A2 changes laws and will no longer allow RV parking at Pioneer
Shitters full😳
I have this picture on a t-shirt 😂
Well, this will go over well with the fans.
They want the Gameday experience to suck, don’t they? If not, they have a weird way of showing it
There's got to be an alternative to this.
It’s called “Park Elsewhere”. But that sucks.
At 6 miles per gallon in an RV and $6 per gallon by the time the season starts in Michigan a parachute drop is a break even.
Who did that??
Pioneer High School WAS the largest individual spot for RV parking. I doubt the remaining RV-capable lots combined are going to be able to handle this change in policy.
Correction: they didn't CHANGE the laws.
They simply said "holy shit there's fire code violations all over the place, we should probably address those"
Apparently there was an incident after the Indiana game last year, and then they did inspections during the OSU game and it was bad.
On November 28, 2021, the City of Ann Arbor reached out to Ann Arbor Public Schools regarding numerous life safety concerns. These concerns were the result of overnight recreational vehicles (RV) parking at the Pioneer High School parking lot. On November 26, 2021, the night before the University of Michigan versus Ohio State University football game, the Ann Arbor Fire Department did a walk-through of the site based on an incident that occurred at the Indiana game earlier in the 2021 season. This was approached from an educational perspective; no enforcement action was taken, and no citations were issued. There were a significant amount of fire code violations, violations of the City’s tent ordinance, and lack of inspection and permitting for portable generators. Firefighters checked several trailers for carbon monoxide (CO), and found several had elevated levels of CO. One trailer was at 120 PPM of CO, which could have been fatal overnight. Additionally, there was a significant volume of stored gasoline and propane next to trailers with occupants sleeping. Yet another issue was the misuse of portable heaters in tents. The fire department takes responsibility for not addressing these concerns historically. We have verified with the State of Michigan Bureau of Fire Services that the City of Ann Arbor codes, ordinances, and enforcement apply to this activity.
See:
https://www.a2schools.org/cms/lib/MI01907933/Centricity/Domain/3661/Fire%20Chief%20Kennedy%20letter%20-%20City%20of%20Ann%20Arbor%20-%20Pioneer%20Tailgate%20Parking.1.pdf
Thanks for the factual contribution. It's unsurprising to find out that a bunch of people camping overnight in a school parking lot in Michigan, late November, are at risk of various health-threatening mishaps.
Reading this, I have to think the incident at MIS with that country music festival also contributed to the decision. Didn't three or four teenagers die from essentially this? As soon as they knew about the risk, their insurance was in jeopardy. The school/city couldn't accept that liability risk.
Technically, two were 20 and one was 19.
The background above is great info which the article should have included (good journalism is dead). While I certainly understand and agree with the safety issues and potential for fire, injury or death, and I get they are trying to proactive, but it seems to me there is a middle ground between shutting it all down vs all out laissez-faire-dom to continue with RV parking/tailgating/overnighting. While I’ve never RV tailgated at Pioneer, have done so in several other stadiums.
Some quick simple thoughts or ideas that could be implemented:
- miminum distance between RV’s to allow for exhaust & air circulation and mitigate potential fire spread, say I dunno, 20-feet separation. This allows the RV-ers to extend rolling awnings or pop-up canopies adjacent to their rig anyway. Lost revenue due to spacing sucks, but maybe the parking rate has to increase
- prohibit open storage of gasoline, propane, flammables. All rig mounted propane tanks not in use to have valve locks, etc. (this is probably already a policy no one was following).
- suggest/require an operating smoke/CO detector on board (seems to me for any owner this would be a must/want to have anyway.)
- require operating fire extinguisher on board (all should have this anyway)
- admittedly this one is a long-shot/pipe-dream, but maybe invest in constructing power-pedestals to allow electrical hook-ups to eliminate/reduce generator use. They could sell it as the “greening of tailgating”. Could be done in partnership between UMAD, the City, school district & utility provider.
Seems to me this is really more of an education and awareness issue than anything.
I suspect that infrastructure like adequate fire hydrants in the parking areas may not be up to snuff either…that would have to be worked out with the city or school district to improve the system. AAFD probably also concerned about access for fire trucks if there ever is an emergency.
While I know AAFD has many better things to do on gamedays, maybe have good-will representatives out in the lot, not for citation purposes but to point out hazards might be a good PR. I realize drunk tailgaters will be less than enthusiastic about complying, but gotta start somewhere. Perhaps if they resist or defy the recommendations, citations could be issued if it comes to that.
Crazy to think that at a NW-UM game in Evanston about a decade ago, we tailgated late into the night after the game in the parking lot immediately west of Dyke Field, with an open campfire (in a metal pit), chucking log after log onto the burn. Never again I suspect.
