grumbler

September 19th, 2016 at 7:54 PM ^

Just to make the analogy more tortuous, the SS (i.e. Himmler) made very sure Hitler never saw anything confirming the nature of the "Final Solution," but Hitler signed papers allowing, for instance, the re-purposing of trains to move Jews to the camps.

Hitler knew, but his subordinates made sure he didn't know-know.  After all, it was vital that Hitler saw a hero when he looked in the mirror.

CorkyCole

September 19th, 2016 at 2:12 PM ^

While I don't agree necessarily to what he said, there is in no way a correlation between those two instances. Hitler ordered others to gas people. Paterno did not order Sandusky to rape children. Not the same thing. That does not mean he shouldn't have stopped it when he had the opportunity to, but he wasn't the one doing it.

I understand why the Penn St. community has a hard time letting this go, but they have to. Paterno had a good repuation before that realization for good reason - he did have a very positive influnce on those he taught while at Penn St. He was known for his influnce as others as leading them towards following a strong ethical code, strong academics, etc. He had probably the biggest impact on that community for the longest period of time.

That doesn't change what he did, however, and you have to do your best to move on from that. If you want change in the university, you need to prove that you're moving forward and not living in the long extensive past that was polluted by Sanducky's actions and those that enabled those actions by not taking their societal and ethical responsibility of stopping them. You just can't ignore that. I'm afraid that the university will never recover if they don't move past it all.

Besides, if there ever was a time where it might possibly be OK to remember Paterno for the good that he did do during his lifetime, it is not now. This is going to take years to recover from, DECADES.

Paterno may not be Hitler, but he's not ready to be remembered.

beedub93

September 19th, 2016 at 1:12 PM ^

Paterno is an accomplice, at a minimum. He knew, did nothing about it and if I remember correctly, said something along the lines that he was busy coaching and didn't have time for listening to or dealing with that stuff.

Not sure what you don't get, but he had a chance to do the right thing and chose not to.

Fuck him, his goddamn surname and the penn state "family".



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superstringer

September 19th, 2016 at 1:18 PM ^

He knew, he was in position to stop it repeatedly, he ignored it because he didnt want the fallout or trauma (or perhaps his old-old-old school brain couldnt process or fathom the offense), and thus he is the opposite of a grrat leader of men. He failed the greatest challenge he was presented.

Being a Catholic myself, I look at JoPa's failure as identical to the Church when dealing with exactly the same issue. I think it got ignored because it could get ignored, and it was so personally repugnant to leaders like JoPa that they didnt have the moral courage to step up and deal with it--such as even admitting it was happening.

People in that town said for years, "Keep your boys away from Sandusky." This was an open, local secret. It was all part of the "unspeakable crimes" culture that is so old-world and so prevalent in that part of the country.

JoPa, as the supposed example of a glorious leader, was a failure at this. He deserves ever bit of blame that is possible.

Hope we are still going for 2 when we are up 80 in the 3d quarter.



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markusr2007

September 19th, 2016 at 2:07 PM ^

1. Joe Paterno was the authority of the program for 46 years. Paterno WAS Penn State football. In fact, few people alive today even know or remember the name of his predecessor. A walking legend, and revered and worshipped by Penn State as such.

2. Joe Paterno's family, especially his wife and son, did more damage to Joe Paterno's legacy by trying to invent a narrative about what happened related to the child rapes and his obstruction of justice, minimizing Joe Paterno's poor judgements and enablement of criminal acts (child rape, sexual assault, etc.), and maximizing his gridiron achievements. To continue to do this in the wake of the trial results and the legal outcome, and in the faces of rape survivors is just too obscene for words.

3. Even when the shit went down to the wire, and the facts of the case had been released to the media, and Sandusky on trial, Joe Paterno himself refused to admit to any wrong-doing or apologize to the victims for this sexual violence.  He did not acknowledge that it even happened.

4. Joe Paterno and his family wanted to preserve the status quo and his prior legacy, even when that was not longer possible.

Paterno didn't molest anyone, but he knew  child rape and sexual assault was taking place under his watch and by whom, and he did nothing to report it.  In fact, he and at least three of his assistant coaches knew about it dating back to 1976, and again did nothing.

Paterno hired all of these men, including Sandusky, Bradley and Schiano. They were under his charge.  He was directly responsible and accountable for their performance. One could argue Paterno was NOT responsible for their conduct (Sandusky's).  Normally, I would agree, if Paterno did not know Sandusky was a secret pedophile. But Paterno did know. And he still did nothing. In fact, the university officials knew as well. And they did nothing. Assistant coaches knew, and they did nothing.

