AAARGH I REMEMBER [Patrick Barron]

Unverified Voracity Remembers, Ominously Comment Count

Brian October 18th, 2023 at 1:10 PM

Quote of the year. Mike Sainristil on prepping for MSU:

“Coach Harbaugh says: ‘A faithful man forgives; a smart man forgets; the Harbaughs remember,’’ Mike Sainristil quipped.

This does not put the Harbaughs in the "smart man" category, admittedly.

Don't get cocky, kids. The Athletic has an Anonymous Coach Quote article about this weekend's OSU-PSU game that touches on Michigan towards the end, and well, neato:

“Michigan is above both of them,” said a staffer who faced Penn State. “Ohio State and Penn State are 2-a and 2-b in some order, but Michigan is well above both of them.”

Also:

“Michigan brought the fight to them in my mind,” said an assistant coach who faced Ohio State. “We really won’t know about this year’s team until we see them play against Michigan. That game is going to come down to the line of scrimmage. I don’t know how physical they are. Notre Dame was a fairly physical game, and they struggled to move the ball. That’s the only team they’ve played that can really match them up front so far.”

It seems like the coaches surveyed for this article give PSU the edge this weekend. We're going to learn a lot about how far the OSU OL has come since they got overwhelmed by their own defensive ends in their spring game:

“Their defensive ends, they have three that are elite P5 players, and they may have the best collective group of linebackers in the country,” said one head coach who faced the Nittany Lions. “They have two NFL Draft picks at corner who can play man; one’s a first rounder, the other is probably a third- or fourth-rounder. Their third-down package is good, but they don’t have to do anything crazy. (Defensive coordinator Manny Diaz) likes to be creative, but they don’t have to do a ton to get to the quarterback.”

Against Michigan last year Diaz got creative to the detriment of his own team; it's possible they can play Michigan more straight up this year and not get thrown into the ocean by Michigan's ground game.

[After THE JUMP: a tale too toxic to tell]

Also in Penn State. But you might have to throw the ball somewhere in the vicinity of "downfield". Yeesh:

image

Drew Allar's 6.9 yards per attempt ranks 83rd nationally among 113 qualified passers. His 6.3 air yards per attempt ranks 108th.

PSU has been able to grind out wins against the meek and lovelorn; probably going to take some explosives to beat OSU since I don't think the PSU ground game is likely do do much.

Something interesting from Yet Another NIL Hearing. Yesterday Congress had its tenth(!) opportunity to rabble about college football players getting rights literally everyone else in the country has; I'll spare you the counter-rabbling… most of the counter-rabbling. I will allow myself one counter-rabble:

There.

Anyway, the most newsworthy thing coming out of this hearing was outgoing ND athletic director Jack Swarbrick talking to reporters after his testimony:

“It’s a fairly radical notion, but if we could find a way to reach binding agreements with our student-athletes, most of this goes away,” the Notre Dame athletic director said, referring to what industry leaders say is a chaotic compensation system around name, image and likeness (NIL).

“We don’t have a mechanism to [collectively bargain] without them becoming employees. It would require a new mechanism that would recognize the rights of student-athletes to negotiate for the terms and conditions of their participation as athletes without being employees. I think it’s worth considering.”

Swarbrick is still holding on to the "they're not employees" fig leaf but once you have collectively bargained with your Not Employees you're 99.9% of the way to making them employees.

"Thanks, Alejandro" – Seth. Michigan's odd-looking interception at the end of the first drive against Indiana, as explained by Sainristil:

“It was kind of a zone between me, Rod and Junior. Will was out there locked man-to-man. And when three sits, I sit. So he sat and I went to make a play on the ball. I’m not 6-3. My arms aren’t long enough to pick it myself. But I batted it up to him. I could have dove for it, but I saw he was in position.”

So it was probably Rod Moore who needed to get over the top of the #2 guy going to the endzone.

