Offensive Philosophy: Keep it the same or move in a different direction?
We all know there needs to be some changes made to the offense. My question is would you prefer Michigan to keep running a pro style with some tweaks, or something of an OSU/Oklahoma offense that will shred you through the air, while still having 1,000 yard rushers?
I would like to see a change to a more modern day spread offense. Right now Michigan is running a Windows 97 offense, while everyone else has Windows 10.
Harbaugh needs to make a move like Brian Kelly and relinquish his play calling duties. He can still be heavily involved throughout the week, but on Saturdays he needs to let the OC handle the play calling aspect.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:19 AM ^
Dump it. Now.
Bring in a true OC and a modern scheme. I favor a passing spread over a running spread myself but bring the guy and his scheme who will generate the results we need.
November 25th, 2018 at 11:39 AM ^
How many times did a Wolverine running a shallow route get absolutely destroyed by a defender yesterday?
No creativity. I felt bad for some of the receivers.
November 25th, 2018 at 1:30 PM ^
But what about Ben Fucking Mason
November 25th, 2018 at 1:54 PM ^
Hurdling a Maryland defender is cool.
Scoring lots of points is a lot cooler.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:19 AM ^
If I had it my way we’d back up the brinks truck to Kingsbury’s house and tell him to come here for a year, kill it, then go back out and find a HC gig. We have the personnel to run his air raid offense next year. Odds are we won’t even have a top dog RB next year so this smash mouth shit won’t work as well.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:54 AM ^
1000x yes. I don't know why the Kingsbury threads keep getting deleted. Too snowflakey? He'd be a kickass hire.
"B-b-but that's not Michigan football!!!" Yeah, and neither is what we saw on Saturday. The way to be Bo 2.0 is to achieve Bo results. It seems the program is confusing means and ends. Identity isn't established by the methods you use to get there, but by actually getting there.
November 25th, 2018 at 11:05 AM ^
We just saw what happens when a B1G defense goes up against a Big 12 offense. Why anyone wouldn't want the offense to perform at the highest level possible is beyond me.
November 25th, 2018 at 12:10 PM ^
We ARE achieving Bo results, go back and check his record. Even that was against shitty competition.
November 25th, 2018 at 11:38 AM ^
We have the personnel? Are you sure? Is Black going to be healthy? Nico, Black, and DPJ are the only receivers that Michigan has. Can you do Air raid with 3 guys? Are you going to run out Ronnie Bell and Jacob McCurry? Is Oliver Martin going to develop into more than a guy that can catch a couple of passes against bums?
I'm not seeing it...
November 26th, 2018 at 2:43 PM ^
Don't need to go to a true Air Raid, more like a 2018 Bama style modified Air Raid. Besides even Air Raid offenses need possession receivers. We have three top tier WRs along with a bunch of other solid WRs...
Ronnie Bell did not suck as a true Freshman, that says something good about his future.
Oliver Martin may well be dynamic, but at a minimum I would see his floor as being a more athletic Grant Perry.
Giles Jackson seems like a perfect Air Raid slot.
Sounds like a good start to me...Bringing in Kingsbury could help recruit kids like Johnson or Ford...
November 25th, 2018 at 10:21 AM ^
Why are we upset with the offense? Michigan put up 39 points. Same as 2006. The lack of big defensive plays are what killed them in The Game, not their offense.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:23 AM ^
We took a page out of the Lions book and put up points when the game was already over. Not to mention 6 of those points happened because OSU dropped a kickoff.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:30 AM ^
Our quarterback had what? 187 yards passing against the worst passing defense in the B1G. And it's not like we made up for that by running for 300 yards. This offense is garbage and painful to watch because of the talent at WR being squandered while McKeon is targeted 15 times a game.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:54 AM ^
McKeon has 14 receptions this season. I don’t think excessively targeting him is the problem.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:38 AM ^
So, wait, Michigan only put up points when the game was already over? And if you execute on a play immediately after a turnover that leads to a quick score, this is an argument that the offens was somehow innefective at other times in the game? This makes no sense to me.
