B1G Crossover Scheduling
Given the random, uh, inconsistencies over the past forever years, I've been thinking about how it would be possible to "fix" the issue. But a 14-team conference makes schedule parity all-but-impossible.
Instead, wouldn't a simpler solution be a form of standings parity? Like, what if Division winners were determined only by a team's record within their division? What's the downside?
September 21st, 2020 at 8:57 AM ^
I'm confused.
September 21st, 2020 at 8:58 AM ^
Seek help?
September 21st, 2020 at 8:59 AM ^
Technical impossibility, I'm afraid.
September 21st, 2020 at 3:22 PM ^
Too late.
September 21st, 2020 at 8:58 AM ^
Yes, yes you are - Captain Obvious.
September 21st, 2020 at 8:57 AM ^
You are a disciple of the Bill Moos philosophy?
September 21st, 2020 at 9:05 AM ^
After a quick google, that appears to be the case.
September 21st, 2020 at 9:09 AM ^
I assumed that this was Bill Moos' account, which would be udder nonsense!
September 21st, 2020 at 9:45 AM ^
It probably is, that guy will milk this for all it's worth.
September 21st, 2020 at 9:58 AM ^
Or, complete "Bull"winkle.
September 21st, 2020 at 10:17 AM ^
Making a joke about Nebraska's AD whose name is the sound cows make is milking it just a bit, don't you think?
September 21st, 2020 at 11:57 AM ^
Of course not, what cud go wrong???
September 21st, 2020 at 10:20 AM ^
there is no whey these cheesy comments can continue.
September 21st, 2020 at 11:24 AM ^
Yes, whey.
September 21st, 2020 at 12:17 PM ^
I skimmed through this whole thread, drinking in each comment. I only agree with 2% of what I read.
September 21st, 2020 at 12:31 PM ^
I agreed with half and disagreed with half.
September 21st, 2020 at 12:38 PM ^
but did you read the WHOLE thing? Or did you just SKIM it?
#WholeMilk
September 21st, 2020 at 4:05 PM ^
Then you NEARLY agree with all of it.
September 21st, 2020 at 12:21 PM ^
I did mean to string it along, hope you camembert.
September 21st, 2020 at 12:38 PM ^
Come on everyone, it's been a huge misteak for this to continue. I'm going to have serious beef with anyone who thinks these are funny.
September 21st, 2020 at 1:01 PM ^
well you've put a stake in the ground on that one. Well done - that kind of things is so rare these days.
September 21st, 2020 at 1:07 PM ^
Is that the one were you play an easier schedule based upon how far away your campus is from anything interesting?
HiO
September 21st, 2020 at 6:00 PM ^
That's going way too easy on Penn State.
September 21st, 2020 at 9:07 AM ^
I think the biggest problem with the crossover scheduling in the way they do it now is giving each team a consistent crossover for a six year stretch. Michigan is in year 5 of 6 with Wisconsin and then will start a series with Nebraska. I guess this makes sense for TV, but it really bakes in some inequality in schedule difficulty. I would rather just have three new teams rotate in every year in a random way.
September 21st, 2020 at 9:38 AM ^
I would think a two year rotation would be an appropriate method (home/away) for crossover games. They could try a four year rotation but that might be pushing it. I agree that six year rotation is too much.
September 21st, 2020 at 2:52 PM ^
Home and Home and rotate.
September 21st, 2020 at 9:48 AM ^
I hate the 6 year locked in crossover. But I believe part of the issue is that Indiana and Purdue are perpetually locked in as a crossover game. I think it would cause some issues to have that game as a locked in crossover and have everyone else doing a full rotation.
September 21st, 2020 at 10:17 AM ^
That's an interesting point I hadn't thought of. There's probably a way to handle that, but it is definitely complicating.
September 21st, 2020 at 10:53 AM ^
I'm sure there's a way to change it more often and still be fair (4 years maybe). There could be realignment to fix (swap Illinois for Indiana or something) but you would then disrupt some other rivalries/trophy games.
There's so many old trophy games in the big ten that it's nearly impossible to keep them regularly played without permanent crossovers. I guess the argument could be made that you would go at most 2 years between games with a full rotation schedule but it will never be perfect.
September 21st, 2020 at 11:04 AM ^
Flip Indiana with Illinois. Sure the geography is not consistent but it would permit that. Unless the Ilini and NW "rivalry" is something that exists.
September 21st, 2020 at 11:12 AM ^
It is something that exists. Illinois and Northwestern have been competing for a trophy since 1945. First was the Sweet Sioux Tomahawk until 2008 and since 2009 it has been the Land of Lincoln Trophy.
September 21st, 2020 at 12:16 PM ^
Thanks for that info. I had no idea they had a trophy for so far back. I recognize they have played one another for years but that length of tradition surprised me as I read up on the trophy. I can go to bed now, I learned something new today.
September 21st, 2020 at 12:22 PM ^
There are so many damn trophies in the big ten. I don't know if we will ever be able to have a system that allows for both preservation of yearly trophy games and competitive balance.
