Signgate update from Hole
https://youtu.be/hn5hGU_SfFk?si=fdugMw8QZAGc0xAJ
Not much new information. Mostly reaction. Big Ten ADs getting their very delicate lace panties in a wad and pushing the BigTen to act was unexpected. The weird pedo lower level staffer non-story (reported by former OSU's best, moral compass and authority on all that is holy, Zack Smith, the coach who pushed his pregnant wife down the stairs and sent her death threats) was one of the two remaining bad news items to drop. The alliance of never sanctimonious and holier than you schools who have never stolen signs are very peeved that the sanctity of their moral code has been violated. Very peeved! They're worried about the children. Hole is fired up (which means his voice almost noticeably raised) because he knows "the truth that will set Michigan free". He expects Petitty to learn this truth from Santa tomorrow which will force him to take a step back and reconsider. This will cause the wad girth of the aforementioned panties to increase in size substantially. Hole mentioned again that the goal of this orchestrated hit job is to prevent Harbaugh from ever coaching on the Mich sidelines again. He said that if he coaches Saturday that it's more likely that he's allowed to coach of the rest of the season. He remains cryptic about his source and what this "truth" is that will set us free.
DISCUSS.
November 3rd, 2023 at 7:55 AM ^
My German Shepherd, who hangs out at a dog park with a canine friend of Victor the frisbee dog, shared some concerning news. Victor was lamenting how, for a mere handful of treats, he agreed to have CS put a listening device on his collar for in-game reconnaissance. Notice how Michigan's success corresponds with Victor's arrival? I guess this is why he is in the Wyld Stallyns image.
November 3rd, 2023 at 7:11 AM ^
Weren’t we just talking about pushing a contract extension through two days ago? And now we’re talking about “IF” Harbaugh even coaches on the sidelines on Saturday?
This story is freaking all over the place, kind of feels like a situation where JUB says “no one knows anything.”
November 3rd, 2023 at 7:26 AM ^
My bigger question is when does sportsmanship cover not conducting 3rd party investigations of your rivals?
I believe 2 things should happen:
1. if UM has proof that Stallions was on the sideline at CMU, fire him and suspend JH a game for lack of oversight. Pay a fine.
2. if there is proof that Day hired a PI firm and went around the Big Ten and NCAA (instead of reporting it to them and using normal channels) he should also be punished by Pettiti as this is also not in the spirit of sportsmanship.
both coaches suspended and fined, case closed no questions asked and everyone else can wait for the NCAA to come out with their read
November 3rd, 2023 at 8:58 AM ^
This is what is crazy to me:
If #1 is true, then the NCAA can just put comms in a few helmets for every team, which is a bonus for everyone. UM gets a slap, everyone moves on.
If #2 is true, this opens a huge can of worms for every team to do this to their rivalry across all college football. And yet no one is questioning it.
Yet here we are, everyone acting like UM are pumping steroids into the kids and/or playing ineligible players or something.
Im hoping they have proof of #2 even if #1 is true, the collateral damage will be huge.
November 3rd, 2023 at 9:27 AM ^
Does McElwain get suspended as well!? For lack of oversight! How can one coach be responsible for this rogue agent but the other is off the hook? If Jim should know everything Stalions is doing at all times shouldn't McElwain know if there is an imposter coach on his own sideline?
It is so clear Stalions is a man with no football background who wanted to make himself appealing to the program he adores so as to secure employment. He found a loophole and exploited it to make himself look like he knew things others did/could not. It is also clear, after kicking Staee's teeth in, that this sign stealing shit is a fucking joke and not something that has any tangible impact on a game.
November 3rd, 2023 at 9:33 AM ^
I agree and while the one game suspension is not based on precedent it sends a strong message about not breaking the rule
re: McElwain if he’s a pure victim no forget it. If he knew, he should get punished
November 3rd, 2023 at 7:28 AM ^
The irrelevant story about the guy who was fired a long time ago was one of the two bad things Hole knew was coming?
