Recruiting woes?
I am not a voracious consumer of recruiting news. But, to my great irritation, I'm seeing on my stupid twitter feed, day after day, thrilled pronouncements by tOSU, Notre Dame, PSU, other crap schools about pulling in all-world recruits.
I thought that would be us after making the freaking playoffs. What gives? It can't be all NIL; I understand Notre Dame is far more gun shy than we are, but they appear to be having more immediate success. Maybe we need to exercise patience, which none of us can do. And, to reiterate, we just made the playoffs. I thought that would precipitate a revolving door of elites.
In before delete...
I'll take the bait......Maybe it is because right after we beat OSU and then go to the Playoffs that our Coach is interviewed and says he just wants to keep the momentum going. Then he lets the entire country know he wants to be in the NFL and doesn't want to be at Michigan if he can get an NFL job. This is dragged out at nauseam over weeks with no idea what the head coach is going to do. Then Harbaugh says he is coming back to Michigan and still waits forever to sign his extension, all the while we lose our Offensive and Defensive Coordinators. Could be that.
Could also be lots of turnover in the recruiting staff.
How many times a year will we have to suffer these posts? Remember when people were panicking because Rutgers had a better class than us?
Those weren't real people!
Fence The Garden!!
"Maybe we need to exercise patience, which none of us can do."
We're Michigan fans. The so-called patience of Job is a requirement around Ann Arbor, unless something is going down at a City Council meeting, in which case it better happen soon depending on what it is and who you ask.
The so-called patience of Job is a requirement around Ann Arbor ...
So that would make it a Job requirement?
I'll show myself out ...
We'll always be a good football recruiting school, but we'll never be elite. Elite classes will happen, but never sustained runs like Bama, Texas, USC, LSU, etc have had. You just have to make peace with that.
Notre Dame is taking better to NIL that we are. No idea where you heard they were gun shy about it. The only one even attempting to follow rules right now is Michigan, to their detriment.
you're assuming that NIL has something to do with ND's class.
more like guessing.
FWIW, Sam Webb implied that ND was leaning in more on NIL during a recent round table broadcast. Perhaps that’s what the poster above was referring to.
You summed up most of America pretty well here, OP. “I don’t really have much information but I sure am getting angry about some shit I keep seeing on twitter and now I’m convinced there’s a problem where everybody is getting theirs but me. What the hell!?!?”
Our staff is VERY “new.” Either new in terms of being employed on this staff, or new in terms of which position they coach. Both of our main coordinators are also gone. There’s a lot of uncertainty about what the team will look like to recruits and a lot of new faces recruiting them. Building those relationships takes time.
“new” offensive coaches:
Grant Newsome now the TE coach
Ron Bellamy now the WR coach.
Gattis gone, Moore and Weiss now splitting OC duties, not “new” necessarily but I’m sure there’s some questions in recruits minds about the offense with new co-coordinators (Moore was co-OC already)
“new” defensive coaches
Nua gone, Elston in
JayBaugh moved to safeties
MacDonald to NFL, Minter as OC
Add in the turnover in the recruiting department as well with Courtney Morgan’s departure.
Thats 5 coaches that are coaching a new position or are new to the staff, not including new roles for the OCs. Turnover at both coordinator positions is a big reason for pause. It’s going to take some time to rebuild those relationships and get some momentum, but we’ll know more after the summer and once the season gets underway. Not worried yet, there’s still 7 months until early signing day.
This is probably one of the biggest parts of the equation, and I haven't seen it mentioned a lot (but I haven't been checking the board that often recently.)
Honestly though, it's clearly a combination of things:
- Coaching turnover is HUGE. Genius defensive coordinator leaves who also hated recruiting leave, the coach responsible for the killer DL leaves... Our OC, who was assistant coach of the year leaves, and kind of burns bridges on the way out.
- Harbaughs flirtation with the NFL didn't help, and probably contributed to the turnover at OC. The shine and glamor of michigan was instantly overshadowed by controversy
- NIL isn't being used like it is at other schools
- ND getting a super charismatic coach
- MSU getting a charismatic coach that has embarrassed michigan 2 years in a row
Get off twitter and the problem magically disappears.