That current players, students and fans must suffer and serve as an example for the world of how not respond to sexual predators (I can't believe this needs to be explained) might be unfair, but life is not fair. And neither is getting introduced to Penn State university employee-sodomites in positions of power while you are a vulnerable, fatherless, helpless and innocent child seeking approval and guidance.

Ponypie

September 19th, 2016 at 4:06 PM ^

(in response to Fieldy's Nuts)

 

I have a hard time taking your post seriously. To exonerate Paterno because he "would have been happy if his assistant coach hadn't turned out to be a pedo" is to create a land of denial and fantasy that is beyond even that of a Penn State apologist. Paterno's legacy is supposedly as a man who influenced characteer, not merely as a winner of football games (as much as that drives some of the respect that his minions show him). Thus, to not hold him accountable simply because "all he wanted to do is coach football" entirely misses the mark of why his malfeasance is so heinous.

As to why the NCAA should punish the entire program, and harshly, at that, it is well-known that Paterno established a self-policing culture of hero worship - a closed system where the Head Coach wielded total power in every respect.

In the end, almost everything that Paterno supposedly stood for is exposed as a lie; even his supposed modesty is belied by his ownership of  a multi-million dollar home and his narcissistic self aggrandizement.

Sandusky deserves what he receives, and more; Paterno, who could have intervened to severely limit the damage, deserves still worse, which he may yet experience.

Kevin13

September 19th, 2016 at 5:11 PM ^

and you do nothing about it you are as guilty as the person doing it and when it comes to something as horrific as child molesting........ Wow.... Nothing more needs to be said. Turn the guy in immediately and clear your program of it the second you find out. Instead how many more kids were hurt because he turned his back...... There is no excuse for what he did, he is just as sick as Sundusky....

tjohn7

September 19th, 2016 at 12:54 PM ^

My God.  Thank you for sharing that.  Disgusting that Penn State cannot understand why Paterno deserves no reprieve and should be wiped from our memory.  While the SEC obviously espouses the "winning at all costs" mentality, Joe Pa took the cake.

Jeff09

September 19th, 2016 at 1:12 PM ^

Great article, thanks for sharing. Honestly with all this garbage Penn State is my most-hated team in any sport. I hope them the worst in every single game for every year, from now until that idiotic fanbase realizes how many people they continue to hurt with their behavior.

McSomething

September 19th, 2016 at 1:13 PM ^

Penn State football should've been shut down. That they even have a program to this day should be viewed as a gift. Instead PSU cultists claim their program getting punished at all was the real victimization.

charblue.

September 19th, 2016 at 1:22 PM ^

Maybe the guilt and shame of this crime and indifference to legacy punishment will alter the thinking of Penn State faithful. Or maybe things will just go on as usual.

Blue Balls Afire

September 19th, 2016 at 1:45 PM ^

Penn State and Baylor both deserve the death penalty.  I honestly believe they need it for their own sake.  Make a definitive break from the past, make amends, and begin anew.  Right now, both are fetid, rotting, corpses that need to be buried so their respective delusional apologists stop playing Weekend at Bernie's with a piece of shit that stinks to everyone else.

superstringer

September 19th, 2016 at 2:13 PM ^

I'm betting the University does nothing to publicly embarrass, censure, disrespec(k)t, or otherwise rub PSU's nose in this mess.  As a fellow conference member (GRRRRR), I don't think the administration would be in good graces with the B1G for pulling any crap on Saturday.

But the fanbase, however....107,000+ can and should do what they want.  At a bare minimum, turn their backs when PSU walks into the stadium -- just like JoPa turned their backs on those kids.  (Admittedly I stole this from Temple's fans.)

ijohnb

September 19th, 2016 at 2:24 PM ^

don't like the idea of putting the current Penn State players in this box with Sandusky and Paterno.  They did absolutely nothing wrong.  (I am genuinely perplexed at how Penn State does continue to recruit fairly well though).

In reply to by ijohnb

BlueCube

September 19th, 2016 at 10:35 PM ^

this are gone. It's not like they weren't aware of what was going on there and if a couple of them didn't, they didn't do much investigation of the school they were choosing.

People who mention the "innocent" students and fans don't seem to be concerned with the culture that led to the continued abuse of the innocent kids.

This isn't about people trying to enjoy a football game. It's about kids who had their childhood ripped from them.

pdgoblue25

September 19th, 2016 at 2:10 PM ^

One, because it rarely ever happens, and two because of how much this generation has ruined this word.

I was actually offended by Penn State saturday.  I'm offended by the university, the fan base and everyone involved with this embarrassment on saturday.

I only hope that we kick the shit out of them next week.

HelloHeisman91

September 19th, 2016 at 2:30 PM ^

I read this article yesterday and the mention of the aunt that just wanted everybody to get together as if nothing had happened shined a light on what some people are willing to ignore for a sense of normalcy. It's really really sad.

