OT: SIAP I swear I checked...Could OK State Appeal?

Submitted by s1105615 on

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/oklahoma-state-stunned-by-central-michigan-…

I swear I checked to see if anyone else had posed the question and didn't find anything.  If I missed it, neg away and I'll never create another thread again.

What, if any options would Oklahoma State have to appeal the result of the game against CMU this past weekend?  If the play never should have happened, and the clock read 0:00, why cant Oklahoma State just mark it down as a W?  Why wouldn't the NCAA allow such an egregious error be corrected?

UMgradMSUdad

September 12th, 2016 at 10:12 PM ^

I agree.  Why was there not somebody on the OSU staff who knew the rule and threw a fit? With all the money paid for coaching and support staff, shouldn't there be somebody tasked with knowing the rule book backwards and forwards? Have that person stand near the head coach with a copy of the rule book and voiciferously intervene when the officials make an error like this. 

Mr. Elbel

September 12th, 2016 at 12:54 PM ^

the good news for the cowboys is that if that happened to run the table or even lose one more but win the Big 12, the CFP committee might overlook the CMU loss as a second loss because of the mistake. Whether or not they overlook the close game to a MAC school, or whether or not OSU can actually win the rest of their games after the way they played this weekend, remains to be seen.

Also, just say SIAP and be done with it. Including that in the title is dumb.

uncle leo

September 12th, 2016 at 1:01 PM ^

The committee can just wipe away the result. The loss is a loss. There would be a complete uproar if a situation happened that OK State got in with 2 losses and had a non-conference L "overlooked" because of a botched decision. Could you imagine how pissed off a more deserving team would be??

Mr. Elbel

September 12th, 2016 at 1:10 PM ^

I think that's my point. The committee can look at another team and deem them as not a more deserving team if they know that OSU should not have lost this game. They aren't trapped in a box like the computers were to only look at the W-L results of this game.

Using that example, if OSU wins the Big 12 with 2 losses on the season, and Stanford wins the Pac 12 with 2 losses on the season, the committee can reasonably say that OSU is effectively a 1 loss team even though the record doesn't show it, and put them in over Stanford.

Of course all of that is relative and hypothetical. Stanford could have lost to two considerably better teams than CMU, and thus be put in over OSU in that scenario, but the committee gets to weigh their options more here, which bodes well for OSU I would think.

Goggles Paisano

September 12th, 2016 at 1:06 PM ^

GA was favored by 53 against Nichols St.  Just throwing that out there.  

Ok St. could have ended this game on their hail mary attempt had they actually had a WR run a go route or just have the QB get outside the tackle box.  If the play design had either of these two facets in it, there would have been no intentional grounding.  

michfan23

September 12th, 2016 at 3:13 PM ^

Mike Gundy claimed that he never thought of either of these two suggestions you gave in your post.  I have to question what he was thinking.  Having 10 guys stand at the line of scrimmage and the QB just heave the ball downfield is the definition of a penalty.  None of the other players or coaches realized this fact and questioned his decision?  I get that the penalty shouldn't have resulted in an untimed down, but I find it odd that he would leave it up to the officials to decipher a little known rule.  I wonder if he knew the rule immediately.

Baugh so hard

September 12th, 2016 at 1:15 PM ^

Even if they're clearly wrong, your don't want to set the precedent of changing the outcome of a game due to officiating mistakes. That's a slippery slope that doesn't end well. They clearly need to leave the outcome as called on the field.

Hab

September 12th, 2016 at 1:18 PM ^

The rules are clear... OK State should have won.  The Chips shouldn't have gotten an untimed down.  But there's no appeal, and OK State just has to suck it.  Got it.  Understood.  Loud and clear.

But wasn't the way the game decided the way we want all games to end?  If the referees had called it correctly, the game would have ended with OK State intentionally running a play that the rules also determine to be illegal, and therefore worthy of a punishment--except at the end of the game (where it arguably could matter the most)?  I understand that the rule is clear on this, and that my question has no bearing on what should happen regarding the result of Saturday's game.  But if a team attempts to exploit the rules to obtain an advantage at the end of the game, and the play results in a loss of down on fourth down, the other team should get a chance to make them pay--which the Chips did here.

