An Obligation
11/30/2019 – Michigan 27, Ohio State 56 – 9-3, 6-3 Big Ten
Afterwards, Justin Fields said that he thought Ohio State took things more seriously:
I asked Justin Fields and JK Dobbins why Ohio State has had more success in this rivalry.... #OhioState
— Justin Rose (@JRoseWXYZ) November 30, 2019
“We take it more seriously than they do.” #Buckeyes #Wolverines #TheGame pic.twitter.com/Z4Hlj4OumE
He's probably right. This September he told the world that he took nothing but online classes. Fields was part of a university community in the same way someone in jail next to it is:
“From what I have seen, the campus is beautiful and the people around are great,” Fields said.
Even in relatively good circumstances online classes are often jokes. A lot of small liberal arts schools are scrambling to get together joke online masters degrees in a hopefully-futile bid to survive in the face of declining enrollment. Those programs exist only to give people bullshit credentials they hope will pass muster in an environment that doesn't really care to examine them.
Those are for people for whom the diploma they receive might actually mean something at some point. For an Ohio State quarterback? If Fields even does any of his own work, spelling his name will suffice to pass. I don't have many illusions about the academic standards placed on Michigan players, but I'm dead certain they actually show up on campus because I know many people who have taught or been in classes with Michigan football players. So you wonder at which point the dubious nature of college football becomes outright fraud.
"How far is too far?" is not a question that's ever troubled anyone at Ohio State. The NCAA is a joke to be exploited. Classes are a joke to be avoided. Anything not related to beating Michigan is a joke.
And, okay, you win. Whatever. Good one.
[After THE JUMP: slightly more of this]
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Michigan's not going to do that stuff. This isn't a value judgment. For a guy like Justin Fields, classes are a stupid distraction. It's reasonable to treat them like that. Michigan isn't going to do that, because the institution thinks things like going to class are important. This is also a reasonable thing to think.
What it does mean is that this is going to continue. Ohio State faced a potential reckoning point when some idiot emailed Jim Tressel about Terrelle Pryor. Gordon Gee said he hoped Tressel didn't fire him, eventually did fire Tressel when it was inevitable, and then everyone treated him like he'd martyred himself for orphans. They took their bowl ban, changed nothing, and continued beating Michigan.
That's literally all that matters in Columbus. When Fields said his bit about online classes the local paper rushed to defend him like he'd been caught lying four separate times to the NCAA. To describe their media as bootlicking does an injustice to bootlickers, who may have ill feelings about the boot in question.
Meanwhile Michigan's athletic department is so prim and proper it won't even try to dissuade hordes of Ohio squareheads from filling the seats around me every other year.
So that's how it is, and how it's going to be. Michigan's going to pretend to dignity and Ohio State's going to beat their ass. Nothing is going to change. You can be done with Don Brown all you want. Michigan can hire Super Robot Lombardi as their defensive coordinator, and Ohio State will beat his ass. Not one emotion you might have matters. You can agitate on a message board all you want and even if you get your heart's fondest desire, Ohio State is going to beat that guy's ass.
Maybe at some point Michigan will win one of the games that happens to end up close, and hooray for that. Not one thing you say or think or care about is going to change the situation.
So okay. The only thing I'm annoyed with this Monday is that I have to spend time writing this instead of talking about the basketball team, which is good and fun, because of some lingering sense of obligation. What is the optimal point at which I have discharged this duty in a way that will be minimally satisfying to the insane 20% of the fanbase who wanted a full hour of football talk on the podcast? At what point do the wishes of the 50% who asked for zero minutes of football take primacy?
Right about… now.
December 2nd, 2019 at 2:37 PM ^
how would it make any difference?
it just does.
i, for one, don't want my school - my degrees from which are my proudest personal accomplishments - to lower their academic standards so some privileged nitwits will get to puff their chests out when kids they've never met win a few more football games than they used to.
December 2nd, 2019 at 9:53 PM ^
can somebody explain the difference between this and the affirmative action policy that Michigan had in the 90's before the Supreme court ruled it unconstitutional?
