Good Yahoo Sports Article on the OSU Situation
This methodically goes through the situation and who was required to do what:
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/whats-next-urban-meyer-ohio-state-7-questions-will-determine-coachs-fate-173936078.html
The crux of the matter is the clause in Meyer's contract requiring him to disclose allegations of misconduct of any of his staff members going back to the dawn of time. That alone makes his non-disclosure of Smith's transgressions at UF an offense worthy of termination.
Of course there is the matter of his wife clearly knowing what was going on in Columbus with Zach Smith three years ago. It is laughable to think she never told UM but it might not be provable.
One would think that OSU will have to bring in outside counsel to investigate as they have a couple of other shit storms brewing there. Anything else would look like whitewashing and an outside investigator will take their time.
Bottom line is OSU can fire him with cause if they want to do so. If they let him return it will be a huge PR issue for them, especially since Meyer just publicly lied about the matter a few weeks ago. The longer this drags out the more likely that additional evidence is uncovered and OSU is held in the spotlight. The optics of letting him come back are just plain bad from many angles.
50:50 at this point IMO.
50/50... too much wiggle room.
So now they've announced a group of people to direct the investigation. Time to do some digging as to who these folks actually are besides the titles identifying them in the article...
http://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/24269311/ohio-state-announces-group-direct-urban-meyer-investigation
Probably some outstanding unbiased folks - I'm thinking the officiating crew from the 2016 game?
I don't know, part of me wants him canned now which would be more than appropriate. However, part of me wants OSU to hold onto him so investigators can dig further. I've been basically paroosing the internet for anyting Urban Meyer related and I saw something today that now there are allegations of player abuse from his coaching days at Florida. I don't know that a place like OSU, which probably realized there were some skeletons in the closet but rather opted for wins at the time, are wanting revealed now through an investigation. Not to mention in the court of public opinion, if they keep him as coach, can you imagine the interviews he's going to face? Plus, every up an coming reporter is now going to delve into everything Urban Meyer, University of Florida football program, and Ohio State. I'm guessing OSU has some things they don't want public and getting dug up, especially with the swimming team scandal going on right now. OSU has probably been paying their PR department hazard pay since Tressel and alot of people are getting raises about now.
August 3rd, 2018 at 10:55 AM ^
Paroosing is my new favorite verb.
Yeah, I just took a 5-minute look at this "special, independent board working group."
3 of them are current Ohio State University trustees.
1 of them, Jo Ann Davidson, is a former trustee. She was also Speaker of the Ohio House in their state legislature.
Another one, Carter Stewart, teaches law at Ohio State.
The last one, Craig Morford, is a DoJ droid, albeit a high-level one, having been an acting US Deputy Attorney General. He worked a lot in Ohio.
This panel seems to me designed to keep Urban there if at all possible, which I am sure is their goal.
August 2nd, 2018 at 10:19 PM ^
Actually Morford is the one listed on their law school as an adjunct prof. Curse the lack of an edit button.
August 2nd, 2018 at 10:20 PM ^
Ah, never mind, I was right the first time. I'm going to bed now.
Unrelated but I find it fascinating that fans of MSU and OSU will try and point at Grant perry and graham Glasgow as harbaugh letting criminals play on his team.
glasgow incident happened before he got there, no one got hurt. Jim gave him a chance to play football and rehab. Wow he’s so evil, he only cares about winning. He didn’t seduce any unmarried women *cough*rape*cough* or get accused of murder.
GP was not allowed near the team while the case was going on and once he payed for his time for drunkenly cutting in line, being belligerent, and inappropriately groping a girl. Then ran from the cops because he was drunk without an ID. That’s sounds like a lot of college kids to me. So he should have to pay for it for the rest of his life? If he wasn’t an athlete no one would care, as unfortunate as that is for females who are legitimately raped and assaulted by non athletes. He went through the proper legal process and served his sentence if you want to call it that.
There are rapists that have played for dantonio and murderers who have played for Meyer along with a wife beater on his staff. But JH is horrible for giving two kids who got drunk and were really stupid second chances, along with punishing them.
You won't get much argument for the Glasgow situation but a great chunk of this board would have been satisfied if Grant Perry was released from the team.