So while the rules were not correctly applied in this case, we still got the 'right' outcome.

 

CompleteLunacy

September 12th, 2016 at 1:47 PM ^

Being able to chuck the ball and commit a penalty to end the game is dumb. The rule itself is arbitrary...if a penalty ends in loss of down, why is that a suddenly ok way to end the game? The intent of the rule is to prevent offenses from getting free untuned downs...but in this case, loss of down results in a turnover. And the rule just doesn't sufficiently address it. CMU may not have won the game by current rules, but as for a "spirit/integrity of the game" argument, the rule SHOULD be that CMU gets an Untimed down in that situation.

michfan23

September 12th, 2016 at 2:59 PM ^

I agree with this. I'm a biased person being a graduate of CMU, but committing a penalty intentionally, which is what the play did, shouldn't reward the offending team. If Oklahoma state wants to complain, and I understand why they would, they should start by going into the locker room and saying "knock the ball down". Even with the penalty enforced incorrectly, CMU was 51 yards away with one play, hardly a high percentage play for the win.
In fact, the only reason this discussion is going on and the officials were suspended was because a miracle happened and the play resulted in a touchdown.



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Monocle Smile

September 12th, 2016 at 2:02 PM ^

But this is how sports work. Missouri lost on a 5th down in 1990. Should that be appealed, too? What about stuff that's one-off the officials...like Clockgate? These things should be remembered to guide the future, but sometimes shit happens.

WolverineHistorian

September 12th, 2016 at 2:42 PM ^

The sad thing is I'll bet people were saying in 1990 that a thing like that should be remembered to guide the future. But now 26 years later, even with the use of replay, refs STILL make mistakes.

1990 was the first year you could spike the ball to stop the clock in college football. So players and fans didn't notice that Colorado spiked the ball on 4th down and scored the game winning touchdown on 5th & goal. Still, even with that being a new rule at the time, the refs should have known what to do and they fucked things up anyway.

What happened in the Oklahoma State/Central game should NOT be happening in 2016.



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Muttley

September 12th, 2016 at 5:38 PM ^

after Colorado spiked the ball at the Missouri one on their (correctly observed) 4th down.

So an overturn would involve not knowing the outcome of Missouri snapping the ball from their own one.  If there is any such unknown, then I don't think the conditions for an overturn exist.  Especially from their own one where it's not hard to imagine a fumbled snap and a recovery in the endzone by Colorado.

Very rarely are the conditions for an appeal as clean as the Okla St/CMU circumstances.

Ty Butterfield

September 12th, 2016 at 2:08 PM ^

Life is full of disappointments. Remember, things can ALWAYS get worse. It sucks but the outcome should not be changed. It is what it is.

Jon06

September 12th, 2016 at 2:44 PM ^

The solution here is for OSU to claim it as a victory and list the score as what it was before the last play. They can do that in all of their materials forever, whether the NCAA likes it or not, just like schools claim pretty implausible national championships to pad their totals. CMU will list it as a victory, but that doesn't mean OSU has to recognize it.

This is very similar to our game against MSU last year, which we won 23-21, because stupid plays by Australian punters who don't know when to stop trying to punt don't actually count. 

The Maizer

September 12th, 2016 at 3:29 PM ^

Was surprised not to see any conjecture in this thread on what the effect of an appeal system would have on sports betting. Like what would happen if OSU got the outcome of the game changed somehow and all those (probably tens of people) that bet on CMU to win straight up had their winnings snatched away?

drzoidburg

September 12th, 2016 at 5:05 PM ^

Look it was a non conference game and so this only matters if OK St finishes like 11-1 and then it's up to the playoff committee to consider this effectively 12-0. Since OK St will likely lose many more games however, i think we can let this go

Rasmus

September 12th, 2016 at 9:02 PM ^

The reason they can't change the outcome is the opposite situation, where a rules error results in a game not being extended when it should have been. How do you remedy that, after the fact? You can't. You don't know what would have happened. You can't have it both ways.