Why is there no Michigan staff or faculty dependent tuition support?
I've been contemplating the strong possibility Joshua Christopher comes to Michigan. There has been much discussion about the number crunch, with Michigan currently set to have one more player than there are scholarships available. Adding Christopher would put Michigan two above the total number of 13 scholarships.
One solution is to shed a player or two. Another option is for Jace Howard to come as a walkon. The reality is that players leave the team at different times for different reasons, at which point a scholarship becomes available. It is this last option, having Jace come as a walkon, that led me to ponder whether or not there are faculty and staff dependent tuition support. And I found out that there are none.
I'm wondering if any of you know why there is no support from Michigan for their staff. Is Michigan all about the money, such that no discounts are made available? Or do they just expect dependents to apply for financial aid like everyone else? Obviously, given Juwan Howard's salary and compensation, he wouldn't qualify from the status of need. But still. It bugs me that Stanford and the University of Chicago and even MSU provide tuition support for full time faculty and staff dependents, but Michigan doesn't chip in a lousy dime. I know it's been this way for 50 years. Do any of you know why, from an institutional standpoint?
February 27th, 2020 at 3:27 PM ^
There are over 45,000 staff of the University (if you include the hospital, which you'd have to). That would end up costing them a ton of money.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:37 PM ^
This is true, but I still find it odd. I know of many schools that offer at least a small discount (which may exist at UM) and they all vary in size. I cannot help but think the main reason is Michigan is a very picky school and doesn't have any shortage of paying applicants/students every year, so why would they offer assistance?
February 27th, 2020 at 3:50 PM ^
There is some tuition reimbursement FOR staff, but it doesn't apply to dependents. For example one of my old coworkers started going to nursing school (not even UMich), the University is reimbursing her a portion of her paid tuition as long as she continues to work for Michigan Medicine part time.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:50 PM ^
I don't think you have to make it available to all staff, but when my wife was hired at the senior director level at a 10,000+ student university, one of the benefits was free tuition for our kids, and there is (I gather) a sort of tuition exchange program with a fairly large number of other universities, so that if they end up going elsewhere, there is some level of tuition remission. Considering that all full-time staff are going to be paying in-state tuition anyway, I don't see why they can't give them at least a discount.
February 27th, 2020 at 5:03 PM ^
This was the case at Emory. My dad was on staff at the hospital and both my sister and I could've attended Emory with a full tuition waiver. We both went out of state to Michigan and paid the full boat.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:50 PM ^
I don't think you have to make it available to all staff, but when my wife was hired at the senior director level at a 10,000+ student university, one of the benefits was free tuition for our kids, and there is (I gather) a sort of tuition exchange program with a fairly large number of other universities, so that if they end up going elsewhere, there is some level of tuition remission. Considering that all full-time staff are going to be paying in-state tuition anyway, I don't see why they can't give them at least a discount.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:53 PM ^
1) You don't have to include the hospital -
Academic staff get 15 sick days, and 1-2 days per month of vacation.
Hospital staff get 25 days of bundled PTO.
Academic staff get 2x retirement match up to 5%.
Hospital staff get 2x retirement match up to 4.5%.
Academic staff get paid season days.
Hospital staff do not.
2) Not including hospital staff - UM isn't much larger than lots of other universities that do provide subsidies.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:29 PM ^
I have a hunch that they won't have an issue getting both Josh Christopher and Jace Howard on scholarship. I could see the 13 scholarships going something like this:
1. DDJ
2. Brooks
3. Jackson
4. Christopher
5. Wagner
6. Livers
7. Todd
8. Williams
9. Johns
10. Dickinson
11. Howard
12. Castleton
13. Bajema/Davis
That would leave Nunez transferring out. I have no inside information and I also do not know the scholarship situation of players like CJ Baird.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:34 PM ^
CJ Baird isn't on scholarship, and I stated in my post that Livers will probably declare for the draft. He can't really improve his stock by coming back. JMO.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:40 PM ^
I fully expect Livers to enter for a grade, but I am also expecting that grade to be late 2nd round/UFA barring an absolute crazy tear to end this season.
And if he does get that grade, what's the point in not coming back? You get to finish your degree and play on a loaded team with another chance to make a run. Plus if he returns and plays a full and healthy season, his draft position could ABSOLUTELY improve.
He needs more time to show his 3 and D potential to scouts.