Everyone knows making the playoffs guarantees you nothing but elite recruits until the end of time! Just ask MSU, Washington, Cincinnati, Oregon, Florida State, Notre Dame, pretty much everyone other than Georgia, OSU, and Bama.
Oregon, FSU and ND have gotten elite recruits. There is no way U-M should be put in the same category as MSU, Cinn. and Washington when it comes to recruiting. If MSU makes the playoffs, there still shouldn't be expectations of them getting elite recruits. If Michigan makes the playoffs, then the recruiting should be on par with Georgia, OSU, ND, Oregon and Alabama.
I understand we are in the era of NIL, but there isn't even major buzz with Michigan and recruiting. Hopefully the new changes by the NCAA towards NIL and boosters will prevent schools from using NIL as a recruiting tool and Michigan will make an impact in recruiting to the same level as the other big-boy programs. Having said that, I also still believe the energy and priority in recruiting is just not there with Harbaugh and staff in comparison to other programs.
it's OT season. i expect to see somewhere between 42 and 27 more posts exactly like this one until the season starts
I dived into the 247 Composite rankings and I'll just come right and say it - our recruiting is terrible and sucks. We have an average / player rating of 88.65 (for our 6 commits) which is good for teams like Iowa, Minnesota, Nebraska etc... But we're talking about tradition rich Michigan who's coming off a B1G championship, Playoff appearance and just kicked the shit out of the Suckeyes. We should be somewhere between the 91.00 to 93.00 rating per player.
2023 Recruit Football Team Rankings (247sports.com)
And the real kick in the nuts. For those of you saying it's early, take a look through the top Composite 150 uncommitted recruits and not one is favoring Michigan - NOT ONE. This is just unacceptable considering the year we had in 2022.
2023 Top Football Recruits (247sports.com)
And I think we all know the reason why - JH pursuing NFL jobs. You can bet the other coaches recruiting against us are using it to the max. It's absolutely killing recruiting
You’re looking at recruiting average of a 6 man class? Yikes.
Here, take away our kicker commit, he’s the #1 kicker in the country mind you, and tell us what our average is then?
You hit on the main point I was trying to make. Yes, we have only 6 commits which would not be a big deal if we were in on - and favorites for - several bigtime, uncommitted 2023 HS recruits.
But, I provided a 2nd link which lists all of the 2023 247 Composite HS top recruits and AGAIN, UM is not the favorite for any of the top 150 remaining recruits, How is that going to affect that average - even without your kicker - going forward ?
You’re basing your analysis on who the alleged favorites of recruits are 7 months before signing day. Just stop.
Rankings will change, guys we aren’t in on right now will pop up with interest later, guys we lead for now will fade into the distance.
There is ZERO reason to be worried about this right now and ZERO basis for your complaints.
Michigan has had an average recruit rank above 91 once since Harbaugh got here (the 2017 class). The last four cycles there have been 33 teams with an average recruit of 91+, and Clemson (2), OSU (4), Bama (4), Georgia (4), and Oklahoma (3) comprise 17 of those 33 times. We would love for Michigan to recruit at that level, but that seems a bit unrealistic to happen with any consistency until they make the playoffs a couple times and of course most importantly, get NIL moving.
Three things:
1. Harbaugh has/did? One foot out the door
2. UM appears way behind in any of this NIL crap. Disregard what stance you have, they have had no resounding answer to battling any of these other schools playing top dollar. Doesn’t look like they will either.
3. A current highly touted player has come out to say the NIL dead sucks ass.
idk man maybe it’s my negativity as living in shithole Columbus brings me down, the friends updating me of their new 5 star players,but it isn’t looking too good for us. Outside of next years team, I’m not sure where you can find a positive trend happening?
Wow, samiracle, I'm sure glad you made a contribution today. You thought really carefully and made sure to include some useful information. Not just a rant ...
Well, no.
Your little shitpost is in line with all your other posts, I see:
You will get negged by the Harbaugh slappies for pointing out facts about the "woes" of Michigan recruiting.
Nope. I'll bet most of the negs are (like mine) for the poor quality and general uselessness of the post. Michigan's recruiting issues are known to most everyone.
