OT- In defense of Sparty and their problem with alcohol related arrests
There has been lots of discussion of riots and other expected ill behavior in East Lansing. Although it pains me to do it, I must defend MSU students, at least a little bit, when it comes to their apparent penchant for getting unruly after a night of drinking. Ten years ago, I had a personal experience that shed some light on the issue, and I now believe there is more to it than simply a lack of control by their students. It's a long story, but entertaining and enlightening (at least I believe it is, or I wouldn't be typing it, right?)...
Back in 1999, during final four weekend, I was visiting a friend who attended MSU. On the Saturday night, after their loss, my friend and I went out to find some parties. We ended up in a couple of random apartments drinking beer. As the night was winding down, my friend and I were relaxing with beers in another random place, he on a couch talking to a girl, and I in the dining room talking to another very cute girl. Suddenly, there was a loud knock on the door. The girl I was talking to peered through the peep-hole, and rushed from the door saying the cops were outside. She was worried because she was only 19, and had been drinking. I looked around and saw no sign of the guy who lived there. I went to the door and opened it. The landlord and four cops were standing there demanding to see the resident. I told them I'd get the guy, and began to close the door. They refused to let me close the door, so I refused to walk away from the door, not wanting them to just wander in and look around. I stood there in a stand-off until the guy living there showed up behind me. The police immediately told him that he needed to shut the party down. Although there had been at least 50 people in the apartment earlier, the crowd had thinned to about 7 or 8 of us. The guy who lived there pointed out that there was almost no one there, and we were all just sitting around relaxing. The police told the guy that he needed to get rid of trouble-makers like me. ME! The guy tried to defend me, but I left voluntarily to keep from causing any further trouble for this stranger who had graciously opened his apartment (and his keg) to me.
End of story? Not a chance... As soon as I was outside, I was surrounded by the police. They immediately started shoving me toward the stairs of the apartment complex, demanding that I leave immediately. I consented and walked down the steps, my friend following behind me. Once onto the front sidewalk, we stopped to talk. The police then came down the steps and again got in my face, threatening to arrest me for trespassing. They were obviously looking to get a rise out of me. I pointed out that he was obviously on a power trip, then turned and walked away. Night over.
The lesson: I believe the police in East Lansing are at least partially to blame for their problems. They go into situations acting like the students are all criminals. When treated like criminals long enough, people start to act like criminals.
Not reading all that
Hey, at least I put that it was OT, and said it was long in the opening paragraph! But thanks for sharing.
Edit: by the way, the final sentence or two sums up my position for those without the patience.
Cops unnecessarily harassing the wrong people in their relentless pursuit for troublemakers? Sirrah, I resent your tone and find your spurious accusations ignorant and frankly Communist.
Why do you hate freedom, restive neb?
Yeah, Osama and I hate freedom.
I lived in East Lansing for four years and the police are certainly part of the problem.
I had a similar experience. About six friends and I were between bars and an officer stopped us. There was a report of a fight and he wanted to make sure it wasn't us (it wasn't). He asked (told) us to stick around. We were understanding and cooperative. We actually had a friendly conversation with this officer while he waited for backup.
While we were conversing, Chief Wiggum showed up like bat out of hell. Before assessing the nonviolent situation, he jumped out of the car and immediately said, "I just got new taser and I have no problem testing it out on you guys!" Wow. Thankfully, nothing escalated beyond a couple ill-advised smart-ass remarks on behalf of my friends.
The point is, the ELPD does not have a good relationship with the students and they don't seem to making any attempts to improve the situation. This certainly does not excuse mindless assaults or destruction of property on behalf of students but you'd expect middle-aged, "professional" officers to conduct themselves well - professionally.
It may not be all of ELPD, but only a few officers. I know that at my small school, there is one officer who has single-handedly arrested 5 people I know on individual occasions and harassed many more of them. He circles through the college areas, but makes his living circling the big freshman dorm stopping tons of kids. I think some officers can be Steven Segal fans that want to be like their idol, but like Super Unknown said, there can be fine cops as well.
Steven Segal IS an officer of the law in E.L. and he's out for justice.
for the summary at the end.
Not that I know much about the issue other than what's been presented here, but I don't doubt the premise for a minute. By hyping up the "riot problem," the ELPD help to secure a larger operating budget.
Seagal is actually a commissioned sheriff's deputy about 15 minutes away from me, right outside New Orleans. I never speed through his areas.
While I do not disagree with the OP that the ELPD should bear a sizable portion of the blame for the tensions on campus, I think the problem goes deeper than power-tripping cops. Virtually every college town in America features tensions between the locals and the college students, and those tensions often boil over during student-police incidents. But when I was in EL during law school, the thing that struck me about MSU was how much pride they seemed to take in partying hard and generally acting like idiots. The battle cry was "Sparty on!", and you were as likely to hear that as people walked to the stadium on Saturday as you were when people were exciting the Landshark later that evening. Now, UM students are no saints themselves, but at MSU there remains a culture centered heavily around partying, drinking copious amounts of alcohol, and then seeing how far you can push everyone around you.
I was finishing up law school during Cedar Fest (the last major riot they had), and even leading up to it the general sentiment on campus was that the residents of the apartment complexes were preparing for an incident, and actually seemed excited about it. I know this will make me sound like a UM snob, but there seems to be a culture at MSU that cultivates a "me against the world" mentality, that they "work hard" so they are allowed to play hard, even if that means starting fights with anyone walking down the street. Most students don't buy into it, but there does seem to be more who do than on other campuses. So when the police show up, this aggression bubbles to the top and you get the front-page stories that have come to embody the MSU student body.
Hell, when UM played at MSU, my fiancee (now my wife) and I were walking from our apartment to the gym when we were accosted for wearing our UM apparel. Now, I'm not talking just words (though apparently wearing maize and blue implies that I both (a) enjoy performing coital with my mother and (b) enjoy receiving sexual penetration in the aft from men), but also errant cups and other debris thrown our way. My wife actually stopped wearing a UM shirt while running after 2 separate incidents of people throwing stuff/attacking her, including one in which a MSU student picked up an acorn and threw it at her as she ran down the street, staring her down the entire time.
Now, I have a great many friends who went to MSU and most of them never bought into this culture. And the police department definitely had a stick up its butt while I was there as it pertained to students. But I don't think the MSU students should get off on their role in these types of incidents.