Nothing Burger
Here it is. A low level staffer — not even on the coaching staff — breaks down video of opposing teams. Gasp.
‘The article does make clear that doing so is not illegal, yet it spends several paragraphs addressing Harbaugh’s potential punishment and concludes — for some reason — that this is worse that the Astros and Patriots.
The issue is this: did this staffer go to games of opponents and tape them. The NCAA has nothing and they know it. (That’s why they are asking for his computer).
https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/38700739/michigan-staf…
October 20th, 2023 at 8:25 AM ^
Sounds like a young Harbaugh, being an unpaid, unofficial referuited for Western KY in the 1990s while he was still playing an NFL schedule as a starting QB
October 20th, 2023 at 2:03 AM ^
Sad that the our own conference and NCAA are discrediting this team for being a great team with excellent coaches. Some ex Marine who is breaking down game film, traveling to Ann Arbor on a miniscule budget, and this is the reason our team is so great. Pathetic. Our AD should just tell the NCAA and B1G conf to go fuck themselves.
October 20th, 2023 at 2:05 AM ^
I do appreciate how the traditional M-hating sportswriters are all getting after it: Thamel, Schlabach, Stewie Mandel. Just waiting for a Heather Dinich article.
(I do not include Dellenger and Wetzel in this category, they may not be pro, but they aren't real haters, IMHO.)
October 20th, 2023 at 2:06 AM ^
Two things can be simultaneously true:
1. This “scandal” is totally overblown
2. It’s fucking exhausting being a fan with Harbaugh
October 20th, 2023 at 7:45 AM ^
It is still curious why the ncaa seems so intent on going after Harbaugh despite the mountains of "open secret" shady dealings going on in the SEC and other locales. Even early on, when Harbaugh was advocating legal satellite camps, the ncaa was actively against him.
October 20th, 2023 at 8:39 AM ^
I'm thinking it's because he's been an advocate of player compensation, the transfer rule being modified, etc. Josh Pate yesterday compared the NCAA to a small town Sheriff who is out to get the guy who bad mouthed him.
October 20th, 2023 at 9:03 AM ^
Small town sheriff?? Lol. This is literally politics on any level. One person comes along and won't play ball, gets too much power, and the System comes down on them until they give up or go away.
Sucks to be on the other side doesn't it.
October 20th, 2023 at 9:54 AM ^
Well said! I think he figured small town sheriff sounds a little better over podcast than grumpy clerk on the zoning board, but it fits either way.
October 20th, 2023 at 2:09 AM ^
They can talk about sign stealing all day, but what rule was broken? Traveling to games to scout with the knowledge of the athletic department seems to be the only case to be made. Presumably that would require travel records and witness testimony that someone had knowledge of it.
The comment about "technology" is weird. Are we talking about broadcast tv and the ability to record it? The only person old enough to make that comment would be Ferentz.
October 20th, 2023 at 2:33 AM ^
Hell they do not even let you bring a bottle of water into the stadium. The type of recording equipment needed to record sideline conversations from the stands would not be allowed into the stadium. And don't tell me it is a smart phone.
October 20th, 2023 at 2:56 AM ^
They wouldn't be recording audio conversations. They would (allegedly) be recording video of the signs they make from the sidelines (posterboards, hand signals, etc.) to indicate the plays. This can easily be done with smartphones.
October 20th, 2023 at 10:15 AM ^
And how many fans at the game have their own cell phone and take videos during a game? Answer: a lot. Proving intent to break the NCAA bylaw without any tangible evidence (actual video recordings on Stalions' phone or university-owned computer, email communications, payments made to Stalions to buy game tickets, etc) is impossible. There is no way to prove anything absent the direct evidence.
Gathering intelligence on the opposition is just one reason why good teams stay good. Are people so naive to think that OSU doesn't have at least one dude in the stands gathering data at every Michigan game that is not against OSU?
Come on, man. What the hell are we doing here?
October 20th, 2023 at 3:49 AM ^
Shirley, you can’t be serious.
October 20th, 2023 at 6:41 AM ^
Yes, and don’t call me Shirley.
RIP LN
October 20th, 2023 at 2:35 AM ^
"This is worse than both the Astros and the Patriots -- it's both use of technology for a competitive advantage and there's allegations that they are filming prior games, not just in-game," a Big Ten source said. "If it was just an in-game situation, that's different. Going and filming somewhere you're not supposed to be. It's illegal. It's too much of an advantage."
Let's dig into this...
1. It's not "illegal". It's a potential rule violation. Big difference.
2. Use of technology for a competitive advantage also is not a problem in and of itself. That can apply to advanced analytics, training methods, etc.
3. There have been zero allegations made that in-game shenanigans were going on as with the Astros. The allegation (so far without any evidence) simply appears to be that Michigan filmed opponent's prior games by attending in person and not relying on game tape that is totally within the rules.
Whoever made that statement is not being fair and objective. They clearly have an agenda.
October 20th, 2023 at 4:31 AM ^
Plus, I have not read anywhere that recording coaches on the sideline of prior games is a rules violation. The alleged violation is simply that people affiliated with the university scouted opponents in person.
