It's become a real possibility The CW will get the Pac-12 media deal
With USC and UCLA leaving the Pac-12 all the big players have backed out of any deal. It also looks like this possible deal with The CW is not sitting well with Oregon and Washington. Utah, Arizona, Arizona State, and Colorado have (apparently) already been eyeing the Big-12.
Could The CW really get this TV deal?
Is it time to start throwing dirt on the Pac-12 grave?
First the LIV tour and now this. Really putting second tier leagues in a choke hold
Watched a little bit of the LIV tour last weekend on the CW. Very amateurish at best. Horrible graphics, especially the scoreboard. It covered up 25% of the screen and the font was so small, you couldn't read it.
That's a total surprise. About all I knew about LIV was that it was backed by a gazillion dollars, so I'd have assumed their production values would be great.
I genuinely do not get the LIV coverage. The side ticker like its an auto race, the teams, the amateurish names of the teams, the shotgun start that kills any drama or your ability to build narrative. I don't know who convinced the saudis to light all this money on fire but it just lacks direction or competitive drive. But hey at least I don't have to see patrick reed on tv as much so I guess theyve done me that favor
I think LIVs problem is that at the end of the day...it's golf.
I'm wondering if people will watch the new Tiger Woods thing, it sounds kind of cool, but it seems like it'll just have niche sports audience.
Amazon started NFL coverage and it was great week 1. But it was he NFL.
I think at the end of the day, it's about the sport.
We love football, we'll watch basketball in the right moments, baseball is baseball, hockey only matters to hockey folks...and that's fine, because NASCAR only matters to NASCAR folks and that's also fine.
Soccer is the one that interests me the most. The US seems to be gravitating to soccer more and more...and I think it's partially because you get the community of football mixed with the season of baseball.
As for Golf (and Tennis)...they only truly matter (in the US) if generational American players are playing. I wonder, what are the top 25 most viewed golf tournaments in history? And were any played without Tiger?
I watch all the good I can get. It is very exciting. Soccer on the other hand is so insanely boring. How can you watch a sport that goes for 2hrs and ends in a 0-0 tie?
The same way people watch Iowa Football.
Community, strategy, teamwork, tradition, etc. - like I said.
Soccer is the closest thing to football when it comes to the atmosphere.
Interesting that hockey isn't a high scoring sport but I never hear anyone call it boring.
April 10th, 2023 at 12:02 PM ^
I got into EPL soccer at the ripe age of 51. I ignored and somewhat scorned soccer for most of my life with the same attitude that you just conveyed. But I can honestly say that some of the most exciting sporting action I've seen has been 0-0, 1-0, and 1-1 EPL games. And the relegation avoidance pressure makes the bottom feeder games so damned interesting. A recent Brighton-Brentford 3-3 tie was absolutely delicious to devour as a neutral fan.
Cartoon Wetwork?
For those (like me) who had no idea what "the CW" is:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_CW
Also, think about being a Pac-12 leftover. One minute your peers are UCLA and USC, the next they're UCF and Cinci. That's called sinking in class.
Was on the same boat. Thanks!
The C is from CBS and the W is from Warner Bros. but they go out of their way to not make that clear. Thank you for the wikipedia link.
If the CW was still UPN I would be all in supportikg them picking up the Pac-12. Reminds me of my favorite 90’s sports memories
If the CW was still UPN I would be all in supportikg them picking up the Pac-12. Reminds me of my favorite 90’s sports memories
Had NO clue what the CW was, thank you.
Just shows, even st my age you learn something new every day.
I don’t know. UCF and Cincy may be a small step ABOVE the PAC 12 leftovers…
I seriously did not know the CW was still a thing. I thought it went the way of the WB.
The WB? Fuck that fucking frog
The WB frog died a long time ago.
Fortunately, we still have his cousin, Michigan J. Frog.
Right, I always thought it was the frog that sang “The Michigan Rag” in the WB cartoon? You know - some construction worker finds a singing frog in a time capsule, tries to monetize it but it only sings for him, he fails, goes crazy, buries it again.