1) Who even cares.
2) He knew Zach Smith had this and was sitting on it? That's the part that's more intriguing to me.
November 3rd, 2023 at 7:52 AM ^
This is why OSU is at the begging stage. They shot all of their ammo last week, but it was just the same story repackaged four different times.
If OSU went full psycho girlfriend after just two losses to Michigan, what would they have done had they had 10 years of futility against us?
November 3rd, 2023 at 12:46 PM ^
They would have known it was out there to be found on Instagram; that Zach Smith would be the mouthpiece was probably a surprise. Although I suppose that's who's most likely to be diving that particular dumpster...
November 3rd, 2023 at 7:48 AM ^
I have 2 tickets @ PSU for next weekend. Purchased through our AD so they are in the Michigan section. NGU Row 86. $350 for the pair. Leave your email and I will reply in order of response.
November 3rd, 2023 at 11:40 AM ^
Petitti's last name actually means "small boob". Just thought I would share that to calm everyone down...
November 3rd, 2023 at 1:15 PM ^
His name would have to be spelled Pe-TITTY, no?
November 3rd, 2023 at 7:55 AM ^
What is this truth. Can we pay 1m, suspend harbs for Purdue, sign him to a 100m contact and move the fuck on?
November 3rd, 2023 at 8:44 AM ^
Pay for cheeseburgers, steal signs & win..... get over it!
November 3rd, 2023 at 8:45 AM ^
I'm wondering, at what point does michigan start their PR campaign? I know most people are dying for it but there are some things to consider:
- Michigan was caught totally flat footed while the "other side" had a coordinated PR campaign that was precise, thoughtful, and very effective. Basically had an indefinite amount of time to get their ducks in a row.
- Michigan needs to be careful before you start leaking things or spouting off...need to make sure you are confident in what happened/is happening.
- It needs to be impactful and also follow the rules. You can't speak about an ongoing investigation, but make no mistake you can get the message out there. You want to get out accurate things that are impactful though or it will look like UM is just making up stuff or they are leaking "soft" items that don't compete with the big stories.
So what can they do:
- They started with the leak about moving forward with Harbaugh contract...they need to get that done. That is a HUGE statement. It would be great to get that done in the next week or so. It sounds like they already had a framework so hopefully it goes fast-ish.
- Ono has been showing support, which is huge. His meeting with BIG today is important. The story will get out about how this meeting goes. Be a partner, but be steadfast and firm. If we are to believe there "is nothing there, there" outside of minor infractions then the meeting should end today shutting the door on any major punishment from BIG. That will be huge PR one way or another.
- Keep leaking to insiders bigger pieces of information. It does help fight the machine when positive news is leaked. This is how you do it. Anyone notice how coordinated and aligned the leaks to Sam, Hole, and Balas have been...Continue that...
- Harbaugh on the sidelines tomorrow is big. From Balas to Hole to others it seemed to be the thought that after everyone has two weeks to regroup on they bye that if you see Harbaugh on the sidelines tomorrow then "it's on". I expect him to be on the sidelines.
Just as an fyi on the radio here in columbus most are NOT expecting him coaching tomorrow and that he will be fired soon.
November 3rd, 2023 at 8:52 AM ^
They have to be very well coordinated with how they handle this, they can't fuck it up, they have one shot.
November 3rd, 2023 at 8:58 AM ^
I do agree and while everyone wants more, I think they really need to be measured as to not violate NCAA rules but also having all their crap together and confident in how this will go. Signing Harbaugh and strong statements of confidence in him as well as a productive meeting with BIG today, and Harbaugh kicking ass tomorrow night should kick things off.
November 3rd, 2023 at 11:49 AM ^
Can someone clarify the actual NCAA rules about what Michigan and other schools can and can’t say? I’m confused, having watched a lot of coaches say a lot of things (and even Jim Harbaugh had a statement at the start).