December 2nd, 2019 at 12:39 PM ^
No. We should want Michigan athletes to be part of the campus community, not isolated from it. If we miss a stud recruit now and then because we want them to play school, so be it.
December 2nd, 2019 at 2:20 PM ^
I don't agree completely with this.
Ryan Day is an elite play caller. He's a savant this year. Don Brown was completely owned by him in every way. If Michigan could somehow hire an equivalent-level play caller as DC, that game could have been within a score (excluding the fumble, drops, offsides, missed RB read on 4th and 1 and other things). One problem is that it's very difficult to find that level of DC, it would be a lightning strike, and it's needed to compete with OSU. Another is that the parenthetical still exists and needs to be remedied through recruiting, development, and coaching. We're far away from OSU (nearly everyone is right now).
Celebrate the wins.
December 2nd, 2019 at 2:35 PM ^
Would he be a savant if he were calling plays for Rutgers or MSU or some other team that has little offensive talent? I've always believed that it is great players that make coaches look great. When you have a mauling O Line, a dynamic RB/QB combo to go with very talented and fast WR's, calling plays can look quite easy. If Al Borges were the OC, they would still be 12-0.
December 2nd, 2019 at 5:19 PM ^
Well the results would be different for sure. But he's been there 3 years and they have run 3 different schemes in those 3 years to accomadate for his personnel. And, he's been successful doing it.
I'd say that's pretty good coaching. Not saying he's coaching Jesus or anything but he should get some credit.
December 2nd, 2019 at 9:50 AM ^
I have a legitimate question, for anyone that thinks that we should be able to beat Ohio State: why?
December 2nd, 2019 at 9:55 AM ^
Who has beaten Ohio, consistently, in the last 20 years? Anyone?
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:14 AM ^
It's not about doing it consistently. We will never do it consistently anymore with the way things are set up now. It's about how MSU, and even fucking Purdue figure out how to do it once or twice every 5-6 years. We are far superior to those 2 programs. Guys like Rob Renes would have simply refused to let something like the last 2 years happen.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:23 AM ^
There is a big difference between Purdue / Sparty / anyone else and us. When OSU loses to those teams, it is because OSU often overlooks them. OSU never overlooks us. As we have heard many times, OSU spends a portion of every single practice working on something related to the Game. I can guarantee you that aside from the week before playing Purdue / MSU, OSU does not even think about those teams.
Unfortunately, we get 100% of OSU's attention, and that is why we will never catch them looking ahead. It's sad, but they are just at a different level than we are, and that will continue unless something seismic happens (like the NCAA growing a set of balls).
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:31 AM ^
OSU is talented enough that they could probably practice for the UM game every single week and still run through the schedule with only 1 loss.
December 2nd, 2019 at 11:20 AM ^
I think they might do that already.
December 2nd, 2019 at 11:35 AM ^
In retrospect it's pretty clear they did this the entire second half of the 2018 season
December 2nd, 2019 at 12:53 PM ^
They've pretty much admitted as such. Why do you think they were so caught off guard by Maryland's normal offense? And then dropped 62 on us the next week? They practice for us, almost exclusively and have been doing so for a LONG time.
Why we don't do the same I'll never know.
December 2nd, 2019 at 1:49 PM ^
The reason UM doesn't do that, and probably cant do that, is the program isnt in a position where they can go out with minimal preparation and beat 10 of the 11 teams on the schedule.
OSU steam rolls just about everyone on their schedule. Other then UM they maybe have 1 or 2, some years maybe 3 teams, where they need to devote all resources the week of the game to beat the team they are playing on Saturday.
OSU's talent level is so far above most of the teams they play, they can go in with a vanilla game plan and still usually cruise to a win.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:39 AM ^
Agreed. If it wasn't clear from many recent videos of Urban Meyer obsessing in team speeches abotu what Michigan does, then you have been living under a rock. They practice for Michigan - constantly.
