Beilein removes all transfer restrictions on Doyle and Albrecht
Not surprised he relented and removed restrictions on Albrecht since he's a grad transfer, but I don't think it's bad form to put reasonable restrictions on a non-grad transfer (i.e. can't transfer to another B1G school).
I wonder if this will be the new norm going forward for him.
If you're gonna take a stand on it then don't fold just because a few people said mean things about you on the radio or in the newspaper.
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It's night and day. Basketball program looks like total amateur hour compared to how football is run right now. Quite concerning.
Your first point would have more value if the whole thing weren't so predictable. Any time a player wants to transfer to a school he is restricted from talking to, the coach gets criticized and often backs down. I guess he gets some credit for eventually doing the right thing, but given how common this is, it's hard to credit him with simply "making a mistake" initially, no matter how ethical he may be.
Edit: That's not to say that Spike or Ricky were hurt by the restrictions. Just that transfer restrictions are low hanging fruit for criticism (mostly because they are complete bullshit) and it is entirely predictable that such restrictions will draw ire from the media.
Was it really predictable? Beilein put the same restrictions on Spike that he did on Beilfeldt. Except in this instance, Spike KNEW it was coming.
What's the difference? People like Spike. That's the difference. For some reason (and I think part of it has to do with GRIT), people got angry that Spike didn't get an extended scholarship even though he announced he was "retiring" months ago and knew that Beilein would and should fill that scholarship spot.
People want to be mad at Beilein right now because being a bubble team is UNACCEPTABLE regardless of circumstances because THIS IS MICHIGAN.
I got mad when Beilein missed the tourney for the second time as Michigan coach and wanted him fired. I was a stupid 22 year old and Beilein would then take Michigan to back-to-back Elite 8s and an outright conference championship. This was two years ago. Despite being universally revered among his colleagues, a loud, probably minor, faction of Michigan fans hate Beilein. It's insane. And this blog and the mob mentality don't help.
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And I speak as somewhat of a cynic. But can't people actually have opinions they actually believe instead of internet people questioning literally every statement they make because of who funds them, or who they work for, or who they have to be friends with, or where they live, etc etc etc. How about Sam actually belives what he said?? Why is that so difficult to believe? Sigh.
Sam Webb credits him for being the most ethical coach in basketball because his recruiting is shockingly vanilla and clean in the dirtiest recruiting sport out there. Moreso than even football. It's not like coaches get their ethical reputations from what transfer restrictions they're putting on kids every year, it's just not nearly as often in the spotlight as recruiting is. On this, I don't think we can give Beilein a pass for simply "making a mistake".
You don't think we can give Beilein a pass for doing what he's always done, what every college coach does? Give me a break.
If Spike weren't white and short, and scored 10 points in that final instead of 17, this would be a lot less of an issue. People got all upset because he's a fan favorite and because they wanted another reason to be mad at Beilein because unless your name is Schembechler or Harbaugh, nobody is good enough for Michigan fans.
It's possible for somebody to hear opposing opinions and change their own opinion. That's intellect. Too many people see that as a fail when it's truly a win!
"Sam Webb said the other day that he's the most ethical coach in college basketball now and maybe ever."
That's a good thing right Eric? Please tell me that's a good thing. Because it's starting to look to me like we're in the car driving 55 on the freeway while everybody else is blowing past us doing 70 or better.
who did we lose to this policy? Kids judge interest by who calls, attends and pays. They judge a school on coaching, facilities and ability to accomplish their goals.
I say we stick to the speed limit. Cheer the players we have. Upgrade the facilities as required. Profit.
School me on this. Who did we lose to lack of an offer? We are not a BB school. An offer from Indiana isn't going to win FB recruiting battles with OSU.
I don't know about amateur hour, but folding up at the first sign of resistance to a decision you have apparently made based on a defensible position looks really, really weak. Not at all impressed with Beilein at the moment...
The Josh Jackson recruitment was the biggest amateur hour recruiting fuck up I've seen in a while. Michigan had a real shot there with the best prospect to come out of the state since Weber but Beilein wouldn't relent on the ridiculous "no offer before visiting" rule and we lost him. He's probably going to end up a Spartan now, but it's almost a McDowell situation at this point where his mom wants him anywhere but and is refusing to sign the LOI.
His girlfriend is playing at Michigan next year and his mom doesn't want him to be a Spartan, but we let him get away. Unacceptable. One of the scout mods got a quote from a source close to Jackson when asked how UM messed up with him that read: "combination of being stupid and trying to be slick. Deadly combo when dealing with already slick people. UM had a shot teed up and blew it." Brutal.
I really wish I hadn't read that. Jesus, that makes me ill.
