A conversation with a Buckeye fan at The Game
I put off posting this for a bit because I didn't want it to seem like an emotional reaction. There were a few Buckeye fans sitting a row in front of me. Before kickoff I was of course amped up and probably feeling the effects of a few pre-game beverages. I started making some lighthearted (obnoxious) remarks to them about bagmen, Cash Young, etc.. They sort of laughed at first but then things transitioned to a more serious conversation about the topic. I'll paraphrase but one of the guys said, "Look, I don't necessarily like it but it's how the game is played these days if you want to win". I don't live in Ohio or Michigan so I don't regularly have these conversations with people but this was the first time I heard someone simply say "yeah, we do this. The ends justify the means". While I might not respect the thinking I certainly appreciated his honesty. We were both very respectful with one another and he actually seemed like a knowledgeable person. When Dobbins scored a touchdown he looked at me and said, "cha-ching!" which I gave a wry smile to.
I apologize if the title isn't to your liking but I'm curious if others have experienced conversations like this as well? I only seem to read on various message boards the "deny, deny, deny" culture. Here was someone who openly admitted, without direct knowledge of course, that he believes the team he roots for cuts significant corners in order to lure top talent. I appreciate your responses.
December 5th, 2019 at 2:09 PM ^
Do you think Michigan is clean? We have bagmen too, maybe not super sleazy ones but we have them. You cant tell me players are getting offered $100k from other schools and decide to come to Michigan because we offer a great education. Nobody on our football team is driving around in a 15 year old Honda Civic...
December 5th, 2019 at 2:09 PM ^
Do you think Michigan is clean? We have bagmen too, maybe not super sleazy ones but we have them. You cant tell me players are getting offered $100k from other schools and decide to come to Michigan because we offer a great education. Nobody on our football team is driving around in a 15 year old Honda Civic...
December 5th, 2019 at 2:11 PM ^
Do you think Michigan is clean? We have bagmen too, maybe not super sleazy ones but we have them. You cant tell me players are getting offered $100k from other schools and decide to come to Michigan because we offer a great education. Nobody on our football team is driving around in a 15 year old Honda Civic...
December 5th, 2019 at 2:14 PM ^
NCAA doesnt care if you cheat as long as you aren't sloppy and make them look bad. Im sure they actually like when schools like Bama, Clemson, or OSU build powerhouses as it draws viewers
December 5th, 2019 at 2:14 PM ^
Ditto to what Indy Pete said in the very first post. We lost. It’s over. It’s disappointing but it might be time to move on.
December 5th, 2019 at 2:14 PM ^
Dreaded double post - a ditto to the ditto I mentioned above.
December 5th, 2019 at 2:33 PM ^
The big problem here is the lack of a spine at the NCAA. We've seen it over and over - they do their best to sweep problems under the rug. The NCAA does not care about an even playing field or doing what is right. They care about image and money. In a different context, there's another example brewing right now of a lack of care by the NCAA. Jauan Jennings of Tennessee, in a horrific display of poor sportsmanship and intent to injure, stepped on a player's face with his cleat - very reminiscent of Albert Haynesworth in the NFL in 2006. The SEC (not even the NCAA!) decided to suspend Jennings for 1/2 of the bowl game. Compare that to the NFL, which suspended Haynesworth without pay for 5 games.
December 5th, 2019 at 2:35 PM ^
The NCAA and/or the Big 10 are clearly going to do nothing, or do very little. Thus OSU (or whatever school) will continue pushing the proverbial envelope. If the sanctioning bodies aren't going into enforce the rules, then there aren't any rules. Michigan should take advantage
December 5th, 2019 at 3:31 PM ^
Well, while I doubt these guys ACTUALLY know....they all know. It's obvious, the writing is all over every wall in Columbus.
I literally had a client when I worked for Merrill Lynch tell me he doesn't care if the OSU players are "doing lines of coke off hookers" as long as they win football games.
December 5th, 2019 at 4:02 PM ^
Wow, that must mean that OSU pays its players..oh wait, they were just fans with no knowledge of whether or not it was true? But they are fans so it must be true.
December 5th, 2019 at 8:14 PM ^
Let me just park this here for you.
December 5th, 2019 at 5:06 PM ^
"If you aren't cheating, you aren't trying. You're only cheating if you get caught" and the NCAA doesn't seem too interested in catching the OSU's of the world.
December 5th, 2019 at 8:04 PM ^
I have a firm belief that this sort of tomfoolery was introduced with Tressel. That man was a self righteous, arrogant sap who got caught, receive a slap on the wrist, but only after he brought tons of success. The lack of penalty for Ohio State was enough to show them that the NCAA was nothing more than a joke that could be manipulated through money and persuasion.
The list of players who have admitted this type of behavior, made outright comments about the lack of academic standards, or have gone on to be less than honest human beings is lengthy. Urban Meyer is as shady as they come, and he was/is a god to them. Ohio State can claim success, and they’d be right, but even they won’t claim squeaky clean actions.
To many people, this lack of punishment and success for Ohio State signifies a need to become like them by imitating unsavory actions. I just can’t see that being the right way for Michigan.
December 6th, 2019 at 11:08 AM ^
Agreed. Winning in a game cannot be the most important thing to a university, a town, a people without paying a high price. That kind of thinking easily leads to the kinds of things we abhor. If winning necessitates looking the other way on rape, other sexual assaults, drinking and driving, and even child molestation then consider this my vote for "against."
December 5th, 2019 at 8:21 PM ^
Tressel’s regime was bagmanish. I honestly didn’t hear anything during Meyer about that. He was just obviously a shady POS with questionable morals.
$EC for a reason. I can’t throw that at OSU right now.
December 5th, 2019 at 9:34 PM ^
Meyer didn't have to do anything. The people who pay the players are local businessmen and wealthy alumni. They didn't go anywhere when Tressel left. Tressel set up a culture.
December 5th, 2019 at 10:34 PM ^
A winning culture of kicking butt and taking names. If there's anythign wrong with that, it would be un-American.
December 5th, 2019 at 9:05 PM ^
It's happening, folks... Everywhere, to include at Michigan. It's really the worst kept secret in CFB. The only question left unanswered is: to what lengths is each program willing to go in the pursuit of talent. I would assume there are varying degrees of evil in this regard, mostly stemming from a mix of audacity and financial ability. The OSUs, Clemsons, Alabamas, Tennessees, and Georgias (as well as many others) are taking full advantage, while programs like Michigan (and many others) merely live on or slightly past the line. Once athletes start getting paid, the teams above will just find another way to keep their advantages.
December 5th, 2019 at 9:45 PM ^
Nobody in this message board has any proof. But I will say if a program like OSU is doing it so is Michigan. Remember the fab 5. Michigan is not above doing something like this either. My opinion is all major universities are doing this and Michigan included.
December 5th, 2019 at 10:32 PM ^
“Can I have “Things That Never Happened” for $1,000, Alex?”
December 6th, 2019 at 5:44 PM ^
Bullshit.
December 6th, 2019 at 8:18 PM ^
Some of y'all are incredibly sad.
If you honestly believe that other schools cheat and michigan doesn't, you're a fool.
December 7th, 2019 at 9:30 AM ^
Cool story bruh,Yea so some random drunk fan in the cheap seats is an insider, ok ,lol. Did you at least catch his name, no details how this person knew these things? Sorta like using witnesses in a impeachment process, that wanted the defendant impeached before he was elected?
Sorry, anyone with half a brain wouldn't take casual chatter from a total stranger as absolute truth. Unless there was already a bias before.