UM-ND rivalry?

Submitted by dsikora on

Hey everyone.  I could use some input.  I just got into an argument with a co-worker regarding college football rivalries.  To keep things as short here as possible, he's from the west side of Michigan and contends that the UM-ND rivalry is more important to him than UM-OSU.  Whatever, I'll stay hands off.

However, he also contends that UM-ND is the nation's #2 college football rivalry.  I think he's damn near crazy.  Any chance I can get some feedback from all of you?  Either reply here, or voice off on my blog, 5280', where I made a post to solicit opinions, at http://5280ft.blogspot.com

Thanks everyone.  Go Blue!

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bdubya

July 2nd, 2008 at 4:08 PM ^

It's not even close in my opinion. I wouldn't even care about the ND game at all, but I have a friend who is a die hard Irish fan and it sucks when they win. On the other hand, I have no Buckeye fan friends and get no grief from anyone when they beat Michigan. What does this guy think is the #1 college football rivalry?

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dsikora

July 2nd, 2008 at 4:23 PM ^

He did concede that UM-OSU is the #1 rivalry.

However, the rationale broke down beyond that.  If I heard him correctly through the smoke pouring out my ears, he was giving some kind of order like:

1. UM-OSU; 2. UM-ND; 3. ND-USC

 No consideration whatsoever for other rivalries.  He wouldn't even address them.  I've met some people from down south who would laugh as they roast this guy on a spit for tailgating.

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medals

July 2nd, 2008 at 4:13 PM ^

But I think that your co-worker's geographical point of view skews things. It is 3rd on our list (waaaaay behind OSU and MSU) and likely third (?) on ND's (behind USC and BC?). Sounds like your co-worker doesn't watch much football beyond the Midwest . . .

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WolvinLA

July 2nd, 2008 at 4:15 PM ^

I'm from Grand Rapids, and I certainly know where this guy is coming from. I have an equal, if not greater, hatred for ND as I do for OSU. Part of this is that GR is equidistant to both South Bend and AA, so there is a strong ND influence in Grand Rapids, especially from anyone Catholic. Additionally, I think this stems from the fact that in addition to atheltics, ND and UM compete academically for the same prospective students, an area where OSU isn't nearly in the same ballpark. I have peers who are ND alums, and no OSU grads leave Ohio. That said, I would never argue that overall it is a bigger rivalry than UM-OSU or that it is in the top 5 nationally, but I get just as excited when we beat ND (and pissed when we lose) as I do against OSU.

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Md23Rewls

July 2nd, 2008 at 4:19 PM ^

I'll say that I hate Notre Dame much more than Ohio State. (I'm from an Irish Catholic family who finds it funny to give me "Michigan...Sucks" t shirts every year). But most Notre Dame fans would tell you they hate USC more, so it can not be the #2 rivalry.

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ts

July 2nd, 2008 at 5:00 PM ^

I hate ND more too. I want OSU to have a decent record for the sake of the conference and the rivalry but I want ND to lose every game they play. I enjoy rooting against ND almost as much as I enjoy rooting for UM.

As far as what is the #1 rivalry, I think it depends where you're from. I don't know how anyone can say that UM/OSU is any more intense than say Alabama/Auburn.

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Jim Harbaugh S…

July 2nd, 2008 at 4:19 PM ^

UM-ND is a great rivalry - but due to many years off it can't be considered one of the best. Top 20 for sure, maybe top 10. USC/ND is bigger than UM/ND. I'd even go so far as to say MSU/ND is better than UM/ND.

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mjv

July 2nd, 2008 at 4:36 PM ^

Medals, The ND-BC rivalry is much less significant to ND than ND-UM. Much more history between us and ND than ND and BC. It could be argued that our rivalries with MSU and PSU may be bigger as those are conference games. I also agree with JHS that the ND-USC rivalry is probably bigger than ND-UM.

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chunkums

July 2nd, 2008 at 5:02 PM ^

I despise Notre Dame, but mainly because I grew up in a Catholic school and everyone was always talking about how sweet they are. Furthermore, their conference situation annoys me, but nothing comes close to my hatred of OSU. I have neighbors with an OSU mailbox and I really want to revert back to adolescent tactics and blow it up. I'd say the MSU rivalry is on par with the Notre Dame one for me, but in that case it's a friendly rivalry. I like Sparty, and wish them the best, but love it when we beat them. It's kind of like Rocky and Apollo.

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Jim Harbaugh S…

July 2nd, 2008 at 5:24 PM ^

I was rooting for ND - I will never root for OSU.

 

I'd say the ND/MSU rivalry is better because it has a more recent history of great games than the UM/ND series.  1966 game of the century - 2006 ND comeback, 2005 MSU overtime game, all the recent Sparty wins in South Bend, they also have a rivalry trophy which adds to the mystique.  

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WolvinLA

July 2nd, 2008 at 5:40 PM ^

A team like MSU can't be a part of a huge rivarly because they are always insignificant.  They can play spoiler, which they often do with ND, but never the other way around.  In contrast, UM and ND are almost always BCS bowl contenders, and that game is a big game for both teams.  People all around the country care about both UM and ND, no one outside of the 517 and 616 area codes give a shit about MSU.