Because a 17 year-old who is going against the advice of his parents and wants to attend a cesspool in East Lansing is ALWAYS RIGHT and definitely trustworthy...
You can prep Teske or Davis. There is always a scholarship avaiable for someone with the talent of Josh Jackson. Every single high level college basketball player has had a somewhat dirty recruitment. Guarantee McGary was offered plenty of non-kosher incentives when he was choosing a school by many that were after him. That's just the world we live in, and it's no reason to not want a guy. This isn't being dramatic, it's recognizing an abject failure in Jackson's recruitment. He's a special, special player and to not even make his finalists with the family and girlfriend pushing Michigan is embarrassing.
And no, right now it looks like he's going to MSU.
Scout basketball insiders have said the kid has chosen MSU and now it's down to if his mom will relent and sign the LOI.
Prepping Davis would not be sleazy at all, it's been a possibility for his entire recruitment and his class wasn't even clearly defined when he committed. Teske could also legitimately use a prep year as he stands a 0.0% chance of seeing the court next season and looks like a stretched out 14 year old.
Also, you can't drop a "all we heard about was how dirty his recruitment was", and then deride me for speculation and say "we have no clue if Jackson's recruitment is dirty." Hate to break it to you, but college basketball recruiting is off the deep end corrupted and dirty. The influence shoe companies and AAU coaches have is unimaginably deep and illegal benefits are par for the course for 4 and 5 star players. All of those Michigan players you listed save for maybe Chatman really blew up long after they committed. GR3 was a 3 star when he pulled the trigger for Beilein.
Right? I don't think Teske needs prep but maybe.
Jackson did not visit... am I wrong? Coordination with WBB was possible. Kids go where they go. MSU is not a stupid choice for BB.
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...then why did JB reach out to josh Jackson a week ago to gauge interest?
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Did Michigan really have a "real shot" with an in state kid who can't even make it to campus for a visit? This policy hasn't seem to hurt Michigan in getting kids on campus and offering them, he hasn't closed on many, but they have visited.
Everyone cites Jackson's girlfriend coming to Michigan but if he was truly interested in Michigan, he could have made it down for a visit, Tag along with your girlfriend when she comes to town on a visit if you don't want to come by yourself.
If Beilein did other stupid things to mess up the Jackson recruitment then so be it, he is far from the best recruiter in college basketball, but his no visit no offer policy is not going to be the reason Michigan does not land Josh Jackson.
Also, since when has anything Beilein done ever been described as slick. Maybe he has done some stupid things in Jackson's recruitment, but if his people are turned off by Beilein being "slick" then that should eliminate a lot of other coaches from his recruiting pool.
Sam Webb has talked about him for a while, and barely ever during the recruiting roundup. He says the kid's the best since Webber, loves his game, talks about that. But when people ask if he ever considered Michigan, Webs says he never really did. I don't remember the specifics, but from what I gathered Jackson grew up seeing Michigan as a very below average BB program, and never really had them as a consideration. Beilein did his due diligence but there wasn't much point in continuing.
This. I don't understand how people can speculate about Josh Jackson's recruitment (I dont' care how much Scout insider bs you read, you don't know 5% of the conversations coaches have with recruits) and then claim that Beilein didn't reach out. If Josh Jackson was interested, he would have come to visit. Are people really saying the Michigan staff didn't invite him to come visit campus?!
Except Jackson now lives in California, so he's not really an "in-state kid". Just grew up here.
That's total BS dude! What exactly was Jackson expecting? A red carpet? Money? An escort service ala Louisville?
These kids have outsized ego's.
Bottom line:
Either JJ wants to play at the home state school or he doesn't. Either he values an education or he doesn't. Either he values a straight shooter for a coach or he doesn't. Either he values a ball handling guard oriented system or he doesn't. If Jackson wanted to come to Michigan he would have. Hell the invitation is still open I'm sure. But if he wants to be wined and dined, and given a bunch of promises from used car salesmen like Calipari, Pitino (and Izzo) then clearly UM is not the place for him.
here's hoping he sees the light.
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I don't understand your question. I thought the issue was Beilein never offered Jackson, not that Beilein didn't recruit him at all. If you tell me Beilein made no effort to recruit Jackson then all my points are invalid. But I was under the impression that Beilein recruited Jackson he just never offered because of his no visit, no offer policy. So no, no one in Jackson's camp needed to reach out to Michigan because I assume Michigan attempted to get him to visit, he just never did. If I am wrong about that, then Beilein did make a massive mistake.
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Thank you, that was an informative and reasonable response, wihch can be rare in these kind of threads.
