EMU Athletics in a Death Spiral?
EMU faculty and students urge school to drop out of D-I football. Bet we'll be seeing a lot more of this. https://t.co/1K7OmYinL4
— John U. Bacon (@Johnubacon) April 25, 2016
So at least some students and faculty are suggesting that a good way to contribute to solving budget problems at EMU is to drop from D-1 to D-2 (skipping 1-AA entirely).
This would obviously be a pretty big change for the athletic department. And they have sports that aren't disasters. But, of course, football drives the train, and EMU's football program has been a flaming garbage pile for 30 years.
I can attest that the D-2 program here in Duluth, UMD (D-1 in hockey only, obviously) gets as much or more attention in a town with no major teams of its own than EMU does in A2 or Ypsi. They, at least, have a fanbase and a consistent radio broadcast and even a local tv broadcast of home games.
So perhaps it's time. But maybe there are alternate options. Dropping football would certainly be a big step, without gutting the rest of the department, right?
Its a scandal that it has been allowed to gone on as long as it has.
I never went to EMU, but I taught classes there for many years. I can honestly say I couldn't find the football stadium without a map. Nor do I ever recall having anyone that even looked like a football player in a class, and I must have come into contact with 2000-3000 students in my time there. My point is...it's almost like the football program doesn't exist now anyway!
They need to drop down to Division II or III and try to become a regional power like Grand Valley. They've been too bad, for too long at too much of a cost. Its the right thing to move down. The article mentions the idea of joining th Horizon League for the other sports and just moving football down a division. That seems to make sense.
I don't think that would work for a few reasons:
A. Grand Valley is a relatively good school (far better than EMU and arguably 5th best in the state after UM, MSU, Tech and WSU) that has become a residential campus. EMU is a commuter school and likely not anybody's first choice of colleges.
B. Michigan is incredibly rich in D2 schools, with two of the schools I mentioned above plus traditional powers in GVSU and SVSU. Eastern would be out of the frying pan and into a much smaller frying pan where competition for D2 level athletes is just as fierce. They're best off in 1-AA, reflecting their status while also making them a unique option as the lone Michigan school in that division.
It has a larger than normal amount of undergrad transfers out -- and mostly to 4 schools specifically: WMU, CMU, MSU and UofM.
April 25th, 2016 at 11:03 PM ^
Agreed with you that EMU should go 1-AA. But have to point out that based on pretty much every ranking out there, WMU and CMU are both significantly better than GVSU as universities.
In the longer run, when the P5 break off into their own thing, I'd expect the three major directional schools (sorry Northern) to be reunited in whatever bottom half of 1-A/top half of I-AA division emerges.
April 25th, 2016 at 11:34 PM ^
Are they? They're less selective for one thing.
Average ACT scores for incoming freshmen (25th, 50th and 75th percentiles):
GVSU - 21, 24, 26
Western - 21, 23, 25
Central - 20, 22, 24
Eastern - 19, 22, 25
Wayne State - 19, 22, 26 (but Wayne has a full suite of grad programs to save it)
MSU - 23, 26, 28
Michigan - 28, 30, 32
Michigan Tech - 24, 27, 29
and our cousins down the road in Dearborn - 20, 24, 27
April 26th, 2016 at 11:40 AM ^
It's a sad misconception that the gap between the "best" and "worst" schools in terms of the quality/intelligence of the students is huge. Having taught at both EMU and UM, I can tell you that the best at EMU could easily excel at UM. The main difference is the variance - the worst at EMU probably don't belong in college, while the worst at UM are smart enough to be there, but lack real motivation and only got in because they could afford test prep, went to top high schools, came from $$$$, etc.
as do a number of non-Power 5 conferences. That is just the reality of modern day college football. I wouldn't be surprised to see some schools dropping football altogether, given the Title 9 implications.
to be competetive in games with similar-sized schools. Getting crushed regularly cannot be any picnic. Heck, we go to minor league baseball games and have a blast, not kidding ourselves that we are seeing the greatest athletes but just enjoying the atmosphere and spectacle.