February 27th, 2020 at 4:12 PM ^
Livers could absolutely improve his draft stock by coming back and staying healthy for the whole season.
February 27th, 2020 at 4:02 PM ^
I pretty much agree . . . with the exception that I see BOTH Bajema and Davis staying. I have heard some good things about Bajema, and Davis' benefit to Michigan as a solid backup at 5 is undeniable. Again, at Juwan Howard's compensation level, paying tuition for his son is not tough. And with so many other possibilities (unexpected transfer from someone else, or Livers going to the NBA,) it isn't a real problem. Still would be nice for tuition to be covered, which obviously isn't going to happen.
February 27th, 2020 at 4:59 PM ^
I see only 1 problem with your list. No Greg Brown.
February 27th, 2020 at 6:37 PM ^
Brian suggested that unless a lot of spaces show up (i.e., Livers and Wagner go pro,) Brown will go elsewhere. So he will wait to commit, to see where there is immediate clear playing room. Of course, i want Livers and Wagner to stay, to anchor a great incoming class or recruits. So ergo, no room or expectation for Brown, as much as we'd all love to have him.
February 27th, 2020 at 7:35 PM ^
Livers goes pro, Wagner stays & blossoms, Juwan pays his son's way & Jace lights it up on his 1st game appearance. 2nd appearance, he comes off the bench to score 18 in 20 min. UM sails to final 4, as you hear over & over how JH is REALLY doin' it right. I just called it.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:31 PM ^
Apparently faculty voted in the 60s or some such time for retirement contributions and not tuition reductions. Philosophical concerns likely factored in too.
February 27th, 2020 at 4:11 PM ^
That's interesting. I never knew that. I definitely can't complain about the retirement matching program. By far the best I've had in my career.
February 27th, 2020 at 7:28 PM ^
I heard the same thing. The people that did not have children were at a disadvantage. To make things right they scrapped the tuition assistance for dependents and jacked up the match on the 401k. At least this is what older U-M employees have told me.
February 27th, 2020 at 10:27 PM ^
The 401K originated in 1978. The first 401K savings plan started in 1981.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:32 PM ^
I think staff and University employees do get assistance, but it seems to me that your post is stating 2 different things. I have faith the Juwan will figure it out. I would think that Livers in the camp that another year wouldn't necessarily help him, and if they get all the guys they are currently in on, someone will see the writing on the wall and hit the portal.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:33 PM ^
That is odd. I assumed that was what Jace was doing because his father works there. No matter what, I am sure Howard can afford to pay his son's tuition if he went the walk-on route, but even small private schools offer this. I used to work at a private university in Grand Rapids and they cover 100% of tuition (still have to pay for books, boarding, meals, and other fees) for all full-time staff and their dependents for bachelors and masters level courses.
February 27th, 2020 at 5:06 PM ^
I can see why a small private school would offer them but a school like Michigan might not. Michigan is turning down a large number of applicants every year whereas my school did not. It was worth it for the smaller schools to forgo charging tuition to get the rest of the fees and expand the alumni base.
February 27th, 2020 at 5:56 PM ^
I am faculty at a large private university (bigger than UM) and tuition is free for my children. It's worth quite a lot given that tuition is over $50K per year. It's just a choice the university has made. My wife works at a different large university (public) and gets no tuition benefit even though tuition at that school is cheaper.
February 27th, 2020 at 7:16 PM ^
Johns Hopkins is an elite, private university and they offer tuition support to faculty and staff (doesn’t even need to be high level). If you can get in, I believe it’s fully covered. They also have an arrangement with other, less competitive schools as well where faculty and staff dependents are also covered. I work at a large, public university in the big ten and my kid would get half off instate tuition. Unsure as to why Michigan doesn’t have the same.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:37 PM ^
Generally public school = no tuition support. Even for faculty, forgetting about staff.
That’s one reason why I took a job in the Ivy League - full tuition support if my daughter goes to my school, or 2/3 cash equivalent if she goes elsewhere.
February 27th, 2020 at 9:25 PM ^
“forgetting about staff.”
That is what faculty tends to do, yes.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:40 PM ^
I think additional retirement compensation is much more equitable and fair than providing tuition support.