November 3rd, 2023 at 9:06 AM ^
"the truth that will set Michigan free"
So, I do think this thing is slightly overblown by the fact that most teams have guys who are around to steal signs and it's not illegal. This whole thing is basically "you can kill your neighbor, but if you do it on a Friday with a knife, that's a no-no."
That all being said, what "truth" will take away from the pretty known fact that CS did most of what he has been accused of? Any "truth" won't remove him sending people to steal signs. Whether that is a violation or not is another question, but that fact is pretty apparent and short of something coming to light that shows he didn't actually do those things... I don't see what late breaking news will change things.
November 3rd, 2023 at 9:22 AM ^
It's great that all these coaches know about the sign stealing now and can prove how much they would have trounced Michigan if not for this.
So far, Michigan 49 Opponents 0
Looking forward to game two.
November 3rd, 2023 at 9:50 AM ^
I try and not read every story/opinion on this, but I can tell you one thing, I'm really sick of "I have sources guy". Everyone seems to have "a source". Its a super secret reliable source and no I can't tell you everything they tell me or who it is, but I'm meeting with them again next week and if you tune in to my "insert link to podcast, news letter, website, etc.", you will find out the "truth"!!!!!
I always take a step and look from a thousand foot view. Does random writer/podcast guy really have a source that close to the team? Would a "source" that is close enough to have legit info really risk the investigation by sharing vital news to random podcast guy? If said source told random podcast guy, is there any chance he didn't tell someone else, who would then tell someone else, then it gets leaked?
This is all just stupid.
November 3rd, 2023 at 11:10 AM ^
Thank you for saying this. Hole is the ultimate "I have a source" asshat. Okay, Mr. Hole, what does that "source" say? And by "say," I mean beyond vague "trust me" quotes? Who is that source? If you can't publish any meaningful facts via your "source," you don't have a good or even real source.
November 3rd, 2023 at 12:31 PM ^
I'm not specifically referring to Hole, (he apparently is "legit"). It just a general statement on the whole "sources" thing. Any legit source is leaking something on purpose to drive the narrative or is probably full of shit and not a source.
November 3rd, 2023 at 10:08 AM ^
I have "sources" too. They talk to me through my fillings. And the truth will set us free...
Ono hands Petitty a photograph.
"What's this? It looks like a dumpster."
"It's in back of Schembechler Hall."
"Why are you showing me a picture of a dumpster? And what's that sticking out of the top? Looks like a man's legs."
Ono hands Petitty a second photograph.
"This was taken a few seconds later. Recognize him?"
"OMG, that's..."
"No, it's his little brother."
November 3rd, 2023 at 10:19 AM ^
I just thought about something that I'm not sure has really been discussed here (hasn't had to since its a hypothetical) but it just occurred to me and I'm glad its not a reality Michigan has to entertain?
How much less confident would we all be about Michigan's chances, or Harbaugh's level of support, if Schlissel was still UM's President right now?
I don't know for sure, but something tells me he'd be wanting to stay as completely disassociated from this as possible and would've told Warde "This is your department's mess, and its not my problem. You clean it up."
November 3rd, 2023 at 10:59 AM ^
"Hole update" and "not much new information": Kind of redundant at this point.
November 3rd, 2023 at 11:17 AM ^
For those who say I’m doing whatever for clicks yada yada yada, I would rather not do the podcast than mislead (note how sporadic I tend to post).
Sorry I can’t say everything. It’ll all come out soon enough. If you’ve followed the last two weeks, then you’ll see that everything I’ve insinuated has come to pass.
As far as the weeks, months, years part, what I’m saying is when it’s over, we’ll be able to fully break it all down. But in no way can that happen now (for quite obvious reasons considering there’s an actual NCAA investigation happening).
November 3rd, 2023 at 12:28 PM ^
Oh wow...is this IH himself? I've always found you to be dead nuts on and I think some people are just listening to the podcasts too fast. You are giving nuggets of information, and again, I've always found you about the most reliable (even more than Sam...no offense to him...most of the time).