It's been a drain on their AD for decades.
You mean Huron Devotee???
They have 3 fans: HuronDevotee, HuronBenn, and DiscussHuronMan...
They might even have a board like this with a thread that has a post in it, although that post must be quite old by now and possibly moderated by the mod, who is also the poster.
To the point though, if I read the numbers on finances right from USA Today's database, Eastern's athletic department has the highest % subsidy in the MAC, filling a gap of over $20 million, and I have to think a big portion of it is football. They would do much better financially by scaling it down to Division II levels at least. They shouldn't feel compelled to do this to themselves year after year, in my opinion.
I believe they wrote a rule to expel any school that drops football. They're clearly worried that other schools would follow the first one to do so.
That's assuming EMU's administration is inclined to act. They've pushed back against faculty and even some AD sentiment for dropping D-1 football in the past.
Nicely done!
First comment in a while that's actually made me LOL.
broken-hearted,
paid my dime
and only farted
My freshman year was almost 30 years ago. The football team just came off a California Raisin Bowl victory in '87 and the basketball team would soon make the Sweet 16. Since it has been downhill. I never really cared much about EMU athletics even though I was a student. I was born a rabid Michigan fan and it was my observation that there were more far Michigan fans at EMU than EMU fans. Tough to gain traction there with it being such a commuter school and the fact that the greatest university in the world is just a few miles up the road.
April 25th, 2016 at 10:24 PM ^
Came on the heels of a campaign led by Dr. Porter to save the school from being kicked out of the MAC in '83-'84 for low football attendance. That rescue effort seemed to breath life into the football and basketball programs. EMU saw record applications during this time and its academic exclusivity ratings soared.
Then the school dropped its Huron name and its been all downhill since: multiple presidents, lower apps, cruddy exclusivity, no athletic banners. Just like the Pistons sucked in teal, EMU seems destined to remain seperated from success too until it restores its original moniker.
Might want to add a "FREEP" warning near your link. Some folks don't like that rag, I've heard.
EMU's business school is solid.
At some point you need to cut bait.
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I feel bad about this because it is partly our (Michigan's) fault.
Any D1 program needs support from the surrounding community to thrive. You can't do it with just students and faculty.
But next-door Michigan sucks all of the D1 sports oxygen out of the room. There is nothing left for EMU.
If there was no University of Michigan in the Ann Arbor/Ypsi area, EMU would do fine. But it can't survive sports-wise in the long heavy shadow of UM.
If EMU was winning championships, this wouldn't be a topic. But EMU has been terrible for a long time. Their last MAC title was almost 30 years ago.
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Actually, you are wrong here. Michigan is so awesome that its gravity has slowly drawn Ypsi closer. It'd be even closer, but sometimes it is pulled back towards Westland because Westland sucks so much... :-D
Garden City sucks more.
Romulus is for Lovers
part of the reason Eastern sucks is because they have no identity. They are a commuter school, permanently rooted right in Michigan's shadow. There's no local fanbase.
I hear this logic all the time and think it's kind of bullshit, to be honest. It's not like EMU is UM-Dearborn and all the students get Michigan tickets. There's really no good reason why most EMU students should care more about Michigan sports, at least not any more so than CMU or WMU or GVSU students, etc. In fact, you can see people wearing Ohio State stuff at basically every MAC game on a given Saturday, why doesn't it impact them to the same degree?
Eastern's problem is that nobody who goes there really wants to be there. I work in an office with grads from every school in the state. On Fridays in the fall, when we're encouraged to wear our alma mater's gear, EMU alumni are more or less the only people who don't take part. It was a place they were required to be for a few hours a day. Cheering for EMU sports teams is like cheering for your company's intramural softball team.
and that is where they get most of their students from. They also draw from northeastern Ohio. Being so close to UM in a major media market means that most kids will grow up UM or if not UM, MSU and OSU.
