Conference Expansion Talk - This Time From Oklahoma
Hey, I know it's kind of a slow news day, what without any commits in at least 48 hours (!!!), so I figured I'd bring up this potentially dead horse. Apparently, a few days ago, the OU president brought up the idea of the Big 12 actually trying to get back to 12, because the pro rata revenue is set to stay constant no matter how many schools are in the conference (thus, anyone new doesn't need to bring in $20 million+ in value immediately). Many felt that the lack of a championship game prevented Baylor and TCU from making the playoffs this past year, which could really hold the conference back in the future.
However, as many of us are aware, the available options for an expansion are pretty bad, as detailed in this ESPN article (http://espn.go.com/blog/ncfnation/post/_/id/111803/oklahoma-president-d…), and they even cite trying to get Nebraska back as an (admittedly unlikely) option. A guy who often has a pretty interesting (if fringe-y) take on expansion says this may point as much to Oklahoma potentially being willing to leave the conference if they feel it's still too Texas-centric, with the Longhorn Network, etc., and thus holding them back (http://frankthetank.me/2015/06/25/bad-blood-within-the-big-12-oklahoma-…). As another random thing, apparently there was talk back in March of Arizona State joining the Big Ten for hockey alone (there was mutual interest: http://www.cornnation.com/2015/3/28/8298423/big-ten-hockey-expansion-co…), and of course, Hopkins is the example of the new world of affiliate membership for one sport.
So, I guess my broad question is, do you think the Big 12 will expand, and if so, who do they go for, do you think Oklahoma gets poached before that happens, and what is the Big Ten's move going forward? Get more academically strong affiliate members that pair well with its existing strengths (a fringe-y idea is MIT for rowing, etc.)?
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PaRappa the Rapper
Eh, we still have Gucci Mane!
In the rain or in the snow, I got the funky flow, but now, I really gotta go.
Still don't want Oklahoma and Texas. This is not a game of collect 'em all. You don't win for having the coolest schools in your conference. Texas acts like hegemonic assholes. I don't know why any conference would want to invite the school that destroyed the Big 12 as well as the Pac-16 before it even left the ground. They'll come in acting like their shit don't stink and nobody will want to live with them.
Nothing against Oklahoma per se, I suppose, but you're not a Big Ten school if you're closer to saltwater than to a Great Lake.
I agree with the first one-third of your post. The rest, no.
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Ugh. It's like Rutgers got the Big Ten drunk in Vegas and married Rutgers without signing a prenup. I feel like the analogy is appropriate given the reputation of Rutgers' women.
Got any phone numbers?
Yup. There are literally no downsides to adding Texas. They can bully the Big12 around because they dwarf everyone in the conference (even OU, once you get outside of football UT has more money, better academics, everything) and so the conference is at their disposal. Once they get into a conference with Michigan and Ohio State they are no longer the only giant. They would no longer be the top academic school, they'd had have 3 other revenue giants on their heels. They would have to play ball with everyone, it would be a stellar addition.
was surpriesed PITT never got an invitation to join the BIG. geographically it makes sense as does Notre Dame. If it was up to me I would add PITT and Notre Dame. Looking at it economically Nort Carolina and Georgia Tech would be a good fit i think as well as more plausible than ND. who else would be a good fit.
It's not about geography. It's about eyeballs. Pitt is located between Columbus, OH and State College, PA. The B1G already has the Pittsburgh TV market covered with OSU and PSU. Pitt does not help expand the B1G's foot print
Honest question: did the addition get the Big Ten Network added to NYC cable packages? That was basically the entire reason for their addition, which is extremely sad in my opinion, and I'm not sure if it ever did or will come to fruition. Plus, with the seemingly impending move to a la carte television, I think it was an extremely stupid move. Rutgers adds NOTHING. Not academics, not athletics, not research, not a good place to travel to. I can't think of a single good thing to say about that "school".
They once counted distinguished alum James Gandolfini as one of their most avid fans.
That's pretty freaking awesome, even though the addition was downright terrible.
Thank you. And I was sad to see his passing. Even in one of the worst movies I've ever seen, "The Drop", he was a bright spot. Awesome actor.
But please, I hope we never let Rutgers forget how unwanted they are in this conference. No need to be overly cordial for hangers-on.
They are like the really crappy kid in your elementary school class who your Dad made you invite to your birthday party with the coolest kids in school, making you look worse, just because that crappy kid MIGHT give you a really expensive birthday present.
Then he shows up and just brings a card... without any money inside. And eats all the cake. Then throws up on himself and goes to eat glue in the corner.
Anything in NYC would be a bonus.
Rutgers gets us a Michigan game in NJ every other year, and makes NJ Big Ten country. This in turn may get us Mr. Gary over Alabama.
Sounds like a good deal to me.
Whatever gets him here. I don't care if it's the color of the socks we wear.
What do you mean Rutgers adds nothing? It added a second Big Ten team for Jersey Shore stars to root for.
They did get it added, and it actually went forward more smoothly than anticipated.
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You do realize that [the state of] Maryland is on the Atlantic ocean, right?
Yes, which makes Maryland now and forever not a real Big Ten school. Rutgers too.
And PSU by a skosh.
True. I actually Google Earthed that a bit ago and they're closer to Baltimore harbor than to Lake Erie by about twelve or fifteen miles. I'm willing to give them a waiver basically for being on the western side of the mountains. But, I also wouldn't bat an eye if we traded them to the ACC for someone more midwestern. Maybe Pitt. Then everyone who gives a shit about markets can still have their markets.
Is Oklahoma really much worse of a school than Rutgers? Everyone I know from New Jersey, who has the means, and whose child has the intelligence, has flat out REFUSED to send their child to Rutgers. Perhaps it is the combination of subpar academics, a crappy campus, and a compltely unremarkable name... but they would rather send them anywhere other than Rutgers.
virtually the etire B1G listed before the FIRST SEC "school" ( Georgia ) Nebraska keeping us from saying that
Vanderbilt (35) and Florida (43) are both ahead of Georgia (53-67) in those rankings.
Penn State (37), Purdue (38), Rutgers (39), and Ohio State (41) are all ranked lower than Vanderbilt and Indiana (47), Michigan State (50), Iowa (53-67), and Nebraska (86-108) ranked below both Vandy and Florida.
So the FIRST SEC school (Vanderbilt) is ranked ahead of half (7 of 14) of the Big Ten.
Oklahoma Rankings:
Forbes: 202
US News & World: 106
Washington Monthly: 148
ARWU Global: 301-400
For comparison, Here is Nebraska:
Forbes: 280
US News & World: 99
Washington Monthly: 165
ARWU Global: 201-300
So in summary, Oklahoma is no Michigan, and a debatable academic addition, however they are very comparable to Nebraska academically. If they are behind Nebraska, they aren't behind by much.
Also as a side note, I think any University that falls in between 50 and 150 is pretty much the same in academic quality. For example, Michigan State falls at 85 in US News and Report. Great school, but I you can't convince me the 50 or so schools behind them are that much worse.
Not yet.
I want UVa and/or UNC, Wahoo. But that ship has passed.
Asking the important questions.
Maryland has very good academics, basketball, lacrosse, etc., and a good football program is not beyond the realm of possibility. MD finished 4-4 in the B1G, way better than many long term B1G teams. Rutgers...ugh.
Other than football, and they were 8-5 this past year, what does Oklahoma bring to the table.
Maryland had their first football game sellout this past year for the first time since 2007.