PSU goes down - UM now 1 game out of 2nd place in B1G BB standings
With PSU's loss to Indiana, there is now a log jam for 2nd place with 5 teams tied at 10-6 (or 9-6) and UM 1 game behind at 9-7.
Should be a crazy finish to the season for the strongest conference in NCAA BB.
As the saying goes - "Just take care of business and everything will sort itself out".
B1G BB standings
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/standings/_/group/7
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:06 PM ^
Forgot to make it a hyperlink
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/standings/_/group/7
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:08 PM ^
Damn I wish we could play PSU again.
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:16 PM ^
We may still get the chance in the B1G tourney, if the BB gods so wish. "Just take care of business..."
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:10 PM ^
If we can finish 3-1 we're going to be in great shape. This team is really solid when healthy.
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:44 PM ^
I know that we took care of Rutgers without him, but damn, I’m not sure I have seen one player as irreplaceable for a particular team as Livers is for us. He changes everything on the floor for Michigan. All of the sudden, everybody is exactly where they should be at the right time, on both ends of the floor. Purdue was a mess against us yesterday. That is a team that beat MSU by 30 points.
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:54 PM ^
Yep, he’s a game changer in his own right, on both ends, and he commands the attention that opens a lot up for others. He really makes us a different team.
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:02 PM ^
While I also agree with you....I think our big-3 are all irreplaceable with our current depth/talent. We got by Nebraska without Simpson, but doubt we could survive without him. While Teske has been up and down on both ends of the floor this year, I don't think we could survive very long without him either.
Hopefully next year, despite replacing the two star seniors, we'll have more depth and versatility to insulate us from injury or suspension:
- PG - DDJ, Brooks, Jackson
- SG - Brooks, Jackson, Christopher?, Bajema
- SF - Wagner, Livers, Williams, Nunez, Bajema
- PF - Livers, Johns, Williams, Todd
- C - Dickenson, Castleton, Todd, Davis?
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:53 PM ^
There is absolutely no way Christopher doesn't start. Same with Todd. My very remedial basketball brain says
PG: DDJ/Brooks/Zeb
SG: Christopher/Brooks/Zeb
SF: Livers/Franz/Christopher
PF: Todd/Johns/Livers
C: Dickinson/Todd/Davis
Someone that is a starter this year will not be a starter next year if we land Christopher AND Livers comes back, IMO.
February 23rd, 2020 at 5:35 PM ^
It’s going to be really hard to have Franz and Brooks coming off the bench. Both are outstanding defenders. If Livers comes back, I think it’s pretty likely that Todd comes off the bench, but still gets 20+ minutes per game. I could also see Cristopher getting some minutes at the 1. To me it’s looking like Livers is going to go pro based on his play.
February 23rd, 2020 at 5:55 PM ^
If he finishes this year strong I think he will go pro as well. Then you could have
PG: Brooks/DDJ/Christopher
SG: Christopher/Brooks/Zeb
SF: Franz/Christopher/Williams
PF: Todd/Johns/Franz
C: Dickinson/Todd/Davis
Getting pretty close to positionless basketball.
February 23rd, 2020 at 6:36 PM ^
Yeah other than Brooks you could see any of those guys play any position 1 through 4. Dickinson is a straight up center, no questions asked.
Can you imagine a 6'10" point guard? LOL
February 23rd, 2020 at 6:59 PM ^
I don't see Livers or Franz moving to the bench. As excited as I am about Todd's athleticism, I don't think he starts if everyone returns. I think Todd comes off the bench as a 4 or small-ball 5 who brings a ton of energy to the floor. I think Zeb and Williams struggle to crack the rotation and I did't even mention Howard.
Good problems to have, but not very many teams go beyond 9 deep. So if you rank the players by important next year and likely minutes, you're something like.....
- Livers
- Franz
- Christopher
- DDJ/Brooks (starting PG)
- Dickenson/Castleton (whoever starts at C)
- DDJ/Brooks (whoever backs up both spots)
- Todd/Johns (first wing off the bench)
- Backup-C
- Next PF off the bench
- Other (Bajema, Nunez, Williams, Howard, Jackson)
Notice I don't have Davis in there. Todd is an amazing athlete but he's still very raw. Do you think he's going to take a lot of minutes from Franz and Livers? And I look forward to the battle with Johns for minutes. The C position is going to be a wildcard, so someone can get minutes there. Maybe Franz can play some SG and go huge.