Fan bases are driven in large by media attention and UM receives a huge chunk of it.I'm at a loss for why you think this is "bullshit."
Many people choose to go to EMU for education, nursing, business, and an assortment of other degree programs.
Your last statement is most definitely bullshit.
Which media market is driving people to become engaged Central Michigan fans? Do you suspect that the media in Saginaw and Flint cover CMU football to a greater degree than UM or MSU football? Do you think kids who end up at Western come in sans attachments to MSU or UM or Notre Dame?
I'm honestly baffled by the idea that anyone thinks "Michigan exists" is a better argument for EMU's lack of student engagement in athletics than the fact that it is a commuter school with zero identity whereas the other schools I mentioned are primarily residential campuses. Is it not obvious to you that living somewhere inherently builds a stronger identity than driving there a couple of times a week from Canton?
As for EMU being a school people choose to go to, that may well be. And I say this with the utmost respect, as someone who knows plenty of highly intelligent Eastern grads, but they're most likely choosing it because of cost or convenience not because of any great love for the school or the place or even because of the quality of programs on offer (USNWR would rank it as the second worst school in Metro Detroit, ahead of Marygrove).
Going to EMU is more like going to a community college than other MAC schools. It has some good programs, but the entire campus culture and academic level is more similar to a community college feel.
Memphis, Univerisity of Utah, and New Mexico are on the list of top commuter schools, but EMU isn't. Their cutoff for "top" is 87% and per the numbers on Wikipedia, EMU is about 79% commuter. Basketball schools on the list include Wichita State, UNLV, and Weber State. Nearby schools include Wayne State, UM-Flint, and UMD.
As a D III alumnus, I would applaud a move to a lower division to be more fiscally responsible.
I think part of it may be that if you are at central or western you are kind of there and its not super quick to go to another school. However, at emu you can take the bus to the Michigan game pretty easily
April 25th, 2016 at 11:24 PM ^
You're right that geography matters. I grew up in Kalamazoo and local sports coverage there was Western first, UM/MSU second, ND not on the radar. In middle school, when Western made the basketball tournament and upset Clemson in the first round (1998?), they actually paused class and turned it on for the fourth quarter in my school - with a PA announcement and everything, not just my teacher being a big Bronco fan or something. I can't imagine them doing that for UM or MSU.
Sure, there were lots of people around who had those secondary allegiences, but Kalamazoo itself is definitely oriented around WMU. Eastern has it much worse from what I can see, as everyone just perceives Ypsi to be kind of this second-class adjunct of Ann Arbor.
I don't disagree with your point but it's not in any way our fault. It wasn't our call to have Michigan State Normal College (now EMU) be established a few miles away from us.
Saban winning 4 titles at Alabama is remarkable, but Alabama's program and culture is built to be a perennial champion. It already has all the resources in place to make those kinds of accomplishments.
EMU has a history and culture of being nothing but losers. And not just any losers, but big friggin' losers. You're not just turning around a team. You're turning around an identity and culture. How many of their teams have even made it to bowl games in the past 30 years?
It's no wonder that no one wants to go there.
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"I don't understand how they can continue to suck so badly for so long."
Ypsi is basically a cesspool. If there was a way to have recruits visit but never actually see Ypsi, it may make a difference. But really, EMU may be the worst place in the country to try and recruit. Any player with other optioins is usually going to go somewhere else. That leaves EMU with players who basically had nowhere else to get a scholly.
My solution: annex the area between Washtenaw and Huron River Drive as "East Ann Arbor." Cross St, could serve as "Downtown East Ann Arbor." Then, EMU could be in "East Ann Arbor." It might not hurt to extend the south boundary to Packard.
Problem solved.
I know at least 80% of what you wrote is joking malarkey, but have you ever been to Ypsi? It's kinda great. Or have you just never been anywhere outside of Stepford?
He is one of the most bizarre internet denizens I have ever encountered. Posts, but never interacts. So basically you are wasting keystrokes by responding to him.