Chris Balas / Doug Skene - Geting out coached in the MSU game
This is not to pile on! I think it's worth hearing a former Michigan great calling it like he sees it - like many of us see it. That this is still a thing 7-years in to Coach Harbaugh's tenure is the foundation for all the problematic issues IMHO. If there is self-scouting going on, it needs to be reevaluated because it's an abject failure at this point.
As Michigan fans, we want this program to succeed & rightfully question why basic issues like being out-schemed, out prepared, out coached are still happening when the track record is there begging for self-correction.
Too much talent on this team to see it suffer from consistent coaching gaffes. You can't ask the players to step up and be great if the coaching staff is unwilling or unable to do the same.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:08 PM ^
A 4-point loss in a game that could have gone either way if the ball had bounced just a little differently...
If they had gotten blown out, that's one thing, but it was a pretty even match.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:11 PM ^
Ah, a moral victory!
November 1st, 2021 at 2:14 PM ^
No. Not a moral victory. Nowhere in that comment did I mention a moral victory.
However, melting down as if the team just lost badly to a far inferior opponent is a bit of an overreaction. Michigan State is a damn good football team this season with a Heisman front runner leading the charge, and some fans are acting like Michigan just lost to Arkansas State by three touchdowns.
November 1st, 2021 at 10:11 PM ^
How many more losses to Michigan State and Ohio State do we need before melting down is acceptable to you? I guess we should accept that Mel Tucker, in his second year, has a tougher and better-coached team than Michigan does in Harbaugh's 7th year.
November 2nd, 2021 at 6:17 PM ^
Troll
November 2nd, 2021 at 6:17 PM ^
Troll
November 2nd, 2021 at 12:14 AM ^
No - we are reacting because MSU went and got a coach with a below .500 record, revamped their roster with transfer portal players, and then went out and beat us to get a top 5 ranking. Why can’t we do that in year 7 some of us ask.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:19 PM ^
Yeah, Harbaugh really fucked this game up by scheming up 400 yards through the air, 150 on the ground, 2 interceptions, keeping Thorne/Reed/Nailor in check, and blasting their OL into oblivion. On the road. While keeping Cade in the medical tent when JJ fumbled. And by telling the refs to call a non-existant hold in the redzone. And also telling the refs to take 4 points off the board.
It's amazing to me that people think Mel Tucker coached a great game. What coaching is involved in your RB dancing like Barry Sanders while your OL holds on for dear life to rescue you from a 2 score deficit on several occasions? Please, other than tempo, show me what great scheme Tucker had served up. I'll wait.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:25 PM ^
See, I agree with much of this. The offensive game plan (when we didn't have 3rd or 4th and short) was really good. There was speed in space!
On a down-to-down basis, when it came to passing the ball, running the ball, rushing the passer, MIchigan looked like the significantly better team.
But tempo killed us. Numerous times. And it happened agaisnt Nebraska too. Did they think other teams wouldn't try the same stuff? And it changed the game.
So did a continued inability to convert in short yardage. This was made even more painful by the fact that twice MSU completed deep passes in these situations, once on a brilliant trick play.
It's encouraging that Michigan was able to open up the offense, and for the first time we saw just how dangerous it could be if they just clean up the little things. But there are always some little things that never get cleaned up. This year, it isn't "corners are slow and the team can't play zone", it's "can't handle tempo or convert short yardage". And these little things always sink Michigan.
At this point it feels like even if they gave Ojabo the TD or if JJ/Corum didn't fumble, something else would have flipped it Sparty's way.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:45 PM ^
Gifting your opponent 2 touchdowns because of substitution issues (not to mention the penalty yards), when that tactic was exposed as potentially problematic during the Nebraska game is getting out coached and paying the price for it. One time, ok, they got us, but 3 more times after that is inexcusable.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:45 PM ^
Comparing Walker to Barry Sanders? WTF? I'll wait.
If you don't think Tucker out-coached and exploited our game plan you are delusional. Tucker played to win.