Why did Wiscy lose to Illinois and now is West champ? Come on. Get a clue. OSU can care less about Purdue they will give all their best for Michigan.
This argument of random teams catching them snoozing and equating to that WHY NO MICHIGAN DO THAT needs to die.
December 2nd, 2019 at 11:19 AM ^
After the last two games you must be sniffing glue if you don't think OSU is on a different level than Michigan. And the crazy stupid thing is they appear to be getting better.
December 2nd, 2019 at 9:55 PM ^
and MSU had the benefit of PED's . As evidenced by one of the bulloughs and this Joe Bachie character.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:25 AM ^
Purdue can sneak up on OSU and catch them unprepared and unmotivated. Michigan can't. That's the biggest difference.
Also, Rob Renes played at a time when the talent level between the two schools wasn't so disparate. I think questioning the team's drive or motivation to win is silly. I haven't seen one iota of evidence that this team is any less motivated to win than the ones that did in the 90's.
December 2nd, 2019 at 12:41 PM ^
Ohio State only loses in the B1G when they don't prepare/show up for an opponent, which will never happen against Michigan because Michigan is OSU's only rival.
December 2nd, 2019 at 1:00 PM ^
You're looking at it from the wrong angle. It is SO HARD to go undefeated no matter how much talent you have.
December 2nd, 2019 at 2:42 PM ^
yes, why can't we be more like fucking purdue.
the "guys like rob renes wouldn't let this happen" thing is silly. these kids are every bit as tough, and work every bit as hard, and are every bit of everything else you can name, as "guys like rob renes."
suggesting otherwise does the current group a real disservice. they bust their asses every single day, just like "guys like rob renes" did. this isn't about effort or focus or some weird nonspecific hard-assedness.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:20 AM ^
I've been asking people the same thing. OSU isn't just killing us, they're killing everyone. OSU is 54-6 since Harbaugh got to Michigan, thats basically 1 loss per year.
I think would annoys people is that MSU, PSU, Iowa and Purdue have beaten them in the last couple years and we are a much better program than 3 of those schools and slightly better than PSU.
December 2nd, 2019 at 12:44 PM ^
MSU hasn't beaten them since 2015, when they went to the CFP. The last three years they've lost by 45, 20 and 24 points.
December 2nd, 2019 at 5:23 PM ^
In the Harbaugh era PSU is slighty better. I think they have one more win and a B1G title.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:27 AM ^
I'd settle for being "Auburn" to their "Alabama" in The Game.
Auburn rises up periodically, especially at home, and bites Alabama in the ass in comic and humiliating fashion. One "Kick Six" Auburn win is worth a dozen nondescript Alabama wins.
And then when Auburn does break free of Alabama in a given year, they cash in and win the Conference and make the Playoff / BCS title game and even win the National Championship game.
Alabama has dominated Auburn . . . but Auburn has done just enough that it doesn't feel like it.
I'll settle for that.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:29 AM ^
Yes, this^^^^
December 2nd, 2019 at 2:19 PM ^
Yes but - Auburn cheats like mad dogs just to get to beat bama occasionally, in crazy circumstances like the Kick-6.
Auburn was Cam's, what, 4th school?
Michigan is pretty fuckin far from being Auburn - in both the bad ways and the good ones!
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:32 AM ^
Michigan needs to adopt Dantonio’s little brother disrespect persona I think. We are OSUs little brother and we need to have more of a chip on our shoulder when preparing and stop acting like we are equal. We need that “pride comes before the fall” and “it’s not over, it will never be older” stuff. Yes, I know it seems silly but that stuff works in rivalry games.
