OT: Olympic Men's skating - Adam Rippon and why he didn't score higher

Submitted by Dennis on
Been watching men's figure skating tonight and openly gay US skater, Adam Rippon, had an absolutely amazing no-mistake performance, and the other athletes who scored higher than him fell. I was pretty pissed and thought he got jobbed, but apparently the judges are scoring on "innovation" this year... landing quad jumps, etc, bc some athletes in past years scored higher for flawless performances without trying new things. https://www.google.com/amp/ftw.usatoday.com/2018/02/why-adam-rippon-sco… In my opinion, you can try for quads but you shouldn't be rewarded if you can't land them. What do you think?
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JHumich

February 12th, 2018 at 2:50 AM ^

Anyone familiar with diving knows exactly how this should work

There is a degree of difficulty involved that should act as a multiplier

So, a safe routine has a relatively low ceiling for what it can score

And an aggressive routine has a little more leeway for flaws

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JBM

February 12th, 2018 at 9:02 AM ^

The problem is this - a failed quad is worth more than a completed triple.  You have to get four rotations before wiping out to get credit for a failed quad or it becomes a failed triple, but still...

It's not fun for anybody under these conditions because there are so many busted routines it takes away from the enjoyment of the viewing experience.

If you want a good exmple, look to the Team Mens Short Program event, where basically all the best skaters in the world went to the ice and it came down to who could scew up the biggest thing.

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BroadneckBlue21

February 12th, 2018 at 8:55 AM ^

Now, now, do not hurt the feelings of those who feel attacked on here by bringing in civil rights issues of equity (treatment) and equality (laws and beliefs). I mean, we just watch games; the personal lives of Jamies Winston and Johnny Football, and the shit storm of MSU and PSU civil scandals dealing with sexual abuse and what’s done off the field, should be left off the boards. We are purists! Absolutely no non-sports discussions or suggestions. Absolutely no “politics,” because we never, ever care about those issues when we judge each other. Instead, I’m going to be bothered by the fact that you are bothered by Pence’s being bothered enough by LGBT people that he thinks they should convert and he’s tried to make laws to discriminate against non-heterosexual and non-Christian minorities. And remember, you can voraciously defend the honor of a 22 year old QB when fan’s blog post that he sucks, but absolutely do not listen to or defend an athlete who openly says the Vice President’s policies and beliefs make him feel like less than. Honestly, party affiliation does not matter, but policies and beliefs do. They affect sports and all of life. Did the OP word ihos or her suggestively? Yes. Was it part of the reason the skater didn’t win? Doubt it. Has LGBT issue been at front of a boring Olympics? Yep. Should we pretend that people aren’t assholes and that minorities of all ilks get drowned out by the sensitive majority? No. Did Pence make a political statement by not standing for the unified Koreas? Sure did. Is it a double standard for a man who walks out on black players protesting inequality, not the military? Am I way way way way away from OP? Yep. Do I care? Just a little.

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bronxblue

February 12th, 2018 at 3:53 PM ^

Did you try to make a point here?  Sure did.  Did it track consistently across paragraphs?  Sorta.  Is it trying to make an argument I didn't into a direction that I can't quite tell the OP even wants to go to?  Absolutely.

I think Rippon was robbed, but so be it.  My issie isn't the sexuality but the fact that figure skating seems to be going the direction of an arm's race, where the number of hard jumps you try matters more than how often you hit them or how "good" your overall performance is.  It's a performance piece in the end, so falling down because you don't hit the quad is worse, to me, than not trying it and putting on a still-difficult performance that flows but perhaps doesn't have the high amplitude attempts.  But that's me.

The fact that the OP brought up his sexuality is a little off-putting initially but it is a core part of his national identity right now.  And honestly, maybe his sexuality played a small role?  I doubt it, but if judges have been found in the past to rate performances lower due to nationality, it's not a crazy leap to imagine that the overtness of one's sexual preference could have an impact.

I'm just responding to the poster that said someone talking about their sexuality is highly insecure by pointing out that we only really care about Rippon's sexual orientation because a person in high government office in this country has consistently made it a point to attack the sexual orientiation of people he doesn't agree with, including promoting a thoroughly discredited method of "fixing" people.

