Would you support moving to freshman/varsity setup in CFB?
This is obviously hypothetical, but would you support going back to a two team setup for football?
I actually think it would be pretty cool. Instead of redshirts, players get to show themselves in game situations the first year. You could keep scholarship limits, which would give walk-ons a much greater opportunity to succeed. You'd get twice as much football, as well as a glimpse into the future. It'd also give CFB a much more academic vibe, sort of reminiscent of high school JV.
The cons would be twice the travel and equipment costs that would burden smaller teams. And if freshmen were completely ineligible, we'd lose some awesome efforts, i.e. Rashan Gary this year.
But if it were aligned like this: You have one year of freshman eligibility and 4 years varsity. If you're called up, you still only have 4 years. EDIT: I didn't make this explicit enough. If a kid is good enough to play, he'd immediately start his 4 years on varsity. I think that's the major contention with this idea.
An I the only one who thinks this would be awesome? If we watch HS All American games, then this would be a no brainer.
November 4th, 2016 at 12:19 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 12:30 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 1:20 PM ^
As far as coaches are concerned, the goal would be to give better opportunities for your freshmen to develop, not to give fans twice as many games to watch.
Who do you want coaching your scholarship freshmen? I'd think it would be your regular coaches. Who do you want coaching an additional 50+ freshman walkons? I don't think you want to give your coaches that extra job. Would your freshmen be better off on the scout team, practicing with varsity players or practicing against a bunch of freshman walkons? I think that's a no-brainer.
For this to have a chance to work, I think you have to make freshmen ineligible, otherwise you'd just have too few scholarship players on the freshman team. I doubt many are in favor of that. Nobody is going to have 25 scholarship players on their freshman team. How many would Harbaugh have?
November 4th, 2016 at 1:44 PM ^
Sounds like the XFL. No one watches bad football.
November 4th, 2016 at 1:53 PM ^
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November 4th, 2016 at 2:51 PM ^
I can say that, as a Lions fan, once you have finished navigating DABDA - however long that might take one - then it becomes a little easier to go to games and yet somehow divorce yourself from what your preferred expectations for the team would be. It's the only reason I can gripe about Jim Caldwell but somehow let myself watch (or go) to Ford Field. I shouldn't do this to myself, it isn't healthy, but being a Lions fan never really has been that.
November 4th, 2016 at 3:14 PM ^
The Lions have also had some of the greatest players of all time. You also get quality football from their opponent. You won't get quality football from two teams full of walk-ons. If none of your freshman are QBs, you are screwed. Does this mean you no longer get 5 years of eligibility?
November 4th, 2016 at 1:53 PM ^
You are going to get all these walk ons admitted? Ah, no, that won't happen.
November 4th, 2016 at 1:55 PM ^
Add in 25 scholarships, and you have plenty.
So then the varsity will have only 60 scholarships?
The number of football scholarships per school is not going to go up. Title IX makes that too difficult.
November 4th, 2016 at 12:51 PM ^
Yes, get the kids who would otherwise play MAC to play JV first and try to make the Varsity. And my proposal would be to do it in the Spring so we have TWO FOOTBALL SEASONS! Make it happen somebody!
November 4th, 2016 at 3:24 PM ^
The NFL couldn't get people to watch either version of that European league and those players don't suck nearly as bad as these players would suck. No one watches that.
November 4th, 2016 at 3:55 PM ^
Sure we would root for Michigan, but I can't see getting excited about the results. I certainly wouldn't care about watching other schools play.
November 4th, 2016 at 12:20 PM ^
I am not a fan of copying the Figthings
November 4th, 2016 at 12:20 PM ^
Back in the day, this might've been to protect freshman. Today, athletes are much bigger, stronger, and likely better conditioned than players in the past. Freshman come into college a year (or sometimes less) away from playing and competing professionally. Stunting a freshman's chance to show his skills against the big boys when he's able to do so isn't fair to the young men who can win spots on a roster in a meritocracy like Michigan.
See Especially: Rashan Gary (that dude doesn't belong on a freshman team)
November 4th, 2016 at 12:21 PM ^
Sounds interesting, but in addition to the cons you've already mentioned think about the coaching implications. Would coaching staffs want to call two games? Would the freshman team have its own set of coaches?
November 4th, 2016 at 12:21 PM ^
Does this mean I get to see two games a week?
November 4th, 2016 at 12:23 PM ^
would only be broadcast at midnight on PAX after marathons of Supermarket Sweep.
November 4th, 2016 at 1:22 PM ^
when I was little.
As to the OP's idea, :::::fart noise:::::
November 4th, 2016 at 12:23 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 12:25 PM ^
High School freshmen just starting to hit puberity would get obliterated on the varsity team. That's an even worse idea than having a freshmen and varsity team in college.
November 4th, 2016 at 3:28 PM ^
But wait copacetic, just like alot of posters felt on this board a few weeks back, if someone is twice your size you don't forefit the game, you MAN UP and take your beating!
obvious but necessary /s
November 4th, 2016 at 12:29 PM ^
You call this a stupid idea, and then come up with an even dumber one.
High school football, especially, is about development. And if your talent group is riding the bench for three years until they're seniors, it's going to look like a JV team anyways.
November 4th, 2016 at 12:32 PM ^
Don't limit the years players can play football because they are freshman.
