Balas: Herbert wanted to stay, but M wouldn't give him the long-term deal he wanted
According to Chris Balas ($), Ben Herbert wanted to stay at Michigan, and told Michigan what it would take to keep him, and Warde Manuel didn't give it to him. Manuel said at the Sherrone press conference that he was doing his "due diligence" on Herbert. Apparently he didn't do enough of it.
So we can blame Harbaugh all we want but this seems like Warde Manuel's fault for not doing what it takes to retain the most important coach in the program.
January 29th, 2024 at 4:06 PM ^
As the recent additions that osu is making would suggest and this situation deserves repeating...
You can't buy culture.
Herbert was a HUGE influence on Michigan's culture and it brought a Championship. I don't care if it was Warde, Ono, Moore or the Easter Bunny...someone eff'd this shit up big time and now we're going to feel it. I was such a big proponent of keeping Ben in the university's employment and now he's gone.
not happy.
January 29th, 2024 at 9:34 PM ^
If Santa Ono is spending more than fourteen seconds giving consideration on how to spend $4m a year for a decade to retain the man that teaches people how to do pushups, then he is a shitty university president. This is madness. Enough.
Warde's greatest failure was not turning Michigan into an NFL team so everyone would've stayed.
January 29th, 2024 at 4:17 PM ^
Maybe I'm mistaken, but it was my understanding that the AD either sets the overall budget for football staffers or it is specified in the HC's contract. The AD doesn't engage in salary negotiations for assistants unless the HC is going beyond his budget.
January 29th, 2024 at 6:28 PM ^
S&C probably not under the assistant budget.
January 29th, 2024 at 5:18 PM ^
I assume that the AD sets an overall budget for coaching salaries, and then its up to the head coach to determine how to allocate the salary to build out his staff. Requesting a budget for coodinators and staff should have been an integral part of Sherrone's contract negotiation.
But if Herbert was really asking for a 10-year guaranteed contract at $3 MM a year then there is probably not much that could be done to retain him. Last year Sherrone and Minter each made close to 1MM each. Ben Herbert was already getting paid nearly as much as each of Michigan's coordinators.
I know fans want to believe that coaches salaries are just like imaginary numbers, but there's really no way to afford spending that much for an S&C coach when you still have to go out and hire an OC and DC and have a bunch of other coaches who you are desparately trying to retain, who are also looking for raises.
January 29th, 2024 at 7:31 PM ^
There absolutely is a way.
Just stop so lavishly funding the country club sports. Football, and to a lesser extent basketball, are the revenue sources. Michigan spends way too lavishly on the country club sprots that will always be revenue drains. Spend more on football and basketball.
Spend to the level that keeps Michigan very near the top without the 19 year dry spell in Big Ten football championships that we had from late-Carr until three years ago.
From 2004 to 2021 is WAY too long of a football conference title drought. And that happened because the Athletic Department is dysfunctional and has its priorities out of whack. Your post read like an inter-office memo in the Michigan AD.
January 29th, 2024 at 8:58 PM ^
Complaining about Michigan not spending enough on football because they are losing their S&C coach who was ALREADY the highest paid S&C coach in the country is a wild take…
Data is out there showing Michigan is one of the biggest spenders when it comes to football, and you just spout nonsense…
January 30th, 2024 at 10:19 AM ^
This may be the dumbest take I have ever seen in this blog.
Remember the Barwis cult?
If you think cutting scholarships and those Olympic sports is a good idea just to retain an S&C who is demanding a 10 year agreement that is triple his own highest paid ever salary, then you have jumped the shark into SEC fandom.
If you have to cut sports to retain a darn strength coach, you are prioritizing the wrong things.
Coaching transitions are gonna mean good people leave. The key is to replace them with new talent. The checkbook alone can't stop transition. The Warde whining is out of control.
We won the Natty and everyone managed to start whining more, not less.
January 29th, 2024 at 8:54 PM ^
This story doesn't pass the sniff test. Why is Herbert negotiating with Warde and not Moore?