In fact, Michigan scored 13 points in six seconds, how does this ridiculous criticism square with your premise? I mean those plays were huge at that point in the contest, and Michigan had the chance to tie at half and had a good play called for the two-point conversion that just didn't work.
By the way, on that play, Michigan used both motion and formation in an effort to confuse the Buckeye defense, but they played it well, leading to an incompletion.
I thought Michigan should go up-tempo in the second half, to increase offensive rhythm and lead to quicker scores, but that is pretty much what OSU wanted. They wanted to get into a pinball scoring match while Michigan opted to ground and pound to keep Haskins off the field. That did work but because of a blocked punt TD, everything changed when Michigan couldn't keep up with their scores and then Campbell housed the game with his long run.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:55 AM ^
The thing is, they didn't go back to that motion-to-confuse concept. They used it for a quick score, and abandoned it. The play calling is predictable and we have gotten by this whole season by getting to third down and being able to obtain a first by keeping it manageable. Running into a stacked box once (or twice) and getting ourselves into obvious passing situations works against bad defenses. Having an offense predicated on a QBs ability to throw across his body outside the pocket is not sustainable, as much as this blog would have us believe it is.
That is the most upsetting part about this game on both sides of the ball. Whereas last year we had probably our most creative game of the year against OSU, this year our offense was vanilla and predictable and our defense did nothing to try to cover its most glaring weakness. I am wholly disheartened by the apparent lack of planning that went into this game. Our lines got manhandled, but our coaches got bitch slapped.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:58 AM ^
Come on. Michigan scored 13 points in 6 seconds because we scored on a long drive and OSU fumbled the ensuing kickoff and gifted the ball to us at the 9, not because we ran some souped-up fastbreak offense to do that. The larger question is why the fuck were we trying to ground and pound when we have a 5-star quarterback, a 5-star receiver, and another 4-star opposite. Those 2 WRs and Black are at least as good as OSUs trio. I think they're better. But 3/4s of our formations involve multiple tight ends, none of whom are as talented as the receivers. Ground and pound was a dumb-ass strategy because it played to OSU's strength and away from ours. OSU has a bad, bad pass defense, but we made fucking Schiano look like a genius.
November 25th, 2018 at 11:46 AM ^
Yes, that's the point. The way the offense was being called didn't allow us to put up touchdowns for long drives. I get what Harbaugh is trying to do but it doesn't work. Far too often we settled for field goals all year. We should have blown MSU out but we came up empty after long drives and had nothing to show for it until the 3rd quarter. That might work against a shit offense like MSU but it won't work against OSU, as we saw. Harbaugh himself even said "we can't settle for field goals" and what did they do in the first half? They couldn't sustain long drives until OSU backed off in the second half when the game was well out of hand.
November 25th, 2018 at 11:49 AM ^
In fact, Michigan scored 13 points in six seconds, how does this ridiculous criticism square with your premise?
Other than the KO fumble, Michigan had two trips to the red zone in the first half... and came out of it with 2 FGs.
The PREMISE is... people saying Michigan's effort got them 13 points in six seconds is a farce considering tOSU gave Michigan 6 of those 13.
So, wait, Michigan only put up points when the game was already over?
Yes.
After the failed 2pt attempt in the first half, tOSU rattled off 20 unanswered points. FACT.
Michigan scored their first garbage time touchdown with 9 minutes to go and down 23.
Michigan scored their second garbage time TD with 4 minutes left and down by 30! THIRTY!
November 26th, 2018 at 4:34 PM ^
Scoring a TD with 9 minutes left to get within 2 possessions is not garbage time. You can win a game down 2 scores with 9 minutes left.
The last TD with a true freshman QB was obviously garbage time- no disagreement there.
November 25th, 2018 at 12:51 PM ^
Up tempo? When was the last time we snapped the ball with more than 10 seconds on the play clock? We don’t do fast.