Sione's Flow

September 19th, 2016 at 3:19 PM ^

I hate the Buckeyes and Spartans with the passion of the fires that burn in hell and I'll be pulling for them against PSU. Everything related to that program should've been burned to the ground.

Lie-Cheat-Steal

September 19th, 2016 at 4:02 PM ^

so I could believe Joe Pa was burning there and Sandusky would be joining him soon.

I also wish Sandusky was not in isolation so he could be violated the same way he violated all those innocent children.

Call me a horrible person, but I in no way believe this man should feel anything but suffering for the rest of his days.

And PSU can go fuck themselves and their precious football program should burn to the ground....perhaps they could get a pass for the historical atrocities that occurred on campus (assuming most people were in the dark), they definitely proved what they are about in how they have handled the situation after shit hit the fan.  Disgusting cult of people.

MFan73

September 19th, 2016 at 4:55 PM ^

I am going to share this with my brother, a Penn State fan, that continues to defend dear old JoePa.  I have had a hard time breaking through his denial and have had to stop talking about it with him after awhile because it me makes sick to my stomach.

Kevin13

September 19th, 2016 at 5:01 PM ^

and right now the best thing PSU can do is just stop talking about him, honoring him in any way, shape or fashion and try to move on as humble as possible and do as much for children victims of such a horrible crime.

Blusqualo

September 19th, 2016 at 6:14 PM ^

"Leaders of men do not deserve to be commemorated if they cannot protect children." I believe this qoute/line pretty much says what happy valley can't seem to grasp. Jo Pa was a failure. He was a failure as a human. That is his legacy, and he earned it. He earned it, confirmed it and reaffirmed it.

BigFanA2

September 19th, 2016 at 7:20 PM ^

I posted this last week on the story about the honoring of Joe last weekend and it got burried. We have to do something. I heard on NPR friday that 90% of PSU alumni think it is time to move on and honor joe.  It may be too late for a banner this year but we have to do something.

 

We need to do something about the delusional Penn State fans. A few weeks ago when I saw the post about a petition to get the Joe Pa statue back http://mgoblog.com/mgoboard/penn-state-lettermen-petitions-return-paterno-statue-because-he-didnt-do-anything-wrongI was sick to my stomach.

 

Then I found: http://mgoblog.com/mgoboard/psu-alums-erect-new-joepa-statue, this made it clear that many people are in denial about what a Joe Pa allowed to happen under his watch.

 

We need to send a clear message that the world knows #JoeKnew and maybe they will eventually realize it.

 

So I propose we to do a crowd source fundraiser to get a banner flown over the Big House 9/24. It should simply saying #JoeKnew. Hopefully we can make this an annual event or even make the site open to other fans so every game they play will reminded of the truth. 

 

I have no idea on how to start the fundraiser or contract the banner but I am sure some of the great minds here can help us.

 

I think it is sort of like holocaust or 9/11 deniers we all know they are wrong but don’t have a realistic way to get a message to them. But in the case of PSU, we know where the #JoeKnew deniers will be every Saturday every fall.

 

Before I posted this I needed to confirm for myself that #JoeKnew. So, I went out and did way to many hours of reading on PSU boards and elsewhere to see if maybe he might not have known. The information I read including theFreeh Reportwas disgusting. I am sad to say it is clear that the only he could not have know is if he was so stupid that could not tie his own shoes. We all know he had a brilliant mind and was very good at coaching football so he had to know.

 

My reading also made me realize that for any sports program with a super loyal fan base like PSU, Michigan, or many others this type of delusion is possible. If that ever happens to us I am sure other members of conference would go to any length possible to make us see the truth, so we have to do this.

 

Am I concerned about this being bulletin board material to fire up PSU against us for years? NO I strongly believe that most in the program now know or at least have a small hunch that #JoeKnew so it would be self defeating to use this topic to fire up any team.

 

Assuming, this post is allowed to stay, I don’t get banned forever, and we succeed in getting the banner flown how long do we keep doing this. I would suggest that we do it until 24 months after the last attempt to get the statue placed anywhere on PSU campus. 

ndscott50

September 19th, 2016 at 8:24 PM ^

You are never going to convince the die hard PSU crowd to turn on Joe Pa. You would have about as much luck convincing a sandy hook truther that they a both wrong and a disgusting POS.

The good part is that the vast majority of people know what Joe Pa did and view him with contempt. His legacy is destroyed regardless of what happens with the statue. Regarding the PSU crowd that wants to glorify him I would bet the vast majority of them are unwilling to articulate this view in their professional or social lives that don't involve a room full of like minded PSU fans.

Joe Pa's legacy is that of a powerful man who enabled a child molester. The PSU crowd can do nothing to change that.



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