Wagner
What was up with Wagner yesterday? It was a great win, but our "best" player was hesitant, tuning down open 3's, not driving with the manner in which we are used to. When watching the 2nd half, in an important back-and-forth part of the game, he was not out there.
Anyone else notice this? There were 4 or 5 times I was screaming at the TV for him to take the open 3. Usually for him, that is a layup.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:28 AM ^
Please just shut the hell up
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:40 AM ^
Drop the negbomb on this OP!
February 22nd, 2021 at 10:23 AM ^
The proper response is Feagin.
February 22nd, 2021 at 12:46 PM ^
Oh, I thought it was hook'em, my bad.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:28 AM ^
His shots weren’t falling as well as the other players so he hesitated. I definitely think Wagner would be better if he was more aggressive offensively but I didn’t mind him dishing it out to others having a better day.
Also I don’t think Wagner is the best player on the team. Maybe the one with the highest NBA ceiling. But best would probably be Livers or Dickinson on any given night
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:29 AM ^
I really don't understand why Wagner gets so much hate. He has games where he fills it up like against Rutgers, and then he has games where his defense and passing and IQ take over.
The dude scored when needed, still knocked down shots, and ran the offense. I swear, nobody can just be happy.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:32 AM ^
I agree with you! No hate for Wagner at all. He does his job well and his length on defense is outstanding. Camp Sanderson and an off-season training with Mo has made him into a great player. I think his ceiling could be even higher. But he’s been playing really well
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:37 AM ^
Oh his ceiling is definitely higher. I wouldn't be surprised to see him be a lottery pick based off his ceiling.
February 22nd, 2021 at 12:49 PM ^
I love Wagner but he's not a lottery pick. Great college player; doesn't have the athletic upside that NBA teams want.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:47 AM ^
The team scored 90 pts in 40 minutes. How many basketballs can you have on the floor at once? This isn't an All Star weekend skills challenge.
February 22nd, 2021 at 10:47 AM ^
I agree, but I think some people expect him to be more consistent offensively, which I guess is valid? His scoring volume isn't super consistent, but we also don't need it to be and still impacts the game is so many ways
February 22nd, 2021 at 11:03 AM ^
Is he getting hate?
Seriously, anyone who dogs a player for having a quiet game hasn't watched the basketball team this year. There isn't a guy on the roster who hasn't had quiet games, and yet here we are projected as a 1 seed.
This is not a team that needs any one guy to have a big game to win. The fact that a guy may have a quiet game, or be defended in a way to make them less of a factor, and yet the team still has the weapons to win is one of the most exciting aspects of this team.
Dickinson just got off a run of a handful of pretty subpar games. Livers has been good but he had some duds earlier in the season. There are games where Chaundee is totally invisible, and games where Mike Smith takes a couple bad shots and finishes with 5 points and a bad A/TO ratio.
Except for the one game where Eli was gone and we were due for a stinker, they've all been wins.
So Wagner, who is a good but not dominant offensive player, has it a little rough. We just put up the best offensive performance of the season in the Big Ten.
I think the vast majority of consistent fans of this team know that.
February 22nd, 2021 at 11:21 AM ^
Agreed. Unless every guy goes off in every game, someone will complain. Maybe next game against Iowa, Wagner goes off and Smith or Brown are quieter.
As long as we keep winning, it doesn't matter who had the big game. Style points don't matter.
Our team played great and beat a very, very good OSU team that played well. Just enjoy it.
February 22nd, 2021 at 1:38 PM ^
I swear, nobody can just be happy.
We need MOAR bitching about the refs posts and threads
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:30 AM ^
Feagin
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:30 AM ^
Beethoven
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:47 AM ^
was a fraud. word has it that phil martelli wrote all the music.
February 22nd, 2021 at 9:15 AM ^
^^current leader in "snappy comeback" category for today.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:30 AM ^
He's been second guessing 3s all season. He started out the year 1-8 in the first four games. Since then, he's been shooting 40% from deep. We need him to shoot more.
But his confidence comes in and out. I was kinda surprised he wasn't out there late, but Juwan wanted the two guards and Chaundee played great D all game, so he got Franz' minutes. Franz still had a major impact with 6 boards, 4 assists and had six FTA.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:32 AM ^
EXACTLY! The guy does a little bit of everything and is vital in every win. Some fans are just too casual and only look at points.
February 22nd, 2021 at 9:35 AM ^
Chaundee also drilled 3 straight 3's when we needed them in the first half, so that helped his case for more minutes. Brooks and Livers got the most minutes, while Wagner was in the next tier down. What I recall, though, in the last two minutes, Juwan was rotating Smith and Chaundee on offense and defense every trip up and down the court. I thought everyone was working for the extra pass the whole game, not just Wagner. This is a special team and one that plays without ego. I credit the staff for creating this culture.
February 22nd, 2021 at 11:19 AM ^
Then again, perhaps he's been shooting 40% because he's been more selective.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:31 AM ^
Justin Feagin
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:35 AM ^
I'm not sure if you noticed.... but we fucking won.... he was the only starter that didn't hit double figures in scoring, he had 9, with 6 rebounds and 4 assists. That's called TEAM BASKETBALL
FFS
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:45 AM ^
A very important point. We see game after game what the TV folks keep saying, and Mr. Blue in PA reemphasized, is that they play as a team.
That's a crucial strength of any strong team, and certainly of this one.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:37 AM ^
He made a great euro step for a big layup late in the second half and had a hell of a pass on a fast break to Chaundee.
Look how good our team is. Our best prospect who has been one of our best players all B1G season had an off game yesterday and we still won vs a Top-4 team on the road in a game where we broke 90 points. Good on Juwan for recognizing who was playing well and keeping Chaundee in longer than he normally would.