Prediction: overblown. Austin Meek has an article on the "toxic" Michigan-Michigan State rivalry in the Athletic, but the only things cited other than the tunnel incident are light press conference sparring, Michigan State dysfunction that doesn't have anything to do with one specific football game on the schedule*, and the State News quitting the annual flag football game because they always lose. The specter of fan violence is brought up:

As the teams prepare to meet for the first time since the tunnel altercation, fans are understandably wary of another incident. In July, a Detroit radio host cautioned Michigan fans to stay away from Spartan Stadium or risk “eating a battery.” The game will be played at night, which tends to encourage a rowdier crowd. It also will be the first Michigan-Michigan State game since the passage of a state law that allows schools to serve alcohol at sporting events.

We are fortunate that circumstances have conspired to lower the temperature in the MSU fanbase. Instead of hoping against hope that Coach Sunk Cost Fallacy can turn it around by going 3-1 against Michigan, MSU fans are looking at a potential 2-10 season headed by an interim coach. Judging by the Red Cedar Message board, anyone who actually attends the game is going to pull the ripcord if Michigan gets up a couple scores. The game will likely pass without much incident unless one of MSU's periodic attempts to injure a Michigan player works, and I'm not even sure MSU has enough GAF left in them to try it.

Meanwhile, this guy is so close to getting it:

Cogitate just a little further.

*[Except insofar as everything wrong with the MSU athletic department is about one specific football game on the schedule; in any case none of the Tucker/BOT stuff has anything to do with Michigan.]

Etc.: Step 1: complete. Step 2: Samuel L Jackson commencement speech. Bill Connelly names Jaylen Harrell Michigan's midseason MVP, which is bold. The Chronicle on Santa Ono's tenure to date. NIL has not led to a collapse in ratings. Inside Washington and Oregon's move to the Big Ten. Michigan –156 against Fitchburg State. If A&M axes Jimbo you can probably eliminate Mike Elko from the MSU search.

Comments

DiploMan

October 18th, 2023 at 1:56 PM ^

I don't have an Athletic subscription so I can't read the linked article, but Penn State doesn't have any common opponents with either Michigan or OSU so far this season, so I don't know how these anonymous opposing coaches can be making meaningful comparisons.

Blue Vet

October 18th, 2023 at 1:56 PM ^

Meek's writing process.

Step 1: need to write about a rivalry game.

Step 2: lots of agitation.

Step 3: include all the juicy stuff.

Step 4: notice all the juicy stuff is on one side.

Step 5: scramble to seem balanced.

Koop

October 19th, 2023 at 9:02 AM ^

I am grateful to Austin Meek. After the Athletic moved Nick Baumgartner off the regular Michigan football beat and assigned Meek to it, I canceled my subscription and found this site.

Best decision ever.

And yeah, @Brian and @Seth: I would gladly pay the equivalent of a subscription to The Athletic to get an ad-free experience on this site. :-)

Hensons Mobile…

October 18th, 2023 at 2:00 PM ^

Yes, thank you. This is the correct summary of the Austin Meek article and the "toxicity" of the rivalry.

Also, did Manchin "say the quiet part out loud"? I guess for some people. But this is what I am always left with when I hear arguments against NIL and revenue sharing. "I don't like change" is more important than not exploiting people.

Angry-Dad

October 19th, 2023 at 9:28 AM ^

No Manchin defender, but you have to remember he is the senator from West Virginia.  No way West Virginia can compete in NIL like those at the top of the market (although there is still a ton of coal money in West Virginia).  It may be that he is hoping to put some limits or caps to level the playing field for his home state program?

Or he could just be an asshole? or both?

Kermits Blue Key

October 18th, 2023 at 2:12 PM ^

I wonder if Manchin found it hard to root for his daughter who as CEO of Mylan drove the price of EpiPen up 500%? 

Spoiler alert - he did not. Mylan gave over $200k to his campaigns. I guess he only roots for certain types of Capitalists.