December 2nd, 2019 at 12:00 PM ^
At this point, I just don't believe that anyone in Schembechler Hall doesn't think about, and do something about OSU every day. They all must've have felt this way after last year - thinking Michigan finally had the upper hand and then were smacked down historically.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:52 AM ^
Auburn is 4-6 against the mighty Alabama with roster talent similar to ours.
bUt MiChIgAn WiLl NeVeR CoMpEte
December 2nd, 2019 at 11:19 AM ^
You're completely ignoring the fact that Auburn doesn't worry about integrity, going to classes, and the other stuff that Brian mentioned in the post any more than Alabama does. So while the talent might be on par (though I don't really know if that's the case) there are other handicaps for Michigan that no SEC team concerns themselves with outside of Vanderbilt.
December 2nd, 2019 at 1:57 PM ^
Frankly, I'm getting really tired of the bUt wE hAve InTegRiTy argument.
A) No we don't. Michigan does their fair share of shady shit too.
B) Who gives a shit? None of that honestly matters at all. Lose with integrity all you want, but you're still a loser. No one ever remembers the teams/people that had integrity and failed.
Michigan football is trying to be the captain going down with the ship because "that's what men" do, when everyone else is hopping on the ample supply of lifeboats and moving on with their lives.
December 2nd, 2019 at 12:01 PM ^
Auburn is a football factory that cheats too dummy.
December 2nd, 2019 at 5:45 PM ^
Weird that auburn and Michigan have similar ranked recruiting classes but one clearly cheats and one doesn’t
December 2nd, 2019 at 1:27 PM ^
Honestly, it's a bad comparison. Auburn and Alabama play by the same rules (which are pretty similar to OSU's rules). Bama just plays better but, because they play by the same rule book, the series is closer to even.
OSU and Michigan don't even play by the same rules. If you want to compare us to a rival that plays by similar rules, use ND. And the series has been fairly even, despite us having had some terrible years along the way.
December 2nd, 2019 at 2:11 PM ^
Michigan is the little old man in the fedora hat that drives exactly 55 mph on the 4-lane interstate in dry sunny weather because "That's the law" . . . while everybody else zooms past him going 70 mph because even traffic engineers will tell you that 55 mph is arbitrary and is unnecessarily low for modern cars on interstates.
Then one day he'll find that they raised the speed limit to 70 mph because that's what makes sense. The 55 mph never really mattered, and those "cheating" speeders were right all along.
Pay the players. And let them come back and finish their degree (or get a real degree) when they are done playing.
That's what makes sense.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:11 AM ^
Here's why: we're fucking Michigan and beating Ohio is our goddamn duty. Imagine that school in the 90's under Cooper just bending over for eternity because losing to Michigan "is what it is and there's no changing that ". Imagine telling John Beilein that Michigan State is too good at basketball and cheats so you'll never beat them or flip the script with a clean program. Imagine Purdue or Iowa or Penn State or Michigan State convincing themselves they'll never beat Ohio because the talent gap is too big.
Brady f'n Hoke went into Columbus with a 5-6 squad and a 3rd string runningback and a battered QB and miserable o-line against the freaking national champions that year and the game was in reach in the 2nd half til Drake tore his ACL.
Beating Ohio is hard, but not impossible. And it's Jim's job to solve it. If he can't, we go and find someone who can.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:18 AM ^
If he can't, we go and find someone who can.
Yeah, that's the real easy part right there.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:23 AM ^
Michigan is 3-17 vs OSU since 2000. UM hasn’t won in Columbus since 2000.
Through four coaches running different styles of offense and defense, fast or bulk...Michigan hasn’t found a way to beat OSU more than once a decade.
December 2nd, 2019 at 1:59 PM ^
High school freshman have seen Michigan beat Ohio State exactly once in their lifetimes.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:32 AM ^
False parallels. Michigan in the 90s wasn't what OSU is now. The thing that made the 90s weird was that OSU was frequently the favorite and shit the bed against Michigan. We're not living in an opposite era. In the last 15 years OSU has been favored to beat Michigan 13 times. Of the two times Michigan was favored, they won once.