Logically speaking, more teams means more players can play football, not fewer. That is, it's the exact opposite of a limit. I'm quite sure the best freshman players at your HS played JV or even varsity. Our HS had freshman, JV, and varsity baseball teams, and I'm sure as hell glad they did because I got to play for a lot longer than I would've if they had only one team.
November 4th, 2016 at 1:58 PM ^
I don't get it. Why is it "stupid" to give young high school players who aren't varsity-caliber a chance to play? What good would it do to nail them to the bench?
November 4th, 2016 at 2:01 PM ^
Started drinking early today?
November 4th, 2016 at 2:05 PM ^
call this early???
November 4th, 2016 at 12:25 PM ^
I assume that was back in the days of unlimited scholarships? There is NO way you could field proper JV and Varsity teams today with the scholarship limits in place.
And if you remove the limits, you are majorly damaging non-elite school programs since Michigan and Notre Dame could take as many prospects as they want and let them compete.
If I'm wrong, please tell me.
November 4th, 2016 at 12:25 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 12:25 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 12:26 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 12:28 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 12:52 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 12:29 PM ^
Eh, I don't think so. Part of what makes football so cool is its scarcity. It's a short season and you play once a week. You have all week to gloat or stew, depending. And by the same token, one thing football is doing to turn everyone off to it is saturating everyone with it. So suddenly doubling the amount of football is just watering it down.
I mean, the comparison to HS all-American games is ironic, considering that itself is a symptom of the oversaturation of football. And it's one thing to see the year's best HS players - I'm never interested in it, but some are - but Thursday night Georgia State vs. Arkansas State is lame enough** without foisting the JV squads on us too.
**Seriously, I had this game on for a little bit last night. They made damn sure not to show the stands on TV.
November 4th, 2016 at 12:50 PM ^
I agree completely with this. Adding competitive freshman football would dilute the best parts of CFB. I don't want to split my attention between two teams and I don't want other teams' fans to be able to have something to potentially point to if our real team beats them.
Also, there would be an enormous parity issue. Compare our 2016 recruiting class (hypothetical freshman team) to our opponents' classes this year. That would not be good football.
November 4th, 2016 at 12:30 PM ^
sounds like a solution in search of a problem.
November 4th, 2016 at 12:41 PM ^
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November 4th, 2016 at 12:46 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 1:56 PM ^
just disagree that it would be an improvement. There are many true freshman that are ready to play. The ones that redshirt get to practice, watch film, workout and improve to become contributors. Your suggestion really does not do anything to improve upon that but needlessly increases costs and poses logistical challenges for academics, coaches, game sites, etc., and also likely increases the chance of a needless injury in a meaningless "game." I just don't think it is a particularly good idea with a lot of down side.
November 4th, 2016 at 12:34 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 1:42 PM ^
I think this is the best version of the idea. Having a full, season-long JV team seems like a bit much, but having a freshman-only team that could play a handful of scrimmage-type games against other schools while maintaining redshirt elibigility seems like a win for everybody - young guys get to develop, fan get to see a glimpse of the future players, etc. Coaching for the game could be used to give younger coaches experience running the freshman team for a few games (e.g. Drevno as "head coach", Jay Harbaugh as OC, etc.)
November 4th, 2016 at 2:19 PM ^
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November 4th, 2016 at 5:53 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 12:40 PM ^
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November 4th, 2016 at 12:42 PM ^
Can you link the article?
Edit: Also the idea is bad.
November 4th, 2016 at 12:44 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 12:44 PM ^
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November 4th, 2016 at 12:49 PM ^
November 4th, 2016 at 12:44 PM ^
I'll pass, but I would be in favor of a spring game versus another real team that allows early enrollees to play.
I'd allow teams to play as long or as short of games as they want (some teams aren't going to have a lot of depth). So if they want to play a full game, go for it, if they want 3 periods instead...fine. If they want 10 or 12 min quarters...whatever they agree on before the game. It's not like a Spring Game at many places is a full 15min/4 qtr game.
Soccer teams do this all the time in the spring...they'll play 3 30's instead of 2 45's. It's not like it counts for anything so who gives a shit? As long as you can evaluate your team and get better...and the fans will get a taste of CFB that no one gets in a watered down spring game.
You'd also get some cool non-conference matchups that would never happen during the year. Stanford or Miami or Texas at the Big House.
Let teams do one road game and one home game. They can even go against the same school if they want.
I'm daydreaming, but I think it'd be a fun way to get a couple of "games" in April. Going into the upcoming season.
November 4th, 2016 at 1:13 PM ^
One of the big differences I love about college vs. NFL is that in college you have no idea what you are going to get until that first game. Everything between the bowl game and the first game is completely in-house. The second piece that makes college great (for me at least) is that every week matters. With only four playoff slots available it puts tremendous pressure on the top teams every week.
The greed to see more college football (adding exhibition games in the spring or fall and exapnding playoffs) is the very thing that will kill the essence of what makes college football so awesome.
The NFL is living proof. Owners thought they could keep getting rich by having 5 pre-season games. They thought they could get more eyeballs on TV's by moving to five time slots (Thursday night, 2 during the day on Sunday, Sunday night, and Monday night). They have since cut pre-season back to 4 games and the TV ratings this year are starting to dip and are not expanding for the new time slots. There has even been articles about why the NFL is becoming boring. As recent as two years ago there were articles about how the NFL is the best thing ever and nothing can stop it now.