Coaching bits from WTKA roundtable
Per Sam Webb Beielin could have had the Orlando Magic job last year and DOES NOT believe Beilein's primary reason for leaving is that he wants to prove it in the NBA.
Craig Ross: "In 3 or 4 years from now Michigan fans will regret Luke Yaklich isn't the head coach at Michigan." Mentioned Steve Fisher, Matt Painter, Tom Izzo, Johnny Orr, and Bill Frieder as guys who went from assistant to head coach and had success. Webb is skeptical this will happen.
The pie in the sky candidates (Stevens, Wright, etc.) likely aren't happening.
Michigan could get Nate Oats but he's not willing to interview due to just taking the Alabama job. Webb hasn't seen or heard that's he's a candidate however.
Brian: "Once you get past guys like Steve Prohm I don't see a single head coach out there that I would prefer to an internal hire or Juwan Howard."
A must some of the current assistants are retained especially Yaklich. Webb: "It would behoove Michigan to ask all three what it will take to keep them."
Webb: "It's going to be an interesting month." Brian: "Month?!" Webb: They're still in the search firm vetting phase." This would contradict Baumgardner's report that Warde had a ready made short list.
You bite off that whore tongue of yours RIGHT NOW!!!!
I'd hope for Dugan or even the recently retired, 70 year old, Dan Fife well above Shaka. However, I'd still put Dane below the Shaka-line.
Well, Shaka Smart sucks....so there's that.
If it's Smart, it's not going to be smart. Guy is way overrated because of a couple decent years at ODU - in one of which Michigan thoroughly trashed his best team.
You mean VCU.
If Smart was able to keep Yaklich and then hire an offensive guru to be one of his other assistants I think it could work because he's such a great recruiter. But is he willing to do that? I would make that a stipulation for him before you offer him the job.
I worry about Smart’s in game X’s and O’s. Great recruiter, but that’s where the coaching compliments end. Couldn’t find success at Texas even with great recruiting, so how can I trust he could do it at Michigan? Would take him over Moser in a heartbeat though.
I’ve said this elsewhere, but if we end up with a worse coaching hire than Nebraska, that might be it for college hoops in my life for the foreseeable future.
I agree with your premise, but holy batfucks! How do you typo VCU into ODU? That is impressive!
Probably because those teams were very forgettable. Seriously, the only thing that comes to mind when I think of Smart/VCU is McGary absolutely laying a dude out.
I remember going into that game I was so nervous "shit this pressure is going to kill us" .... man we beat the shit out of them real quick. Smart had ZERO answer for anything
I gots talent!!!
C'mon! I got the state and the U correct, so I have that going for me...
Hiring Shaka Smart is a great way for Warde to suddenly put his job in jeopardy. I think most Michigan fans are apathetic toward Warde. Hiring a middling P5 coach is a great way to make a lot of people dislike him overnight
Would Juwan Howard be the most likely to be willing to keep the assistants?
Being an assistant only, unless he tries to steal a lower level assistant from the Heat, he probably doesn't have many other connections established.
Dude has been around the highest forms of basketball his entire life. He has contacts...
One more thing: Everyone but Craig agreed Billy Donovan would be a great hire. Probably goes without saying but thought I would add that here as well.
I don't think Donovan is coming here unless the Spurs fire him. He recently set up his son as a coach for the Spurs "G" League team, and moved Billy Jr's family from Gainesville to Austin. He feels that the Spurs organization is a great place for his son to learn the ropes.
That's nice and all, but Donovan doesn't work for the Spurs. He works for the Thunder.
And only "for now."
How can the Spurs fire him when Gregg Poppovich is their coach and Donovan coaches the Thunder.
Popovich can fire Adam Silver if he wants.
People don't quit jobs.
They quit bosses.
when did you change your picture? I liked the old one better...