 

BuckeyeChuck

October 18th, 2023 at 2:30 PM ^

Inside Washington and Oregon's move to the Big Ten.

I must have been really out of touch with the PNW, because I didn't know until recently that they were such hated rivals. I always thought that their primary rival was their respective in-state version of Sparty.

Richard75

October 19th, 2023 at 12:11 AM ^

It’s a big brother/little brother dynamic.

Historically, Washington (being a traditional Pac-10/12 power and a regional-cultural rival) is the mountain they’ve wanted to climb. Obviously Oregon has a lot of cachet today, but people forget just how downtrodden that program used to be. Oregon still doesn’t even lead its all-time series with Cal.

Carpetbagger

October 18th, 2023 at 2:47 PM ^

Finally someone else who doesn't think this MSU game is going to be a big deal. Half the players on MSUs squad are new. The coaches who tried to leverage the rivalry to hate are mostly gone. They aren't good. My assumption is Michigan will forget its even a rivalry near the end of the 3rd and up by 4 scores. The ultimate insult is to play them like they don't even matter.

Angry-Dad

October 19th, 2023 at 9:32 AM ^

I had the misfortune of watching that game in my brother's frat house in Charlottesville.  UVA was set to go to number 1 if Michigan lost, so lots of drunk dudes pulling for the upset.  Not a great time. 

I would imagine being in the stadium was worse.  

jmblue

October 18th, 2023 at 3:12 PM ^

“It’s a fairly radical notion, but if we could find a way to reach binding agreements with our student-athletes, most of this goes away,” the Notre Dame athletic director said, referring to what industry leaders say is a chaotic compensation system around name, image and likeness (NIL).

I keep hearing this argument, but I don't understand it.  We now have star football and basketball players making six (if not seven) figures in NIL.  There is no way any sort of collective bargaining agreement would pay athletes that much directly from the schools.  Moreover, they wouldn't give up their right to NIL just because they agreed to a CBA with the schools.  Pro athletes don't give up their right to endorse products because they're paid by their teams.  Any NCAA-mandated salary would just go on top of NIL money, not replace it.

The NIL genie is out of the bottle, for better or worse.  

Hensons Mobile…

October 18th, 2023 at 3:36 PM ^

Ignore it. It's just part of the rabble rabble. I'm not sure why Brian considered that rabble rabble more newsworthy than the other rabble rabble because all the rabbles are bullshit. I think he just wanted to make fun of Swarbrick, which, fair.

I'm embarrassed for these people going to Congress, begging the United States government to basically codify new NCAA rules as law, when the NCAA doesn't even know what it wants. In part because they can't even identify a problem that needs to be fixed, because there isn't actually a problem.

This was another part of the rabble rabble:

"Utah is offering everybody on the team a new truck," said Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.). "Between the [transfer] portal and NIL, college football is in absolute chaos."

LOL Utah is not doing that. Or did he mean the state of Utah? Because the school isn't. That's still an NCAA violation. Yeah, okay, maybe there's a collective doing something like that (doubtful) to which I say, and...?

SD Larry

October 18th, 2023 at 3:38 PM ^

Great column.  Pretty surprised to read the surveyed Coaches give PSU a slight edge this week.  

My favorite write up quote of the year so far:

“Michigan is above both of them,” said a staffer who faced Penn State. “Ohio State and Penn State are 2-a and 2-b in some order, but Michigan is well above both of them.”

Sounds so good I want to believe and believe I do.  Beat Sparty !  Win the game.

DennisFranklinDaMan

October 18th, 2023 at 3:39 PM ^

If it were at all possible to limit NIL to "getting rights literally everyone else in the country has," in Brian's words, I honestly don't think anyone would care, much. But of course it's not. Schools remain incentivized to pay the players — a "right" very few people have — and many's the pundit, in Ann Arbor as elsewhere, that demands a school pay whatever it takes to get a highly-prized recruit to commit to the local school.

