Joel Klatt on Harbaugh's future at Michigan
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmLJiqrkKag
13 minute mark and runs about 2 minutes.
Nothing we don't know.
But it's a short discussion with some of the reasons people have had enough of Jim.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:49 PM ^
They then did the exact same thing to Bo Pelini.
Frank Solich is their Lloyd Carr (who wasn’t fired but more or less forced out by a livid fan base and probably tired from the pressure)
We do not want to make Harbaugh our Pelini. The only reason Harbaugh should be let go is if their is a certain bonafide replacement.
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:54 PM ^
So keeping Frank Solich and Bo Pelini was the answer? The problem was hiring Mike Riley not that they got rid of Pelini.
November 4th, 2021 at 1:21 AM ^
Who else was going to take that job after they fired Pelini? lol
November 4th, 2021 at 1:30 AM ^
Again, they had no real replacement, they just reacted to Pelini being a pretty successful but not earth shattering coach. Which is exactly what we would do if we let go of Harbaugh without knowing that we have a sure-fire replacement coming in. When UM hired RRod and Hoke they were much more reactive, not proactive.
November 4th, 2021 at 6:59 AM ^
I don't necessarily agree that RRod was reactive. They were stupid hires by people who didn't know what they were doing.
RRod was hired by people who were completely oblivious to the football culture. Hoke was hired by a megalomaniacal control freak who saw himself as the George Steinbrenner of college athletics.
I would say however these were good/competent coaches who had success elsewhere but here. Harbaugh is the same way. Hell, Brady Hoke resurrected the San Diego State program after he left Michigan.
We need to be asking ourselves "why?"
A toxic fanbase doesn't help. We are very much in the hunt for a Big Ten championship and we're calling for the coach to be fired. The rival thing is legit, but it's not helpful. It's easy for other coaches to neg recruit our fan base and it's draining to the team. It often makes me wonder to what extent is our fanbase a liability?
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:51 PM ^
There is a good contingent of fans who are perfectly happy being John Cooper era OSU simply because the coach’s last name is Harbaugh.
I always made fun of OSU for hanging on to 2-10-1 Cooper. Little did I know some Michigan fans would be so content with 0-6 Harbaugh.
I think it’s great Harbaugh has turned this team around and want nothing more for the team and him to win out. All that said, if he becomes 0-7 Harbaugh, then he needs to go. How many chances does he need to get?
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:43 PM ^
People who want to keep Harbaugh must think John Cooper was a great coach
November 4th, 2021 at 9:15 AM ^
People would kill for John Cooper levels of success. He went 2-10-1 against us (3-10-1 if you include the Rose Bowl). Harbaugh is not on track to win two games in 13 years.
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:54 PM ^
Michigan will never be Nebraska by virtue of literally not being in the state of Nebraska.
November 4th, 2021 at 8:40 AM ^
Exactly we are 7-1 this year and a top 10 team. People want him gone but who are you going to bring in. Everyone seems to think every swinging dick out there would make Michigan like Alabama. People who want him gone give me a list of coaches we can bring in who will make Michigan a national contender every year. Been waiting a long time let’s hear it
November 4th, 2021 at 12:02 PM ^
We already are, Harbaugh is our Solich
November 4th, 2021 at 12:24 PM ^
It's one of those myths that Nebraska only went downhill because they got rid of Solich. Solich was a solid coach, but Nebraska didn't slip because they got rid of him, they got rid of him because they could feel things slipping. If anyone thinks Nebraska would still be challenging for national titles, if only they had held on to Solich for another 10 years, they live on another planet.
It'd be akin to thinking that if Lloyd had stuck around another 10 years he would have beaten OSU and won another national title. In reality, of course, the rot was already in and well advanced by the team Lloyd left.
November 4th, 2021 at 2:57 PM ^
If you can make this statement then I can make the one that says people have dreams of beating their rivals and maybe, someday, winning a BIG championship and CFP appearance.