I want shirt-less Putin riding a horse
#SoDreamy
I'm glad I don't have to make this decision. I'm a little disturbed by this notion that JB didn't leave to prove himself in the NBA. Why go there then? Something isn't adding up. The Adidas/FBI/NCAA-sucks scandals aren't new. Why would this just now make JB want to leave? Kids leaving for the NBA before they are ready isn't new. Why is it now bothering him?
I'm just listening to the narratives and trying to distill where the truth is... I can't imagine Cleveland is a dream job for JB. The motivations profferred don't appear to make sense and or aren't new.
I interpreted this as a yes.
Beilein asked whether issues like transfers, recruiting, etc., led to his departure: “I think that’s a discussion for another time and I’m just really happy to be here right now. ... We probably can talk about that later on.”
— Matt Charboneau (@mattcharboneau) May 15, 2019
I agree. Remember the ESPN recruiting guy's tweet this week? Beilein has tried to do everything right, keeps losing guys early, and then sees top recruiting targets he has invested time and effort into snatched away by bagmen.
Michigan really should be a title contender next year and it seems clear that Beilein thinks that won't happen with Iggy and Poole out the door.
I agree. I try to put myself in John's shoes. For years he was at Canisius/Richmond and lower where the bagmen probably weren't a huge part of his life. Then he moves on to WV and then Michigan where I'm sure it's everyone. John reached essentially the pinnacle of college basketball and is getting burned left and right on the recruiting trail. It's gotta be so, so frustrating. Then the guys he does recruit and develop end of leaving faster than the higher rated guys that got bought away from him. I feel like he finally had enough. Even if the NBA is tougher sledding, at least he'll feel like the playing field is nominally level
I get how that would be very frustrating, but wouldn't a man who is by all accounts of very high ethics, try to change the corrupt system by calling out the shenanigans instead of running away? Or maybe he has tried to change the culture of CBB only to be consistently rebuffed.
I mean, he was the head of the ethics committee, right? Who better than he to know that the whole thing is a crock? I strongly suspect he got tired of getting burned by cheaters and early departures. Imagine how good some of Beilein's teams would have been if some of those early exits had stuck around
Here's what I don't get about this: Does he really think its going to be any easier building a roster in the NBA? At a place like Cleveland?
Let's be real about Cleveland's roster: It's terrible. Cleveland is almost certainly going to rebuild, so guys like Love, Thompson, JR Smith, etc. are going to be on their way out. And they don't have much trade value. Really there are 3 or 4 guys who might be on that team 3 years from now: Colin Sexton, Cedi Osman, Ante Zizic....maybe one of John Henson/Marquiss Chriss?
So let's say Dan Gilbert wants to be smart (a big ask) and rebuild appropriately and not try to make the playoffs right away. This will be a 76ers like task, where Beilein and co are going to need to lose for years and hope to get a game changing player or two. At best, Beilein is probably looking at having a team capable of making the playoffs in...4 years? 5 years?
Or Cleveland overpays a bunch of decent players and tries to scrape into the bottom half of playoffs where they get blasted like the Pistons this year.
Either way, is that really how you want to spend your last years coaching??
Its so bizarre to me.
Not easier. But more fair.
And yes, Cleveland vs. LA/Texas teams/etc. isn't fair. Different states have different income taxes, different cities have different attractions, different owners can change almost everything. It's far from totally fair.
But more fair than the NCAA? HELL YES. The NCAA is corrupt, vile, and predatory. I don't blame Beilein for getting away from it.
So let's agree that its more fair in the NBA: Despite that Beilein was able to create one of the most successful teams in the NCAA during his tenure at Michigan. He finished second in the country twice. He won 65% of his games...
...Is there any reason to believe he will get anywhere close to that in Cleveland? Is there any reason to believe that Dan Gilbert would let him stay for more than 3-4 years if he doesn't succeed? Is there any reason to believe his ceiling will be higher than a bottom half of the seeding playoff team that gets bounced by Giannis in round one?
Cleveland would need to luck into a Giannis/Lebron/Kawhi level player in the draft. At least Beilein could recruit guys to come to Michigan to be successful even if he missed out on some players or had others leave before they should have. In the NBA he's at the mercy of ping pong balls.
