NCAA considered eliminating in-person scouting restriction in 2021
"Two years ago, the NCAA considered eliminating the rule against in-person scouting of future opponents because of its "minimal competitive advantage."
The proposal was voted down 48-14, including the big ten voting against it, but it provides interesting context for the current investigation. As has been said on this site, penny-ante BS.
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:37 PM ^
bit late to the party, champ
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:40 PM ^
Hmm...article only came out 3 hours ago.
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:42 PM ^
New article, old info.
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:44 PM ^
Hard to keep up
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:51 PM ^
+1. Just take your lumps. Gives us a good opportunity to make some jokes. We could use a little more levity these days.
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:57 PM ^
I'll take the lumps. But I'll add that there is some relevance in that a media organization is at least trying to get a bit of a positive spin out there from Michigan's perspective
Looks like I'm going to get my sports reading fix from CBS going forward.
November 22nd, 2023 at 4:00 PM ^
Good point - I take back my snark... +1
November 22nd, 2023 at 4:45 PM ^
I think this is a good post. I upvoted it.
The neutral-to-positive spin that CBS (a broadcast partner now) puts on it is noteworthy.
There is no WORST SCANDAL OF ALL TIME!! bullshit.
They actually read the rulebook and know the rule history, something that we have bitched about the media not doing.
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:52 PM ^
Put another way, you're doing a better job maintaining boundaries than many on this site.
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:46 PM ^
The 2021 vote was well discussed on this site since the beginning of this.
However it was also voted on in 2013 when a majority, but not enough to reach threshold for change voted to end the ban on in person scouting.
https://www.ncaa.org/news/2013/6/21/division-i-scouting-ban-upheld.aspx
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:16 PM ^
Logged in to upvote. Hard out here these days. Thanks for the article. Keep your head up OP
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:48 PM ^
Considering that I haven’t seen a single reference to this point in any of many dozens of anti-Michigan comments on TV, radio, or social media, I think it’s a certainty that virtually nobody outside of the Michigan orbit is even aware of it. Repetition is what’s necessary to get it across.
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:01 PM ^
Yes, this is interesting as a tracking point in "the narrative." But the MGoBorg Collective was aware of this (and specifically the point about it being "minimal competitive advantage") months ago. But if that kind of knowledge is seeping into the general public consciousness, that is a good thing overall.
November 22nd, 2023 at 4:52 PM ^
It is not what we know or think that matters now. It is what the influencers know and think that matters.
Especially since we have an impressionable commissioner that is not familiar with his own rules and has no college football background.
November 22nd, 2023 at 4:49 PM ^
Keith Jackson RIP
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:37 PM ^
It's only penny-ante bullshit for anyone except Michigan. Then it is a capital crime.
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:37 PM ^
Haven't we known about this for weeks? Maybe not the voting details, but I'm pretty sure that "minimal competitive advantage" quote has been floating around for awhile...
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:58 PM ^
months...
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:37 PM ^
lord.
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:38 PM ^
Which 14 voted for it? The SEC?
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:38 PM ^
BEAT OHIO
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:38 PM ^
This just in...stretching is also a crime if you wear maize and blue
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:39 PM ^
Welcome to 2023 October. Where have you been?
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:41 PM ^
Again? They considered this twice at the same time? Talk about the inability to take action...
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:44 PM ^
We know
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:48 PM ^
I'll be anxiously awaiting your next post when the Keith Jackson news drops.
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:50 PM ^
I'm afraid that Keith Jackson won't be alive come February.
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:56 PM ^
Don't say that.
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:05 PM ^
whoa nelly!
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:48 PM ^
Dodd is going to break the moon landing story next week
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:50 PM ^
Old news. So the question is: "Why rehash it now?" My WAG:
Is this stuff about "milk" Venmo payments on Twitter/X starting to get traction? i.e., Are some OSU types worried it'll break out to more mainstream media soon, and rediscovering this talking point is a way for them to get ahead of the news now that it might be useful in defending the Buckeyes?
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:01 PM ^
I like the way you think.
November 22nd, 2023 at 2:53 PM ^
Playing a bit of devil's advocate here, but two things about this have always bothered me:
1. The rule change was resoundingly voted down, which suggests that most did not agree with removing the rule. Whether that means they disagreed specifically with the "minimal competitive advantage" is unclear, but it's not a leap to think that at least some of those that voted this down did so because they disagreed with the idea that the minimal competitive advantage was minimal.
2. I've seen people twist this "minimal competitive advantage" point to say that having all of another team's signs in advance is a minimal advantage. Unfortunately, that's kind of taking the quote of context. The quote is about the advantage gained from advanced scouting. You could of course argue that a byproduct of advanced scouting is knowing all of a team's signs, but that's easy to say with hindsight now that Stalions' scheme is known to all. It's not clear to me that at the time they wrote this language they were even considering a sign-decoding scheme such as what Stalions was doing. It seems far more likely to me they were thinking about more traditional advantages gained from scouting--learning opponents tendencies, strengths, weaknesses, etc. Maybe they did have sign-decoding in mind, maybe they didn't, we really have no idea one way or another because there's no further context provided.
Anyway, in the end in my mind this "minimal competitive advantage" language should not be given much weight for these reasons.
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:08 PM ^
You’re looking at it as if only Michigan has ever stolen signs before. In reality, we know all of our opponents do so legally and possibly via advanced scouting as well, although that hasn’t been proven yet.
Therefore, stealing signs via advanced scouting is of minimal advantage at the MOST, if one’s opponents also have decoded a good number of your own team’s signs. Michigan has produced receipts that Purdue was given a pretty comprehensive portfolio of Michigan’s signs from OSU and Rutgers. So in reality, this is not about any significant competitive advantage. It’s about allegedly breaking a fairly outdated, minor, and irrelevant rule.
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:43 PM ^
Why else would you need to see the game in person?
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:46 PM ^
Advanced scouting has to be entirely about the signs. All other information is publicly available.
Furthermore, rule was implemented to save cost. It was NOT initiated to address advantages. It would be inappropriate to pretend the rule was about on the field advantages now when it wasn’t before. Just like it isn’t about safety.
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:00 PM ^
They factored in player safety and turned it down, clearly
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:03 PM ^
This is old news, but I'm upvoting you just because you're a Michigan fan. Go Blue!
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:05 PM ^
Old, old news. Like from day one of the scandal.
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:09 PM ^
We landed on the moon..... In Jim Carey's voice of course
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:16 PM ^
Like being in jail for marijuana possession, then they legalize it.
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:23 PM ^
“This is the most serious scandal ever to hit football” they said as they literally were giving and getting info on their future opponents. And people bought it! It doesn’t get dumber.
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:36 PM ^
Could bode well for our response to whatever's coming later from the ncaa
Edit:read the article and never mind on that haha
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:50 PM ^
wait until he hears about Keith Jackson
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:57 PM ^
Key sentence:
"Several coaching sources confirmed to CBS Sports that they can figure out an opponent's signs to signal in plays from game film without in-person scouting of future opponents."
Which also makes Connor Stallions more of an idiot for doing something so stupid and unnecessary.
November 22nd, 2023 at 4:03 PM ^
3.5 hours on Saturday afternoon will decide Conner Stallion’s fate in Michigan history.
Will he be an odd footnote that folks forget about over the next year or so, or will he be persona non grata for the rest of his born days?
November 22nd, 2023 at 4:55 PM ^
Poor guy. Only Ryan Day is more desperate about the outcome of this game
November 22nd, 2023 at 3:57 PM ^
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