September 21st, 2020 at 2:28 PM ^
All of those trophies are meaningless drivel. UM/OSU has never had a trophy and it doesn't need one. These trophies mean nothing to the players. JUST WIN!!!
September 21st, 2020 at 1:34 PM ^
I tried to figure it out a few years ago --- not to get too detailed but I couldn't find a way to (1) guarantee Purdue/Indiana annually and (2) rotate everyone else's cross-overs equally during a 6-year period, without having some other guaranteed cross-over game.
September 21st, 2020 at 10:48 AM ^
Yeah, but instate or not, the Oaken Bucket is more meaningful than the Brown Jug? How we didn't get perpetually linked to Minnesota has always been my question. Are there even any other East-West "trophy" games?
I like the 2-year rotation - a home and an away. And if it's staggered, someone new always comes on the schedule. Maybe move to 10 conference games - force the non-con to be more meaningful and have two coming on, two coming off for the crossovers.
September 21st, 2020 at 11:10 AM ^
They'll never move to 10 conference games unless something like that becomes mandated at the NCAA level. Every extra conference game is guaranteed to add additional losses to the conference as a whole which is bad for business.
To answer other crossover games with a trophy there is the Jug, The Illibuck for Illinois/OSU, The Old Oaken Bucket for Indiana/Purdue, and the Governor's Victory Bell which is Minnesota/PSU.
Indiana and Purdue are each others primary rival so I would say that game is more important than the Jug overall. The Jug is historic but it's not a "current" rivalry in the sense that MSU/OSU are. I don't have an answer for why weren't paired with Minnesota but my assumption is that the conference wanted to avoid perpetual crossover games as much as possible.
September 21st, 2020 at 2:03 PM ^
Illinois and OSu play for the IlliBuck trophy.
September 21st, 2020 at 9:11 AM ^
No, the crossover games should work through the list of the teams in the other division. You have your 6 division games and what, 3 crossovers? You play the 1st three (teams 1, 2, & 3) on your list of crossovers year one. You play the 2nd 3 (teams 4, 5, & 6) the second year then play teams 7, 1 & 2 the third year, etc.
September 21st, 2020 at 9:29 AM ^
I think you'd need to keep them in two year stints to handle home and away. 123, for two years, and so forth.
September 21st, 2020 at 10:56 AM ^
That could work, but you'd double the length of time between when two teams in different divisions would play each other outside of the 2 years in a row they would play.
September 21st, 2020 at 9:43 AM ^
There would been to be realignment in order for this to work. Purdue and Indiana have to play every year and are currently in opposite divisions.
September 21st, 2020 at 10:48 AM ^
Yeah, I'm not sure what you'd do there. From a geography standpoint, the next closest team to that east/west "divide" is Northwestern, but again, they have to play Illinois every year, so you're right back to the same problem. I guess you could go north/south but that's not ideal, either. So, in conclusion...
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
September 21st, 2020 at 9:12 AM ^
Yes. You use a variant of the 2020 schedule with a double "championship weekend".
All teams in each division play each other. No cross-over games.
Weekend 1:
Championship bracket: West 1 plays East 2, East 1 plays West 2. All other teams play zipper.
Weekend 2:
Championship bracket: Week 1 winners play for 1/2. Week one losers play for 3/4. All other teams again play zipper.
This gives you a 4 team play-off for the B1G championship with 4 OOC games.
You could do similar with one cross-over game but not count it toward conference standings.
September 21st, 2020 at 9:20 AM ^
I like something similar to this, but I would do an 8+1 model like they do now, but instead of having 6 division games and 2 crossovers, I would give each team two permanent rivals and then rotate the other six. Then for the "+1" play 1-4 and 2-3 as B1G semifinals and then play games down the standings as everyone's 9th game (5-6, 7-8, 9-10, 11-12, 13-14).
September 21st, 2020 at 9:46 AM ^
Bring in two more schools.
Play the other seven schools in your division for your reg season plus 2 non-cons. = 9 games
Fully crossover-seeded 16 team B1G tournament = 4 more possible games
(1:8, 2:7, 3:6, 4:5)
There will have to be a losers' tournament or something to keep MSU from being dropped to 10 game seasons.
That does make 15 games when the B1G winner goes to the CFP final, but that's only 1 more than currently. And the last six games are do-or-die... with the advantage of any B1G team being "tourney/playoff seasoned" by the time they get to the CFP.
Plus, it gives more opportunities to start beating OSU twice a year, once the inertia is moving in the right direction.
September 21st, 2020 at 5:24 PM ^
I like all three of the above ideas; but the more I read this one, JHumich, the more I really like it!
There are a couple downsides, I suppose; like for example the Little Brown Jug game (or pick any other intra-division matchup) only happening once every...who knows...??? Could be a long time for some match-ups...
But in my mind that's a relatively benign issue, unless you really like the cross-divisional aspect. But keeping the Non-Conference games (needed for revenue) and expanding an actually meaningful "B1G Playoff" would I think create a lot more excitement (and relevance)... good call
September 21st, 2020 at 9:21 AM ^
We are going to go like 14 years between Purdue's last visit and their next visit to AA.