The guy Bo actually wanted- Mo, what if he had not resigned back in 1995?

Submitted by iawolve on

This has nothing to do with the current coaching search, which I am obsessed with and fearful of at the same time since I am trying to insulate myself from any giant disappointment. In doing this, I started thinking back to the man at the helm when I was in college, Mo. This is interesting since he was someone who we did guess about in regards to if Bo would have wanted him or not, he was Bo's pick as his first successor. 

Once I went there, I thought about what if Mo never got arrested and resigned, and instead lead the program until retirement sometime around when Carr left (they were very close to the same age). Would the program have looked any different? Would Mo have developed a large coaching tree so we have successors? Would we have embraced new look offenses?

The guy was actually pretty fascinating considering he was both the DC under Bo, left for Illinois and came back coaching QBs, DC again and then OC which is insane. He won 3 B10 (no B1G then) titles and 4 bowl games in 5 years in addition to coaching a heisman winner and laying the foundation for our NC team which included another heisman winner. I always thought he was more strategic than Lloyd and might have had a higher ceiling for the program, but it also could be that it was too long ago for me to really remember the details. 

Interested in any Mo talk from the board and if you feel we would have done better, worse or same as what we got out of Lloyd in addition to your thoughts regarding Mo's ability to develop coaches. He certainly was able to get good talent.

 

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wigeon

November 4th, 2014 at 7:13 PM ^

was the man.  I knew Andy well, who was kind of a dickhead, but his dad was amazing.  I sat in on a seminar for HS coaches at  the U of M Coaches clinic, and was ready to run through the proverbial wall for him.  

And bigger picture, so were the hundreds of high school coaches in attendance. 

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CoverZero

November 4th, 2014 at 10:29 PM ^

The Lions actually extended Mo's contact and were going to bring him back as HC for 2001... however then they brought in Millen who proceeded to fire Mo and bring in Mornigwhig and his Harley, which kicked off a decade of bumbling and incompetence resulting in one of the worst, if not THE worst stretches by an organization in NFL (and professional sports) history.

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2000-11-29/sports/0011290350_1_big-t…

 

 
 

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RJMAC

November 4th, 2014 at 11:46 PM ^

It was a Matt Millen move. The Lions made Moeller head coach after Bobby Ross quit during the season. They were close to making the playoffs, but lost the final game at the very end. Matt Millen was subsequently hired as GM and he wanted his guy so he fired Moeller. Millen hired 3 of his guys as coach and never got it right in the next 7 years as the Lions hit rock bottom. He would have been better off just keeping Moeller and tweak the team he had instead of dismantling it.

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uminks

November 5th, 2014 at 2:12 AM ^

against the Bears he would of made the final wildcard spot and Millen would have kept him. Oh well!

I think Mo would have had an overall better record than Carr. Not sure if everything would have went right for a '97 NC? But I think he would have kept a top 10 team well into the 2000s. Carr seem not to get the bounce he should have had after the NC team. It helped recruiting but Carr just lost too many close games and then '05 happened. Carr bounced back in '06 but the downward slide started there after. Now 8 years later we are in the midst of our second dip!

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mikoyan

November 6th, 2014 at 1:43 PM ^

The Lions brought in that jackass GM and that jackass GM had to bring in his own people even though he was sitting on a guy that brought the Lions 1 field goal short of the playoffs despite having every reason to quit.  I realize that they needed to hire a new GM but they should have at least given Moeller a chance.  And honestly, the jackass' treatment of Moeller is why I didn't like him from day one.  It seemed like, "Maybe I'll keep you or maybe I wont" knowing full well he was going to fire him.  Should have cut him loose immediately.

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SFBlue

November 4th, 2014 at 7:16 PM ^

I credit Mo with opening up Michigan's playbook in the mid and late 1980s.  No doubt, he had better offensive bona fides than Lloyd Carr, and was a better HC candidate.  What ultimately hurt Michigan was the failure to groom and retain coaching talent.  Would Mo have done any better in terms of setting up a transition?  It is hard to imagine that being worse, as there were no viable internal options.

In terms of the impact on overall record during the Carr era, I bet it would look pretty much the same from 1995-2003 or so.  (Moeller had back-to-back four loss seasons to end his tenure, Carr had a great stretch from 1997 to 2003.)  After 2003 you could argue Michigan may have been better had Moeller recruited and retained better coaching talent, but this is all highly speculative. 