January 29th, 2024 at 3:42 PM ^
Warde, meet Sun
January 29th, 2024 at 3:59 PM ^
You sure there's a powerful enough rocket?
January 29th, 2024 at 4:30 PM ^
Are you saying we shouldn't be surprised that Warde doesn't seem to value strength and conditioning?
January 29th, 2024 at 8:53 PM ^
I think this much can be certain - if we go from Champs to not making the 12 team playoff Warde will be taking his talents to Miami (Ohio) or maybe Stony Brook. If either is that dumb.
January 29th, 2024 at 9:00 PM ^
Idk, I think with what Michigan was already going to be losing (even if Harbaugh stuck around) and the schedule difficultly next year, there was a pretty strong possibility we would miss the playoff anyway.
January 29th, 2024 at 3:43 PM ^
Fuck Warde. Dude's gotta go now.
January 29th, 2024 at 3:43 PM ^
No No No, Move along. Nothing to see here, folks. Herbert couldn't win a Lombardy trophy here so obviously he wouldn't have stayed... no matter what! Stop blaming, Warde! He didn't do anything! Anything!
January 29th, 2024 at 3:55 PM ^
Yeah, the Warde defenders have grown more and more insufferable in their MGoPiety.
January 29th, 2024 at 3:58 PM ^
Agreed. I don’t blame Warde for JH leaving. I blame him for stupid shit like this.
January 29th, 2024 at 4:59 PM ^
I agree that Warde is not to blame for JH leaving, but he is to blame for not doing everything he could to try and convince him to stay. This new move is baffling. There is no way that Herbert has more value to an NFL team than he does to us.
January 29th, 2024 at 7:32 PM ^
Warde cutting JH's pay in 2000 is a huge factor in JH leaving now. Warde not having his back on burger gate and l'affaire Stalions added fuel to the fire.
January 29th, 2024 at 3:43 PM ^
It seems pretty bad for Warde at this point. You can argue whether Harbaugh would have gone regardless but I think you now see why we have lost so many coaches and talent under him. People try to find a different reason every time but it seems like he is in over his head.
January 29th, 2024 at 4:58 PM ^
And yet he persists…
January 29th, 2024 at 3:44 PM ^
Nothing against Balas, but I would like another source to corroborate this.
January 29th, 2024 at 3:52 PM ^
This feels like a give the readers what they want with a scapegoat that they already hate.
If I really wanted a conspiracy, I would say it's so the fans keep any ill feelings away from blaming Jim as an added reason to say this.
January 29th, 2024 at 4:02 PM ^
Maybe, but Herbert staying makes all the sense in the world. He seems like the one guy we should have been able to keep with the right offer. This is different than Warde not being able to get Harbaugh to abandon his Superbowl dream.
January 29th, 2024 at 9:38 PM ^
So odd to me but it's almost like Herbert felt some loyalty to the coach that created his entire career. So weird that we couldn't get him to stay.
January 29th, 2024 at 4:08 PM ^
Or maybe it's not a conspiracy and Warde just sucks as AD, as the previous 4,678 pieces of evidence suggested.
January 29th, 2024 at 5:09 PM ^
Or maybe everyone that already hates Warde with the passion of 1,000 burning fires is out there seeking confirmation bias.
I don't know what's accurate or not but if its true that the highest paid S&C coach in NCAA just asked for a huge (3x?) raise and a 10 year contract, I don't care how much you like him, that is ridiculous.
Believe it or not but there is a finite amount of money and paying $3M per year for your S&C coach (50% more than the highest paid coordinator in NCAA) may not be the best allocation of funds
January 29th, 2024 at 5:25 PM ^
If you're calling Beilein, Bakich, Harbaugh, Minter & Herbert all leaving on Warde's watch "confirmation bias" then yes, I've had enough of it.
As for this "finite budget" the richest athletic department in the land supposedly has - the simple math is they offered Jim Harbaugh ~12 million to coach Michigan. They signed Sherrone Moore for 5.5 million. That leaves ~6.5 million in the budget they had for coaches.