The ONLY reason I would be opposed to taking a chance on another coach is because I have no confidence in the people that would perform a coaching search. We would invariably screw ourselves somehow. By either waiting to fire the coach til too late to get a jump on recruits, get caught up in some ridiculous Michigan man garbage, etc. coaching transitions are not a strong suit of our administration.
November 4th, 2021 at 11:09 PM ^
Those delusional few who think Michigan should dominate MSU and maybe even get a win against Mel Tucker. A lot of the old Icarus in them, to be sure.
But forget the rivalry stuff if you’d like. A quick check of Michigan’s final ranking compared with those of other Big Ten teams in each season:
2020: Lolz, unranked with 3 Big Ten teams ranked.
19: 3 Big ten teams ahead of Michigan, so fourth
18: only one (take a guess) ahead of them, so second
17: unranked so at least behind the four ranked teams
16: behind 2, so third
15: behind 4, so 5th.
Even excluding COVID year, I’ve got 2nd, 4th, 3rd, 5th, and at best 5th. You get 3.8 as the average there, but since that’s excluding his by far worse year and assuming the absolute best for 2017, I think it’s fair to round that up. He is producing, on average, a team that’s 4th best in the conference. That’s sure as hell better than Rich Rod, but let’s not pretend he’s consistently sitting in 2nd with only OSU ahead of him. On average in addition to OSU, two other Big Ten teams (most commonly MSU and PSU) are also having a better season.
November 3rd, 2021 at 8:33 PM ^
They don't start talking about Harbaugh until 13 minutes in and he kind of avoids the question.
November 3rd, 2021 at 8:36 PM ^
Wait until the end of the season. Why discuss this further? If the season ends well you know the answer if it ends mediocre than the university will tell you the answer.
November 3rd, 2021 at 8:45 PM ^
Michigan is still in control of its own destiny. I understand that the world is ending after losing to the #3 team on the road with some iffy calls however its not like Michigan lost to Toledo.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:33 PM ^
We do not control our own destiny. MSU controls their own destiny. If we win out and so does MSU, we don’t go to the B10 championship, MSU does. I’m fact, we need to win out AND hope MSU loses TWICE to get the the B10 championship because with both of us having 1 B10 loss they would own the head to head tiebreaker. It ain’t happening. All we can hope for is that we beat OSU and get a NY6 invite.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:59 PM ^
If michigan wins out they make the playoff. National titles over big ten titles all day every day
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:48 PM ^
While I can certainly buy into getting into the playoffs if we win out, a national title is not very likely unless you seriously think we can beat Alabama or Georgia. I wish I could buy stock in optimism, this thread would make me a rich man.
November 4th, 2021 at 5:00 PM ^
Nope, we'd still need help. You think a non-conf title game winner, participant even, is getting in ahead of undefeated Oklahoma, undefeated Cincy and 1 loss Oregon? What if Bama beats GA, thats 2 spots right there plus the B10 champion, so why would M get that #4 spot over several other teams if they all win out?
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:10 PM ^
Remember when everyone thought we would 6-6 or 7-5, and your considered pretty optimistic if you predicted 8-4 or 9-3, and dEluSiOnaLly optimistic if you thought 10-2….well now, here we are mad with 11-1 and a win over OSU.
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:24 PM ^
I am willing to bet that a 10-2 finish to the season gets Michigan a NY6 bowl game. Michigan is a major national draw and bowl committees like money.
November 4th, 2021 at 8:30 AM ^
You are correct that we do not technically control our own destiny but seeing that this thread is tailored around Harbaugh staying or going, if we win out the cries will not be to get rid of Harbaugh. And we would still have a great chance of slipping in as the #4 seed in the CFP. Go Blue!