November 26th, 2018 at 8:20 AM ^
Do we even have an up-tempo offense? Re-watch the end of the ND game. Our 2 minute offense was geriatric paced. I have not seen up-tempo on offense in the last 2 years.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:27 AM ^
The defense was atrocious yesterday. They certainly deserve a lot of the blame.
But the offense is just so lackluster. Think about what the game looks like yesterday if Michigan scores TDd instead of Fgs in the first half. Instead of 24-19, it’s probably 28-24 Michigan. The offense has been bad all year in the redzone. That’s the main reason I posed this question.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:54 AM ^
Even under the circumstances you contend were the result of lackluster play, Michigan had a TD pass to Gentry that he dropped which would have given them a tie at half even with the Buckeyes last second field goal. So, Michigan scored 19 first half points and 20 second half points. And both levels of scoring were better in two other victories this season.
You score one point shy of 40, I'm sorry, you win most of the time. Ohio State committed more than 10 penalties for 120 yards in markoffs which when added to their defensive yield, put Michigan's benefitting yardage over 500. As it was, the Buckeyes gave up more than 400 yards. They are on defense what we thought they are, but they were more effective in making plays on first down and forcing second and third and long situations, which is not Michigan's forte.
And they got pressure on Patterson and eventually knocked him out of the game. So, he threw a pick leading to a short field score. Then Milton got picked and that led to another short field score. So the defense had to deal with sudden change and failed to hold up to all of those they faced.
This was a complete team loss. Not one unit. Every part of the team failed. The coaching staff and every unit failed at one point or another during that game.
November 25th, 2018 at 11:02 AM ^
Gentry and McKeon have had crucial drops all year. Hell, that's been McKeon's m.o. going back to last year. You know who never ever drops passes? DPJ. Collins also. This is why you build your offense around those wide receivers rather than the mediocre tight ends.
November 25th, 2018 at 11:21 AM ^
For such an integral part of our offense, the TEs have been very weak. Gentry is a minus blocker and now a minus pass catcher.
Where the fuck was Martin in this game? Injured, or what?
November 25th, 2018 at 11:56 AM ^
You score one point shy of 40, I'm sorry, you win most of the time.
Unless when you score one of those TDs, there are 9 minutes left in the game and you're down by 20.
Unless when you score the second of those garbage time TDs, there are four minutes left and you're down by 30.
November 25th, 2018 at 11:58 AM ^
The offense has been bad all year in the redzone.
Yep.
I looked it up for the deniers and participation trophy crowd in here this morning.
Michigan is ranked #50, out of 124 Div I teams, in red zone TD conversion this season.
29 TDs in 50 RZ trips.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:30 AM ^
So true! I keep seeing complaints about the offense but the defense got shredded.
November 25th, 2018 at 11:37 AM ^
People are and were complaining about the offense and defense. Though it's tough to thoroughly analyze and discuss the failures of both units at the same time.
We all know that both units failed, but this thread is about the offense.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:38 AM ^
I agree with this. Michigan scored 39 and left more on the field (going for two twice...and missing, Gentry's dropped TD). Yes, OSU handed Michigan a TD with the botched kickoff return. In my mind, the offense is fine, the execution (and play calling) was poor. They rarely attempted to get wide with speed. There might have been one screen pass. TE'S dropped at least three passes. It seemed like Shea was typically rolling in a direction that forced him to throw across his body. Harbaugh and Hamilton had bad days. However, I think that the offense will work.
November 25th, 2018 at 11:00 AM ^
Eh. The offense scored two touchdowns when osu went soft and prevent. Another was a gift off a fumbled return. The offense was mostly plodding, especially against a very substandard osu defense that got wrecked by Purdue and Maryland.
November 25th, 2018 at 11:08 AM ^
27 points.
One TD was in garbage time against a Quarters defense and the other was after being gifted the football after a special teams gaffe.