In that case a great chunk of this board is unreasonable. Some people here assume that the claims made by the victim are absolutely true but clearly the DA didn't buy it or the original charges against him would have been more severe than CSC fourth degree. People have made false claims before. Remember the hooker who claimed she was raped by the Duke lacrosse team? If all Perry did was get drunk, brush against someone in a crowd and then run from the cops that isn't something that should ruin a person's career and future. The bottom line is the final adjudication of his case doesn't show a basis for dismissal. He pled guilty to a felony count of resisting arrest and a single misdemeanor count of assault and battery. The criminal sexual contact charges weren't even part of the final charges. He was sentenced under the Holmes Youthful Trainee Act so his convictions have been set aside until the end of his probation.
August 3rd, 2018 at 12:19 AM ^
"brush against someone in a crowd..."
c'mon, man. he obviously did something more than that, else he wouldn't have run away, right? i would have had no problem with him getting axed from the team. i said the same for gibbons when the issue first came out his freshmen year.
sexual assault is magnitudes worse than dui or smoking weed. the former should be dismissal. the latter two deserves second chances, imo.
We know he was underage, drinking and didn't have ID. There was some kind of pushing in a line to get into a bar. You can't imagine a guy running from the cops unless the contact had been of a sexual nature? You must know a pretty select segment of society. I don't know what happened there and you probably don't either. I do know that the charges and the outcome don't warrant dismissal from the team.
Don't worry: our internal committee will investigate everything ??
Ohio St. should hire Paul Manafort as their new coach.
I'll even throw in the ostrich sweater vest!
August 2nd, 2018 at 11:30 PM ^
I think you've done more than enough for dear Paul already, Vlad.
This article is mistaken to say that Title IX applies to this situation. A ruling was issued last month in federal court regarding a lawsuit against Colorado University, in which Pamela Fine accused head coach Mike MacIntyre, athletic director Rick George, chancellor Phil DiStefano and President Bruce Benson of failing to properly handle the accusations of domestic violence against former Buffs assistant coach Joe Tumpkin. That lawsuit was thrown out, because, in the words of U.S. District Judge William J. Martinez, "as someone with no affiliation with or connection to the university, she was not within the group of individuals that the policies were designed to protect".
Courtney Smith is not a member of the staff, faculty, or student body at Ohio State; therefore, nor is she included in the group of individuals to which Title IX applies. So all this talk about Title IX violations is unfounded.
It's a someone shady situation that's difficult to talk about, because while Title IX may or may not apply in this case (you'd basically have to go to court to find out), the policy in question is the school's Title IX policy.
So, to probably be the most accurate, this would be an investigation into a violation of the university's Title IX-related policy, but that's a mouthful and nobody's ever going to read through that whole sentence in a news article, so they shorten it, which introduces some ambiguity (and makes OSU fans feel like they're being unfairly targeted).
That would indeed be a mouthful, but you may have a point. It seems odd to report issues unrelated to Title IX (as seen in the Colorado case) to the Title IX officer, so I was initially uncertain about your interpretation. However, the university may not want untrained staff determining what constitutes a Title IX issue, instead leaving that to an official with expertise in Title IX. I could see that, or something similar. Looks somewhat confusing in the contract, though.
August 2nd, 2018 at 10:02 PM ^
Forget title IX. Not sure if it applies or not and it doesn’t matter. It’s the fact that he definitely knew and, when asked publicly, lied about it. He should be done. Period.
August 2nd, 2018 at 10:26 PM ^
The topic of this post is a Yahoo Sports article, which refers quite often to Title IX in ascertaining Meyer's responsibilities, so it does matter if journalists are incorrectly (and carelessly) pushing this false narrative.
Interestingly, I see nothing in either this article, nor in Meyer's contract, about lying to the press (if, in fact, he did).
August 2nd, 2018 at 11:28 PM ^
Which PR firm do you work for in Ohio?
August 3rd, 2018 at 12:00 AM ^
Ad hominem attacks don't really address the issue. In light of this ruling, do you think Ohio State can contractually show cause to dismiss Urban Meyer?
Yes. It’s not hard. He lied about what he knew and when regarding domestic abuse. We know this because it has been proven his wife knew and he publicly said he and his wife share everything. Even if he hadn’t said that, it is surely proof beyond REASONABLE doubt (no, it’s not beyond a shadow of a doubt, as there rarely is the “smoking gun” in any case like this) that he knew, then lied about it at media days. It’s enough to trigger whatever clause it is that talks about holding up a moral code or human decency. I don’t remember the language, but it’s in there.
It’s not an ad hominem attack. He’s in a position that requires honesty when asked publicly. I understand the article is about title IX, but it turns out it doesn’t apply nor does it matter.
August 2nd, 2018 at 10:26 PM ^
Please don’t call Urban Meyer UM.
