OT: The Last Jedi (SPOILER Edition)
Spoiler WARNING. For anyone who wants to discuss TLJ feel free to include any spolier info you want. Here are my thoughts.
Best Parts:
- throne room fight
- Poe tooling with Hux
- Luke with Leia toward the end
- R2 convincing Luke to come back
- Yoda
- Holdo with the Hyperspace kamikazi move - beaurty of a sceen
- Rey vs Luke in the rain
- the flashbacks
- DJ the slicer
Parts that I thought weren't so good:
- Super Leia (could have killed her 2-3 ways that would have been fine)
- Maz from star tours (can't have her on the ship with the resistance? Have her point Finn et al to Lando maybe?)
- BB-8 piloting an AT-ST
- Luke milking that thing - I guess it really sets up his character status but that was just weird
- some of the canto bight stuff went long so it didn't bother me really
I thought it was some amazing screenplay and story telling- every main character had a legit moment of "are they doing the right thing"? Even the secondary characters like Adml Holdo- you didn't know where she was going. Lots of questions answered. Lots of ways to go in the next one. Overall, this was the movie to move the SW story forward and not keep looking backward. Who knows what EpIX will be.
December 17th, 2017 at 12:36 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 11:23 AM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 11:37 AM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 11:38 AM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 12:00 PM ^
"This director showed zero respect for that adding in characters like Rose to score Social justice points that just wasted screen time, didn’t use Phinn at all . . . ."
And ironically, the same criticism that you voiced about Rose was leveled at the character of Finn when episode VII was released. (Though, yes, it's more prominent with the character of Rose.)
December 17th, 2017 at 2:35 PM ^
December 18th, 2017 at 4:05 AM ^
December 18th, 2017 at 8:28 AM ^
I let it go since it was short lived and maybe was a quick way to get us excited about the destruction of the casino/freeing of animals and then the Jedi being "born" at the end.
But yeah, totally political/humanizing an otherwise great escapism franchise.
December 18th, 2017 at 10:39 AM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 2:40 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 12:08 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 5:57 PM ^
So if the Rose character was a white man or woman it would have improved the movie how?
December 17th, 2017 at 11:51 AM ^
I'm sorry I can't pretend to like this film. It was more than disappointing. It sucked.
No character development, so when characters get offed as easily as they do in this film you are repeatedly sitting there wondering:
"Is this the part where I care?"
Disney is just not good at storytelling anymore. Especially not science fiction.
Let's take some inventory of just what the hell Disney thinks its doing:
- Lor San Tekka - Dead (who is he? Is he important? He knows the Jedi? Aww fuck he's dead already)
- Han Solo - Dead (Star Wars' only remaining alpha male)
- Admiral Ackbar - Dead (really not your year, Ole Miss)
- Leia - should be dead from vacuum of space, but impossibly isn't
- Snoke - Dead - and it was so easy, you're like "screw you Rian Johnson".
- Captain Phasma - Dead - also so easy, at this point yeah, epic double birds to Kathleen Kennedy
- Admiral Holdo - Dead - her overt feminist triumphalism had me cheering and clapping when she died. Thanks Disney?
- Luke Skywalker - Dead - main character, the seed of the chosen one - offed from the stupidest cause ever - Force Meditiation?
- Rose Tico - I'm kind of hoping she's dead. Her SJW character acting and voice was cartoonish and unbearable.
So what are we left with?
- Chewbacca
- the droid trio
- Emphysema Leia
- Finn (action figure now comes with weird love triangle that everyone knows is going to end badly)
- Rey (the official Mary Sue of Disney SW who became a Jedi in what, 72 hours? Eff you Disney!)
- Kylo Ren (the perfect whiny brooding Millenial who had a cad for a Dad and a career woman mother. Predictable results ensued.)
- Poe Dameron - I guess he's cocky and funny. Needs a lot more testosterone though.
The special effects and space battles where very good.
But it was effectively cancelled out by lame comedy relief that just didn't fit.
December 17th, 2017 at 11:54 AM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 12:12 PM ^
Wow dude, do you always make everything about your small little penis?
December 17th, 2017 at 12:15 PM ^
December 18th, 2017 at 7:36 AM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 2:40 PM ^
December 18th, 2017 at 10:48 AM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 3:00 PM ^
its like people fucking forget luke had a couple of days of force training before using it to destroy the death star.
December 17th, 2017 at 3:03 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 4:52 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 11:58 AM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 12:19 PM ^
I think that the Han Solo movie may end up being terrible. Disney fired the original directors, the guys that did the Lego Movie, and hired Ron Howard to replace them. The original directors probably made the tone of the movie like what they did with Thor: Ragnarok. I would have been good with that since Han is supposed to be this rogue-ish snarky type of character.