December 2nd, 2019 at 11:30 AM ^
This needs to be upvoted more and is probably the most salient point of this thread. Their program over the past 15-20 years has just been materially better than ours in terms of talent and coaching. In many of those games they were also favored by large margins. Given that we are the last game and they are maniacal about preparing for us, there is no ability to slip under the radar or catch them at anything lest than their best. Also, they are generally playing for the Big East title, chance at a national title, etc. Just provides that much more incentive for them. We have generally playing for pride during that period
December 2nd, 2019 at 11:42 AM ^
Agreed. Ohio State was favored by 9 in 1995 and 17 in 1996. Surprisingly, we were actually favored by 1 in 1993.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:34 AM ^
I used to feel that way, but it is just silly.
Look at the problem and tell me how one can reasonably expect a solution:
1. The talent gap between us and them is insane. They have 5* at half of the positions on the field, high 4* at the others, and their backups are more of the same just waiting for their shot. Guys like Gray, Hawkins and Metellus would not even make their 3rd string. Not knocking those guys, but this is a fact. We get guys like Peppers, Gary, DPJ and Dax and celebrate because they are once every few year recruits. They get 3-5 guys of that caliber EVERY CLASS.
2. Because of their 2-decade dominance, and our corresponding 1.5-decade long slump, we are simply not relevant to top recruits out of state. We haven't made a single BCS CG or playoffs since either was created, and have not played in a single B1G CG. Ever. Let that sink in. For almost all recruits that do not have tied to the school, we are no different that Miami, Nebraska or Tennessee. Let that sink in. At least Miami and Tennessee are down south and have weather / hot girls to attract recruits. We like to think that we are more, but we are essentially Nebraska.
Harbaugh has a top 10 winning percentage over his 5 years hear. If you read Brian's post about Fields' "online study program," (which does on at almost all of the schools that have coaches with higher winning percentages than Harbaugh), you will realize that we are simply not playing by the same set of rules as OSU. It's not that different than if they had 5 downs per possession and we still needed to make first down in 4. How, under such a situation, is Jim supposed to "solve it"??
December 2nd, 2019 at 7:27 PM ^
1) If you think Metellus isn't competing for a starting job at OSU, you simply don't know the metrics. There is a gap, but it wasn't athletic on Saturday, it was in the trenches (and mental errors).
2) This is utter nonsense. Yes, Michigan is a tier below Alabama, OSU, Clemson, etc., but the average fan knows they are a good, not great, program.
3) Michigan recruits at a top 10-15 level on average, and they recruit nationally. We are in a way better place than Nebraska. WTF are you talking about?
The main issue since Harbaugh has been that he hasn't quite maximized his talent and OSU has. I truly believe the turning point was '16. Yes, Michigan made mistakes, but they got absolutely hosed. Since then OSU has improved their already great recruiting and added Ryan Day. Don Brown has put up great numbers at Michigan against any offense that isn't great, but I believe he should be let go because the '18 game plan was God awful and this year featured mistakes that shouldn't happen in the last game of the season, let alone a rivalry game. The one style of defense that has been used effectively by teams with less talent against spread offenses is the one he has been vocally unwilling to play (Quarters). This game featured terrible gap integrity and safeties getting beat where they absolutely can't be beat. Even if that isn't coaching, it's coaching.
I think Gattis has proven himself and the defense needs to simplify and focus on the fundamentals. A defensive coordinator with recruiting chops is a must. Ugh....
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:35 AM ^
The fact that Brady Hoke is more competitive against OSU is concerning. I don’t think firing Harbaugh is the answer, but it appeared that Hoke teams would get up for that game compared to Harbaugh teams now. In 2013, running lanes appeared opened, Devin was sharp and calm in the pocket, we threw it all out on the line. We didn’t make earth shattering mistakes.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:42 AM ^
OSU wasn't full on Bama elite yet when Hoke was coaching. It took Meyer 4-5 recruiting classes to get the SEC model from his UF days at full steam. Now that the "infrastructure" is in place to run the football factory, they are at a different level than Hoke era OSU.
December 2nd, 2019 at 10:54 AM ^
Yet Auburn has beaten them 4 times in the last 10. 2 of 3.
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