August 3rd, 2018 at 12:36 AM ^
I was going to say this too. And I live in Cincy. Coincidence?
Also was going to say this, and I live in cincy as well!
August 2nd, 2018 at 10:28 PM ^
If they didn't have the other looming issue going on I could see OSU rolling the dice. Now? They'd need to do something before they wind up really getting hammered.
August 2nd, 2018 at 10:37 PM ^
I wish this never happened. To be quite honest I don’t want almost every thread on a Michigan blog about urbs. I hope their is a resolution soon and I wish it never happened I want him to stay there so Michigan can start beating his teams. I still fully believe he will end up being their coach. Don’t know why but I do and they will use this as fuel that they don’t need. Then every game we will hear about it all game they are playing. Just looking forward to a good season for Michigan and less breaking news stories on terrible stuff going on in college athletics
August 2nd, 2018 at 10:39 PM ^
I an a cynic and believe that, in the end, Meyer will be back at OSU. And while my guess is it will hurt recruiting for a cycle or two, I've seen enough comments about Courtney and Zach Smith that I'm not sure that many people believe she isn't partially at fault and wouldn't be inclined to hold Meyer's transgressions against him.
August 2nd, 2018 at 10:46 PM ^
Can we not use Urban’s initials when we refer to him?
August 2nd, 2018 at 11:12 PM ^
I agree, I think you're right. It's the appearance that's bad, and very likely, enough to make Ohio St fire him, to distance themselves from the appearance of it.
August 3rd, 2018 at 12:56 AM ^
This may be true. Perhaps that will be the only solution that not only best protects the university, but also helps motivate society to define better policies to protect women who are battered, abused and harassed.
August 3rd, 2018 at 12:21 AM ^
Please don't ever refer to Urban Meyer at "UM". Just don't do it. I shouldn't have to explain why.
Lets not refer to Urban as UM anymore...
I disagree with your assessment. While I already posted about this same article, since you made it a new topic I'll do so again. In short while its the moral choice to fire him, they can't necessarily do it with cause right now if they want to. Did he violate the contract? You are mistaking "probably" or even "almost without a doubt" for "did".
This is spin from OSU world. The most significant part of the article is regarding his wife's requirements for disclosure, because what she did was likely going to have a large impact on this investigation.
The legal sources saying his wife didn't need to report under either circumstance? Debatable, but they are getting behind the court of public opinion as the one thing that would really sink Meyer would be someone indicating he actually knew. Given his contract, without that, he's going to (unfortunately) have a decent cause of action in court, and I doubt OSU finds it in their heart to do the right thing for the right reasons, and fire him because he should have known. While the moral choice, it 1) puts them in the hole for $38 million, 2) enrages their donor base due lack of a fair trial or witch hunt, etc, and 3) potentially ruins what they feel is going to be their best season in a while.
Now, she has a clear and easy reason to say for whatever reason (marriage problems maybe?) she simply failed to tell Meyer. They will then ask everyone else, did you tell Meyer or any other coach, etc? If nobody admits to telling Meyer, no record exists showing he was told, and he maintains as he has up to now that he didn't know, OSU has a legitimate reason to show that he simply didn't know and that's that.
All that being said, there's enough going on down there that if the committee wanted to dig into several things they could likely find an actual reason to fire him.
August 3rd, 2018 at 10:41 AM ^
Not sure how to post yet....I’ll put this here for those who may like to know.
Ohio State moved up their first fall camp practice today from the originally scheduled 3:30pm to 9:30am. I have to believe this is not coincidental. It is obviously pure speculation, but why would you do that last minute unless you needed that 3:30 time slot for something else. It seems like a decent possibility that those who have “heard through the grapevine “ so to speak that a press conference regarding Meyers fate will be this afternoon had legs. (Yes this could be coincidental, but it certainly gives the speculation legs)
August 3rd, 2018 at 12:43 PM ^
Interesting addition thanks. I could totally see wanting the entire team to watch a press release where they indicate they had concluded after investigation that there is nothing showing that Urban Meyer knew.
New t-shirts?
Urban Knew
August 3rd, 2018 at 11:03 AM ^
What galls me the most about OSU fans' reactions to this entire situation is that they assume their team will be FINE no matter what happens. They just assume they will land on their feet.
August 3rd, 2018 at 11:07 AM ^
Because they will. Bank on it and be happy if they don’t.
I keep thinking that the universe will balance itself and they will have to go through at least some of what we have endured.