joke that isn't landing to "OSU" since it seems to be not funny to people.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:43 PM ^
How about I go with "AN ohio state..." or something along those lines?
February 14th, 2024 at 12:44 PM ^
Works for me!
February 14th, 2024 at 12:39 PM ^
they're just practicing to fire cryin' ryan next year.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:41 PM ^
Sadly, it seems OSU outplayed us in getting ahead on candidate opportunities
February 14th, 2024 at 12:51 PM ^
That was my first thought but is it a 100% foregone conclusion that we'll fire Juwaun after the year?
February 14th, 2024 at 2:51 PM ^
I get a feeling Warde won't pull the trigger without pressure from big money donors. That's just typically how college sports works.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:42 PM ^
Chris Beard, come on down!
February 14th, 2024 at 12:59 PM ^
My thoughts exactly
February 14th, 2024 at 1:26 PM ^
I know he was ultimately cleared of the DV charges (his then-fiance said she didn't want to pursue them) but I think UM probably isn't dying to go after a guy with that in his recent history especially after so many people have been adamantly against Howard and his outbursts. I might be wrong but there are likely coaches out there with similar resumes and without that mark against them.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:42 PM ^
clever use of v-day card as holtman's pink slip. djork is the hare and warde is the tortoise.
pikiell from rutgers is the best poachable coach in the big teng. preferable to zhoidberg... probably best to look at the sec cupboard first when warde finally decides to use the rolodex.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:43 PM ^
Pikiell has two of the top 5 recruits in the nation coming to Rutgers next year, somehow. I doubt he's leaving this year.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:47 PM ^
That's not how this works. They get the coach and the players will follow. I'm not entirely sure that he's a very good coach but...
February 14th, 2024 at 12:47 PM ^
you are making my case. pikiell can bring them both and they will get plenty of minutes.
read the manual warde. you have a job to do and the time to do it is upon you.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:51 PM ^
It's a fair point, I wonder if for Harper he's there for Pikiell, or if it's some combo of being a hometown kid / NIL. But yeah if he can get them to follow him it would be the best hire of the year.
February 14th, 2024 at 12:55 PM ^
ron harper's son and jr's brother I presume?
February 14th, 2024 at 12:57 PM ^
Yes and yes.
February 14th, 2024 at 1:03 PM ^
Plus, Rutgers is centered in one of the top HS BB recruiting bases in the country. If they get that program really rolling, watch out.