December 17th, 2017 at 1:52 PM ^
It could very well be awful, but at least we expect that this time. Unlike this movie, with it's inaccurate critic reviews. I don't care if you like this movie, there is no way it is above 90%.
December 17th, 2017 at 1:06 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 1:50 PM ^
I did too, but the fact that everyone can use it in it's "superpower" sense WITH NO TRAINING is what bothers me.
December 17th, 2017 at 2:36 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 8:07 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 8:40 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 11:09 PM ^
December 18th, 2017 at 12:22 PM ^
My point is not that they shouldn't have ABILITIES. I actually loved Rian Johnson's approach with anyone being able to use the force, with heritage having not as much to do with it as seemingly emphasized before. Also, yes, I believe Leia should be decently strong in the force considering she is a Skywalker.
However, I hate the sudden and confusing lack of TRAINING behind these characters. Like others said, it's like their suddenly super good at everything. Almost no arch of character development. Just use the force out of nowhere. That is what bothers me.
December 17th, 2017 at 3:14 PM ^
You say Lule could have died another way, so how? Dont criticize and not present how you wanted to see it happen.
The lazy plot writing managed to plant the seed early in the movie that it was possible to use the force to meditate somewhere but that it would probably kill you.
I think Luke showed his mastery of the force in the final scene and then had finally found peace with the force thru both Rey (future) and Yoda(past).
Bottom iine is Luke wasnt going to be the hero of this story. I feel that is the root of the anger toward these new movies. People wanted a continuation of the skywalker storyline but instead are getting these new characters and having their heroes "destroyed".
The force is never going away whether the Jedi exist or not. Whether good or evil are in power. With or without Skywalkers.
December 17th, 2017 at 12:02 PM ^
I went into the movie with the mindset that as long as I was entertained, I was happy. And I was fully entertained. I also really enjoyed the big questions the movie posed to its audience: are the light and dark side really so different from one another? Would the galaxy be better off without the Jedi and Sith/Dark Jedi in it? It wasn’t just mindless nonsense like the prequels were.
Overall I really liked it, and can’t wait for the next one.
December 17th, 2017 at 12:06 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 12:31 PM ^
I'm a casual Star Wars fan and I left the movie a bit disappointed. It all seemed a bit forced, especially the parts with Luke, no pun intended. I’m not sure if Mark Hamill’s heart just wasn’t in it, or if it was bad writing or what, but something was definitely off IMHO. It seemed like the story was burdened by having to pay homage to the original trilogy over and over, i.e. the cringe worthy CGI Yoda scene. Hopefully now that Luke and Han are gone the series can move on. I thought Rouge One was an excellent example of the sort of story telling that can be created from the Star Wars universe without getting bogged down by past events, story lines, and characters.
December 17th, 2017 at 1:03 PM ^
I hoped to have more answers than new questions, but I felt the movie was good. The success is in the little details. A few forced humor parts weren’t needed, but didn’t ruin it. They just weren’t as well executed as some of them with Han and Luke or Chewie and Han from the originals.
December 17th, 2017 at 1:11 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 1:18 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 1:22 PM ^
My wife was wondering why Kylo Ren's body is so wide. She shared the same sentiment as Rey asking to cover up with a towel or something. Overall we both loved it, every throne room scene was awesome.
December 17th, 2017 at 2:03 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 3:18 PM ^
stop looking at it that way.
The original heroes had their moment and were successful. They stopped the emeperor and saved the galaxy. I am not sure how their legacy's were destroyed.
December 17th, 2017 at 2:08 PM ^
I liked the movie overall but it was too long.
I liked the "ticking clock" they set up with the cruiser slowly running out of fuel trying to escape the star destroyers and liked the mutiny that happened.
I liked the lesson Poe learned about not going on crazy missions which will result in a bunch of death.
I loved Luke almost killing Kylo Ren in his sleep and the dual perspectives of the two on the event.
I loved the Kylo Ren and Rey force connection conversations.
I loved when Snoke was on screen in all the throne room scenes but absolutely hated how we never found out who the hell he is and where he came from. (Friend brought up the insane theory that maybe he's so powerful with the dark side he can reform himself which is why his head was partially split open and jaw all messed up.. so he's still alive)
I hated the casino side mission that ended in failure and betrayal anyways.
I hated Luke dying through....overuse of the force or something?? Choosing to?
I loved seeing and hearing original puppet Yoda, but very much disliked the idea that in death he could make lightning strike down from the sky.
