Sanderson filed formal HR complaint against Howard per Brendan Quinn
https://theathletic.com/5134471/2023/12/13/juwan-howard-michigan-basketball/
According to three team and university sources, speaking on the condition of anonymity because they’re not authorized to speak publicly on internal university personnel issues, Sanderson filed an HR claim following a heated dispute with Howard on Dec. 7..
...
The confrontation between Howard and Sanderson stemmed from a disagreement between an athletic trainer and senior guard Jace Howard, Juwan’s 22-year-old son. Jace Howard has not played this season with a stress fracture in his right knee and tibia, and questioned why he’s yet to be cleared to play.
[ED- I cut the quoted part down. Please don't c/p most of someone's article]
December 13th, 2023 at 6:08 PM ^
I'd encourage everyone to go back and read Seth's columns about the Wisconsin thing.
I feel like the narrative has shifted and people are forgetting how that whole thing went down. It started with Gard grabbing Juwan in the handshake line. And two Wisconsin assistants pushed/grabbed Terrance Williams.
But now that the basketball team has had some losses it has shifted to Juwan is a violent person. Which idk maybe he is, maybe he deserves to be fired depending how this HR investigation turns out. But let it play out, and don't fall victim to repeating the lazy media narrative that "Juwan assaulted a coach", as if it wasn't way more nuanced than that.
December 14th, 2023 at 2:22 PM ^
I’ll go back to what I said right after the Wisconsin slap: if that had been Izzo/Fran/whoever this place would have immediately and unanimously demanded that coach be fired. This whole “his arm was grabbed, someone grabbed Williams” is just beside the point: a coach should be breaking up that kind of bullshit not jumping right in and hitting somebody. Howard’s conduct there was ridiculous.
December 13th, 2023 at 2:49 PM ^
How can you in good faith actually write this? Consistent rumors? Really? Like I said in my other posts. Never will I defend or try to defend another grown mans job. But when other I suspect grown individuals take a stance on rumors, it makes me glad that I've never had to work, study, nor fraternize with those persons ever in life! Thank God!
December 13th, 2023 at 5:15 PM ^
Watching his loss of control in person and/or on TV, multiple times (in at least one case where his own players had to restrain him), is NOT "rumors. " Is it zero tolerance for him (or were we mis-informed about that)? Or is it zero plus x tolerance? , in which case, I think we need the value of x described.
December 13th, 2023 at 8:29 PM ^
did you see Fran McCaffrey get kicked out of the Iowa game?
December 13th, 2023 at 2:03 PM ^
At the end of the day it’s a heated argument between 2 coaches…and frankly if this report is correct, Sanderson has some blame. He didn’t have to air out Jace & Juwan like he did. Juwan does have to take blame for how he reacted too. Both adults could’ve been better
December 13th, 2023 at 2:06 PM ^
Well, the rubber meets the road, because hopefully a proper investigation reveals what actually happened, rather than just rumors.
December 13th, 2023 at 2:16 PM ^
I think it has likely already been fairly accurately reported at this point what happened, at least in the ballpark. The question is, if there was no physical altercation, what is it, really? Zero tolerance cannot mean that you get fired for anything anybody reports regardless of if you did anything wrong or how trivial it may have been. Sanderson is a big dude. Possibly Juwan called him on something and he did not take it well. Also, it may have nothing to do with the confrontation itself. Possibly Juwan "relieved him of his duties" to the extent he can and that is what the HR complaint is. (He notably did not travel to Iowa).
December 13th, 2023 at 4:09 PM ^
Sanderson's reputation has been sterling. Howard's has not. If Howard "relieved him of his duties," it further shows a lack of judgement and leadership. If there was ANY hint of a threat, he needs to go.
December 13th, 2023 at 2:43 PM ^
Considering Sanderson has been at UM since 2009 and hasn’t had any other issues during his tenure (at least not publicly), I’m willing take this complaint at face value.
Everyone, including Howard, deserves due process and to share their side of the story but HR complaints have a way of opening a Pandora’s box for some folks. I really hope this is the only interaction that needs addressing.
Lastly, I think Howard is not having a good time and with his recent health issues and the weird-ass coaching dynamics upon his pseudo-return to the bench, I can’t help but think it’s best to mutually break up. Getting tossed on a technical or even talking shit once in a while is fine but everything gets so damn escalated with this guy it feels like a “when” situation, not “if”, that another physical altercation is coming.