October 20th, 2023 at 4:50 AM ^
If the last few years have taught us nothing, it’s not what true or not. It’s how loud the media talking heads can scream from the mountain tops to set the narrative. The average 50 hour per week college football fan will believe Michigan is the dirtiest bunch of cheaters in NCAA history because that’s all they hear, without actually digging in to verify what they’re hearing. The truth gets burried and the damage is done. I can guran dam T that the cameras pan to our sideline no less than 500 times while bringing up the allegations throughout the season. If Warde could find a pair and sick the entire Michigan law school on anyone reporting hearsay as well as the ncaa, whether there’s a case or not it would help hose down the damage. But we all know Warde was groveling from the get go. I’m not a sec fan but do admire their ability to tell the ncaa to piss off and they do just that.
October 20th, 2023 at 1:20 PM ^
At worst it’s the same as the Patriots and not remotely close to the level of the Astros.
October 20th, 2023 at 5:29 AM ^
If you have a relatively new mobile phone you likely have high resolution still and video capabilities. Finally, I have a reason to give up my legal practice and become a sign stealer.
Silly me...I could have made millions using my phone to steal signals; instead I took a vid of the players touching the banner and took selfies.
If nothing else, the team now has some good reason to play with a chip on its shoulder.
October 20th, 2023 at 2:10 AM ^
I'm not sure I understand this. Coaches can use game tape to watch what happens on the field, but not what happens on the sidelines? Is that the allegation?
October 20th, 2023 at 2:58 AM ^
No, any game film is fair game, including film that catches signs on the sidelines.
The allegation is that people somehow associated with the Michigan staff 1) scouted games of opponents in person and 2) created video recordings while in attendance at those games. Those are both NCAA violations.
October 20th, 2023 at 8:36 AM ^
All teams get the 'all 22' video of all future opponents. That camera angle shows the sidelines and, therefore, any signals used to call plays.
So I do not see how having a friend of the program go to a future opponent game and filming signals with an iPhone is some sort of competitive advantage.
October 20th, 2023 at 10:35 AM ^
Thank you - that's exactly what I was wondering.
October 20th, 2023 at 2:16 AM ^
This is so fucking stupid.
October 20th, 2023 at 5:57 AM ^
It’s stupid for sure and every clickbait site including SI and ESPN are raining down on the what ifs. I’d normally say that this is nothing and it will just go away, but I’m not so sure this time. I hate politics and the cess pool media and this is the reason why. Every day I wake up at 4am and flip on the local news, which last until I see the weather and then turn it off. This situation confirms I’m right by doing so. We’re guilty in the eyes of media assholes and regardless of the outcome, that’s all everyone’s gonna remember. We could win the CFP this year but it will have a huge asterisk beside it thanks to the ncaa and their hatred of JH. It’s sad for the staff and more than anything the players who’ve worked so hard.
October 20th, 2023 at 7:05 AM ^
We could win the CFP this year but it will have a huge asterisk beside it
I would not worry about this, the only ones who will consider an asterisk would be the cooler-poopers, and their opinions do not really matter after the smackdown they will receive.
People still care way more about Georgia being champs than they did about the Jordan Davis situation, Auburn's championship still counts despite them paying Cam Newton, and Jameis Winston stealing actual things (not just signs) doesn't take away from FSU's championship. If Michigan wins it all, the gripes of sore losers will not detract from their championship one bit.
October 20th, 2023 at 7:51 AM ^
Exactly. They can shove their asterisk where the sun don't shine.
October 20th, 2023 at 9:45 AM ^
No amount of sign-stealing can account for the beatdowns that we have put on the bad teams we have played so far. And now that the microscope is out, there certainly won't be any sign stealing when we play the upcoming good teams on our schedule.
So what is there to asterisk? What actual competitive advantage would we have gained?
October 20th, 2023 at 2:23 AM ^
Matt Weiss.
October 20th, 2023 at 6:42 AM ^
Whatever Weiss did was never really disclosed outside of a general allegation. That whole deal was just weird as shit. My son who thinks he’s a Vegas betting savant tells me that they’re pissed about this deal. I actually look for some off the wall, crazy assed “insider info” to drop in the next few days. Apparently the ncaa can’t STFU and wants to iceberg our ship
October 20th, 2023 at 7:50 AM ^
Gattis... or more likely Dudek?
October 20th, 2023 at 7:55 AM ^
Not that it couldn't be him but why wait this long?
I find it real hard to believe that, if true, it was kept quiet for so long. There are enough people that have left on unpleasant terms that SOMEONE would have talked by now.
October 20th, 2023 at 2:33 AM ^
The problem is that this article is indicating that the "stealing" of signs was going on during the week watching replays of Big Noon Kickoff...like every other person could do.
My money is still on Gattis being the snitch. Weiss screwed himself, so I doubt he did it.
October 20th, 2023 at 2:48 AM ^
Isn’t anyone able to attend a public sporting events, even someone affiliated with the program? If so, it’s not enough that a person from the program was at a game. The issue is we’re they scouting? How would you ever prove that?
October 20th, 2023 at 3:12 AM ^
The "scouts" were not Michigan-affiliated.