Of more interest to us all, Bill Freehan was the catcher for the Tigers in 1968 when the Tigers beat the Cardinals in one of the great 7-game series of all time. Bill Freehan was a Michigan graduate. We should all have plenty of good-feels for the aforementioned Bill Freehan.
This thought made me feel better than the OP. Feel free to negbang if I am wrong.
I also like Mickey Lolich, but I will pontificate on him elsewhere. I do not like Rusty Staub...
What gives? Our goofy head coach wanted to leave. That killed any and all momentum for this class. No chance we finish in the top 10 at this point. Top 15 might even be a stretch.
Oh no! The last time that happened, that pathetic class led us to the Big Ten title!
<<response redacted>>
This topic brings nothing new to the table and it should be deleted.
There's been an uptick recently actually with the spring evaluation period. Michigan is getting some good official visits scheduled for June. And traditionally, Michigan hits it out of the park on its visits. Even our haters will admit that one.
Watch out for some of the following guys:
- Michigan is ahead: 4* CB Jyaire Hill (Top 200 on 247), 4* CB Aaron Gates, 4* OL Amir Herring, 3* Deakon Tonielli (4* on On3), 5* EDGE Nyckoles Harbor, 3* EDGE Joseph Mupoyi (Top 200 on On3)
- Michigan is behind but has secured an OV: Top 50 WR Johntay Cook, Top 100 LB Jaiden Ausberry, Top 100 OL Cayden Green, 3* DL Kelze Howard (Top 200 on 247, On3), Top 100 ATH Jaxon Howard, 4* ATH Collins Acheampong, Top 100 DL John Walker
I think you can see how this perception can change quickly. I wouldn't be surprised to see all of those for whom we lead commit to Michigan in June (other than Harbor).
We have two stud qbs. That's the most important thing. And we crushed OSU despite your concern.
Bro. We will get our blue chips. I’d hate to live with your level of neuroticism.
Unfortunately we are still at the center of things, the University of Michigan. Tradition ridden and unwilling to change. Took over a decade to kind of get up to a normal college offense and we are still run based, still a power team.
We have a coach who was looking for any NFL team to take him but no one actually wanted him. He wanted to go so much he got an "interview" and thought he was going to be their next coach and told everyone he was gone.
By the time Michigan embraces any actual good NIL stuff, schools like MSU will probably be ahead of us. I'm amazed they haven't did better with it because it is their chance to get good fast
me likey birdie num nums
Goddamn. How many times am I going to have to say that recruiting doesn't get an immediate uptick from a good season? These are relationships that are built over the course of a kid's entire high school career. Seniors aren't going to be swayed by a single good season. But it'll catch the eye of a sophomore who will then get recruited by the coaches over a couple years.
It'll result in good classes 2-3 years down the road.
Apparently the second year staff at MSU and first year head coach at ND have not gotten this memo, then. MSU is killing it in recruiting with interest from high level talent compared to what they normally receive interest from. ND seems to be at a different level in recruiting than almost every other major program.
Yeah. Clutch your butts. This will be fun
So my initial thought was, why are we now recruiting "woes"?
Yeah, no worries, I'll show myself out ....
Yeah, if we don't watch out we'll end up with a class like 2018!
I mean P U...... #22,
The same class that had a highly touted Aiden?! Haskins was in that class as well and he proved himself, but most of the lower ranked guys from that class did not make much of an impact for Michigan in getting to the playoffs.
There is no doubt there will be a 3 star talent coming out of high school who will play elite football at the college level, but that is a small sample size compared to the elite play from 4 and 5 star players. It is a proven fact that schools filled with 3 star players and sleepers are not constant threats in making the playoffs, especially playing in a division like the B1G East.
Michigan recruits to have as many 4 star players as 3 star players, and this has helped them beat OSU one time in Harbaugh's seven years, but the 2023 recruiting class is looking scary in a bad way right now, and there are no signs to believe it will change anytime soon. I hope things change in momentum for Michigan and their recruiting.