I teach at a small, private 6th-12th grade school. We provide tuition support to faculty who have kids here. While it helps build community and teacher loyalty/continuity and it is something I would want to do if I were running the school, there is also no comparable compensation for faculty like me, who do not have kids (or have children who are already in college). On this level, it feels unfair that they get paid full salary AND get additional compensation.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:43 PM ^
You should negotiate a higher salary as compensation. If they want you, they will kick in an extra $15k.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:42 PM ^
Beat Wisconsin.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:44 PM ^
They don't need to. If someone's kid wants to come, and get in, they'll be willing to pay full freight. If not, the University will find someone who will pay.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:48 PM ^
I know good faculty who turned down tenure at Michigan for a lateral into a school that provides tuition support. I knew people at Berkeley that did the same thing.
it matters.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:49 PM ^
Why give away free tuition when the demand for this University if so great that they can bring in tuition via standard admissions processes (many of which out of state students)?
February 27th, 2020 at 3:53 PM ^
Because it brings in and keeps better faculty and administrative staff? The same reason you pay them and give them health care and retirement benefits.
February 27th, 2020 at 3:50 PM ^
Is Michigan all about the money, such that no discounts are made available?
Yeah, I think that's a factor. UM is not known as the world's best employer.
If it makes you feel any better, that benefit will probably go by the wayside at MSU some day, maybe in the not distant future. It's already been reduced in recent memory.
February 27th, 2020 at 4:11 PM ^
Why do you say UM is not known as the world's best employer? I mean I realize that they probably aren't LITERALLY the world's best employer, but they are known around SE Michigan as a pretty good employer for being stable, offering good insurance and retirement, and having a lot of opportunity to advance. You probably don't make the top line salary you could at another, private / for profit, place, but it's a pretty good place to work.
February 27th, 2020 at 4:14 PM ^
Here’s one for instance. At Ross one secretary is responsible for around 20 faculty. At my school a secretary is responsible for 4.
February 27th, 2020 at 4:23 PM ^
Because the university is not run by the faculty. The end.
February 27th, 2020 at 5:04 PM ^
This has got to be the 100th post on how the scholarship situation will work out. Don't worry, it will work out. And btw, football is still over too. Start a few dozen threads to figure that out too.
As a side note, don't you kinda think if JH needed Jace to walk on he could probably cover the cost? Heck, he could cover the cost for the entire basketball team's scholarships....for the next 10 years.
February 27th, 2020 at 5:21 PM ^
I work for University of Iowa....we don't get any discount or tuition help for dependents. It's not just Michigan.
February 27th, 2020 at 5:59 PM ^
For what it’s worth, OSU pays 50% tuition.
February 27th, 2020 at 6:13 PM ^
If I recall in the late 80s UofM did an analysis of their benefits package and let staff vote on what was most important. It turns out that other benefits (e.g., matching 401k, lower contributions for dependent healthcare) were considered more valuable than free/reduced tuition for kids.
Lots of schools don't offer this particular perk, so it isn't way out of line that they invest in other aspects of the benefits package.
February 27th, 2020 at 9:52 PM ^
Certainly this made more sense or was less of issue in the 1980s when in-state tuition was relatively inexpensive. I think I paid around 7K total cost (room and board, tuition, books) in 1986-87. And that's not all tuition.
Given the vast majority of UM employees were Michigan residents, and were reasonably well compensated, a greater retirement contribution might seem like a better deal, even for the people with kids.
February 27th, 2020 at 6:37 PM ^
My sister worked for a hospital associated with Ped State back in the 90's. Initially when she started it was free, then was scaled back to 75%, then 25% and now I think it is gone but she hasn't worked there in a very long time. Ped St also ended the relationship.
In PA most all of the college faculty and staff are union positions and so it would be something covered in collective bargaining. I don't know if UM faculty and staff are represented or not.
February 27th, 2020 at 6:53 PM ^
Some universities have tuition programs for their staff and their families, but usually they are private universities (Vanderbilt and Duke come to mind). Michigan is public. Maybe that has a part in it.
February 27th, 2020 at 7:49 PM ^
The lack of nepotism bugs you? OK.
February 27th, 2020 at 11:42 PM ^
LOL wut?
February 27th, 2020 at 8:31 PM ^
Since the athletic department reimburses the school for scholarships (most universities don't)... could that factor into it for Michigan?
I have anecdotes of faculty at other schools where wives and kiddos have gotten discounted tuition, but like others have posted, every school is different.