I hated BB-8 saving the day with the AT-ST. Same problem I had with Rogue One. If droids are such great assets in fighting why not use them instead of people.
I thought Carrie Fisher was a much better actor in this one than Force Awakens though I hated Leia's force flying through space to save her own life.
I didn't hate all the comedy but I hated when the comedy happened during either serious moments or badass moments.
I was disappointed for the first time in a main Star Wars movie no real lightsaber duel unless you count Luke vs Rey with sticks or Luke and Kylo's lightsabers touching in the flashback.
December 17th, 2017 at 2:25 PM ^
- I thought much of the writing was sharper (in terms of banter) than it's been in the past few, including the humor, which got plenty of laughs.
- Mark Hamill stole the show in many ways (minus the cringeworthy Matrix moment near the end)-- wise decision to have the one guy in the entire franchise who drinks the Jedi Kool-Aid right from the start begin to question the entire enterprise.
- Liked the "Rashomon" treatment of Luke vs. Kylo told separately from different perspectives
- I missed most plot developments when Daisy Ridley is on screen, because I'm too smitten with her to pay attention. I'll have to re-watch.
- So, so glad they did not have Rey end up being so-and-so's child/sibling/daughter-in-law whatever. She's nobody, from nowhere. Good. Finally.
- Like many others, could have done without "Super Leia"-- oy, that was rough. And they didn't really sell a rationale for stopping Finn from his kamikaze run into the battering ram. But those were relatively trivial... it was good, fun, popcorn-munching Hollywood moviemaking.
- I'd slot this one into the rankings this way:
1. Empire
2. Star Wars (no, I'm not calling it ANH, get the f out of here)
(significant gap)
3. Rogue One
4. Return of the Jedi
(gap)
5. Force Awakens
6. Last Jedi
(gigantic, unbridgeable gulf)
7-9. all that other crap that shall remain nameless
December 17th, 2017 at 2:58 PM ^
December 17th, 2017 at 4:09 PM ^
- So, so glad they did not have Rey end up being so-and-so's child/sibling/daughter-in-law whatever. She's nobody, from nowhere. Good. Finally.
I generally agree, but I still have questions about her back story. Rey and Kylo Ren still have some connection from before TFA that still needs to be explained, right? Because he was immediately concerned about a girl from Jakku in TFA, and he would have no reason to know her parents if they just met in TFA. Did I miss how they explain that? Was she one of Luke's student at the Jedi temple that he destroyed? Why would he have let her live if that was the case? But wouldn't Luke have recognized her if she was his student?
December 17th, 2017 at 4:20 PM ^
he was concerned because she took off in the falcon with the droid that has luke's location.
I do wonder if he lied to her and there is some greater connection because of the way they communicated. It could simply be because they both have high force sensitivity and both battle whether to use the light or dark side. They share that and it brings them together.
December 17th, 2017 at 5:21 PM ^
Is Rey really a nobody from nowhere or was that Ren trying to convince her of that. I really think there are a bunch of red herrings in this movie that have everyone thinking that "This is the answer to question X". When in reality the answers will come in the next movie. Besided even Lucas said that the Skywalker storyline was originally 9 movies. We have had 8 so far.
December 17th, 2017 at 2:19 PM ^
Would of been better if Rey went to the Darkside and Luke became relevant again. Or Luke transfers over to the Darkside.
To much joking around and not enough substance. I felt very unfulfilled when I left the theatre.
As a older guy on the board here it seems like once they transitioned away from the meat and potatoes of the story and went to all these sub plots they have kinda ruined it. I do think Luke is NOT dead yet. Seeing as Carrie Fisher passed away they have to bring him back in some capacity.
December 18th, 2017 at 12:48 AM ^
I could write a dissertation (quick summary: I thought the latest movie was just OK), but one thing that confused me is how good every somewhat-main rebel/resistance character is at everything.
Take for example Finn and Rose -- wasn't one a janitor stormtrooper and the other a mechanic? Yet Finn is a) a skilled pilot, b) a great hand-to-hand combat guy (defeated Captain Phasma with no real problem and c) good with a gun. Rose is introduced as a kind of nerdy, back-of-the-ship run of the mill worker, yet she also is mean with a blaster *and* is a great pilot (good enough to knock Finn of course, when Finn tries to blow up the battering ram)."
Rey, is of course, the chosen one -- no training needed for her. She can lift dozens of boulders, fight with the best of them with lightsabers, act as deadeye gunner, etc.
And BB8 is not just an excellent mechanic/fixer of broken things, but it can steal a starship and operate a AT-ST to crush all before him.
Just seems like there is no need for growth -- everyone is just a super-duper James Bond level space warrior.