I'm all for NIL, and at the same time I'm absolutely appalled by the suggestion that schools should pay players, which 100% makes them "professionals." If we want schools to have affiliated and paid football teams, fine, but ... why do those players have to go to class? Why do we worry what their GPA is? Let's just admit that we don't care if they're students or not, and have school-affiliated-professional teams!

In any event, I don't believe every politician who is trying to find a solution that works is necessarily trying to screw the players out of a "right," but may be trying to find a system that allows players to get paid without bankrupting every single non-revenue sport there is. 

 

 

Hensons Mobile…

October 18th, 2023 at 3:49 PM ^

In any event, I don't believe every politician who is trying to find a solution that works is necessarily trying to screw the players out of a "right," but may be trying to find a system that allows players to get paid without bankrupting every single non-revenue sport there is.

If the arguments against paying football and basketball players their actual market worth was limited to discussions around how to do such things while not violating Title IX, not decimating the non-revenue sports, and not violating other employment laws, then we wouldn't have to spend so much energy on talking about whether or not one can root for a millionaire.

I don't have answers for how do we make it work practically. But we have a hard time even getting to that discussion when we first have to keep talking about the morality of paying people who are the labor force of a billion dollar industry.

markusr2007

October 18th, 2023 at 4:28 PM ^

The insistence on the application and use of the adjective "toxic" 24/7 and onto every damn thing and situation in common English parlance grates and has officially jumped the shark everybody.

There has to be a better way.

Surely there are alternatives.

MMBbones

October 18th, 2023 at 5:00 PM ^

Brian's link to the Oregon-Washington story is a good read. Would recommend.

It's amazing how chaotic and random decisions were that will have such long-term implications.

jmblue

October 18th, 2023 at 6:29 PM ^

This was interesting:

That doesn’t mean all schools agreed. Ohio State, Michigan, and especially Penn State, were at first against more expansion. Though they eventually voted for the move, leaders in State College expressed disappointment to the point that one administrator described their feelings on adding Oregon and Washington as “no f****** way.”

I wonder if we'll ever learn what their objections were.  Too many teams?  Distance?  Something else?

SanDiegoWolverine

October 18th, 2023 at 9:27 PM ^

I had Athletic for a couple years. Austin Meek barely even tries. Doesn't do analysis or have an ounce of access to Michigan football recruiting writ large. I wonder how these guys land such cushy gigs.

MGlobules

October 18th, 2023 at 11:57 PM ^

It’s not a strong piece of writing or analysis. But the rivalry certainly is toxic, to my mind. Now, you could make the argument that just shutting up and continuing to play with heads down and--you know--do sports could be the healthiest way through. But to my mind this goes for hoops and football both. And a long suspension, should anything further happen, could be worth considering, in my eyes. 

Puget Sound Blue

October 18th, 2023 at 10:51 PM ^

It seems to me, and maybe I'm wrong here, that the "toxicity" of the U-M/MSU rivalry took on a nastier edge when Mark Dantonio became the head coach. He assiduously fostered and encouraged a culture of resentment, moreso than I've seen any other MSU head coach do in my lifetime. Everything U-M ever did was somehow evidence of "disrespect" or worse. I think that this culture carried over after his departure from the team, and it had something to do with MSU's terrible behavior in the tunnel last season.

Ernis

October 19th, 2023 at 7:50 AM ^

Does “Harbaugh remembers” mean we’ll keep our starters in til the end of the game?

I expect this will look like the rest of our games this year: paving an inferior opponent for a 30+ point MOV. Where I’d like to see it different is not pulling our starters; keep the pedal to the metal.

There’s a practical benefit too: while it’s great getting backups reps (and they’ve had many), the starters need to get the feel of playing a full game going into the next portion of the season. The downside would be risk of injury, especially against this malevolent, trained-to-hate-and-injure team. But an 80 point MOV, Fielding Yost style, would be glorious.