We'll have to wait for his book to come out I guess
This was enlightening for me:
Sam is plugged in but not nearly as much as fans think he is. Sam doesn't know any better what Beilein has going on inside his head than anybody else, its speculation from people in the AD department being relayed through Sam like its fact.
Is it really going to take a month? We waited that long for Harbaugh but it was necessary. We arent waiting on anyone now. Please tell me they have a plan in place. If we have fucking Shaka Smart as coach next year im going to throw up.
* enter scene: a haunted witchs house. The sun sets in the background*
What if i told you they do have a plan? And that its bold, and brave and good and wise?
The plan of course -- and you should know -- is to hire one of the goblin-folk. A former realm leader, reknown for his recruiting prowess (he brought in the Oden-Son), and a master the bag-men.
I shant state his name. But you know. You know.
*evil cackle*
"Per Sam Webb Beielin could have had the Orlando Magic job last year and DOES NOT believe Beilein's primary reason for leaving is that he wants to prove it in the NBA."
If Beilein decided to coach in the NBA chances are he wanted to coach in the NBA.
I think "prove it" is the operative word here. If I follow Sam's logic, Beilein didn't leave just because he always wanted to end up in any NBA job, otherwise he would have taken the Orlando job last year when it was available (which is a little bit of a strange assertion since I don't think there were any rumors other than the Pistons job last year). Therefore, there was something else that was the "primary reason for leaving." In my mind there are three possibilities:
- General malaise over the state of college basketball/Michigan in particular and not wanting to deal with it anymore, to a greater extent than this time last year;
- The Cleveland job has some unique attraction that it was too good to pass up (other than...)
- Money
#1 has been mentioned around here since almost the minute the story broke, but in my opinion I don't think it's a big enough problem for Beilein to NOPE it out of here after 40 years in college basketball. Maybe there is more to the story but for now I can pretty safely discount this to a secondary reason at best.
#3 doesn't seem plausible since Beilein doesn't seem to be the type to jump just for an extra few million. Plus he likely had the ability to make as much over the remainder of his career here than in Cleveland, assuming he doesn't stay there very long
Which leaves #2. I can't imagine what snake oil Dan Gilbert sold him in their conversation, but there must be something particular about coaching in Cleveland that is incredibly attractive. Which seems weird to all of us on the outside given the roster, but who knows?
There could be any number of reasons why Beilein didn't find other NBA offers enticing including uprooting his family (Orlando). His willingness to talk with NBA teams is proof enough that he not only found those opportunities worth exploring but his willingness to leave college basketball altogether.
I would be okay with Prohm.
What the hell did Sam say the reason for leaving was then?
Too bad on Smart, that would be a Disaster and the fans are going to continue to say it. Very loudly.
Warde your job is to get Donovan. Do that and nothing else.
A month? I'm looking forward to Searchbits XCVIII: Is This Real Life?
Michigan engaging a search firm for vetting does not contradict the report Warde had a short list ready.
Agreed. There are about 350 D1 MBB teams. I doubt Warde made a concerted search of all the HCs out there. His list was no doubt just a starter for the search firm to consider.
He also might want the guys on the list vetted, to make sure there are no skeletons.
Yaklich is going to Cleveland.
I’d think Yak would be a top head coaching candidate in college next year if he sticks around. Assuming he’s retained by our next coach, he’s likely going to have another elite defense with Simpson, Teske, and Livers, and his record will be hard for schools to ignore. I guess it just depends on what his ambition is.
What makes Yaklich a better candidate than Lavall Jordan Michigan had a top 5 offense multiple years in a row, a national championship appearance and elite eight the following year and a better recruiting track record and the job he got was at Milwaukee.
What makes Yaklich a better candidate than Lavall Jordan Michigan had a top 5 offense multiple years in a row
Because we know that the defense is solely attributable to Yaklich. Was the offense good because of something Jordan brought to the table or because Michigan’s coach was an offensive genius? I’m guessing more of the latter than the former.