Oh hey...side note...anyone ever tell you that you look just like Ryan Day?
November 3rd, 2023 at 1:34 PM ^
You don't have to reveal sources, but you can do the "here's what my gut says" kind of thing, ala Sam.
We really care about just these two things:
1) Are we going to have to vacate wins and championships?
2) Is Harbaugh going to be severely punished to the extent it does damage to the program . . . he quits, show clause, the program is under a multi-year cloud that kills recruiting, etc.
What do you personally feel about these based on what you know without revealing sources?
Are we screwed on these or is it OK?
November 3rd, 2023 at 3:52 PM ^
I don’t know what’s going to happen, just what has happened. I feel confident in the “lone wolf” of it all but with the NCAA, that doesn’t necessarily matter.
Been teasing all week the bombshell Balas put out (the WaPo article shed a lot of light reading between the lines) but I didn’t know names and such as I know Balas does at this point.
As far as any punishment or lack thereof, your guess is as good as mine. The NCAA and Big Ten aren’t legal entities and very well could try.
November 3rd, 2023 at 11:29 AM ^
I don't really understand why Michigan wouldn't leak the super great exculpatory evidence that would basically end this. Feels like whatever it is is being overstated by Hole or whoever is giving him information.
Also Michigan was once the leader of holier than thou schools. One bright side of this would be if this somehow made our fanbase less a piece of shit about complaining about people cheating in college football.
November 3rd, 2023 at 11:37 AM ^
Who said they’re not?
November 3rd, 2023 at 11:43 AM ^
Because if they were leaking it, it either isn't working and/or you would be able to talk about it. So either there isn't any great exculpatory evidence or they haven't leaked it yet which is just stupid and also implies there isn't some great exculpatory evidence.
I don't know who you are, if you are actually Hole like you are claiming to be. But guys like Hole are useless. Its that simple. Either they leak this great evidence or they don't. A guy saying they have it but also I can't tell you about it is about as useful to me as the tooth fairy.
November 3rd, 2023 at 12:01 PM ^
Michigan is going to have a full handle on the situation before it can leak it to someone on a national level. Also, that’s not how sourcing works—we can’t just tell you everything in advance. If we just told you everything we know or think we know from sources, it a. burns the source, b. potentially impedes the moving parts in the investigation and thus could damage the investigation, c. some sources are not authorized to speak publicly about things but have a full handle on what’s going on; there are parts of this I’ve been asked to withhold for one reason or another. I’m not the only one in that boat, by a long shot.
What’s more important? That you know now or that Michigan finds its way out of this? It will play out and then once it does, all of us who have been sharing nuggets of what we know will be able to tell you what we knew in full and, hopefully, it will be on the better end of things.
That said, I tell people what I can when I can. And when I can’t, I try to still lead people to conclusions analogous to what I can’t say.
November 3rd, 2023 at 12:13 PM ^
If they don't have a full handle on it then they don't have great exculpatory evidence yet. They have what they hope will turn out to be great exculpatory evidence but need to first check it and make sure. Which is fine, but also different than saying they have it and goes back to it likely being signficiantly overstated.
To your last paragraph the question isn't what is important for the school to do. Its the value of your reporting on it. What value is there to telling people you know something that they can't know? How does that help the average fan in navigating this situation? On top of that you are telling them you know something they can't know and the reason they can't know it and university isn't using it yet is because they don't actually feel confident enough yet in the information to use it or they don't feel confident they know the full scope of what actually went on yet. Either way it means it may ultimately not prove to be what you are claiming it is.
I get it, your business is dependent on people turning to you and just saying I have nothing I can report on isn't good business. But that being bad business for you doesn't mean it shouldn't get called out that saying I know something you can't know but is good is just clickbait to drive business from Michigan fans. Its not helpful information in any way. You have no idea how the evidence will play and whether it will persuade the Big Ten or NCAA to not suspend or give a show cause to Harbaugh. Its still just all speculation.
November 3rd, 2023 at 12:25 PM ^
I ain’t reading all that.