”Everybody likes the Michigan Rag”
Classic cartoon from 1955. The frog's singing is the only dialog in the whole thing; otherwise the entire story is told through pantomime and music. A true Chuck Jones masterpiece.
Oops.
Doubly fortunate?
UPN and WB were dying, then combined to become CW. Now they're just one dying network instead of two.
Heh, the WB turned into the CW. Nothing changed besides the name, it's still just the network that is 99% shows for teens starring models...Besides Smallville and Veronica Mars which still were full of beautiful people just actually good shows (well VM was great, i never much liked smallville).
Started from the bottom now we're here...
Who amongst us hasn't binged watched a few episodes of Supernatural before Oregon State-Cal on a Friday night? The 15 episode angel story arcs are tedious as hell but the standalone episodes where they fight a trickster or a wendigo are bangers.
Can’t tell if you are actually trying to knock the show… cuz only someone who has, ya know, actually watched the entire show would know all those details about it.
My wife is a "Supernatural" fan, even to the point of going to the odd convention - not just ComiCon type things, but show-specific ones (like one in Toronto in 2014. I went to a hockey game with a friend instead since Air Canada Centre was mere blocks away). That said, I have seen pieces of the show as a result through time (it aired in syndication for 15 seasons), just enough to confirm that it probably is a poetic lead-in for Pac-12 football.
Next on the CW: Gilmore Girls Volleyball after Oregon State has their last pre pac 12 tuneup game against Smallville College.
It's hard to believe that the PAC-12 is fighting to survive and the Big 12 is now thriving (relative to PAC 12). Losing USC & UCLA and looking to replace them with SDSU (likely) and one of: SMU (possible), Rice (maybe) or Tulane (maybe) is quite a drop in class. Several PAC 12 schools are now flirting with Big 12. ESPN not ponying up enough cash on the renewal of the PAC 12 TV rights so CW becomes a distinct possibility. And with that Oregon and Washington are rumored to dissatisfied. Yikes!
(As an aside and I'm getting old but I must say, college football is lessened without a vibrant PAC 12.)
Not sure why, but Oregon and Washington feels more natural today than it did five-six months ago. Sure could take some scheduling pressure off of UCLA and USC.
No doubt Oregon & Washington will be THRILLED with the CW payout.
"Hello Big Ten, can we talk?"
the Big 12 really isn't thriving - it is basically a glorified G5 conference now
they have no marquee schools left
They lack a marquee school, but that’s a pretty deep conference in both football and basketball.
“thriving” may be a strong word if you’re comparing them to the B1G or SEC, but I’d much rather be in the B12’s shoes than the PAC12 or arguably the ACC’s shoes at this point.
As a basketball conference it's elite and they aren't lacking a marquee school. They've been the #1 conference in KenPom seven of the last nine years--the two times they were second instead of first were 2020 (COVID) and 2021 (Baylor won national title).
Correct. The PAC 12 is about as relevant as the CW so it's a good fit.
Gilmore Girls and PAC12 football... quite a lineup.
I can think of worse doubleheaders.
There is no show I despise more on this planet than the Gilmore Girls. And it’s not a knock on crappy shows that my wife and daughters like to watch because I will watch and enjoy some of that terrible stuff. Emily in Paris? Inject it into my veins. All American on the CW? Awesome. Are they probably all objectively terrible? Yea, but they’re fun and light. Gilmore Girls is just insufferable. I wish I could launch the mom into a black hole. It annoyed me to no end when she was Larry’s girlfriend on Curb.
Don't forget their best show: Penn and Teller! They invite four or five magicians to work on each episode plus they perform as well. Great fun! Maybe Pac-12 football is a magic show too.... see it or not??
Pac12 is definitely in trouble with this contract now that everyone else is signed up...
If they do sign with CW, they'd be smart not to do a long term deal...not sure if Amazon or Apple would be any better though...
Not sure what they can do to improve their product though...There's some good reasoning to add SDSU and Fresno St, but I am not sure the University Presidents would get behind those institutions joining the Pac12.