October 20th, 2023 at 7:06 AM ^
Did they receive payment from a Michigan affiliate ? What’s the realistic exposure here? How do you know all this? I’m not even questioning you seems very plausible but you’ve never come off as an “insider” with posting history. Does the conference/ ncaa have proof of this or just everyone kind of “knows”
I really hope this doesn’t F these kids. That would seriously tarnish my relationship with college football going forward and ability to get personally invested in the product. Saturdays could start looking a lot different
October 20th, 2023 at 7:32 AM ^
I’d I had to guess, Sopwith lives on the west coast and is friends with or connected to the M staffer in question, likely via a USMC connection.
October 20th, 2023 at 8:32 AM ^
Or Sopwith paid an unaffiliated 'scout' to live on the west coast and become friends with the M staffer in questions who likely has a background in military stragegy and a USMC Commission.
October 20th, 2023 at 8:34 AM ^
Wonder if he got his marine buddies to go to games for him. Honestly, the time line is really important. Like he wasn't hired until 2022, but was voluenteering his time to UM football even when he was still at the Naval Academy and working for the Midshippmen football team and Niamontalolo. Also in person scouting is only not allowed for in season opponents.
October 20th, 2023 at 2:19 PM ^
I sent my sourcing info to the MGoProprietors. It's a completely random-ass coincidence of epic proportions that I know any of this. I'll tell the story when the smoke clears. Meantime I don't know exactly what the NCAA knows so I don't want to inadvertently help them with their Harbaugh bloodfeud.
October 20th, 2023 at 9:29 AM ^
Ever bought Michigan season tickets to any sport, or been a member of the alumni association?
You're Michigan affiliated.
October 20th, 2023 at 7:30 AM ^
Could also be Gattis. Especially since he’s back coaching in the conference again AND may think that this gives MD an advantage since they haven’t played M yet.
October 20th, 2023 at 2:36 AM ^
As Murtaugh once said, I’m too old for this shit.
October 20th, 2023 at 6:46 AM ^
I’m with ya man. I’ve been having the time of my life the last few months and now I find out someone shit in my high fiber cream of wheat.
October 20th, 2023 at 2:37 AM ^
It sounds like this guy just may be good at breaking down film. Down, distance, personnel, formation and plays run lead to tendencies. Watching game film can identify these tendencies and he can recognize it in real time. Maybe he is damn good at his job...or just maybe, his role is negligible and UM just has a great team.
October 20th, 2023 at 9:10 AM ^
Or maybe our team is just really good and can react to what other teams are doing. I know it sound completely fucking nuts, but maybe we’re just one of the best teams in the country. I oversee a sales force and everyone is trying to take down the #1. It’s just how society is wired.
October 20th, 2023 at 10:31 AM ^
We have a lot of upper classmen who have been in the program a long time. We have a second year D coordinator with an NFL pedigree. We have smart and well coached players. We have talented players who are bigger, stronger and faster than the teams we've played so far. We have an extremely good QB, RBs, TEs and WRs. Michigan is dominating its schedule because the schedule has been soft to this point in the season. There are tons of reasons why Michigan has been really good relative to its competition. But if we weren't stealing signs we wouldn't be nearly this good? Mmm hmm.
October 20th, 2023 at 2:45 AM ^
The problem is - even if this guy attended one out of market game on his own dime, the association with the program may be all the NCAA needs for some form of punishment. That being said, if he's just really good at analyzing broadcast film I don't understand where the smoke is. One thing is clear, it's definitely not just the NCAA that is out to get Harbaugh, but some other big ten teams as well.
I did go ahead a google this guy and found he has taken down his twitter. He also posted some MS Visio tutorial youtube videos about 8 months ago where there are clear screenshots of "scouting report" folders and play diagrams for michigan football. Probably not the smartest idea. It would be a shame if this guy was playing "football CIA" at his level and no senior michigan staffer checked him. I guess we will know in probably a year once the NCAA has finished its investigation. Either way, we'll have to deal with persistent comments about inequity all year when Michigan wins games.
October 20th, 2023 at 6:02 AM ^
Link to the YouTube video? I'm only seeing this: https://www.youtube.com/@connorstalions9211/videos
October 20th, 2023 at 6:12 AM ^
Here's something from a November 2022 On3 article about five "unsung heroes" in Michigan recruiting, which also discusses Christina DeRuyter, Denard Robinson, Ben Herbert, and Abigail O'Connor:
Connor Stalions, Player Personnel Analyst
Stalions has a bit of an interesting background. He grew up a Michigan fan and attended the Naval Academy, where he volunteered as a student coach. While there, Stalions also worked closely in recruiting with Sean Magee, who later became an Associate AD at U-M. Stalions volunteered at Michigan after graduating from the Naval Academy and is now playing a key role in many areas. Along with helping the football staff with day-to-day operations on the offensive side of the ball, Stalions has been a huge part of official visits and showing them around campus. He is also becoming a go-to guy for recruits and NIL.
They said it
“Connor is great. He’s working hard behind the scenes and makes people feel at home . He made a great impact impact on me and my recruiting.” — On300 Michigan EDGE commit Collins Acheampong