December 13th, 2023 at 2:54 PM ^
If--as Goodman reported (a highly suspect source, already antagonistic to Juwan) that Sanderson began yelling at JACE that the culture was f'd up--in front of other players--then clearly he bears some blame. Robbie Hummel rightly offered that Juwan should have demanded that Sanderson speak to him in private, but Sanderson (again, if the account is true) had already poisoned the well. Sanderson was basically announcing to the players that the program was f'd up. Maybe looking for a fight?
And--said this elsewhere, too--but who bears responsibility for "the culture," especially if Juwan has been absent for months? It wouldn't be hard to believe that morale has been low.
People in this thread, proclaiming that they have NOW heard enough. . . based on the idea that an HR claim was filed? Yeah, now they're really in possession of the full picture. /s
December 13th, 2023 at 2:28 PM ^
A formal HR complaint might also be used by someone who thinks they're imminently going to be fired, so as to set up leverage for favorable severance terms or create a record for a possible later lawsuit. So I don't think the fact of an HR complaint alone is enough to attribute responsibility.
December 13th, 2023 at 3:28 PM ^
This can be true, but in this case, on what grounds would we be firing Sanderson, who is in his 15th year as our S&C coach and generally is considered one of the best in his field?
December 13th, 2023 at 5:17 PM ^
At the end of the day Sanderson reports to the head coach and or acting head coach about what is going on with the health of players. So if Jace was being dumb about rehab then Juwan and Phil would have known about it long before the argument...
So if Sanderson felt like Juwan the coach and dad wasn't doing anything about Jace in regards to rehab, that's what more than likely caused him to lose his shit.
Now what it's going to come down to is what ALL did Sanderson say??? Saying something specific about a player that is out of line could get a coach fired up, but that would also get the father of the player fired up also if not more depending on what was said... add the alleged comment about the program being f'd to it this and its just going to add more fuel to the fire...
December 13th, 2023 at 3:43 PM ^
And let's not forget that HR departments are there to protect the school or business...not the employees.
December 13th, 2023 at 4:12 PM ^
They both have reputations within the university. The HR complaint was most likely warranted. Hopefully we'll have a better picture soon of what transpired.
December 13th, 2023 at 3:16 PM ^
HR complaints are non-trivial.
Spoken like someone who has never worked in a large organization full of petty greivances.
I don't think the existence of this report is any more informative than the existence of the rumors that have been discussed ad nauseum. The university will investigate, it will be resolved. If Juwan violated policy, he should be punished. If it was severe, he should be fired. If he didn't, then his job depends on his performance.
December 13th, 2023 at 4:11 PM ^
Exactly! There are offices with Karens all over the country stirring up mess all the time for petty reasons
December 13th, 2023 at 4:34 PM ^
Going back to your previous post - I still agree with you that media has it in for Michigan. And it's a separate issue that needs to be addressed by the University with regard to PR. And Goodman and BQ are both anti-Michigan hacks.
December 13th, 2023 at 5:57 PM ^
"to some extent" lol you don't say.
December 13th, 2023 at 1:45 PM ^
According to three team and university sources, speaking on the condition of anonymity because they’re not authorized to speak publicly on internal university personnel issues, Sanderson filed an HR claim following a heated dispute with Howard on Dec. 7.
Leaky leaky leaky. There's at least a faction that does not support Howard, if not more than just a faction.
December 13th, 2023 at 2:54 PM ^
So because 1/5 of the staff spoke out you're assuming that they don't like Juwan? Gotcha! Just like the other rumors you've surmised actually nothing!
December 13th, 2023 at 3:01 PM ^
I am surmising that the people leaking stories about HR complaints being filed against Juwan don't like Juwan, yes. Also whoever was saying to reporters that "the culture is bad" or whatever, I assume those people also don't like Juwan (they may be the same people as Quinn's sources).
I don't feel like I'm taking a big leap here.
December 13th, 2023 at 4:35 PM ^
I know you're in the know but as a previous basketball player and of course coach you'll have to remember Sir. The people who spoke in anonymity were coaches. Remember that there are still University of Michigan basketball players who were actually in attendance. I try not to openly go there at times but I'll assure you that at this point, Juwan still has a few human beings on his side. All clicks are good clicks when you're a reporter.
December 13th, 2023 at 4:44 PM ^
I just want to recap my understanding of our exchange so far.
