Basketball Snowflakes
I will give Howard credit for the 2020-2021Big Ten title but things seem to be going south. I doubt Juwan gets fired this season but Warde needs to get a list of coaches together just in case. We can't do things on a budget like we have at points with this AD. Use that 17 million surplus and at least talk to Matt Painter, Mark Few etc.
January 29th, 2023 at 1:53 PM ^
My basketball snowflakes is that we got hit by a blizzard today and Juwan seems clueless.
January 29th, 2023 at 1:53 PM ^
It appears my routine of looking at the halftime score and then deciding if I will watch the game or not that I started about game 10 this season has saved me from wasting two hours today.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:00 PM ^
Sadly due to the anticipation of the 2 big football games later today…I forgot they even played. Glad I didn’t sit through it.
January 29th, 2023 at 3:33 PM ^
Almost same here, This year, I record the game then FF through all the commercials and halftime. I'm not wasting 2 hours on this 2023 shitshow.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:02 PM ^
I just don't understand why this coaching staff does not attempt to draw up easy, close to the basket looks. Juwan seems to be able to get guys "open looks", but they are usually long twos and midranges (which are lower quality shots than open back cuts at the rim), which he doesn't have the shooters to consistently make. Sometimes you have to adjust your approach based on what you've got on the roster. How about running the fast break more, hitting some back cuts, doing some more rolls to the rim? This staff has been characterized by trying to stubbornly fit a square peg into a round hole 3 out of 4 years (2021 was a square hole fortunately)!
January 29th, 2023 at 2:10 PM ^
We really need to run more, I think it would help a lot and it's one reason I think Dug has been better than Jaelin, he pushes the pace better.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:07 PM ^
Warde has bigger fish to fry:
1. find own butt cheeks with own two hands…
2. Literally everything else an AD is supposed to handle but Warde doesn’t…
January 29th, 2023 at 2:14 PM ^
You know even when some of us were saying fire beilein at times (guilty) we never looked like worse than amaker complete doo doo. Juwan can leave now.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:45 PM ^
We looked every bit this bad during Beilein's first year or two.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:57 PM ^
Do you really think that that comment is accurate? Like, when you compare talent, eye test, system implementation, etc.? I hope you say no.
January 29th, 2023 at 3:00 PM ^
they seem to forget the sub .500 seasons. juwan is definitely getting one more year regardless. but as i said when he was hired, he likely leaves when his kids are done. which is after next year.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:14 PM ^
bye, hunter. time to go.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:21 PM ^
He plays like he’s already left.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:21 PM ^
We have a mediocre role player starting at the 4. If Frankie hadn’t chickened out, and if either of Houstan or Diabate had stayed, this would be a nice looking squad.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:23 PM ^
I already can’t wait for all of the excuses again next year when we have a young/inexperienced team…..
January 29th, 2023 at 2:25 PM ^
Good God.. Enough about Matt painter
January 29th, 2023 at 2:27 PM ^
Howard should absolutely not be fired after this year…but.
The lack of effort is shocking. So I’ve watched all but two games and in all of those games but 3 the announcers have mentioned michigans lack of effort at some point or another.
I really don’t like when people call out players for being lazy because it can be hard to tell as a spectator and as a general rules, athletes play hard. But holly crap there is something to it. This is the lowest motor, softest Michigan team I can remember. It’s glaringly bad. You can really see it on defense. Sad to see.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:31 PM ^
Agreed on nearly all fronts here. Was just telling a buddy of mine, I don’t remember the last time I felt like our team quit. Maybe the late Amaker years? They 100% quit today. It’s majorly concerning…
January 29th, 2023 at 3:30 PM ^
The bench is a coach’s friend and he doesn’t seem to utilize it much when his starters stink, which has been often.
Subbing seems to be a mild irritant and afterthought for him and the staff
January 29th, 2023 at 2:43 PM ^
This is what I said in this thread above, there is something amiss with this team. No idea what it is but other than Dug and Reed, nobody really shows any emotion out there. If Hunter is checked out, which I think he mostly is because of the inability to play in the NBA, I’d rather move on from him after this season. If him and Jett want to come back and right this ship then I’m all for that too. That said, there still needs to be some staff turnover though.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:49 PM ^
I think it is pretty easy to tell that there a few players who do not play hard on defense. Look at the old VCU teams, 2015 Dayton etc. and compare that to this team defensively. To me, there is a clear lack of effort and indifference on the defensive end. Today in the second half there was a break Hunter was the only guy back Jett jogs down the court then goes to guard a dude crossing half court while a guy cuts to the rim for a dunk.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:31 PM ^
I hope there can be more of a discussion besides “fire Juwan” though I admit to being skeptical at this point. Some things to consider:
- its odd to say but the number one recruiting class last year was a net negative. Barely accomplished anything last year, and then early departures has cost this team dearly this year.
