I remember a game broadcast last fall, when an analyst was talking about Glasgow and how the Lions ST coach thought he was one of those guys you steal in the final round of the draft and he winds up as a mainstay on your roster.

So that's exactly what I expected. First, of all, he comes from a classic football background and family of over-achieving guys without the usual pro physical attributes, size or speed. Glasgow just makes plays and is easy to root for.

The Panthers drafted 7 defensive players after giving up 29 points a game last year, and allowing 31 rushing touchdowns while having $48 million currently tied up in salary cap money on players no longer on the team. Seven. It still won't be enough.

The Patriots drafted a safety in the second round from Division II  Lenoir-Rhyne University in Hickory, NC, a school with an undergrad enrollment in 2017-2018 less than 2,000.

Players can come from anywhere and the NFL will find you. Doesn't mean they make the right choices or that their the smartest talent evaluators, either. If you're a Lions or Browns fan you know this implicitly.

Regarding our players getting into the draft at lower positions, I do think it's also important to look at performance after the draft. Drafting in any sports league is an unreliable endeavor, so just "Getting in" isn't as telling about a player's quality than what they make of themselves in the league. I think OSU has a far greater stamp on the NFL with its current output than does Michigan.

So I think we are underdogs to OSU currently. Although I agree that we have to bring in an overall higher level of talent to compete as equals, I wonder more and more about what Lorenz alleged was a great disorganization in recruiting. If we were able to recruit with a more sound strategy, I think we'd have more positional balance and wouldn't have those gaps that were discussed. For example, we could try to recruit *some* players that actually play defensive tackle in high school. If we had a more internally-coordinated recruiting approach, I think it's more likely that we at least don't have classes with weird position gaps. Without the roster imbalance, I think you get fewer position switches that waste entire years of players' eligibility (Bench Mason), and you have more of a chance of playing consistent football. Doing so gives us a better chance of upsetting OSU and turning the tide. 

Many folks seem to think that the only path to winning is to just become the same as OSU; I think it would be cooler if we built a more organic approach, progressively building to a point of equal footing with OSU. I like the idea of doing it with an alum like Jim Harbaugh, but it's unclear to me if he's the organizational leader we need for this hoped-for outcome to be realistic. I harp on this a lot, but I will never understand letting a graduate assistant coach a historic class of wide receivers that has now fizzled out. 

It has to start with someone, though. I think JJ Mccarthy genuinely hates OSU for the shenanigans they pulled with his recruitment, and wants to beat them into the ground for revenge. Can't hurt to have a charismatic 5-star with a chip on his shoulder to lead us. Hopefully he's the catalyst.  

I'm not saying DPJ couldn't have produced more, better QB play, coaching, blah blah blah, but this truly was a hell of a class for WR's. Look at the Buckeye's draft-eligible WR's

(ranking according to 24/7)

Austin Mack - 9th WR in class -> UDFA

Binjimen Victor -12th WR in class -> UDFA

KJ Hill - 16th WR in class -> 7th rd pick

I'm arguing with the internet.

Always a winning strategy.

So yeah, Mattison leaves a year ago and Partridge a couple months ago and Michigan no longer has any defensive recruiting.  This is a big problem.  Need MOAR all-star recruiters on that side of the ball.  And if it takes firing Brown to give a guy the DC carrot, it's beginning to be about that time (and I'm one of the remaining Brown defenders but he's not a recruiter)

Also, fuck Greg Mattison.

I don't get into the recruiting wars/arguments around here but I acknowledge that there is a disparity and that Michigan largely underachieves with with what it has (I attribute that to a lack of motivation and mental focus more than anything else but that's another story). 

BUT - let's all train our hatred on this nerd:

https://dailycaller.com/2020/04/27/michigan-10-players-drafted-nfl-jim-harbaugh/

This dude is the worst and is an unabashed Michigan hater. It's the Daily Caller, I know, I know, so it shouldn't matter, but his pieces on Michigan/Harbaugh are ridiculously one-sided and unfair. This one is full of bad faith as well. He doesn't even reference the fact that Ohio State had far more players drafted in the higher rounds than Michigan did. But that  would of course back up the argument that Michigan is in fact operating at a talent disadvantage. You should read  his trash article on how Michigan fans were treating the bowl game against Alabama as our "Super Bowl" without providing any evidence of this fact whatsoever. If I recall, most of the fanbase dreaded that matchup and were glad to come away with a decent showing and a non-blowout loss.

I'm just impressed that the Daily Caller's commitment to shitty journalism is so strong that even its sports reporting is 100% trash. 

the sad thing is, while we were sleeping, OSU was getting a lot better. It will take some kind of earthquake for them to fall off.

If we don't open the money cannon, we won't beat OSU.

So, now I’m 50% on my prediction(Shea wouldn’t get a sniff in draft day) now I only have to wait 1yr to complete my prediction that more than a few here scoffed at. Brandon Peters will get drafted. 
 

I’m not saying he’ll play, but on measurables alone he’ll get his number called. That will make coach khakis look like a numbskull.

I don't think anyone is mad because ten players got drafted.

I also don't think "Come to Michigan and be a fifth round pick" is going to net a lot of top recruits.

We've somehow become the place top end recruits come to be above average. And that doesn't bode well for future recruiting.

Also, that the top three picks spent time at OSU doesn't help us.

DPJ and Blacks lack of production illustrates a big issue.   They were criminally underutilized. And this affects recruiting becuause national highlights tend to show the exciting plays which are passing TDs.   This is a good recruiting tool.  Carr's teams had no problem with it with guys like Terrell and Braylon always in the highlights.  And that helps recruits wanna come here.   Harbaughs teams haven't done this at all, and if we want an uptick in recruiting we have to get Collins lots of long TDs to make the airwaves.  If we don't, no good wr will want to come here after seeing how they didn't use our WRs.  