If Beilein truly slow played or got lazy with Jackson's recruitment then he deserves a lot of criticism for that. I just can't get all that bothered by his no visit, no offer policy. I think it is antiquated for the current state of college basketball, but it hasn't seem to hurt much when it comes to offering other big time prospects.
If there is proof of other big time prospects who lost interest in Michigan due to the policy I would then think it needs to be changed. But at this point I feel Beilein's issue is he is just not a great recruiter/closer period, and is perhaps to honest/clean for the current state of college basketball, not the no visit, no offer policy.
We didn't get on him nearly as early as the schools in contention and never went after him that hard. We made a push early this week but it was obviously too late at that point. Beilein's handling of the whole thing just looks incredibly foolish.
There are plenty of legitimate complaints to make about Beilein's ability to recruit and close, I just think the no visit, no offer policy is often something people bring up as a complaint when it really isn't the issue. If Beilein failed to push and give everything he had to convince Jackson to come for a visit that is a problem, but I don't think Beilein throwing out a scholarship offer without also upping the level of pursuit would have done anything.
Despite what some of these guys are saying, there's no evidence Beilein didn't invite Jackson to visit. In fact, it flies in the face of all logic to claim otherwise.
If you're Josh Jackson, you know you'd be offered when you came to visit. It's not a slap in the face that Michigan didn't offer blindly, it's just our procedure and if Jackson was interested and wanted an offer, he would have came. He clearly was never interested.
Resistance can force someone to consider dissenting opinions and reconsider things. Change doesn't always mean spineless folding. In fact, in most cases it takes a bigger man to admit a mistake and make a change (especially as a very public figure) than to fold their arms and remain steadfast.
am a steadfast Beilein supporter. However, his initial stance was logical and viable. It may not have been everybody's favorite but he was obviously deciding on principle. This does not look like he relented but more like he was told to relent. I don't like this. This does give the impression of haphazard program management and decision making. It is time for Beilein to get this cleaned up. He has earned some breathing room but I think he is getting close to using it up. I strongly support him as a coached but he has got to get all of this shit cleaned up, ASAP.
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I agree, it is absolutely OK to change your mind, when new information comes to light. Other than "the media complained about his decision," I am not sure what new information has come to light. This just looks like a totally rudderless program and decision, in my opinion.
It's kind of shocking, isn't it? I really like Beilein, but I hope is taking a lot of notes and implementing a lot of what Harbaugh does with the football program. In fairness, Harbaugh, side-by-side with almost any college coaching staff, would be tough to measure up to, but not long ago, our basketball program was the one that had it together. Is Beilein slipping, or is Harbaugh just that much better than the Hoke staff (I don't need you to answer that part)? Or is it a combination of the two?
just seems like a guy that does not completely trust himself with his decision making and is having serious trouble balancing what he thinks college basketball should be and what it actually is right now. There have been a couple of things now that I would characterize as bizarre.
He shouldn't have done it in the first place and your point about that is totally valid, but it's really hard to criticize someone for changing their mind to the right thing.
While I think Beilein has done the right thing, my problem is that now people will think he only did the "right" thing to appease his critics. I truly believe JB, after careful consideration, thought about Spike and Ricky and what he would want for them if they were his sons. He then acted accordingly and with his heart. He removed the restrictions on their transfers. Unfortunately, people will believe that a couple of "sports talk jockies" shamed him into doing what they, in order to increase their listenership/readership, claimed was the "right" thing to do even though they had no knowledge or relationship with Spike or Ricky or their unique situations. There are so many sleazeballs in college basketball and they chose to go after perhaps the cleanest and certainly one of the most ethical and classiest coaches in the game. Coach B, I applaud you for this decision, but regardless, I know you will always act within the rules while caring deeply about your players welfare, even when they are about to transfer. I hope no one gives Greeny or Forde credit for this because they certainly don't deserve it. We'll see if they themselves are big enough to give Coach Beilein credit for this decision and applaud him for it.
I doubt that, becuase if your story was truly the case why would he have put restrictions on in the first place? This isn't the first case of this situation arising. We've seen a long pattern of coaches putting transfer restrictions on kids, getting grilled in the media, and then backing down. Did all of them simply put in careful consideration and decide to change course? No, of course not, they were trying to make the necessary PR move. I don't see why Beilien is exempt from this pattern, it's certainly not his first rodeo.
is possible for him to care deeply about his players and have their best interest at heart but have that carefully and precariously balanced against competitive considerations. Take Max, he signed on for four years at Michigan and graduated. There was no fifth year promised or guaranteed at any time from either side. I think it is a fair take for Beilein to object to that player than transfering to another team where his intimate knowledge of Michigan's system results in a notable competitive advantage.