November 3rd, 2021 at 8:49 PM ^
People on this board drastically underestimate Harbaugh's abilities and drastically underestimate how bad of a spot the program was in when he took the job. Short memories. We are lucky to have him.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:01 PM ^
He did better with the other coaches recruits lol
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:27 PM ^
Very well and succinctly said. Given the overall goals and objectives that have been given to Harbaugh for the program by the athletic department, I wonder who could do better.
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:57 PM ^
People also underestimate how bad MSU was when Dantonio took them over, he had them 11-2 his fourth year, 11-3 his fifth, and 13-1 his seventh.
We're in year seven of Harbaugh.
November 4th, 2021 at 12:22 AM ^
It's been SEVEN YEARS and still MSU and OSU own us.
Absolutely nothing substantial has changed, except for more success against bad teams. The big games -- the ones we really care about -- are still crap.
November 4th, 2021 at 7:43 AM ^
3-4 against Sparty isn’t owning.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:00 PM ^
I’m not listening but Klatt is a Harbaugh homer so I’m sure he’ll say give it a decade or two more and see if he can get us to a big ten championship or something.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:51 PM ^
And if you had listened you would have heard him say nothing of the sort. Mostly just said Michigan's narrative under Harbaugh is Sept/Oct success and falling flat in Nov. Plus he put the MSU loss on the coaches and ultimately Harbaugh.
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:04 PM ^
I wonder if having a tougher out of conference schedule would help the team be better prepared for the bigger games that seem to pop up at the end of the year.
November 3rd, 2021 at 11:37 PM ^
Ah yeah, because UW and ND were terrible programs to schedule. Quit while you're behind.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:05 PM ^
Harbaugh entered the Big Ten East race while Michigan was woefully behind and down and OSU / Meyer and MSU / Dantonio were at the peak of their success. Dantonio had a seven year start over Harbaugh. Despite their success as coaches both are now gone because they self imploded. Luckily for OSU they are a machine, for the time being and who knows for how long. Mel Tucker has not won any championships I am aware of. Michigan was in a deep hole when Harbaugh arrived.
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:52 PM ^
Okay so what? Harbaugh lost to shitty MSU squads 2 times inexplicably when Michigan was favored.
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:56 PM ^
Dantonio was lucky in that his first Big Ten Championship was a three-way tie in that there were no Divisions and he didn't play Ohio State. Then the Big Ten moved to the Leaders & Legends Divisions and again, Michigan State lucked out in that the Legends Division was weak, the Big Ten only played 8 conference games and Michigan State only played Ohio State on a rotational basis. It was sure a lot easier going to Indy to play Ohio State than it is competing against them head to head in the Division.
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:59 PM ^
I'm curious how Dantonio being at MSU 7 years before Harbaugh has anything to do with what Mel Tucker has done the last 2 years to Harbaugh.
Also Dantonio had MSU 13-1 his seventh year with multiple 11 win seasons before that.
November 4th, 2021 at 8:15 AM ^
Topic was firing Harbaugh, and my point is Harbaugh has survived both Dantonio and Meyer and Michigan is better today than when Harbaugh arrived when the cards were really stacked against him - just maybe not as good as expected.
Go Blue !
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:11 PM ^
Wow, I remember before the season started prognosticators and Michigan fans were predicting 6-8 wins. Almost everyone talked about how young the team was, how inexperienced the QB was, how difficult it is to win with massive staff turnover, how much talent was lost in the portal, how weak the corners, linebackers, and defensive tackles were, and how, generally, this was a rebuilding season to set up a 2022 run for Harbaugh and Michigan.
Now, after losing for the first time this season, and with a previously unimaginable 7-1 record, "fans" want Harbaugh gone, and tv talking heads are pondering if Harbaugh has a future at Michigan? Considering the context, this discussion is absurd in the extreme!
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:15 PM ^
I certainly will say the team is doing well compared to expectations, but the loss to MSU was quite horrid, and a number of the issues in that game were coaching miscues. It is refreshing to see Michigan's offense coming together, but I think there are still some valid concerns have about Harbaugh, that could make people ponder if he can get Michigan past the 9-4/10-3 hump.