If you want a laugh, check out Patterson's profile over at NFL.com.  These might be my favorites:

• Works through progressions and makes quality decisions
• Slow to feel edge close in at times

. . . who'd they watch?

As for recruiting, I got my own horn to toot.  I'm not all that bothered by Michigan recruiting 3-stars out of New England.  It's a moneyball move and not a dumb one (as long as that's not all you're doing, and that seems to be all they're doing).

I'm far more bothered that they have recruiting lapses to the point of running out of warm bodies at various positions.  Brian covered how they missed on an elite left tackle back when we needed one, and in such a knuckleheaded manner you'd think they preferred doing without.  They KNEW DT was going to be a hole and last season even a Matt Godin caliber DT would've made a huge difference in key games because they played effin' Jordan Glasgow (who FTR was fine when not asked to play DT) on the interior because they literally had nobody.  And now that same damn problem is looming at CB.

There will be seasons when a program at Michigan's place and time will have to field a 3-star "just a guy" when you'd obviously prefer a dude.  It's unreasonable to expect 4- and 5-star recruits to flock to a program that hasn't once challenged for a title so far this century.  But WTF is Michigan doing by playing literally no one at various key positions??  There's having your rough days and then there's incompetence you don't even see at Rutgers.

The folks (or rather That Guy) complaining that Michigan isn't hauling in truckloads of elite recruits are complaining about the wrong thing!

every bit of this discussion is simple confirmation bias.  if you think that recruiting is down, or that the coaching is bad, or that things were better with the highlighter pants, then ten players drafted is further proof of that.  if you think the opposite, then ten players drafted is further proof of that, too.  all of it is just a hook onto which you hang whatever argument you feel like making today.  or, in most cases, the argument you make every day, no matter what.

it's exacerbated by the fact that the nfl draft and its very existence as a topic of discussion is the most masturbatory exercise in sports, even in the best of times.  multiply that by a million, and before you know it you're arguing about whether jordan glasgow getting drafted is good or bad for the program.

Seth: To me it is quite simple: kids want to go play in the playoffs and only a few teams can make it to the playoffs.

This is true, and it was a perfectly predictable outcome of the playoff system.

When they put the playoff system in place, it was clear there would be an arms race for the top talent, because, as has been said many times, success begets success.  When implemented in 2014, there was perhaps a four year window to become part of the "haves" that are plausibly in the playoff picture, and those not in that group would never get in.  The "haves" are the schools we have seen over and over: Alabama, Clemson, Ohio State, Oklahoma ... with Georgia and LSU also in the picture.

(This season will tell whether LSU has staying power, or if they caught lightning in an bottle.)

The window has largely closed.  Teams like Michigan, Penn State, Notre Dame, Texas, and Southern Cal, are not in the "haves."  They are solid teams, but they don't have enough on the roster to provide the fire power and depth to sustain a near-perfect season and two games in the playoffs.  Note the emphasis on depth.  The playoff-winning teams have quality depth; those on the outside don't.

What remains to be seen is how the college football landscape shakes out for those teams that can't even compete for the "solid team" moniker.  For now -- key emphasis -- there's money to be made fielding an 7-5 or 6-6 team.  We'll see if that holds up over the next 10 to 20 years.  I'm doubtful.

Been saying it a long time....ACADEMICS are a thing at UM both initial entrance and continuing education and until the Wolverines allow for more slots, this will continue to be a thing. This isn't the 80's/90's anymore and the profile of an institution is important to a lot of people.

I don't think scouts can get over that DPJ just doesn't look like he's playing fast on the field.  One guy described it as he needs a runway to get going.  I honestly think it's fair.

DPJ ran a 4.48, and Denard ran a 4.43, at any point did DPJ ever look like he was as fast as Denard on the field?

Having said that, i mentioned in another thread that DPJ will have a real chance to shine in the slot for us.  That position is wide open, and with defenders wondering what Chubb/OBJ/Landry are doing, Donovan will more than likely be singled up on a safety/LB.

Dumb question:

Aside from the losing streak to Ohio State, is there a known specific set of reasons why Michigan recruiting has been a "problem"?

Michigan's recruiting has been in the "very good" category comparatively (BIG10), but not at "Elite" level (nationally).

Harbaugh has returned Michigan to Lloyd Carr's level pretty much. 9-3 seasons and usually a bowl loss.

Very competitive, but not consistently "Elite" like Alabama, Clemson, Ohio State, Georgia, etc.

No matter how pissed off people are here, I try to have some perspective: USC's 2020 recruiting class finished 55th. 13 commits, no 5-stars, two 4-stars, 11 3-stars. 

For USC, that's a smoldering crater.

Gratitude is in order, fellas.

What Dufek?

My take-away from This Week's Obsession is that we should have gotten the Princeton QB, rather than the Ole Miss QB. He probly would've been OK academically.

Having played high school football with the Dufek brothers I can’t imagine a Glasgow vs Dufek backyard football game.  Would that be cool or what ?

Those Dufek brothers were crazy dudes.  Watching Billy just f-ING crush some 300 lb Greco Roman Michigan HS wrestling God was an out of body experience.  The two Michigan Dufek brothers were college All-Americans.  The youngest choose Harvard as a QB, which back in those days was a more lucrative long term choice than being the next Rich Leach.  The Glasgows are really good but not All-Americans like Don and Bill Dufek. Just saying the obvious.