I think political threads here are dumb because there is no discourse.  There are people I work with who hold beliefs I am 10000% against on a visceral, human level.  So I don't talk to them about it, not because I can't try to articulate my points and still respect their's, but because whenever I have in the past it devolves into both of us arguing the other is wrong and nothing comes of it.  And good lord, have peoiple on this blog made it VERY clear that civil discourse usually won't hold up when the topic becomes even remotely controversial.  

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bacon

February 12th, 2018 at 7:18 AM ^

Honestly, I used to think this too, but my thinking has changed. It’s hard to argue this without getting political and I will avoid that because I have no dog in this fight. I’ll just point out there are a lot of people in this country who have strong opinions on the lifestyle choices of LGBT individuals on both sides of the issue. Regardless of whether one agrees with their viewpoint, most people will understand that many in the LGBT community FEEL discriminated against and so it means a lot to them. Sports have always had a political undertone, particularly the Olympics. Bottom line, I realized these “why does it matter if” issues matter to some people and it’s not about me. So I don’t complain because I’m lucky that it’s not about me.

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B-Nut-GoBlue

February 12th, 2018 at 7:53 AM ^

And for that matter that weird game where people throw a ball through a peach basket that nowadays has a glass backboard behind it.  You can argue about most sports being truly athletic endeavors, other than football.  Chess,  no.  The other 2 you could argue and figure skating, though clearly not many here's idea of sport, can also be argued for...so get over it.

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BroadneckBlue21

February 12th, 2018 at 9:03 AM ^

And skating on one leg is an athletic move. And you thinking jumping in the air from your feet and landing perfectly Isis harder to do athletically than jumping in the air in heavy skates, spinning around perfectly three to four times, and landing on those skates without falli is not athletic? They are being awarded points on their ability to be the best athlete on ice. It is boring as hell to many of us, but me thinks thou protest too much. Just because one may not like a sport, does not mean there is no athletic competition going on.

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crg

February 12th, 2018 at 12:47 PM ^

Very old debate: sport versus activity. IMO, a true sport requires an unambiguous method of determining a winner (e.g. fastest time, last person standing, most points scored, farthest distance, etc.) These should be metrics that do not require an opinion, but purely facts to determine. So, while some competitions such as figure skating, some gymnastic events, some diving/swimming events, etc. are very demanding and impressive in their own right, I'm not certain that the label "sport" is more appropriate than "performance competition" - akin to events such as cheerleading competitions and dance events.

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1VaBlue1

February 12th, 2018 at 8:07 AM ^

I kinda agree...  Any 'sport' that is scored exclusively on judgement calls is suspect right off the bat.  However, I won't deny the athletic (and artistic) ability behind what they do - no way in hell I could do that on a dance floor, let alone skates! 

Same goes for all of the other subjectviely scored events - freestyle skiing, snowboarding, etc...  They are all pretty fun to watch, though.

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BroadneckBlue21

February 12th, 2018 at 9:08 AM ^

Fouls and penalties are subjective, to a degree, no? Deciding that crossing a plane is worth 6 but kicking is worth 3 was subjectively decided, no? Sure, those sports rely on points being awarded by judges, and judges are subjective, but each move has a range of points for difficulty and standard deductions for errors. lol d of like a 15-yard PI can dictate the success of a drive in football

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BroadneckBlue21

February 12th, 2018 at 9:08 AM ^

Fouls and penalties are subjective, to a degree, no? Deciding that crossing a plane is worth 6 but kicking is worth 3 was subjectively decided, no? Sure, those sports rely on points being awarded by judges, and judges are subjective, but each move has a range of points for difficulty and standard deductions for errors. lol d of like a 15-yard PI can dictate the success of a drive in football

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pinkfloyd2000

February 12th, 2018 at 9:51 AM ^

I mean, you may not like it -- but the level of athleticism to perform at a high level in figure skating is off the f'ing charts.

Besides, you HAVE seen curling -- right? I gotta say, any sport which I have personally participated in, and have actually done reasonably well in...should probably be reconsidered as an Olympic event. ;-)

Now, ALL THAT SAID -- I *do* prefer non-subjectively scored sports. Give me a timer, a finish line, or "goals" any day of the week. Perhaps that is exactly what you were getting at with your comment, though. 

But hey, if they eliminated figure skating from the Olympics -- sad, but true -- they'd lose at least 50% of their viewing audience. No joke. 

 

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BigPuppy4

February 11th, 2018 at 10:38 PM ^

Has been lost to the judges for years. US women’s skater lost to people who fell last night as well. Until that is sorted out, it’s the Olympic sport I put nothing into.

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