Of that 2018 class you've got a number of guys who made significant contributions last year. Hutchinson, Haskins, Hayes, Gray, Barrett, Schoonmaker, and Moody. You've got Bell who's a star receiver. It had Mayfield who got drafted last year and may have been a 1st rounder this year if he stayed. Then you throw in Upshaw who was solid as a backup and looks to be a significant contributor next year.
Stop worrying about recruiting. I used to be a 5 star gazer but our best class by ranking (2017) largely flamed out and our worst class by ranking (2018) made big contributions to our best team since 2003. Harbaugh will get the guys he wants and will develop them regardless of ranking. Plus this is how most Harbaugh classes go. Slow start, uptick during the summer then some big and surprising pickups right around signing day.
I don't understand the disdain for the OP. This is just all true.
The facts:
- We had such an incredible season!
- We beat OSU
- We have one of the highest paid coaches in football
- We have one of the best brands in football
The result:
- A 5* QB in our back yard, a 5* QB grandson of a legendary UM coach, a 4* DL with a brother on the Basketball team all trending away from Michigan
- 5* WR with one of the most legendary Michigan players ever as a mentor is showing little interest
- We have the 18th ranked class in the country with our top commit likely not staying in the class
- A star on our basketball team is giving interviews speaking to how poor our NIL infrastructure is and how we are going to lose recruits because of it
It is utter trash. And frankly the unwillingness or disinterest of fans and supporters of our program to have an honest discussion about WHAT THE F*#% is also a part of the problem. How about some accountability?
LET THE NEGS RAIN!
Real facts:
#1: The "rankings bump the cycle after making the CFP" is a fallacy. If there is a bump it's 2 or 3 cycles later. In actuality, landing Derrick Morris, Keon Sabb and Darrius Clemons was the huge bump that will pay immediate dividends.
#2: Just because a team UofM recruits against raises their recruiting profile doesn't mean there is a problem with UofM's.
#3: So you just witnessed one of the best years in Michigan football, led by an All American #2 pick (who was projected a day three pick by "rankings"), a 2nd team B1G running back (rank #975, pick #131) and a QB everyone wanted replaced with the 5*, a team who overcame a 130+ point "composite rank" deficit against the #5 highest "ranked" composite team of all time, only to lose to the #2 "ranked" composite team of all time because they got out played by a 3* DT, the #434 "ranked" player and a #1800 "ranked" QB; and your brilliant conclusion is we need better "rank"?
"Rank" is a fucking joke and anyone who believes it is a sucka.
We have more than enough talent on this team to win it all, and all the future recruits who actually choose to play here will be more than talented enough to do the same, regardless of "rank".
People said the recruiting bump will come in the 2023 class and not the 2022 class, and now it's 2-3 classes down the line? What if Michigan goes 6-6 this year and/or next year not counting a bowl game? The interest from high talent recruits will immediately disappear.
I have my own opinions on what the problems are, but they are just opinions. However; much of what I have read has stated that Michigan coaches need to work harder to make up ground for their top targets. I get the staff is out stopping in many states to visit recruits while Harbaugh is at the Master's and a MLB game, but coaches like Freeman at ND, Day at OSU, Saban at Alabama, Tucker at MSU etc...are all recruiting with their staff. Harbaugh's days of climbing trees with recruits are long gone.
Could people just be seeing what they want to see? I don't follow every other program but I imagine other coaches do things like go to ball games and the masters. People have negative feelings about the program and/or state of recruiting and want to assume out staff is half assing it.
We had a great season but we lost our OC, DC, and recruiting director and that set us back. However, it is extremely early and I feel like our staff always pulls through.
Some of our big pulls were playoff hype last year but others were just relentless recruiting and scouting. Mason Graham and Jimmy Rolder come to mind.
I think the team will do well again this coming season which means we will get flips and this staff will unearth gems. There is no point panicking this early in the cycle even if we all wished things were going a little better.
Recruiting sucks. Folks denying it are fooling themselves. Not saying to panic … but the recruiting has disappointed after a stellar season. The first season we underperform the fingers ‘may’ point back to this recruiting cycle.
Pretty sure, Maizen said this exact same thing after the 2018 recruiting class, he specifically was upset with talking Hassan Haskins so early.