Personally, I think we are setting up for 2022 to be the best Michigan team since 2016, and would like to see how Harbaugh fares in 2022. He will have experience at QB, and the skill positions will be quite full. Additionally, our DC will have another year under his belt. However, with all this being said, if Jim stumbled to 9-3 again next year, I would be fine and open to a coaching change.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:22 PM ^
The MSU loss was "quite horrid"? A 4 point loss on the road to a top ten team, with some questionable officiating, is quite horrid? Overreact much, pal?
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:26 PM ^
Any loss to MSU is horrid. It's a rivalry game man. We compete with MSU on the recruiting trail and it is a game that is important for the program to establish themselves with.
Calling for defensive substitutions, while an offense is running tempo is College Football 101 no-no. Calling a fade on 3rd and 3 in a 4th down scenario was a drive killer. Yes, the refs did a poor job, but Michigan had a 16 point lead in the 3rd, where if Michigan eats the football, they win. They didn't do it.
I am not calling for Jim's job, but I am upset about continuous problems we are seeing with his teams, such as dealing with tempo. I hope for this season and 2022, he addresses them.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:38 PM ^
I don't consider losses in competitive games to teams close in quality to be horrid. The South Carolina bowl loss was horrid. The last 2 losses to OSU were horrid. The 2019 loss to Wisconsin was horrid. The Florida bowl loss was horrid. Last week was simply disappointing. But, now we're talking semantics.
November 4th, 2021 at 9:20 AM ^
Have you asked yourself why Mel Tucker, in year 2 after taking over such a disaster he had to run over 30% of his roster in a single offseason, is ahead of Jim Harbaugh in year 7? What mental gymnastics do you need to perform to make that ok? Mel is also recruiting at Jim's level in 2022. Michigan has a significantly more talented roster than MSU this year and lost. In fact, all 7 years Michigan had more talent and Jim is 3-4. How is that justifiable?
November 4th, 2021 at 5:44 PM ^
Horrid? The season has gone well. We can't help that you expected perfection. We have had injuries - Ronnie Bell, Zinter, Filliaga ect. We had a starting QB in the injury tent and his Freshman back up was in leading to a turn over at the mesh point. Rain at the end of game, no call PI and holding in the 4th not to mention other calls and drops that worked against us and we were in it until the last minute. And Oh yes, a running back who just may win the heisman.
You have a Horrid take on the season
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:06 PM ^
To be fair, other than the usual insufferable d-bags, most fans here seem rational and supportive of the current staff.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:14 PM ^
Any other candidate we would have is out there coaching at another school right now. Given that the next step up would be beating OSU and MSU would mean winning B1G championships and thus the CFP. The CFP every year has been a mix of Bama, Clemson, OSU, and token team (Okla, UGA). So 99.9% coaches out there are not breaking the barrier wherever they are currently at (even though UM has far more resources than most of them). Getting rid of Harbaugh and gambling for someone else should be approached with extreme caution.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:16 PM ^
Harbaugh runs a seemingly clean program that graduates a lot of good men. He seems to prioritize that. It’s redeeming but it will also limit the program. I would never root for an Urbz like program but would live to see something a little closer to his game on the field.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:20 PM ^
I’m not ready to get rid of Harbaugh at this point. I was after last year. Harbaugh restructured his contract and went out and changed his staff. Anyone who knows anything about football couldn’t reasonably expect a complete turnaround in one year. They kind of have however. I also think Harbaugh is different than the last few years. He’s not the fired up psychopath on the sidelines but he doesn’t look like he’s on downers either, it’s a good blend. I think this Harbaugh is having fun again. If we were to lose to either Indiana or Maryland and the other two competitive games then I might be back on the bandwagon but I think this team is different and Harbaugh is different this year. I’m willing to see what happens the rest of this year and then one more year next year to see if the young staff gels on the field and in recruiting. Beyond that, it all depends on how it’s going.