Pac12 has some options if they were to raid the MW.
SDSU is a no-brainer to me. Blends football and basketball success with a decent sized market.
I can see valid arguments to be made for Colorado State, UNLV, Nevada, Fresno State, Wyoming and Utah State. Boise would be decent for football but they don’t bring much of anything else athletically or academically and don’t bring a large market with them.
Though it’s hard to say any of those schools really move the needle much in terms of improving the product.
While the Pac12 isn't focused on AAU membership as the B1G presidents are, I've read about some resistance to some of the schools mentioned...
Its tough to know what the plan is or who holds the leverage on making these decisions. I think its pretty clear that the Pac12 needs to add teams, but will they?
It's not going to be just a football/basketball decision imo... And then you have to consider whether those schools add value for those bidding on the TV contracts.
From my understanding, the B1G stopped at USC and UCLA because of off the field considerations. UW and Oregon would be good fits; both AAU members. Football/Basketball have been good (UW seems to be coming back up)...
The issue was that they didn't increase the TV rights; they diluted them - they would have lessened the cut for each B1G teams, not increased them...The bottom line was it wasn't worth it to add those teams, even though there were some existing synergies, with rivalries and geography which could have been the foundation of a western division, which would have helped logistically with the olympic (non-revenue) sports that come as part of the deal.
That resistance likely falls to the wayside when you’re talking about the conference falling apart completely.
The issue was that they didn't increase the TV rights
Right, but you’re looking at that through the scope of the B1G and the race for mega TV deals. Not the PAC12 that is fighting for survival with Oregon and Washington wanting to go to the B1G. With Colorado, Utah, Arizona and ASU reportedly eyeballing the B12.
Hypothetically say those four schools do join the B12, since it seems unlikely Washington and Oregon are going to the B1G anytime soon. Where does that leave the remaining 6 PAC12 schools? Go independent? Be forced to try and join the MWC? Or raid the MWC themselves? At the point the PAC12 is fighting for survival, we’re not talking about adding profitable markets anymore. You’re already looking at being relegated to the CW Network with the 10 teams you currently have. Doing nothing doesn’t seem like a viable option.
What do Washington and Oregon do in that case? Come hat in hand to the Big Ten and say "we know we dilute your TV payout, so we'll take a reduced share (less than Rutgers) if you let us in?" It's possibly their best option but still pretty unappealing.
That’s kinda the issue they’re faced with. Doing nothing isn’t really an option. It’s essentially raid the MWC or fold because over half of the member institutions are actively looking for a way out. You either stabilize the situation or it’s pretty much over for them all.
I think that's what the evaluation is skewing for with the Pac12 - staying pat. Or at least wait and see.
I don't think the idea of TV rights is limited to the B1G; for the Pac, the TV revenue has to increase per school. Otherwise why not carry on with the 10 teams.
Not saying you are doing this, but some point only look at this through the lens of football/Basketball. Oregon and Washington are bad cultural fits with the B12, so I think its unlikely they would simply stay and try building up the other brand back to being good again
if you bring in two new schools, you have to add those schools to every single sport, which massively increases cost for travel (depending on geography of course) for the AD in non revenue sports - money coming in from the new schools needs to be able to offset that.
Undoubtedly, the bean counters are going through all the scenarios right now and will advise on what the best course of action is.
Otherwise why not carry on with the 10 teams.
Because over half of the remaining teams are looking to bail. It’s not a stable situation whatsoever at the moment and adding teams already within that geographic footprint helps with that stability. They’re never going to have the status they had with USC and UCLA. And the member schools are already looking for greener pastures.
If the 10 remaining teams were all willing to stay and make things work, it could be a viable option. But Washington and Oregon have actively lobbied the B1G. ASU, Arizona, Utah and Colorado have reportedly expressed interest in the Big 12. Carrying on with 10 doesn’t work when 6/10 want out. For the PAC12 to survive, expansion is ultimately their only option. They’ll just have to accept that their status has diminished to an extent.