February 22nd, 2021 at 11:23 AM ^
Looked like a walk to me..... love this team... man, we are a full seven players deep... 8 if you count Davis. But Brown and Johns...starting anywhere else in the Big Ten I think.
February 22nd, 2021 at 3:19 PM ^
Wasn't a travel. He picked up his dribble then took 2 steps. Perfectly legal and fantastic footwork
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:38 AM ^
Simple answer is matchups. I would bet OSU had a plan in place to neutralize him. He played patient, didn’t force anything or take bad shots and was, as always, solid on defense. I wouldn’t look too much into it. This team is deep and will have guys step up or step back as the game dictates.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:38 AM ^
Horrible title, and yet the content is somehow even worse.
February 22nd, 2021 at 9:26 AM ^
Usually how it works really. I figured this was going to be a bad post based on the title alone.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:41 AM ^
He's an emotional player and it looks like he gets in his own head. Even if he isnt "on", him being on the floor is an asset since he draws attention. We won the game and I wont be overly critical.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:44 AM ^
Big game nerves
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:50 AM ^
Personally I believe this is one of the reasons this team is so good. Guys realize when it's not their night and do their best to get other involved. We've seen the same thing out of just about everyone of the starters. Somebodies always there ready to pick up the slack and be "The Man" for a particular game. Yesterday it was Hunter and Brown who stepped to the forefront. It will probably be someone else the next game. Team basketball is a beautiful thing.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:51 AM ^
He's a year younger than Hunter.
Franz is coming along just fine.
February 22nd, 2021 at 11:35 AM ^
Absolutely. He turned 19 last summer. Mo was the same way. He was 20(!) when we declared for the NBA after the Nova title game. Both Wagner brothers are way ahead of most college players for their young ages.
Franz is the age that many post-HS Prep players are and he's almost done with his second Big Ten season. He's progressing at the same rate as Mo and if we amazingly get him to return for next year, Franz could be VERY special.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:51 AM ^
Wagner's arch this season has been odd.
At the beginning, he looked kind of lost and really not fitting into the flow of the game.
Recently, he has been MUCH better getting to the rack, rebounding, etc.
Yesterday, he did look a little like he did in early season.
He passes up a lot of open looks and gets away with a TON of travels on his first dribble; I feel like he takes a step or two before putting the ball down every single time. I still see him declaring after this season, but there's a lot of work to do before he can be a solid contributor on an NBA roster.
Small complaints for sure- sometimes I think his body is moving faster than his mind.
February 22nd, 2021 at 12:05 PM ^
If you think he's bad at it don't watch Brandon in his first few possessions each game. He's like a puppy with that excited/nervous first step, and if he picks up the travel call he's ruined for the rest of the game.
I think he could be a huge x-factor for the team if he could just sort that out (and maybe get rid of his pump fake in the mid range that keeps getting him blocked).
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:51 AM ^
Just freaking enjoy it.
February 22nd, 2021 at 9:11 AM ^
It's ok to analyze everything, even when the team is doing really well.
February 22nd, 2021 at 9:28 AM ^
Sure, but God forbid he'd have an off night. Certainly wasn't his best game but he wasn't terrible out there. So he had a mediocre game. Whatever.
February 22nd, 2021 at 9:32 AM ^
Uh- that's not my point at all, and I really haven't paid attention to the initial post.
Yes, players will have off-nights. I get it.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:54 AM ^
He was a little too cautious but he made some nice dishes late in the game. You can’t expect everyone to score 15 points every single game.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:58 AM ^
Honestly right now, his passing is the best part of his game. His offense comes and goes, but when he gets into the lane, I'm confident he'll make the right decision.
He is exceptional at waiting until the very, very last second to make the pass.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:56 AM ^
I mentioned in the game thread that he looked unsure of himself with open looks from 3, and I'll maintain that. When that confidence blossoms - the confidence to throw up a three when it feels open to him - his ceiling is going to go up like a rocket. And he's not a bad shooter now! His confidence seems to come and go, though, mostly because he's still really young. He'll grow into it, and when he does he'll make big brother Mo look like a bench warmer.
Aside from that single issue, the kid is an awesome bball player and he earned every single minute he played yesterday. He was aggressive on offense, too - I mean, didn't you see those drives and assists? And his Gumby arms on defense changed several shots.
Franz is a lifetime starter for good reason, he doesn't need to rationalize it.
February 22nd, 2021 at 8:58 AM ^
He's not that great of a shooter so yeah he could have taken them but I like him much better when he's slashing and making plays for others.
February 22nd, 2021 at 9:00 AM ^
I'm looking forward to him dropping the Ring Cycle v2.0 on some unsuspecting B1G Team
February 22nd, 2021 at 9:10 AM ^
If you look at basketball as an individual sport, it is easy to say, "What happened to <insert player> last night?" You could say Livers, as the most experienced player, should be filling it up every night, but he doesn't. Dickenson should have a double-double every night, but he doesn't. Wagner as a likely high NBA draft pick should tear apart teams every night, but he doesn't. Ditto Brown, Smith, Brooks, etc.
But this is a team game, and there may not be a more complete team out there. And most importantly, there may not be a team that plays AS a team as well as Michigan - and with no hurt egos or selfishness. When you play as a team, you have a different guy(s) every night who dominate. How do you defend that as an opponent?
February 22nd, 2021 at 9:18 AM ^
There was a stretch he hesitated from three very obviously. Live thread everyone was talking about it, so you're not wrong.
However his stats were:
- 9 pts on 4 shots
- 2nd leading rebounder (6)
- 2nd leading assists (4) - and several of these assists were just beautiful not just with the pass but creating the pass because of his drive
- no steals or blocks
It was in the bottom half of his games probably, but looking at the complete team game, it was probably the right decision.