My contention is half that would've kept Minter & Herbert at Michigan. And it wouldn't matter budgetarily if they were now not just the highest paid DC + S&C coaches in college football, but highest by a huge margin. Michigan would still be saving millions!
That's math!
January 29th, 2024 at 6:45 PM ^
And my contention is like Harbaugh, practically nothing was going to keep Minter at Michigan. (Just like Beilein)
Frankly I don’t give two shits about Warde and think he likely should be fired for reasons outside of Harbaugh. But the mob that thinks he’s to blame for everything up to and including the weather is acting hysterical.
January 29th, 2024 at 9:16 PM ^
(retracted)
January 29th, 2024 at 7:37 PM ^
You are absolutely correct. In addition, whatever huge salaries paid to ensure that Minter and/or Herbert stayed would have been investments that paid off in the long run. Staying top five will bring huge revenue. Warde is penny wise and pound foolish. Football drives the entire bus folks. Warde's way tilts the odds too much towards another RRod/Hoke swoon. Not saying that is certain to happen. Just saying that Warde's way tilts the odds the wrong way toward that sort of event.
January 29th, 2024 at 3:53 PM ^
i mean there's a little something against balas, presumably? he flings a lot of pickles at the window & they don't all stick.
January 29th, 2024 at 4:00 PM ^
That's all we need - more pickle-slinging.
January 29th, 2024 at 4:08 PM ^
Ever do that at the White Castle in Ypsilanti? Very high ‘stick’ percentage back in the day… so I’m told.
January 29th, 2024 at 3:57 PM ^
I don't believe Balas and no one else should either but Fire Warde just to be safe.
January 29th, 2024 at 4:36 PM ^
Exactly. So let me understand: for the past however many years, whenever news from Balas would be posted on this site, the entire thread would be filled with “Balas doesn’t know a goddamn thing”. But now that’s all out the window when what he says can fuel a perception bias?
Its clear nobody had good sources on the coaching situation at Michigan all season, from JUB on down. Seriously doubt that’s changed now.
January 29th, 2024 at 5:10 PM ^
Plenty against Balas, who is completely untrustworthy. Glad Jim was in his office making his plans for the spring trip last week, otherwise, he might've been in LA taking the Chargers gig!
January 29th, 2024 at 3:44 PM ^
And this is more of a reason as to why Warde needs to go. This is becoming more of an embarrassment and how inept this guy really his. Is he trying to set SM up for failure??
January 29th, 2024 at 3:59 PM ^
it could possibly be Balas that needs to go
January 29th, 2024 at 4:26 PM ^
Sure, I can certainly understand the skepticism with Balas, EJ etc., but there’s too much smoke with this, imo. We’ve seen Warde mess up with these other coaches. Why would this be any different? Since the celebration, Warde seems like he’s really about saving $$.
January 29th, 2024 at 5:03 PM ^
So much goes on behind the scenes that I can't really say what it's about, but yeah, I'm not crazy about the evolution of his staff
January 29th, 2024 at 3:44 PM ^
FUCK WARDE!!!
January 29th, 2024 at 3:45 PM ^
When will this guy get fired already???
January 29th, 2024 at 3:45 PM ^
I am not saying this isn't true. What I am saying is that after sign-gate there is really nobody on the Michigan beat who I think is a reliable source of information.
January 29th, 2024 at 3:57 PM ^
That, and with this Balas story there's no other side of the story. Like what did Herbert ask for and was it all reasonable? Maybe Warde did fuck it up. Maybe he didn't. Too many condemnations on this board are based on extremely sketchy or partial information.
January 29th, 2024 at 4:05 PM ^
What would be an unreasonable request from Herbert?
January 29th, 2024 at 4:10 PM ^
A 10 year deal
January 29th, 2024 at 4:14 PM ^
Yep..that is what Sam said on the radio this morning..just signed a 5 year deal last year (so 4 left) and asked for a 10 year deal to stay
January 29th, 2024 at 5:30 PM ^
But why is 10 years unreasonable?
He's supposedly already signed for 5. What about 10 years is inherently unreasonable?
Do you perceive Ben Herbert as having a Use By date?