November 25th, 2018 at 12:31 PM ^
A lot of the points scored came in the 4th quarter when the game was already lost and Ohio State was playing with less intensity.
November 25th, 2018 at 1:34 PM ^
November 25th, 2018 at 10:21 AM ^
Burn it all and move away from the god-awful we're Michigan we're gonna out execute you style of "pro" offense.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:23 AM ^
I would like to see a spread power running scheme. The pro sets dont even work in the pros anymore.
November 25th, 2018 at 12:11 PM ^
The problem with the pro style in college is you need pro style players to properly execute against the better teams. Has any team, other than Alabama, won a championship runnung a pro style offense?
November 25th, 2018 at 12:34 PM ^
Pro style refers to he formation, not the fact that its an NFL concept
November 25th, 2018 at 10:26 AM ^
Ditch this nonsense please. If I see one more tight end in a winged helmet drop a pass, while our insanely talented WRs are targeted 5 times a game, I'm going to shit myself. I you want to run spread HIRE A SPREAD O.C. instead of attempting to have a bunch a pro-style coaches run an offense they don't know and don't understand muck the fucker up by committee.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:31 AM ^
We had a spread coach. Rich Rod didn't do so well, here...
November 25th, 2018 at 10:42 AM ^
I'm suggesting hiring an O.C. not Rich Rod. Rich Rod's spread sucks because it's one dimensional--and because of his insane insistence on severely undersized o-lineman. And because he can't recruit, especially on defense, which he doesn't give two fucks about anyway, oh, except to meddle with it halfway through the season. The problem was never with the viability of a spread offense at Michigan. It was about Rich Rod being overrated because people misread his record at WVU. Michigan has been attempting to run spread concepts with Shea this year. They're just bad at it because of Harbaugh's need to retain his tight end/fullback-heavy power stuff alongside the spread stuff.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:45 AM ^
Wow! You're right! It's too bad there's only one spread coach in America and he already failed here. It's not like other successful teams run the spread. Like the two we lost to this year. Or the rams. Or the chiefs. Or the Patriots. Or Oklahoma. Or Alabama. Or Clemson. Or...
November 25th, 2018 at 11:02 AM ^
It is amazing how bad the tight ends were.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:27 AM ^
I think whatever happens, JH cant relay the plays, it takes too long. Also, whatever happens, I hope they stick to it for more than one season. The offense hasn't looked the same two years in a row since JH has been here.
November 26th, 2018 at 8:32 AM ^
I thought the offense looked very similar as last year. Just some more QB runs and literally a handful of new RPO's this year. Everything else... same.
November 25th, 2018 at 10:30 AM ^
I agree completely that Harbaugh needs to give up play calling - he's not aggressive enough to go after weak spots. He just refuses to do it, and instead runs something to set up the next play. And when things don't work, he hunkers down and tries to force it. Witness yesterday...
But an air raid won't work in the B1G in October and November. Re-watch WSU get whooped at home Friday to see what it does in bad weather.
Bring in someone who can use the tools within the base offense in an aggressive way. This offense has multiple schemes to run the ball, uses ZR and RPO, has awesome WRs and TEs, and good, versatile RBs. They were not put into any position yesterday to be successful because Harbaugh refused to aggressively go after the OSU corners. And he refused to make the LBs pay for doing nothing more than crashing interior gaps. Did Gentry or McKeon ever get a patter down the middle? I don't recall one...
Need an OC, with play calling authority, that knows how to ruthlessly go after an opponent.
November 25th, 2018 at 11:03 AM ^
Um, Air Raid sure worked for Osu in November.
November 25th, 2018 at 12:25 PM ^
OSU doesn't run an air raid, they run a base spread to run power. The pass game is centered on mesh concepts with short routes. Nothing at all like an air raid...
November 26th, 2018 at 8:36 AM ^
80%+ of their passing offense was drags and wheel routes. Definitely not an air raid offense.