How clear do you think the decision is at QB?
*If* there is a decision to be made. We don't know how serious Speight's injury is, but we have a bye, so it's conceivable he is healthy by MSU. If that were to be the case, do you think O'Korn is clearly the guy? Or do you think it's still an open question?
I feel like it's got to be O'Korn--he was more accurate, he's mobile and his skills seem to offset the issues we have in pass pro and with WRs/TEs not running routes perfectly. But I'm also wary of making too much of what was basically one very good half of football--even if it was the *only* good half of football our offense has had this year. And the staff is clearly seeing stuff in practice that we don't.
What do you guys think?
September 24th, 2017 at 11:34 PM ^
..I think my main fear is that O'Korn will follow a similar trajectory as Tate Forcier...unstoppable early but then flummoxable once good teams adjust to his scrambling tendencies.
Now, granted, if our 2009 offense was paired with our 2017 defense, 2009 would have gone very differently. We don't need to be great at offense, just good enough. So maybe "Tate Forcier who studies film and doesn't slack off" is actually a very good solution to our problems right now.
EDIT: just for fun, I looked at our 2009 team. The only games where we failed to score 20 were PSU, Illinois and OSU. So with a good defense, and that offense (which was okay but not great), we might have gone 9-3 instead of 5-9.
September 25th, 2017 at 7:27 AM ^
September 24th, 2017 at 11:10 PM ^
September 24th, 2017 at 11:11 PM ^
September 25th, 2017 at 10:03 AM ^
this is football. It is a seriously physical game that injures players every game. Trying to place blame is just stupid. If the Purdue player doesn't hit Speight late then WS stays in the game (and likely our offensive malaise continues). Tom Brady got his one chance with the Patriots and looked what has happened since ... and just maybe JOK is very capable to lead this team offensively. With our defense, an average offense will keep us in every game!
Go Blue!
September 24th, 2017 at 11:16 PM ^
50% of you say Speight and 50% say JOK...great!
September 25th, 2017 at 7:45 AM ^
September 24th, 2017 at 11:18 PM ^
September 24th, 2017 at 11:21 PM ^
Speight is very (too) cautious and Harbaugh likes that knowing they have a great defense. O’Korn is less cautious, looked confident, moved the team and scored in the red zone and has the same defense.
If Speight starts, I will be very disappointed!
September 25th, 2017 at 1:16 AM ^
September 24th, 2017 at 11:23 PM ^
September 24th, 2017 at 11:23 PM ^
The game yesterday was won because Purdue only had enough gas for 2 1/2 quarters. While O'Korn played admirably, I think Speight would've also won the game in the 3rd and 4th quarters. Michigan seems to be running a gameplan similar to what they did in the 1980s and what Wisconsin and Stanford do now - wear you out over the course of 60 minutes. Make halftime adjustments, etc.
So, whether it's Speight, O'Korn, or Peters (or McCaffery), the key will be the blocking improving. We won't get away with the same gameplan against Wisconsin or PSU...
September 25th, 2017 at 6:40 AM ^
OK, Speight might have been able to get Quid (money) Nordin in range for 4 FGs.
September 24th, 2017 at 11:24 PM ^
the decision is clear and that's to go with O'Korn. In reality, it's probably much closer if both guys are healthy.
September 24th, 2017 at 11:26 PM ^
One thing I haven't seen mentioned: people were down on Peters in part because he was "even behind okorn". Well, suddenly that doesn't sound necessarilly bad like it did a week ago.
September 24th, 2017 at 11:29 PM ^
September 24th, 2017 at 11:29 PM ^
September 24th, 2017 at 11:35 PM ^
Not physical. Ever since Iowa he's seemed rattled and prone to nervous throws.
September 24th, 2017 at 11:31 PM ^
September 25th, 2017 at 11:53 AM ^
Once you see that, watch, he does it way too often. If he was clean back there and didn't have to roll, might be a contest. But it's not. OKorn is an easy call here.
September 24th, 2017 at 11:31 PM ^
September 24th, 2017 at 11:32 PM ^
Speight has struggled against quality teams. Numbers were padded against teams that barely had a pulse.