February 23rd, 2020 at 7:28 PM ^
I just think Todd will bail and go pro overseas if he thinks he won’t start here. Maybe he doesn’t care about starting if his minutes are good enough, but I’m not sure. Christopher and Todd both seem like sure-fire one-and-dones, and Michigan just has to play it right to get the one.
I do think Franz could play some 2 though.
February 23rd, 2020 at 6:53 PM ^
"Positionless"...you're "remedial" brain is catching on, man. In your scenario I think DDJ gets the starting nod with Brooks getting relief minutes at both 1 and 2.
I am generally in favor of players going pro when they are ready-and I believe Livers is/will be ready. However, I would also love to see him come back and lead next years team in making a serious run at an NC.
I believe there is at least a 50-50 chance that both Christopher and Brown land in AA. Now what does that lineup look like if Livers returns too? I say: Christopher, Brown, Todd, Livers and Johns-that would be one incredible challenge to defend. I pick Johns for spacing. Having that combination of size and athleticism and those skillsets on the floor together...oh my!
February 23rd, 2020 at 7:25 PM ^
That would be an absolute Embarrassment of riches. Jace would have to be a walk-on for a year or two.
February 23rd, 2020 at 9:43 PM ^
Livers is out there looking like a pro. I know the mock drafts don't agree but I think Livers is a sure fire first round draft pick if he stays healthy. He has really high basketball IQ and has a very noticeable effect on the team on both ends of the court. He shoots as good as anyone in the country at 6'7. Add in above average athleticism with defensive acumen and he is a tailor made 3 and D wing in the NBA. Cam Johnson went 11th last year and I think Livers compares favorably to him.
February 23rd, 2020 at 6:26 PM ^
Todd over Wagner ? No way
February 24th, 2020 at 8:54 AM ^
I’m with you on Christopher starting but no way Todd starts over Franz. Franz will be a beast next year.
Todd will get minutes at the 4 and 5.
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:47 PM ^
Which made the whole “freaking out about Juwan” when livers was out that much more insane. This is basketball - one player can have a huge impact one way or another. And we we missing our best player....
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:49 PM ^
Yeah, I like every broadcaster's galaxy-brain insight now that "I think people are underrating Michigan because they're better with Isaiah Livers."
Developing: Team is better when best player plays. More to come.
February 23rd, 2020 at 5:49 PM ^
Like those 2 years the Bulls didn't win while Jordan was serving his suspension, I mean retirement.
February 23rd, 2020 at 6:58 PM ^
Funny that the 1st year that the Bulls was without MJ, they were 2 games worse than the year before when they won it all. They lost in the Conference Semi-Finals. Scottie Pippen arguably played like an MVP candidate that year. The following year, they got worse but still have a winning record.
I think I remember reading that the Bulls have a better record with Pippen but no MJ than the one with MJ without Pippen which is interesting considering most considered him the GOAT
February 24th, 2020 at 12:07 AM ^
Yeah but with Jordan the Bulls had to climb out of a hole where they were a bad team the prior year which didn't make the playoffs. Their record got better or stayed the same for the next 3 years if you consider that Jordan's 2nd year was actually 9-9 for the games he played (ankle injury) and not consider the record of the Bulls that year which was pretty bad, like 30-52.
pre-Jordan: .360 ish
Jordan Year 1 '84-85: .469 ish
Jordan Year 2 '85-86: .500 (18 total games for Jordan)
Jordan Year 3 '86-87: .489 (40-42)
Then in Jordan's 4th year, they got Pippen and won 10 more games that season (50-32) and beyond. Then Pippen had a good arsenal of supporters when Jordan was playing baseball, and as you mentioned, the team got worse for those two years. Then Jordan and Pippen played 3 more years together where the record again improved, and both left at the same time (Jordan retired, Pippen to Houston).
So that is a fun comparison to show Pippen was pretty great, but Jordan had to do a lot before Pippen was able to just jump in and go along with it. (sorry stats not perfect-ish, I had this written out once before but browser lost it navigating around, so keeping it this time).
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:25 PM ^
Conference is probably the deepest it’s been since the 2012-13 season. Ten teams should be in, with the possibility of 11 if Purdue goes on some kind of run and wins a few games in the BTT.
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:26 PM ^
Root for:
Iowa to beat PSU
PSU to beat Staee
Staee to beat MD
and the good guys to handle their business and M should be looking pretty good.
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:28 PM ^
Good on 2 of 3
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:32 PM ^
Why would we want State to beat UMD? The only way we tie UMD in the standings is if they lose 4 of their last 5 and we win out (AKA not gonna happen), so we want them to beat OSU and MSU to help us finish ahead of them.