I also cheered for OSU in that Fiesta Bowl.  I like watching ND lose more than any other team. 

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mjv

July 2nd, 2008 at 5:47 PM ^

I root for the Bucks every week except for 1. I want them to roll into the Game undefeated so it is even more significant when we kick their ass. (at least we used to...) And seeing ND get squashed by OSU was fine by me.

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Goblue49120

July 2nd, 2008 at 7:31 PM ^

I have the perspective of someone that works in South Bend, has MSU grads as friends, and I am a Michigan fan through and through. In South Bend, I would say Notre Dame "hard core" fans would rank Michigan as their #2 rivalry behind USC. I hear more Michigan flak and grief from the casual fans, and they may think UM/ND is ND's biggest rivalry. It might be due to you seeing more Michigan gear and bumper stickers, ect. around here than any other school besides ND. Being so close to the state of Michigan and border spillover for work/recreation feeds this more. People living in Texas, Oregon, ect. probably wouldn't give it much thought. IMHO Michigan is ND's #2 rivalry. I hold ND as Michigan's #2, but this is mostly due to the MSU fans I know don't give a rat's behind about football (go figure). I wouldn't rank ND/Michigan as #2 all time though.

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Other Chris

July 2nd, 2008 at 8:48 PM ^

Or maybe follow football more broadly. I didn't become a Michigan football fan until I was 30, and while Michigan-OSU is a classic no matter who you ask, there is a country full of rivalry much more heated that Michigan-ND. Alabama-Auburn, Texas-Texas A&M, Army-Navy, Nebraska-Oklahoma, UCLA-USC, heck, even my own beloved Virginia-Virginia Tech.

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formerlyanonymous

July 2nd, 2008 at 10:19 PM ^

coming from houston, Texas-Texas A&M is much like UM-MSU.  the aggies have such an inferiority complex they actually included saw'em off reference in their school's song.  i believe its the only school song to mention a rival in it.  And that even when Texas doesn't even consider it a top rivalry (obviously the red river shoot out with OU is bigger). 

 

Nebraska-OU isn't much of a rivalry anymore either.  It had its 10 year war in the late 80s early 90s, but nothing beyond that.  The others, I'll agree with.  Possibly Harvard Yale too. 

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Other Chris

July 3rd, 2008 at 7:58 AM ^

I also submit that MSU is a bigger rival, in that Longhorns/A&M, Virginia/Virginia Tech way, because you lose to ND and you say, "Oh shit" but you lose to MSU and you question your whole way of life, those kids today, consumer confidence, all that.

 

Maybe that's just at our house. 

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king_kerridge

July 2nd, 2008 at 9:08 PM ^

Here's what I think... I have much more respect for ND as an institution, but...... ND has so many more people I utterly despise, i.e. The Blue Whale, Brady Quinn and Lou Holsssssssttttttttzzzzzz I get sick to my stomach when I think of fat ass and no talent Quinn getting any respect or accolades. I still think OSU is a bigger rivalry, too much history, too much at stake, too crazy of an atmosphere.

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Yahtzee

July 3rd, 2008 at 11:46 AM ^

As a West Side Michigander I hate them both, but I am more aware of the M vs. OSU rivalry being our biggest rival (not to mention on of the biggest in the country).

I wish for both of them to lose every game (more so ND, because I want to see the "sugar addict" cry, and makes M vs OSU that much better!)

There are a lot more ND fans here than OSU so that might make your co-worker think this, but he is crazy!

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wigeon

July 5th, 2008 at 5:05 PM ^

I dislike OSU intensely. I absofrigginlutely HATE Notre Dame. UM-ND might be a top 10 rivalry, but not even close to top 2. If they ever joined the Big 10, it would be out of hand.

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chitownblue (not verified)

July 5th, 2008 at 6:27 PM ^

I'll say this - there have been two games in the past 10 years that, before the game even started, made me so nervous that I thought I'd vomit - UM/OSU in 1997, and UM/OSU in 2006.

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hat

July 6th, 2008 at 7:09 PM ^

I can't imagine any ND fan under the age of 50 considering MSU a bigger rivalry game than UM for them. In fact, one of the excuses for their awful record against Sparty lately is that they don't take the game seriously.

Back to our perspective, MSU is one of those games that offers little upside and a ton of downside. When we win, it matters for a few hours and then everyone forgets.  But losing to them is extremely embarrassing, and leads to 365 days of newspaper stories about how "the tide is turning." OSU, on the other hand, offers a lot of upside - beating them is extremely satisfying (and while losing to them is extremely bitter, at least we can respect their football program). ND is in between - some upside, but not as much as OSU, and some downside (when we lose to them, it's always their season highlight) but not as much as MSU.

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hat

July 6th, 2008 at 11:11 PM ^

True, when we beat them in '91 it felt incredible, while beating OSU that year was fun but not quite at the same level (though the "Hello Heisman" TD was awesome). But most of the time OSU has been bigger.

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