Me: The people leaking this don't like Howard.
You: So you think that because people leaked stuff about Howard that means they don't like Howard?
Me: Yes.
You: Some people actually like Howard!
----
I'm sensing hostility but honestly don't understand why.
December 13th, 2023 at 5:52 PM ^
There's none. I was addressing the fact that there were persons leaking info. Rumors. That is a fact! I'm only saying that there will eventually be more than one piece of the pie put together before one slice is eaten.
December 13th, 2023 at 1:46 PM ^
Guess we'll find out soon here if the zero-tolerance policy means 0 tolerance or 1+ tolerances.
Glad Sanderson went the HR route in any case, hopefully that provides some job security until they figure out what will happen to Juwan.
December 13th, 2023 at 1:49 PM ^
I mean, quantum fluctuations, Heisenberg uncertainty principle… when is zero really zero? Never. Well… almost never; never itself fluctuates…
December 13th, 2023 at 1:46 PM ^
the athletic department's flagship teams both appear to be a bit of a mess. thank god we're actually good at football right now.
December 13th, 2023 at 1:51 PM ^
no better time to rebuild the basketball program than under the glow of a football title run
December 13th, 2023 at 1:47 PM ^
Well that sounds like something more serious than a couple dudes shoving and pushing.
December 13th, 2023 at 1:47 PM ^
Yeah............not ideal. It's probably best to part ways before something truly embarrassing happens, which at this point seems kind of inevitable.
December 13th, 2023 at 1:49 PM ^
Juwan's done. I'm most interested in DeVries from Drake
December 13th, 2023 at 2:02 PM ^
Hopefully in Harbaugh's new deal we can include a 15min 1:1 meeting where he explains how to identify a portal target who will actually be admitted vs sorting high to low on 247 rankings and offering scholarships
December 13th, 2023 at 2:55 PM ^
Why don't you call HR and let them know.
December 13th, 2023 at 1:51 PM ^
It’s Juwover!!!!
December 13th, 2023 at 1:57 PM ^
Juwan? More like Juwoff.
December 13th, 2023 at 3:42 PM ^
Howward? Backwards
December 13th, 2023 at 1:54 PM ^
What?? I was assured by Howard supporters that this was nothing and would blow over in a week! How dare this complaint contradict that narrative about a coach who already has two noticeable rage incidents!
Fab Five fan. Love Juwan. Have not cared for his tenure as coach.
December 13th, 2023 at 8:09 PM ^
The basketball team, for me at least, has been near unwatchable the past two seasons. I hate that, because I love basketball.
December 13th, 2023 at 1:55 PM ^
So Howard can't keep his hands to himself and Tucker can't keep his hands off himself?
December 13th, 2023 at 1:58 PM ^
It just blows my mind that Howard keeps making this jump to "Fight me!" mode, like where is this coming from for a guy who was so highly regarded when he got here?
December 13th, 2023 at 2:00 PM ^
He’s from Chicago…
December 13th, 2023 at 3:04 PM ^
“He said to me, ‘Juwan, I’m not going to let you talk to me. You don’t talk to me ever again,’ and he charged at me,” Howard said. “And that right there, I don’t know how you guys were raised, but how I was raised by my grandmother and also by Chicago, because I was raised by Chicago. I grew up in the South Side. When guys charge you, it’s time to defend yourself, especially when a grown man charges you.
“That right there, I went into defense mode and forgetting exactly where I’m at, because that’s not the right way how to handle the situation when you come at and charge someone. I didn’t charge him. So when he charged me, I reacted, and I reacted out of defense. That’s it. Words were exchanged, and then I got tossed. That’s the story.”
December 13th, 2023 at 8:23 PM ^
The most ridiculous quote ever.
December 13th, 2023 at 3:08 PM ^
It is strange how he was always the calm one as a player but as a coach is such a powderkeg.
December 13th, 2023 at 4:07 PM ^
I love Juwan, but my personal opinion is that he's over-reactive emotionally as a Coach because he literally feels responsible for protecting each of the players like they were his own kid. And going further, he didn't have a father in his life - so the job of "protecting the kids" is something he values very highly. My own opinion based on simple observations, and I still love Juwan - but I think he's over his head with regard to running the program & I worry about his health.
December 13th, 2023 at 6:33 PM ^
Nah. He doesn't overreact emotionally, he's overeacts physically. Tell me how it's different than the crap we criticize Draymond green for?