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:48 PM ^
Double bye purposes I’m assuming? Otherwise I’m not sure. Nobody is catching Maryland I don’t think.
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:55 PM ^
Right but how would the first place team losing to a team competing with us help us get a double bye? If MSU beats Maryland, that's a game they could have lost they didn't that keeps them ahead of us/tied with us. Maryland beating MSU helps us catch MSU.
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:10 PM ^
It occurred to me while watching Maryland go on a 14-0 run to come from behind to beat MSU that we might come to regret it. (But I rooted for it anyway.) If Maryland was sitting on four losses now, and facing a sure loss on March 8, losing two more might not be so unlikely. But Maryland losing three in addition to its guaranteed 3/8 loss is probably not going to happen.
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:59 PM ^
Losing 4 of 5 would be a catastrophe, but not impossible
Maryland has scraped by the two worst teams in the conference recently and the rest of their season is road games at OSU, Minnesota, and Rutgers and home games vs MSU and Michigan
That's super tough. If Maryland wins today at OSU then you can likely forget it, but if they drop it they have pressure to not blow their huge conference lead
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:34 PM ^
Fixed it for you:
Iowa to beat PSU
PSU to beat Staee
MD to beat Staee
February 23rd, 2020 at 5:35 PM ^
Iowa PSU and MSU all play each other. That little round robin will knock knock them down. Wisconsin and Illinois have very easy remaining schedules. They are the least likely teams above Michigan to lose twice I think.
February 24th, 2020 at 7:45 AM ^
Do they have to lose twice? Who wins the tie-breakers with UM?
February 24th, 2020 at 10:30 PM ^
They are 1 game ahead of UM now. So I was thinking they need to lose twice for Michigan to pass them by a game. Illinois definitely has a tie breaker cause of a season sweep. I would think Michigan gets the tiebreaker over Wisconsin assuming a win.
February 23rd, 2020 at 3:45 PM ^
Ten (10!) teams within two losses of each other! Impressive. They deserve some kind of group title. Maybe call them a Big Ten!
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:10 PM ^
Think it is 9 - but with Maryland up at the top, certainly is a Big 10 - what a tough conference!
And who would have thought Purdue would be at 11, on the outside looking in - and up at Rutgers.
Crazy ass season that still has a ways to go!
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:05 PM ^
Imagine where we’d be if Livers was never injured... we might be in first place...
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:25 PM ^
And without stupid losses to OSU and Illinois.
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:12 PM ^
Michigan certainly looks the part after not looking the part after looking the part. They have everything in front of them, this is going to be an exciting end to Howard’s first regular season and his first B1G tourney! Looking forward to it.
Oh ya, F Staee.
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:29 PM ^
For the past week I keep looking at the BIG standings and wondering how/why OSU ranked and yet so many teams ahead of them in the BIG are not. Am I missing something?
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:34 PM ^
I would imagine non-conference considerations
Wisconsin was dreadful in non-con schedule, Indiana didn't play a single game out of the state of Indiana or even a road game in Indiana in the entire non-conference, Purdue had a few bad losses. Meanwhile OSU beat Villanova by a ton and won at UNC (not a good team, but still a road win in non-conference)
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:42 PM ^
OSU also beat Kentucky on a neutral court.
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:53 PM ^
That's right. I even forgot about that one
February 23rd, 2020 at 6:29 PM ^
Didn’t they pound nova too on the road ?
February 23rd, 2020 at 8:13 PM ^
That was us last year, they played Nova at home this year and unc on the road this year
February 24th, 2020 at 9:44 AM ^
Non-con wins over Villanova, Kentucky and UNC definitely are still carrying some weight (UNC sucks but its still a big brand name and beating them always carries weight, like beating Michigan in football).
You're right in that once they hit Big Ten play, they became very much a middle of the pack team, but those non-con wins are definitely bolstering their ranking.
They're definitely climbing the rankings after beating Maryland last night.
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:50 PM ^
Buckeyes are gonna get fat on all that home cookin’ today.
February 23rd, 2020 at 4:51 PM ^
Saw a stat that M is 12-3 when livers finishes the game (assuming you’re not counting the home loss to Illinois where he “technically” finished). Those three: last second OT loss to Oregon, a loss @louisville after the trident, and @illinois.
February 24th, 2020 at 1:22 AM ^
We should've beaten Oregon. I'm still annoyed about that.
The tip-in not falling for us was shades of what happened against Indiana in 2013 in Crisler.