 

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UMaD

November 4th, 2014 at 7:37 PM ^

Lost in all the nostalgic Bo-glorification was that Michigan became pretty offensively stagnant in the late 80s, as Bo always had an old-school disdain for passing. Sure we could usually just overpower the "little 8" of the big 10 but we struggled in bowls and elite competition. 

It was Moeller who led Michigan into 90's QB-U era: Grbac-Collins-Greise-Brady-Henson-Navarre.

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rob f

November 4th, 2014 at 8:42 PM ^

Bo started learning about and making use of the passing game more and more once he realized the rare talent he had in Anthony Carter and switched to John Wangler at QB.  Even then, it wasn't until the arrival of Jim Harbaugh that Michigan's offense really became more balanced.  At times.  Unless Michael Taylor was under center.  

Though you're somewhat correct about Bo's disdain for the pass in general, he showed an ability to adapt his offensive schemes to the talent level of his QB over the last decade of his tenure.  And then Mo built upon that framework when he took over in '90.

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Unsalted

November 5th, 2014 at 11:35 AM ^

You make a great point about Bo and the turning point with AC and Wangler. I knew AC when I was at Michigan, and he was really excited when Wangler got the nod at QB over Hewlett in 1980. Wangler was far less mobile than Hewlett even before Wangler's knee injury, but Wangler was the best at delivering the ball.

Even on the famous play to win the 1979 Indiana game with 6 seconds remaining, there was a fake hand-off which fooled no one. I saw Wangler joking about it in an interview.

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mjv

November 5th, 2014 at 7:05 AM ^

I'm not sure the Demetrius Brown starting most of the 1987 season, Grbac starting four games in 1989, Harbaugh  leading the county in passing efficiency in 1985 and finishing third in the Heisman in 1986, and going to the Rose Bowl after the 1986, 1988 and 1989 seasons fits your narrative.  
 
Mo probably had a lot to do with Bo becoming more passing oriented in the late 1980s, but Bo adapted over time to remain extremely successful.

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D.C. Dave

November 4th, 2014 at 7:19 PM ^

He was actually the guy who brought along Michigan's passing game, which was never Bo's favorite part of the game. Moeller was a tremendous coach and, as a recruiter, he was just as good. He knew how to evaluate talent and recruit the players who could do it at the next level. We won several Big Ten titles in a row under Moeller.

His demise was sad. If it happened these days, he might be able to enter a program to get help and keep his job. At the time, it was a huge deal, the video of him weeping did not help, and momentum rose quickly to get him out. It's too bad. I thought Lloyd Carr was a solid coach, but I never thought he was not nearly as good as Moeller.

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True Blue Grit

November 4th, 2014 at 7:19 PM ^

and would have done better over the long term than LC IMO.  I think he was railroaded out of Michigan by the anti-athletics administration at the time and by the local media witch hunt.  In his book, Bo said he was travelling and unavailable at the time.   He could not respond to Gary and would have advised him to fight it.  Unfortunately that didn't happen.  

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CoverZero

November 4th, 2014 at 7:20 PM ^

I knew some former players back in the 90s who played for Mo....they loved the guy and raved about him as a person and a coach. Not bad for a former Buckeye team captain.

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blueday

November 4th, 2014 at 7:25 PM ^

This was the start of the end that is manifesting itself years later. MO should be retiring now... The guy Bo actually wanted- Mo... just love this comment .. I don't know how other people are getting more than that. Schlissel just told the Daily the search is restricted to his head at the moment, so I regard all insider information. it's in his head so let the blogging fail lol We know more ...

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blueday

November 4th, 2014 at 7:25 PM ^

This was the start of the end that is manifesting itself years later. MO should be retiring now... The guy Bo actually wanted- Mo... just love this comment .. I don't know how other people are getting more than that. Schlissel just told the Daily the search is restricted to his head at the moment, so I regard all insider information. it's in his head so let the blogging fail lol We know more ...

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JT4104

November 4th, 2014 at 7:30 PM ^

I always felt like Mo was ahead of the curve in recruiting in bringing in more athletes and kinda getting away from the pound it away Big Ten style at the time. Defensively with help from Carr they really got lighter and faster with the Golds, Dhani Jones and those types of defensive players in the world.

I honestly believe Mo could have gotten a national title or two, but the funny part is I dont think he would have gotten one in 97. Not sure why but it just felt like those stars were way to perfectly aligned for Carr.

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