I’ve obviously had things to report. They’ve been reported. You’re entitled to your opinion and I wish you the best.
November 3rd, 2023 at 12:33 PM ^
Isaiah, thanks for the insight and for the work you do.
I'd ignore ak. You really only see him on Mgoblog trying to play devil's advocate - they are a contrarian at heart. When their point is proven wrong you won't see them until the next big thing that happens negatively towards the program.
Keep fighting the good fight.
November 3rd, 2023 at 11:35 AM ^
I feel like I have to say this every time: Isaiah is legit, and part of our circle of friends in the Michigan media. If he says he's heard something, he has. If he's saying take him on his word that it's exculpatory, he has good reason to believe it is.
November 3rd, 2023 at 12:01 PM ^
Maybe it's exculpatory for a small degree of this, but I don't see how the "truth" will do anything here. The crux of this whole issue is did CS do what people say he did? Answer is a pretty obvious yes. There's no "truth" that will say otherwise. It's not like Michigan has some evidence to show he didn't do those things.
Unless Hole is saying there's truth about Harbaugh and the staff writ large not knowing or something like that, in which case that's good for keeping the coaches out of the direct crosshairs, but it still doesn't push back on the CS stuff.
November 3rd, 2023 at 12:20 PM ^
Even if they can somehow prove beyond any doubt that no other coach knew about this Harbaugh can still get punished. Even if they can prove this is a hit job from OSU if the actions alleged occurred Harbaugh or the program can still get punished and maybe OSU will just get punished too. Unless they can prove Stallions didn't do anything wrong there is no exculpatory proof evidence.
And if the big reveal is that Michigan did in fact have a robust system for telling staffers to not cheat and had a culture of compliance, that a) won't move the needle at all on the story in the media and b) isn't something you'd have to 'leak'. It just doesn't add up
November 3rd, 2023 at 12:46 PM ^
What is wrong with some of you. You literally have Seth and another insider saying Michigan knows they're fine and that they have whatever evidence they need to essentially blunt the impact of this whole thing. Reading tea leaves, I would imagine Michigan has obviously talked to Connor, who owned up to the whole scheme and provided whatever proof he could that this was his plan and nobody else knew (because they'd tell him don't do it, it's a stupid plan). Thus, Michigan will fight any suspension for Harbaugh with this knowledge, which they can't leak because they are bound by rules and they don't want to rile up the NCAA into doing anything drastic.
FFS this is good news, chill out
November 3rd, 2023 at 2:24 PM ^
Reading tea leaves, I would imagine Michigan has obviously talked to Connor, who owned up to the whole scheme and provided whatever proof he could that this was his plan and nobody else knew (because they'd tell him don't do it, it's a stupid plan).
Right... but that's still the crux of the issue here. He did those things. It's pretty obvious he did and to date, no one has come out and flatly accused Harbaugh of knowing and condoning CS's actions. So the "truth" is that the staff didn't know... ok. That's fine, but they still had a guy on staff doing all of the things that he has been charged (not legally) with.
So that's good new regarding the coaching staff maybe not getting launched into the sun, but there isn't some truth out there that will make this any less of an embarrassment. Again the biggest gripe people have with this is CS's actions. Whether he was a lone wolf or not, it's that they had a guy on staff that orchestrated this massive thing and the team benefited (to some degree rivals will always overestimate) from it. No Michigan announcement will change that.
Edit: Also, just saw the report about Michigan looking into PIs from OSU that may have broke this story. Again, if that is the truth referenced, it still doesn't do anything about CS's actions. They can point to the snitch, they should, but the snitch still got the initial story correct. It doesn't invalidate all of this.
November 3rd, 2023 at 1:08 PM ^
Hold on there partner. The only thing we know is actually against the rules (not illegal, we're not talking crimes here like Zach Smith domestic abuse) is the CMU stuff and there's already a precedent for that punishment, the staffer gets a game suspension. That's it. Stallions has already served that and more.