I’m sure someone on here has a breakdown of speights numbers in the Wisconsin, Colorado, Iowa, osu, and FSU games vs the rest of the schedule. I’m pretty sure the offense averaged like 17 ppg November 2016 and in the bowl game
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September 24th, 2017 at 11:52 PM ^
September 24th, 2017 at 11:51 PM ^
September 25th, 2017 at 12:25 AM ^
September 25th, 2017 at 12:53 AM ^
September 24th, 2017 at 11:54 PM ^
If O'Korn doesn't quicken his release, the question of who should start becomes kind of moot, as O'Korn will soon be [superstition prevents me from actually typing the "i" word here] anyway.
We need better OL play.
September 24th, 2017 at 11:55 PM ^
Dupe post. Moms, puhlease delete.
Thanks, Moms.
September 25th, 2017 at 12:00 AM ^
Assuming they are both healthy, it's a tough call. While I would personally prefer to see O'Korn for various reasons, and hopefully Saturday's performance dispelled some lingering doubts in the minds of the coaches about his ability to perform under game pressure, I could very well see Harbaugh not wanting to send the message that players (especially QBs) are susceptible to losing their spot due to injury. You want a QB to be smart, but fearless in the pocket for example, not worrying that a sack or any kind of contact could result in injury meaning that he might lose his position.
I think it's going to depend on the status of Speight's injury, and if he is recovered, competition in practice next week. To have Speight and O'Korn physically and mentally healthy and playing with confidence would be the ideal situation in case anything should happen to either of them. Peters and McCaffrey are greater unknowns, and would probably only be entrusted with a limited portion of the offense.
Even if Speight starts, I would expect to see more of O'Korn against MSU than we saw in the AFA and Cincinnati games. Knock on wood that it doesn't happen, but O'Korn could easily get injured even if he does start, and we will need Speight before the season is over, and most likely next year as well.
September 25th, 2017 at 12:09 AM ^
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September 24th, 2017 at 11:59 PM ^
Assuming the full two weeks of practice from both, I think it will be close. I still have faith in the coaching staff that whoever steps on the field against the Spartans will perform well against a questionable secondary. They will be prepared and have the gameplan down.
I suspect it will be O'Korn since his quick-release and ability to extend plays with his feet are both huge assets behind our questionable pass protection. It seemed to me that the coaches had him reading the intermediate routes first (rather than going through the full high-to-low progression) in the second half. I suspect this was a potential gameplan adjustment regardless of who was under center - but it's something I wanted to see. Our deepest options this year are true freshman (Black - get well soon! and DPJ) or a true sophomore who's shown little aptitute at adjusting to the deep ball (Crawford).
The shallower routes have Perry and a platoon of blocky-catchy types running free for 10 yards on the majority of plays. If we can hit those and sustain drives it'll take heat off the running game, which in turn will allow us to pound the rock more. Once the offense starts staying on schedule the play-action deep shots will pop open as they roll safeties up and leave a corner 1-on-1 with DPJ.
It's amazing how when stuff isn't working on offense, nothing works - but when anything works enough to dictate a response from your opponent, the whole playbook works.
September 25th, 2017 at 12:14 AM ^
I expect MSU will try to take away the middle and crossing routes from the TEs and dropping down Safeties and playing Robber coverages or blitzing, and make Michigan beat them by throwing to wide receivers to the outside, with the Spartan corners playing one-on-one being very physical with them. Michigan (and particularly O'Korn) and the young receivers have not yet shown they are capable of doing that, or that the pass protection can hold up. If Michigan can do that, expect some big plays, and let's hope whoever is throwing can be accurate and take advantage.
September 25th, 2017 at 12:00 AM ^
September 25th, 2017 at 12:06 AM ^
Last year Speight was clearly the better QB. But Speight seems not to have progressed, maybe even regressed some. He's not as confident nor as adept as he was up until the Iowa game last year, especially when the pocket is breaking down. I don't really blame him based on the hits he's taken and the injuries he's had.