Field Goals:
Michigan-4
MSU-0
It boils down to Michigan needing 8-9 scoring drives to win the game, MSU only needed 5.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:58 PM ^
The most telling stat of all:
Rushing TDs:
MSU - 5
Michigan - 0
November 1st, 2021 at 6:52 PM ^
The rushing TD disparity wasn't the real problem. It was our failure to get TD's in the red zone too often and settling for field goals. Who really cares whether the touchdowns come via the pass or run. It became clear in this game in the 2nd half that field goals weren't going to be enough for Michigan to win.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:26 PM ^
IF Michigan had won the game, suddenly Tucker would be asked all sorts of questions about Cade game manager McNamara darn near had a Michigan career day against the Spartans defense and what happened the Michigan State passing game. Tucker wins and now he is a genius and Harbaugh is left to answer questions about what went wrong.
November 1st, 2021 at 6:41 PM ^
Yeah, that's how sports is. The winner is the genius.
It's modern college football. There's too much going on with offenses to expect college defenses to not get burned by some stuff. You often need to put up 40+ to win against good teams. Michigan put up 33 because field goals.
Yeah, they shouldn't have kept having those subbing penalties. But just ONE TD instead of a FG and it's a different ending. TWO and it's a Michigan win. Hell, if the two had been in the first half, I'll go out on a limb and say it's a backbreaker and M wins going away. They need a better red zone and it needs to be something not fades thrown where you could only catch them if you're standing out of bounds.
They're going to need 40+ just to make it interesting against OSU.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:58 PM ^
Did you check the rushing stats? It was our running game that was blasted into oblivion. Not theirs.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:12 PM ^
Michigan had 146 yards rushing. MSU 199. UM ran for 4.3 per carry. MSU 5.5.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:19 PM ^
and several of Walkers big runs he wasn't even touched
they played physical football at the LOS on both sides of the ball, we played reach and grab bullshit that doesn't go against physical teams.
their pass D was not good but they made enough plays to stop us from scoring due to drops/bad play calling in the redzone.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:58 PM ^
Are you referencing the three that he initially got stopped at the line (one of which happened at the goal line) because there was a wall there and he had to run through arms to get it outside? Or the 1 (one) where he busted through the middle because the line wasn’t set yet? I can see where one might be confused with several…wait…weren’t there only 3 big runs…?
November 1st, 2021 at 4:25 PM ^
Dude, what are you talking about?
Walker made Chicken salad out of chicken shit routinely and their OL could not block Ojabo or Hutch.
They had zero pass rush. They played below their season average on rush D.
Physical at the LOS my ass.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:06 PM ^
Completely agree.
One player torched us.
November 1st, 2021 at 5:24 PM ^
For the record, I think Mel Tucker coached a great game. He has shown twice in two opportunities that he recognizes and can attack Michigan's weaknesses. He did very well gameplanning. We have to give him some credit here.
However, just because Tucker gets a lot of credit doesn't mean Harbaugh failed miserably. It was a great game between tow evenly matched teams that could have gone either way. MSU came out on top, and they deserved it, but nobody can sit here and say Michigan shit the bed. They played a great game. It's really unfortunate that either team had to take a loss in this one.
November 1st, 2021 at 7:36 PM ^
Does yardage covered by FGs count toward the ground game or passing game...
November 1st, 2021 at 10:27 PM ^
They sold out to stop the run and allowed Michigan to pass which resulted in over 400 passing yards passing, 3 touchdowns, and 4 field goals. MSU was aggressive on 4th down while Michigan wasn't. MSU's coaching staff saw that that the passing game wasn't working against Michigan's D so they just ran the ball for 200 yards and came back from a 30-14 deficit in a quarter and a half by being a one-dimensional offense because it was clear Michigan wouldn't do anything to stop it since they decided to play two high safeties most of the game despite the fact that the D line was getting shredded. He saw that no matter how many times they ran a hurry-up offense, Michigan would still try to sub half their defense and would refuse to take a timeout to avoid penalties. Michigan's defense was out of alignment and players didn't seem to know where they were supposed to be throughout the game. MSU played to win while Michigan played to not lose.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:33 PM ^
No, we should have blown them out. But I don't believe that this was all on the coaching. It's hard to argue with Doug Skene though.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:02 PM ^
we had a 16 point lead late in teh 3rd and let it slip away with a rash of mistakes that good teams don't make.