- along those lines, one of diabate or Houston comes back and this team is totally different. Even putting that aside, Llewyn doesn’t get hurt and M admissions doesn’t shoot itself in the dick with Terrance Shannon and the current team is also totally different.
i don’t know how much blame you can assign Juwan for the items above - yes, it is his team but this team rolled snake eyes back to back to back to back. If just one of the things above happens (or doesn’t happen in the case of Llewyn) - I think this team is in a fine position.
i do think Juwan deserves some blame for his rotations / lineups and roster construction, but I also don’t know what he could have done differently with the current roster. At the time, every move he made was applauded.
For me, as much as it sucks to say - I’m willing to give Juwan a mulligan for this year, but he needs to make some noise next year or the hot seat talk becomes real.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:34 PM ^
You make some good points here. I think giving him one more year is fine. But I’m not sure how much change we’ll see with the roster we have coming back but I think he likely deserves another shot at it.
With that said, my biggest concern after today was, has this team quit? Cause it sure seemed like they did…
January 29th, 2023 at 2:45 PM ^
And if they did then it’s time to just play the young ones because that is a culture issue and usually a really ominous sign.
January 29th, 2023 at 5:06 PM ^
I mean they looked like they quit against Arizona State, in November. We got blown out by a half-decent Bobby Hurley team (fielding one of our former players), and some acted as if that were just because we had a bad shooting night. Effort and team cohesion have been a reoccurring problem all season long. We've talked about "moral victories" with this team in part because some of the losses (not just against CMU) have been so piss-poor.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:38 PM ^
Very well said. My exact thoughts.
Howard as done some good things, found some good players , but man it’s been a steep quick decline.
mulligan year for sure, but pressure is for sure on next year.
January 29th, 2023 at 3:00 PM ^
What exactly did you see about Llewellyn that makes you think he'd make a difference in a positive way? Bizarre romanticizing something that was awful from the start
January 29th, 2023 at 4:58 PM ^
Admittedly a bit of a leap of faith - but track record of Mike Smith and Devante Jones suggest there would be a bit of a learning curve + Llewyn history suggests he wasn’t as bad as he looked (in limited sample size).
i think it would be fair to say he would be a step above Dug - which likely gets us over the hump in both CMU and Iowa.
January 29th, 2023 at 6:21 PM ^
The Llewelyn transfer was applauded before folks knew it meant Frankie was gone. Maybe Collins was gone anyway, but having a second year guy playing PG early in the season might flip some of those close loses. Llewelyn might be a better overplayer than Collins, but it was going to take a while for him to be better than year two of Collins would have been.
Sam was pushing for more portal on WTKA, but I’m leery of bringing in even more guys in their first year with the team. They don’t just need experience, they need players with experience playing together.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:32 PM ^
It's almost baseball and softball season. Both should be pretty good! And never forget our women's gymnastics team. They're ranked #5 despite the tough loss to Sparty. Hopefully...Howard can get this turned around, uh...next year?
January 29th, 2023 at 2:33 PM ^
It's a developmental year. They're crazy young. They'll be bigger and deffer next year.
January 29th, 2023 at 3:43 PM ^
Are you referring to the BB team or the Russian military?
January 29th, 2023 at 2:34 PM ^
This is a young team and a bad staff. Let Howard make changes this off season and if this team still looks like this next year, then fire him.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:53 PM ^
Fair enough as Juwan should get one more year after he makes sweeping changes, if he can during this offseason.
This kinda reminds me of the 2020 2-4 football season or Brady Hoke's last season in 2014.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:36 PM ^
Next year will be the year , not now, but my eyes are officially looking at JH with a “ooo not sure this is working” look.
and when i say next year i mean he has to show growth, pg development, and pick the the right players to fill the gaps. And win of course.
tall order , program is so far from what it was as of very recent memory.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:40 PM ^
Beilein could no longer deal with the shitshow that NCAA basketball has become, and that was before the NIL and transfer portal craziness. Howard is having to deal with all of the old BS, plus the new BS, all while getting his feet wet as a first time HC. Maybe give him a bit to figure things out. Look around college basketball right now. The Big Ten outside of Purdue is awful. Maybe that's a coincidence, but I think it has a lot to do with teams navigating the new rules and roster construction.