But wait a minute..... you're being rational in your examination of the facts and options. That goes against any principles followed by the city of Ann Arbor. They base every decision on knee jerk reactions coming from worse case scenarios. Another example of how lawyers dictate all public policies in this country no matter how irrational.
Or imagine if the RV-ers themselves had been proactive. You can say that it is A2s fault for not taking a more proactive approach, but it seems many of the RVers are even more at fault.
If they seriously wanted to allow tailgaters and improve safety, they could set up a permit program where you pay an extra fee for a one time full inspection (e.g. have carbon monoxide detectors etc.) and then both fine and permanently revoke people’s permits if they violate. Could even have reciprocity with other big ten teams.
Translation: we used fire code violations to get what we want.
They couldn't have just issued warnings to those people and told them they'd be checked the next game / following season, or fined, even. Nope, ban. Which is what they wanted from the start.
Not sure why that was negged, the A2 FD got a bug in it’s arse after the Indiana game to get rid of RV’s. Could have been handled enforcing code that they never did before. Instead RV’s banned….
On brand with UM and Ann Arbor, doing everything they can to push people out of the stadium on gameday and onto their couches (for the record, I'm one of those people - gave up season tickets years ago and it was the right call).
Would trade very few moments for being in the stadium last November when we beat OSU. I'm sure it was very enjoyable from the couch as well, but for me it just isn't the same.
Yes, that was an experience that could not possibly be matched by sitting on the couch.
However, it's the mid-September games vs Non-Power 5 schools where this does take a big hit in whether or not someone decides to go or not. You can make an event out of the day in September (tailgating, post-game fun at the RV). If the only other option is getting up to drive to watch us play Uconn at noon, it doesn't seem as attractive.
I can't argue against that. I've also had my fair share of good games in person (2011 ND and 2007 MSU away come to mind) but it's just not worth my entire Saturday anymore.
That is a once in a decade or two decade experience, when youre talking about just a regular gameday it's not as ideal.
Doesn’t look like any laws were changed, just that the fire department doesn’t think it’s safe
But what's changed over the last number of decades? It was fine then but not now? How many fire emergencies have they had? And how is this different from many other large tailgating areas nation wide?
As mentioned up thread, there were 3 carbon monoxide deaths at an RV campsite at MIS last summer. Lawsuits have recently been filed.
I remeber after Faster Horses I kept seeing new articles about people dying
The justification in the article is stupid.
Wide threat of death and dismemberment--yup. The usual trifling librul bureaucratic horsepucky. :)
Dramatic much?
Did you actually read all of the justification or nah?
Hard no, I’d wager
There’s also less chance of fire issues as I watch at home in high definition, with high speed Wi-Fi and with food and drinks that are only excessively expensive due to inflation. See ya, tailgating.
no line to piss either. i just go out on the porch so I can still see the action on TV
that being said I do enjoy tailgating once a year on the golf course
This is a free country and if I wanna die from carbon monoxide poisoning in my sleep in a school parking lot after a Michigan game, then by sweet Baby Jesus I should be allowed to do so.
'Murica
Don't forget maybe blowing up the people around you!
they have the freedom to get blown up, or to leave.
'Murica
Did anyone think of the children?
If they don't want to risk getting blown up, they don't have to come outside.
...snowflakes scared of a little CO2. This country has gotten so soft.
My body, my rights.
Well, I guess that's right. You maybe should be allowed? But (there always is one, no?), your death may create liabilities which will have to be argued/litigated for a long, expensive time.
If codes were ever enforced it would not be an issue and incident’s wouldn’t have happened.. People got comfortable enforcement or following rules aren’t a thing so make everyone else pay for it…
MURICA
The question is, where will the RV folks park? One thought is Briarwood Mall parking lot in which they will have to bus into the games. That won't work. Same with the Meijer parking lot on Ann-Saline Road, just south of I-94, a near 2 mile walk. Revel/Roll bowling lot is too small. I can't think of any lot further north up Main street nor east and west on Stadium Ave either.
The RV folks who have parking at Pioneer for years will be very, very upset, good luck to all of them.
The tennis center and the commuter lot connected to it seems like a reasonable spot, it's a pretty quick walk across the golf course.
But the problem is, you're just moving the problem elsewhere... they need to spread out the RVs, a few in each lot further away from one another.
i didn't park there last year but have been for a few years. and that lot is already usually full.
I am not an RV'er. What do they do different in an RV park where they don't seem spread out any further?
All those RVs set up there was part of the fun atmosphere.
It was a potential massive tragedy waiting to happen. But it was a FUN potential massive tragedy
So is breathing
What about hot air balloons and horse and buggies?