at this point it is sad that the same old mistakes keep haunting this program
November 1st, 2021 at 4:47 PM ^
But young teams do, and hate to burst your bubble…Michigan is still a top 10 team. MSU is a team of mercenaries. I’ll take Michigan and the growing process over building a transfer team every year.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:59 PM ^
A 4-point loss in a game that would have gone our way with fair officiating
November 1st, 2021 at 6:34 PM ^
Having a 3rd quarter 16 point lead evaporate due in large part to defensive coaching gaffes does not equate to an "even match". It does amount to squandering what should have been a comfortable win if proper timeouts and adjustments had been made on the fly.
You put your defense in bad situations on at least 4 critical downs by my count that resulted in 2 scores and penalties. Is it fair to asume that left the defense shaky by being out of position repeatedly and seeing the opponent take advantage of it?
November 1st, 2021 at 11:41 PM ^
MSU scored two touchdowns and got consecutive 2 points conversions. Do you believe Michigan would have pulled that off being down 16 in the third? Why was his team able to execute so successfully?
Tucker got a top 10 win at home in year 2. He patched up his roster with the new transfer rule. That’s an outstanding job. Winning 43% against MSU… not great.
November 2nd, 2021 at 12:53 PM ^
But Michigan wasn't down 16 in the 3rd and what part of Michigan coaches putting their defense in bad positions that contributed to MSU scoring didn't you read?
November 1st, 2021 at 2:08 PM ^
Skene kinda sucks to listen to. Always just a disappointed dad who you can never impress. Balas always seems to have smug self satisfaction when bad things happen.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:27 PM ^
Until last year Skene was always overly positive about the program. No matter how bad the team looked he could always find something good with it and almost always predicted a win no matter who the opponent was. That changed last year and I think he has taken a more realistic view of the team and program.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:29 PM ^
Pessimism does not equal realism. Especially if the 2020 college football season is part of the equation.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:03 PM ^
agree 100% on Balas, I quit their site because he is such a smug a-hole.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:17 PM ^
I get it. I really do. Harbaugh has to change and get over this hump, but I'm also not going to sit here and act like they were blown out by an unranked team. Yes, he is the coach and it is ultimately his fault and he takes the blame, but I can name 4 different plays that most likely change the outcome that had nothing to do with coaching. I'm talking simple, every game plays, not (if only he made that diving catch plays). One of them didn't even have anything to do with the players or coaches. Now, it can def be said that if the coaching was better, that those plays shouldn't have made the difference and I guess i'll buy that, but man, people need to chill just a bit.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:10 PM ^
the coaching points need to get fixed and should have been before this game.
trying to sub when they didn't and getting caught 3 times is inexcusable/POOR coaching
guys jumping offsides on offense and D = an undisciplined team
Poor play calling inside the 20 continues to haunt this team as well
all of those are coaching issues that need to be scouted and fixed.
the ref makes the right call on the fumble/TD and replay overturns it on ???? there was NO clear evidence the ball wasn't loose when his knee shin was down, he lost control of it the second Ojabo hit him.
the ball hit the ground and Reed's hands at the same time, that wasn't a catch and they decided to give it to him.
our punter had the ball slip and didn't get a punt off AFTER 2 guys jumped on 4th and 1.
obviously the fumble where the RB somehow didn't know the play
1 bad play in the game didn't loose it for us, a Bunch of boneheaded plays did as well as some really questionable replay overturns that NEVER seem to go our way.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:20 PM ^
It is weird talking about UM having a substitution problem "all year" when, as far as I can tell, they've been called for one all year and that was the last drive against NIU. Like, it sucks it bit UM in the ass in this game but that seems like this weird talking point amongst some people that just doesn't match reality.