O'Korn seems to have progressed quite a bit from last year. His instinct last year when the pocket was breaking down was to tuck and run, trying to pick up yards with his feet. That works sometimes, but he's not a gifted enough runner to make that work most of the time, and that doesn't seem to be what Harbaugh wants out of a QB. This year I've not noticed that same tendency. He seems more willing to move around to avoid the rush but look to pass first, even when there is pressure.
It almost seems as though Speight and O'Korn are on opposite trajectories, and unless that changes, O'Korn seems to be the better option.
September 25th, 2017 at 12:11 AM ^
September 25th, 2017 at 12:36 AM ^
September 25th, 2017 at 1:01 AM ^
It's the clearest, daddio.
September 25th, 2017 at 1:06 AM ^
I am definitely glad that JOK played well yesterday. That was a far cry from Indiana. However, Purdue's defense is ... um, not good.
I remain unconvinced that we can beat OSU (or PSU) with JOK running a simplified game plan, or with a QB that isn't getting full time with the starters, especially the freshman WRs with whom he must be on the same page.
Beyond that, it depends on whether you weight the last three games more than last year for one, and a good half more than Indiana for JOK.
Of course, the coaches have practices to weight too, and we don't, and the coaches will have a far better guess at whether both are 100%.
Given what we know so far, if Speight is 100% I think he's the starter, because I think that gives us the best chance to best PSU or OSU.
September 25th, 2017 at 1:35 AM ^
September 25th, 2017 at 3:20 PM ^
1. Beating MSU is a stepping stone to beating PSU or OSU. In a world where both QBs are 100%, and our OL is what it is, the thing that would hold our offense back is 10-man football. Getting everyone on the same page and building chemistry would reduce that, and so you want the person with the best chance of accomplishing that long-term to get every chance to do it. Thus, you make that guy the starter now, so he gets the extra two weeks of practice with the #1s and the extra game to build everything up.
2. Definitely vastly better! The question is whether or not that is due to a simplified game plan and Purdue's defensive (lack of prowess) and hence whether or not it is applicable to beating PSU and OSU.
One thing that Brian noted should give us hope - the downfield passing game with the TEs was decidedly present. Was it that JOK is more comfortable with them than the nominal #1 Bunting? Why did we run those routes now and not earlier, or did WS just miss the opportunities.
To be clear, I want the QB with the best chance of getting us silverware. If both are healthy, then the coaching staff, with much more information and expertise than we have, decided WS was better. Were they wrong? Tune in against MSU to find out!
September 25th, 2017 at 3:39 AM ^
Did not look good against a weak Cincinnati defense and a so/so AF defense. He did good in the 2nd half against FL.
September 25th, 2017 at 1:09 AM ^
September 25th, 2017 at 2:01 AM ^
O'Korn won the job for the MSU game. Was handed the job in a difficult situation and played very well. There's no way Speight is 100% for MSU by Oct. 7, even if he recovers quickly and plays lights out in practice, so it has to be O'Korn. He gets a full two weeks to be the man, get the reps, and have the offensive staff design a gameplan around him.
September 25th, 2017 at 1:20 AM ^
September 25th, 2017 at 1:26 AM ^
September 25th, 2017 at 1:48 AM ^
O'Korn's skillset much better masks our pass protection woes. I like him going forward.
September 25th, 2017 at 2:48 AM ^
We don't have the OL or the experience at WR for a statue. Pass pro breaks down too often and the WRs don't run precise routes.
September 25th, 2017 at 2:07 AM ^
He was mostly boom Saturday, except for the interception. I think a healthy Speight is still better, and also that Speight would've benefitted from the playcalling JOK got. But I also think Speight got seriously hurt, so we'll get JOK going forward. Hopefully all of the optimism about him is justified by what we get on the field the rest of the season.
September 25th, 2017 at 6:59 AM ^
Ask yourself: Why, with the offense sputtering, did the coaches NOT give WS the playcalling they gave JOK?
The only answer for me, is that they didn't trust WS with those plays (passing).
September 25th, 2017 at 9:59 AM ^