I can't be overly critical of Howard being bad when he just lost multiple blue chip recruits and struggled to bring in new ones with Michigan's NIL lagging. He tried to fill gaps with transfers but one got screwed by academics and the other blew his knee out. What is he realistically supposed to do? Even on hot shooting nights, Baker and Williams are below average players. McDaniel is clearly a guy who needs time to develop. Bufkin is an adequate player who is developing but isn't a finished product. Hunter is athletically and defensively limited, which is why he's still in college and not in the NBA. Jett has been solid and has already played his way to being in the lottery conversation. We can question why Tschetter doesn't play more minutes or whatever other miniscule coaching gripe, but this collection of players wouldn't be a contender with any coach in the history of basketball coaching.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:48 PM ^
So what you're saying here makes sense. But if we're being honest, plenty of coaches deal with this kind of stuff and still win.
People on here love to hate on Izzo but the dude hasn't missed an NCAA tournament since the 90's. Same with Bill Self. Mick Cronin hasn't missed a tourney in a decade, with 3 different programs.
The excuses of being young and having injuries don't fly with me. Especially if we want to be viewed as an elite program.
January 29th, 2023 at 3:17 PM ^
For comparison, MSU is a borderline blue blood basketball school, and they're 14-7 and have lost 4 of their last 6 in a terrible conference. IU and OSU are historically as good or better basketball programs than us, and they're massively struggling. Duke, UNC, and Kentucky are all powerhouse blue blood programs and are all unranked. Meanwhile, Alabama is in the Top 5 and rolling up elite recruiting classes. College basketball is going through a huge shift.
In the end, it won't matter who is coaching at Michigan if our NIL is lagging behind other top programs. Could Beilein take these same players and turn them into an 11-seed? Maybe. But is that really the goal? I still think Howard gives us the best shot of any realistic coaching candidate to bring in a collection of high end recruits. That's how you win a championship in college basketball. You hope you have a few quality upperclassmen who are around when you land a stocked recruiting class -- and bring in a transfer or two. We can envy what Purdue is doing with their over-achieving group of non-NBA players, but we've seen enough Beilein teams like that to know how that ends. They run into a team stocked with NBA talent -- whether it's in the Elite 8 or National Championship. There's always a Julius Randle or Jalen Brunson waiting to out-talent you.
January 29th, 2023 at 3:24 PM ^
Look at their next class. Now look at ours. Izzo adjusted.
January 29th, 2023 at 5:48 PM ^
But look at our class last year compared to theirs. You can always do that. And MSU only got into the tournament last year (or was it the year before?) in the play-in game, and as a gift. To suggest the Spartans haven't gone through down periods is disingenuous.
January 29th, 2023 at 4:18 PM ^
I kind of liked making it to the national championships.
January 29th, 2023 at 6:09 PM ^
Making the Elite 8 or the Final Four is a successful season even if you get out talented at the end.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:42 PM ^
Howard will not and should not be fired this season but next year he is on the hot seat. Miss the tournament and he should be let go.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:43 PM ^
He gets a mulligan this year. All decent coaches do. But you only get one.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:48 PM ^
It is a pipedream to offer Matt Painter or Mark Few. Juwan could clean house with his coaching staff after this season ends. There are no good options. This is the season that started out as it could be but then is never was. It has been obvious since the CMU loss that this team had an uphill battle to qualify for the NCAA Tourney. There have been no Quad 1 wins. The chances are so slim on winning the Big-10 tourney as a last hope.
It's easy to have strong negative reactions after this blow out loss to Penn State but I have been told by several die hard Michigan basketball fans that this team has been hard to watch nearly all season. Let's hope this team can win their remaining home games and save face, if not, then we are entering a dark time in Michigan Men's Basketball. The team is mostly young but bad loss can snowball. The 2022-23 season will be one to forget.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:50 PM ^
Substitute Ono for Warde in your post above.
January 29th, 2023 at 2:55 PM ^
Painter played for Gene Keady at Purdue so that ain’t gonna happen.If this is still a topic of discussion in 2 years Juwan will probably take an NBA job when Jace is done.Jett probably enters draft this year.No need for firing Juwan,be patient.Team is different if 2 starters from last year hang around for this year.
January 29th, 2023 at 3:00 PM ^
1. The hyped recruiting class last season wasn't worth the squeeze it seems. Little value last season and sort of set us back going forward.
2. Juwan needs to find his "Yaklich" hire. Gotta find a DC to come in and have the team buy-in.
3. Juwan needs a roster managment consultant.
4. Losing Shannon to Illinois cost us several games and a postseason opportunity.
January 29th, 2023 at 3:03 PM ^
Juwan has zero experience being a head coach. Beilein had tons before he came here. You have to recognize that the product on the field has had no cohesiveness and no development to win big games, let alone average games in the big ten. His success in 2020-2021 was with guys having a ton of development done by others coaches.
January 29th, 2023 at 3:37 PM ^
Whatever a coach sees on the floor is what he coaches. Not profound, but it’s pretty simple.