I didn't listen to the whole thing because if I want 45 minutes of bad vibes I can find that elsewhere, but that just jumped out to me as one of those things that guys who just want to complain pick out of the ether to give them a strawman to attack.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:33 PM ^
You can have a substitution problem without getting penalties.
M got penalized for it 3 times against MSU. There were another 3-4 occasions where they didn't get penalized, but due to substitutions weren't ready for the snap.
November 1st, 2021 at 6:00 PM ^
Again, they had problems in this game. But these guys acted like this has been a persistent problem all year and I simply pointed out that they hadn't actually be penalized for it during any competitive part of a football game leading up to it.
November 1st, 2021 at 6:20 PM ^
Check the Nebraska game.
November 2nd, 2021 at 9:08 AM ^
November 1st, 2021 at 3:11 PM ^
we had 3 in this game, 1 I can understand but 3 is BS
DC needed to adjust and he didn't
November 1st, 2021 at 5:59 PM ^
Sure, but again they said it was an issue all year when they had only been penalized for it once all year leading up to that game and that was at the very end of a blowout. Michigan also had 2 fumbles yesterday,
Michigan also had issues with holding onto punts and it bit them in this game as well, yet I don't see them railing about that. Or the fact that Michigan had 3 fumbles in this game after having at least one fumble in every game except Rutgers this year, which is an actual problem they need to address, but I didn't catch that leading the discussion (though maybe they brought it up later).
Yes MacDonald needs to adjust but at the same time leaving guys out there when you've not really reped for it leaves you potentially exposed to tired linemen missing tackles and giving up huge gains. I'm sure this is a teachable moment for MacDonald and I hope he adjusts, but there is only so much you can do in-game to adjust.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:31 PM ^
As always you can have little gripes here and there with individual playcalls but honestly the lack of not being ready for tempo is the only thing I can really ding the coaches for, now we know that it wasn't their choice to have McNamara out of the game on the fumble. The offensive coaches looked well aware of what MSU's weaknesses were on defense and exploited them. Defensively I can't really fault the gameplan of lets eliminate the big plays downfield and hope our front can handle itself well enough. I mean it obviously didn't work out cause the front had a very bad game against the run but on paper it did look UM's defensive front was better than MSU's oline going in.
November 1st, 2021 at 3:13 PM ^
the running game wasn't good either
too many times our guys got stuck in the hole or backfield
sparty was reading their keys and crashing inside all day long
we only got over 100 because we had 40 yards worth of QB runs. Need to stop calling those plays that we for whatever reason cannot block well
November 1st, 2021 at 2:36 PM ^
The dropped INT by.. Moten? or was it Turner? gave me flashbacks of the dropped Hawkins INT against Haskins in the OSU game in 2017. Turns out next couple plays boom, TD!
Just can't ever seem to make the game-winning or saving play in rivalry games under this regime.. or rather since 2006.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:52 PM ^
The 2 plays you're referencing aren't remotely similar. Metellus' was a straight drop that clanked off his hands with no one around him. Moten had to leap for his and the receiver clearly got his hand in there as Moten was trying to catch it.
November 1st, 2021 at 8:22 PM ^
Dropped by moment? You come around and fucking bitch about mich enough, but you literally weren't even watching the game..
The ball was deflected by msus wr..
Metellus dropped the int a few years ago. Maybe stop following michigan if you hate them so much.
November 1st, 2021 at 2:37 PM ^
To me the one guy on the staff that was a major disappointment is McDonald. It didn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what MSU was doing with their up tempo. You have to be able to adjust on the fly and he just flat out didn't. He's also got to figure out why too many times this year we have lost our last line of defense. Not sure if its his scheme or what, but too often running backs get past the linebackers and don't have anybody else to beat. If he keeps that up we are going to see an instant replay against OSU of what Walker just did to us.